Is my biological mother alive?

N

neptunian

Well-known member
As far as I know, biological mother is the 4th house.? 4th house ruler Jupiter is in the twelfth house. It's retrograde. What does that mean ?
Eighth house emphasis in the chart. Eight house is the house of death. Moon is in the 8th house and it is the ruler of intercepted sign in the eight house; moon has a seperating aspect with Jupiter. What do you think?
 

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N

neptunian

Well-known member
Chrysalis said:
What makes you ask this question, have you never known her/had contact with her/lost contact with her ?
Click to expand...

I was adopted when I was a baby. Have never known her. My adoptive parents are secretive about telling me what happened. I told them kindly I need to know the truth. I really need. But they don't understand me. All I know, I was adopted. So maybe this chart sheds some light.
 
IleneK

IleneK

Premium Member
i don’t know how to answer this kind of question with horary. i can tell you though that the 10th signifies the mother. i think i would use whole signs, that’s my preference, in which case the significator of mother is Sun.
Sun is void. By that i mean it makes no contacts to other planets until after it leaves the sign it is in. Sun is also in the 8th. To me all these things point to the absence of your birth mother in your life.
If i read the ephemeris accurately, Sun makes no aspect to other planets until it changes sign into Cancer and is opposed by very strong Saturn in Capricorn.

So here is what i see, although it is not the answer to your question: this is not a fruitful time to proceed with searching for information about your mother. i would suggest waiting a bit, and perhaps approaching your parents again. Sometimes asking again later a second time, or even a bit later a third time, may yield the results that you desire. These are such delicate matters for everyone involved.
i am truly wishing you the best.
 
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Chrysalis

Chrysalis

Well-known member
I wonder which house the adoptive parents should come under ?, to see if we can see why they are being secretive about her birth mother.

You've got every right to find your birth mother if you want to, if your adoptive parents are keeping things from you, then the question is why, there must be a reason why.
 
Chrysalis

Chrysalis

Well-known member
Do you know your birth mothers maiden name/dob ? If so, she could be quite easy to trace, with contact with the correct people.

There are avenues you can do down to track her down, i wouldn't even bother telling the adoptive parents, this is your mother and you want answers/to meet her, they can't stop you.

I was adopted too, i tried to find birth mother in my teens, i tried everything, i first went to the social services (UK), they gave me a birth record of her details (name/dob/siblings/what she looked like) and details of her situation leading up to me being adopted, all on 3 sheets of paper.

They then went onto tracing her, i got called back a few weeks later, they said the council house she lived in, she'd moved out of it two weeks prior with no forwarding address, and as she didnt move into another council address, the trace was now lost...id missed her by two weeks.

Fast forward a few years, i had a fake facebook account (no pics or nothing), one evening i decided to randomly start typing her name in again, but i did it differently this time, and typed her name and her location, remember i had her name/s from the birth data i got. She came up, but i wasn't sure it was her as i didnt know what she looked like, as i started looking through her friends/pics, then i started to join dots...it was her, turned out i also had a real sister and half sister too.

I then a couple weeks later plucked up the courage to pm my real sister on facebook, and explained who i was.

My sister then came to my city the following week to pick me up to take me to meet "the mother", .....anyway to cut a long story short, i went down 3 times to see her in total, but it wasn't no happily ever after. She put on an act like she was bothered, but she wasn't i could feel it, and it was really awkward, like i didn't know if to call her mum or her name, so i never called her either. She didn't care about me finding her, she was more bothered about my other two sisters, i was another one of her unwanted children who came back.

Fast forward a couple of years, on new years eve, i sent her one long msg basically telling her how much i hated her, and then blocked her, and ive not spoken to her since, and i never will. So i knew her for two years.

The only reason why im sharing my story, is to say if you want to find your birth mother, you WILL find her eventually, don't let anybody stop you, your always going to want to find her, and until you do this urge will never go away.

Also don't expect miracles, hopefully for you things turn out good, and you can build a relationship with her, but just don't expect this to be an easy road.
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
IleneK said:
i don’t know how to answer this kind of question with horary. i can tell you though that the 10th signifies the mother. i think i would use whole signs, that’s my preference, in which case the significator of mother is Sun.
Sun is void. By that i mean it makes no contacts to other planets until after it leaves the sign it is in. Sun is also in the 8th. To me all these things point to the absence of your birth mother in your life.
If i read the ephemeris accurately, Sun makes no aspect to other planets until it changes sign into Cancer and is opposed by very strong Saturn in Capricorn.

So here is what i see, although it is not the answer to your question: this is not a fruitful time to proceed with searching for information about your mother. i would suggest waiting a bit, and perhaps approaching your parents again. Sometimes asking again later a second time, or even a bit later a third time, may yield the results that you desire. These are such delicate matters for everyone involved.
i am truly wishing you the best.
Click to expand...


Maybe she died when she gave birth to me :sad: or something different or she wants to keep herself hidden. God knows...
I've been waiting a long time for my parents to tell me; but they are either keeping a secret or being selfish.
You say this chart doesn't give clues about whether she is alive or not.? The sky is even secretive then. Maybe that is my fate. Thanks a lot IleneK for your insight and good wish.:love:
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
Chrysalis said:
I wonder which house the adoptive parents should come under ?, to see if we can see why they are being secretive about her birth mother.

You've got every right to find your birth mother if you want to, if your adoptive parents are keeping things from you, then the question is why, there must be a reason why.
Click to expand...

Definitely, there must be something. I told them; whatever is the situation I wanna know. If I hadn't heard them talking secretly, I think they would have kept it as a secret forever. They don't tell me anything can help me.

I do appreciate adopting kids; but after certain age, the truth must be shared. This is my origin, a part of me. I try to explain this to my parents and say them honesty is the most important thing for me; but they don't understand... Unfortunately I cannot find any information that can help me whether my biological mother is alive or not.
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
Chrysalis said:
Do you know your birth mothers maiden name/dob ? If so, she could be quite easy to trace, with contact with the correct people.

There are avenues you can do down to track her down, i wouldn't even bother telling the adoptive parents, this is your mother and you want answers/to meet her, they can't stop you.

I was adopted too, i tried to find birth mother in my teens, i tried everything, i first went to the social services (UK), they gave me a birth record of her details (name/dob/siblings/what she looked like) and details of her situation leading up to me being adopted, all on 3 sheets of paper.

They then went onto tracing her, i got called back a few weeks later, they said the council house she lived in, she'd moved out of it two weeks prior with no forwarding address, and as she didnt move into another council address, the trace was now lost...id missed her by two weeks.

Fast forward a few years, i had a fake facebook account (no pics or nothing), one evening i decided to randomly start typing her name in again, but i did it differently this time, and typed her name and her location, remember i had her name/s from the birth data i got. She came up, but i wasn't sure it was her as i didnt know what she looked like, as i started looking through her friends/pics, then i started to join dots...it was her, turned out i also had a real sister and half sister too.

I then a couple weeks later plucked up the courage to pm my real sister on facebook, and explained who i was.

My sister then came to my city the following week to pick me up to take me to meet "the mother", .....anyway to cut a long story short, i went down 3 times to see her in total, but it wasn't no happily ever after. She put on an act like she was bothered, but she wasn't i could feel it, and it was really awkward, like i didn't know if to call her mum or her name, so i never called her either. She didn't care about me finding her, she was more bothered about my other two sisters, i was another one of her unwanted children who came back.

Fast forward a couple of years, on new years eve, i sent her one long msg basically telling her how much i hated her, and then blocked her, and ive not spoken to her since, and i never will. So i knew her for two years.

The only reason why im sharing my story, is to say if you want to find your birth mother, you WILL find her eventually, don't let anybody stop you, your always going to want to find her, and until you do this urge will never go away.

Also don't expect miracles, hopefully for you things turn out good, and you can build a relationship with her, but just don't expect this to be an easy road.
Click to expand...


I have some information; but not enough to find her.

Some people don't understand. They say "you think about this too much." For them; to say this, easy. But for me; It's not easy to just accept and not doing something.
Your meeting was not pleasant sadly :( but at least it must be relaxing to get rid of unclear situation. Maybe I was unwanted child too.
Even if this is the case, I still wanna know the truth. You can understand my need to know about my origins; but my adoptive parents don't :sad:

Thanks for sharing your story; you're right, this urge never goes away. I'm not gonna give up. My search is not over till i find. Because truth is truth. Thanks a lot Chrysalis, for your attention and support :smile: :love: wish you the best. I hope one day I learn and write here too.
 
M

muchacho

Well-known member
I'd say we've got 3 possible significators for your biological mother: 1) the Moon as natural significator for mother 2) L10 accidental significator for mother and 3) L7 as general significator for any kind of persons that don't have a specific house by default.

I think in this case assigning the right significators is pretty simple. Just ask yourself who (on a feeling level) you would call your mother. Since you don't know her, I'd say your foster parents should get the typical significators for parents and your biological mother the 7th ('any old person').

Now, what's interesting here is that all 3 significators are located in the radical 8th house! :andy:

Another approach would be to treat it like a typical missing person horary.
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
muchacho said:
I'd say we've got 3 possible significators for your biological mother: 1) the Moon as natural significator for mother 2) L10 accidental significator for mother and 3) L7 as general significator for any kind of persons that don't have a specific house by default.

I think in this case assigning the right significators is pretty simple. Just ask yourself who (on a feeling level) you would call your mother. Since you don't know her, I'd say your foster parents should get the typical significators for parents and your biological mother the 7th ('any old person').

Now, what's interesting here is that all 3 significators are located in the radical 8th house! :andy:

Another approach would be to treat it like a typical missing person horary.
Click to expand...

I associate biological mother and father with 4th/10th house axis. On a feeling level, too, this axis represent them for me.
If you can interpret like a missing person horary, what would you say? I feel like she had difficult times; eight house planets make me think this way. Can we understand where is she if she is alive? At first, I thought the 4th ruler Jupiter in the twelfth house represents her. You know this is the house loss, separation, institutions, places can make someone confined or foreign settlement. Here I learnt 10th house is taken as mother in horary. In this case, mercury is in the eight house and moon too. Whether I take 4th or 10th, both rulers are in difficult houses; so I just feel the stress she experienced. What do you think?
 
IleneK

IleneK

Premium Member
neptunian said:
Maybe she died when she gave birth to me :sad: or something different or she wants to keep herself hidden. God knows...
I've been waiting a long time for my parents to tell me; but they are either keeping a secret or being selfish.
You say this chart doesn't give clues about whether she is alive or not.? The sky is even secretive then. Maybe that is my fate. Thanks a lot IleneK for your insight and good wish.:love:
Click to expand...

You are welcome.
I am not saying that the chart doesn't give clues about whether your birth mother is alive or not. I am saying that I do not know how to use a horary chart to answer such a question.
Neptunian, contrary to some opinions, sometimes things just cannot be known; and sometimes it is better that things are not known. But also, you still may get to know who she is.
We will just have to see what is intended to be for you.
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
IleneK said:
You are welcome.
I am not saying that the chart doesn't give clues about whether your birth mother is alive or not. I am saying that I do not know how to use a horary chart to answer such a question.
Neptunian, contrary to some opinions, sometimes things just cannot be known; and sometimes it is better that things are not known. But also, you still may get to know who she is.
We will just have to see what is intended to be for you.
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Okay dear IleneK :smile: you spend your time answering back to me. This is also important. Thanks a lot.

Yes, maybe time will resolve everything. For many years I didn't even know I was adopted. This must be a part of my experience. I'm doing what I can do to find her; because she may be in a difficult situation and need me. And I need her. But even if she doesn't want me, I will at least learn the truth.
Yes, we will see what's intended for me.
:smile:
 
waybread

waybread

Well-known member
neptunian, I'm going to give your question a "no." This does not mean that you cannot find out who she is/was, but just that I don't think she is living.

Traditionally one's mother is the 10th house, with the father as the 4th, although modern astrologers will often reverse them. Then the 8th is the house of death, with the 12th being a kind of catch-all for negative or troubled phenomena. The moon shows your emotional stake in a horary question, but it also rules one's mother.

In this chart we find Mercury and the moon in the 8th house, and Jupiter (traditional ruler of Pisces) in the 12th. The moon is VOC, also suggesting no change to the present situation.

neptunian, I don't know where you live, but at least in the US and Canada, there are "vital records" on birth, death, and adoption.

Certainly in the past (until, say the 1970s in the US) there was a huge stigma against unmarried pregnant girls. Mostly they gave their babies up for adoption, and then tried to get on with their lives as single women carrying a big secret. There were also cases of unmarried girls having babies that were raised by their mothers, with the child (and everyone else outside the family) being told that the biological mother was the child's sister. Or maybe Mom lost custody of her children due to substance abuse. I could go on in this fashion, but depending upon your own age, there may be an old scandal at the heart of the story that your adoptive parents are afraid to reveal.

So I hope you have steeled yourself for such possibilities. Of course, the truth might be kind and gentle, but you can't count on it.

I wish you all the best in your search, and please report back if you learn anything.
 
S

Sunny

Well-known member
Neptunian, I want to have a try on your chart/question. But for this I need a larger picture because on my computer I cannot read it clearly enough. And don't forget the POF!

@Chrysalis
I am very sorry to hear your story and wish you all the best!
 
S

Sunny

Well-known member
So, I had a look at Lilly for your question: is she alive? And it seems, yes, she is, because either the Lord of the 8th is posited in the ASC, nor the Lord of the ASC and the Moon be placed in the 4th which means she isn't dead. (see Lilly, p. 151). And as the Lord of the ASC (mars) ist separated from a bad aspect (opposition) from the Lord of the 11th (venus), this means, that she has been "lately much troubled in mind, in fear of imprisonment, arrests etc. or in distress for want".

Venus is also the Lord of the 7th, separated from Mars by opposition, that is she could have been "in some quarrel or contention".

In my conclusion, and if I understood Lilly well, I'd say she is alive.

I wish you good luck!
 
S

Sunny

Well-known member
Just once more:
You could have news from her when Venus aspects Mars by a trine or sextile, or when the Moon comes to a sextile or trine to Mars (Lord of the ASC). See at the ephemerids when it will happen. Lilly shows us how to calculate the time.
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
waybread said:
neptunian, I'm going to give your question a "no." This does not mean that you cannot find out who she is/was, but just that I don't think she is living.

Traditionally one's mother is the 10th house, with the father as the 4th, although modern astrologers will often reverse them. Then the 8th is the house of death, with the 12th being a kind of catch-all for negative or troubled phenomena. The moon shows your emotional stake in a horary question, but it also rules one's mother.

In this chart we find Mercury and the moon in the 8th house, and Jupiter (traditional ruler of Pisces) in the 12th. The moon is VOC, also suggesting no change to the present situation.

neptunian, I don't know where you live, but at least in the US and Canada, there are "vital records" on birth, death, and adoption.

Certainly in the past (until, say the 1970s in the US) there was a huge stigma against unmarried pregnant girls. Mostly they gave their babies up for adoption, and then tried to get on with their lives as single women carrying a big secret. There were also cases of unmarried girls having babies that were raised by their mothers, with the child (and everyone else outside the family) being told that the biological mother was the child's sister. Or maybe Mom lost custody of her children due to substance abuse. I could go on in this fashion, but depending upon your own age, there may be an old scandal at the heart of the story that your adoptive parents are afraid to reveal.

So I hope you have steeled yourself for such possibilities. Of course, the truth might be kind and gentle, but you can't count on it.

I wish you all the best in your search, and please report back if you learn anything.
Click to expand...


Hi Waybread, thank you soo much for your interpretation. Here where I live some adoption cases remain cloudy regarding those years I was born. I have limited information. But I will deepen my search.

The year I was born, my adoptive family were living in a different city.That year they moved here where we live. There is a long distance between these two places. That year also my aunt went to live abroad. You see many of my adoptive family members changed location that year, which I find interesting.

Another thing, recently; I found some photos of a young woman; said to be a friend of my adoptive mother in the past. I look like her. I searched about her; but no information. as if she was lost :( They said she went away and never heard about her again. I think they know more; but don't share with me.
I think, my adoptive family keep a secret; I can see it in their eyes, their reactions. My adoptive mother gets angry when I ask about this; my adoptive father remains silent. Relatives of them are also silent. There is a secret kept by family members for sure. But if God let me know this much, the rest may come to surface with time, I believe.

I don't know what you think about tarot readings; but when I ask about my biological mother, queen of swords always shows up. So maybe she was unmarried.

I'm ready to learn whatever is the truth. I want just the truth even if it hurts me. I feel incomplete.

Thanks for your good wishes Waybread :love: Of course, I will report back if I learn. :smile:
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
Sunny said:
Neptunian, I want to have a try on your chart/question. But for this I need a larger picture because on my computer I cannot read it clearly enough. And don't forget the POF!

@Chrysalis
I am very sorry to hear your story and wish you all the best!
Click to expand...


Hi, Sunny. I don't know how to put it larger. :eek: P.O.F is 21 degrees 45' sagittarius in the first house.
 
N

neptunian

Well-known member
Sunny said:
So, I had a look at Lilly for your question: is she alive? And it seems, yes, she is, because either the Lord of the 8th is posited in the ASC, nor the Lord of the ASC and the Moon be placed in the 4th which means she isn't dead. (see Lilly, p. 151). And as the Lord of the ASC (mars) ist separated from a bad aspect (opposition) from the Lord of the 11th (venus), this means, that she has been "lately much troubled in mind, in fear of imprisonment, arrests etc. or in distress for want".

Venus is also the Lord of the 7th, separated from Mars by opposition, that is she could have been "in some quarrel or contention".

In my conclusion, and if I understood Lilly well, I'd say she is alive.

I wish you good luck!
Click to expand...


You say she is alive. Hope so. But whatever the situation, I can handle the truth.
Thanks a lot for your interpretation and good wish :smile: I'm truly thankful for all comments.
 
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