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  #1  
Unread 06-17-2007, 12:09 PM
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fishy fishy is offline
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I was wondering what this means?

I am very much a newbie (astro.com got me hooked) to this so please excuse any rubbish I talk! I thought I would post my chart and see if anyone else thinks if anything is a bit weird/ could comment and give me a general picture of what is going on in my chart. I am quite a quiet person, socially, so I'm unsure how my leo ascendant fits in. It would be much appreciated, if someone has the time.
I have both the sun and moon in house 8. I am concerned about how this works because I've heard alot of scary things about house 8.
Thanks,
Fishy
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Planetary positions Sun Pisces 14°16'55 in house 8 direct
Moon Pisces 14°53'16 in house 8 direct
Mercury
Aries 1°04'56 in house 9 direct V
enus
Aquarius 18°24'32 in house 7 direct
Mars
Aquarius 11°50'35 end of house 6 direct
Jupiter Virgo 9°04'49 in house 2 retrograde
Saturn
Aquarius 13°15'32 in house 7 direct
Uranus
Capricorn 17°03'00 in house 6 direct
Neptune
Capricorn 18°21'56 in house 6 direct
Pluto
Scorpio 22°56'03 in house 4 retrograde
True Node
Capricorn 7°30'25 in house 5 retrograde
House positions
Ascendant Leo 12°28'40
2nd House
Virgo 0°01'22
3rd House Virgo 22°52'41
Imum Coeli
Libra 24°03'35
5th House
Sagittarius 3°50'26
6th House
Capricorn 12°29'37
Descendant Aquarius 12°28'40
8th House
Pisces 0°01'22
9th House
Pisces 22°52'41
Medium Coeli
Aries 24°03'35
11th House
Gemini 3°50'26
12th House
Cancer 12°29'37
Major aspects
Sun Conjunction Moon 0°36
Sun
Opposition Jupiter 5°12
Sun
Sextile Uranus 2°46
Sun
Sextile Neptune 4°05
Sun
Quincunx Ascendant 1°48
Moon
Opposition Jupiter 5°48
Moon Sextile Uranus 2°10
Moon
Sextile Neptune 3°29
Moon Quincunx Ascendant 2°25
Venus
Conjunction Saturn 5°09
Venus
Square Pluto 4°32
Venus
Opposition Ascendant 5°56
Mars
Quincunx Jupiter 2°46
Mars
Conjunction Saturn 1°25
Mars Opposition Ascendant 0°38
Saturn
Opposition Ascendant 0°47
Uranus
Conjunction Neptune 1°19
Uranus Sextile Pluto 5°53
Neptune Sextile Pluto 4°34
[IMG]file:///D:/DOCUME%7E1/ADMINI%7E1/LOCALS%7E1/Temp/moz-screenshot.jpg[/IMG]


Last edited by fishy; 06-17-2007 at 02:17 PM.
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  #2  
Unread 06-17-2007, 07:04 PM
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Shaun Shaun is offline
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Re: I was wondering what this means?

Hello, fishy.

I've had a similar problem myself. As I state so often (and, unfortunately, on deaf ears) all horoscopes - every horoscope - has to be verified...even when the physical birth time is provided or known. The reason, contrary to popular astrological notion and practice, is that the physical birth time ("first breath") horoscope is not synonomous with the time the soul selects its cosmic patterns. Such a time occurs before physical entry into this world (during labor) and can can be up to four-and-a-half (to five) hours prior to the physical birth time, but no greater than that. Within each quadrant of a 24-hour day a soul has several potential horoscopes it can choose in connection to its individuality, ideal expression of personality sought, purposes for entering this world, exact location on earth and mathematical timetable of urges that foster the unfolding of influences that are to come in its life as it grows and develops on this earth.

In many cases (but certainly not in all) the real, soul-selected (or cosmic-based) birth time (or horoscope) shifts the Ascendant/house cusps one-to-two signs/houses back from that shown according to one's birth certificate time. I've delineated many astrological horoscopes that corroborate this. But, I don't expect you to take my word on it alone. The best (and first) thing you can do is to rely on your first-hand experience - or reality itself - by asking yourself: What is my personality? How do I relate to others? What do I like - do - seek to be - think...how do I go about my activities, etc.? Write down in no uncertain terms what you know to be you. Then, honestly ask and answer to yourself (excluding all ifs, ands or buts): What Ascendant - physically and mentally - does my personality reflect the most - Leo, Cancer or Gemini.

My experience comes from studying these characteristics for almost a period of seven years straight (thanks to my mentor whose studied same for over a period of 50 years). That, in addition to real-life experience and studying the characteristics of family members, friends, co-workers, bosses and celebrities whose horoscopes I've verified. In every case, they match precisely their lives, personalities and event-related activities with greater accuracy (and total precision) than what their physical (false) birth times showed. Some of their Ascendant signs changed; others' remained the same; but in every case, the true horoscope characteristics were always earlier than the reported birth time (and quite often, way earlier).

Since this is an astrological phenomena that is rarely talked about or known, I had to take it upon myself to do something about it, because astrologers (and those interested in same) need to know the truth - even when it conflicts with what has been (falsely) established. Hence, I've included the link below to assists in your review and in determining which Ascendant you really have. What is shown therein are the actual physical and mental natures of the 12 Ascendant signs and the celebrities who embody them.

The link is: http://the9thorbit.com/index_files/index9.htm

It's also worth mentioning that although verification of true birth times involves a process similar to rectification, possible moments of incarnation times are objectively calculated prior to doing so. From those calculated, only the potential candidate horoscopes (i.e., those that actually reflect the real Ascendant sign, signs on house cusps positions, planets in houses, planets on angles and pertinent secondary progressions that corroborate exactly, and without equivocation, all areas and major dated events in one's life) need to be examined and confirmed for total (100% accurate) functionality.

I would also like to say that there is no intention to ignore or downplay other astrologers (even if most horoscopes are in error). Many have and do extract profound and indepth interpretations and insights from the configurations among the planets in the horoscopes they delineate - both for themselves and for clients. That being said, it's hard to sit by, stand still and not say anything about what I know to be the truth and that would also significantly improve not only the delineations and interpretations of fellow astrologers to near (if not complete) perfection but also the scientific application and advancement of astrology as such (including the entire astrological profession).

In any case, once you have determined which Ascendant most reflects who you really are (or if you have further questions), I'll assists you further in obtaining your correct horoscope.


P.S. By the way, what is your exact date of birth? While I can see the astrological configurations, the birth data is blocked out.

Best regards,

Shaun
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  #3  
Unread 06-17-2007, 09:24 PM
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Re: I was wondering what this means?

I was born at 2:40 pm (ish) .

Thank you for the information Shaun! From the link you gave me, I would probably liken my personality and appearance to that of Pisces/scorpio.
I've been analysing the whole leo ascendant thing, and I've noticed that I am the last to admit vulnerability/ a lack of confidence in serious matters, although I'm not sure if this is due to my nurturing (amongst only leonians and arians). I am also very confident and talented in making speeches and performing, so I've been told, which surprises alot of people as they believed me to be greatly introverted and piscean. I like to perceive myself as quietly confident, and perhaps this is where Leo comes into play.

However, I can not deny that I am the complete opposite in social situations to the leo rising and that I am very slight, physically. It just doesn't tie in very well.

Last edited by fishy; 06-17-2007 at 09:41 PM.
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  #4  
Unread 06-18-2007, 07:20 AM
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Mercury, to fishy

fishy,

You have an unaspected Mercury (thinking, also talking). Since Mercury is "unaspected" you do not "connect in" to your Mercury energy and so you see yourself as not being talkative. In addition, most of your energy is on the right (others) side of the chart, so you focus on others and may not be aware of yourself personally that much.

Other-focused,

Tim
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  #5  
Unread 06-18-2007, 12:27 PM
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Re: I was wondering what this means?

Fishy,
Just pulled this out of another thread, mental health and the "ego".
Original poster was Shiningray, and it is from a Liz green book.
Is this relevent to you at all.
You have saturn in aquarus in the seventh house.

Quote:
Saturn in Aquarius and the eleventh house

It has been said of Aquarius that everything may be seen in the shop window but nothing is to be found in the shop, and it is easy enough to draw this conclusion when confronted with the textbook descriptions of the sign and the association of the eleventh house with hopes and wishes, clubs, and societies. The immense depth and wisdom which are revealed by a study of astrology are not so apparent in this rather incomplete interpretation of the eleventh house and sign. With Saturn and Uranus as its rulers, Aquarius is perhaps entitled to a more complex meaning, and it is possible that the eleventh house is also more complicated and more abstruse than it is traditionally considered.

The tenth house is both the high point of achievement for the individual and his place of burial for it symbolises his deepest immersion in the material world and demands of him the sacrifices of his private and personal desires in order to obtain his goal. If the circle of the twelve houses is seen as a cycle of progressively more complex steps in the unfoldment of the individual's outer life, the tenth house, which belongs to Saturn, may be considered the end of the climb of the personality. In the remaining two houses, both of which are connected with "higher octave" planets and therefore with states of consciousness that are collective or transpersonal rather than personal in nature, the individual loses himself in the group and shoulders his responsibility as a cell in the larger body of humanity. His tests have been met, he has developed personal integration to the point where his mind, emotions, and body function as a disciplined and finely balanced tool to serve his inner purposes, and he is now free to join in the larger task of group integration and development. The passage from Saturn to Uranus marks the transition from the supremacy of the personal will to the development of group consciousness. Group consciousness is not mass consciousness for with the former the contribution is voluntary and the worth of the individual is not lost. This may appear to be a rather esoterically inclined interpretation of what is apparently a superficial house and sign. But if we are ever to make any sense of Saturn and his houses and signs from any viewpoint other than a fatalistic one, or are ever to understand the real nature and extent of the individual's free will and purpose, it is possible that in the esoteric tradition of Saturn some information may be found which helps us to lead freer lives.

People who are strongly Aquarian or Piscean in temperament, yet who have not yet developed a purpose which permits them participation in a larger expression, are often lost creatures, and it is perhaps more difficult for this kind of temperament now because the idea of group consciousness is not yet a reality. It is reasonably common to find the average Taurean personality concerned with his security for this is his natural outlet of expression—or for the average Libran to concern himself with his personal relationships, or the Geminian with his education. But the Aquarian and Piscean temperaments have no personal concerns. And if they are not yet sensitive to the more universal concerns which are the natural expression of these signs, they are left with no concerns at all. It is small wonder that so many alcoholics and drug addicts are strongly Piscean or Neptunian by temperament and that so many of the mentally ill must cope with Aquarian or Uranian energies. To balance this, it must be considered that we owe some of our greatest scientific and psychological discoveries to the Uranian type and some of our greatest poetry, music, and spiritual vision to the Neptunian. It is somewhat easier to understand the great potential and the great failure of these two types in light of the urge toward group involvement and contribution which motivates them both.

If we then look past the level of clubs and societies when considering the eleventh house and apply the idea of group consciousness and the nature of one's responsibility and contribution in this area as a possible additional meaning for this house, more insight may be gained into the meaning of Saturn's placement here. The more ordinary meaning of the eleventh house is often in evidence with its connotation of friendships and social acceptance, and Saturn in the eleventh may display his usual aloofness and isolation and thereby mark the individual as a "lone wolf', one who somehow does not fit into the group. He may find difficulty in making casual friendships and in functioning at the more superficial social level which, in our present society, is considered of such value. He may feel himself to be an outsider and will often behave as one, and his separateness is deeper than a mere inability to conform to popular standards of behaviour. The group which is presented to him as the "acceptable" one—those people whom he meets through family, business, religion, or interests—rarely receives him warmly, and he rarely feels himself to be a part of any artificially structured social unit. He is looking for another kind of group, a deeper group, but he rarely understands that the bounds which link this more abstruse group are of an inner, not an outer, nature.

Saturn is often painfully self-conscious and hopelessly inept at the social graces, but he is always the enemy of superficiality when he is expressing his true nature. His presence in the eleventh house is made doubly difficult because the nature of our present ideas about friendship and group activities can be eminently superficial. Saturn may often feel awkward and uncomfortable as he often indicates an introverted and shy tendency. Thus the usual effect of Saturn in the eleventh house is a deep, although often concealed, feeling of loneliness. He may want badly to feel himself a significant part of a larger whole, to be released from the burden of self-consciousness and "differentness". Yet he is often unable to express his need and will sometimes not even admit it to himself.

We consider man to be a gregarious animal, a communal creature rather than a solitary one, and the man who spends long periods alone or rejects the opportunity for social intercourse is somewhat suspect to the average individual. We are brought up to believe that there is something neurotic or unwholesome about aloneness, yet it is probably far more painful to carry the sense of separateness into a crowd than to be physically alone yet experience a sense of belonging. The man with Saturn in the eleventh house is often compulsively driven to be alone, and he may draw back from friendships because he is afraid he will not be accepted. It is frequently necessary for him to balance this fear and sense of inadequacy with a need to glamourise his uniqueness so that out of pride his separateness is demonstrated to be a virtue rather than a shortcoming. It is probably neither a virtue nor a lack, but the unconscious man with Saturn in the eleventh house is not aware that he has more choices than this. So one of the most typical reactions of an eleventh house Saturn may be demonstrated: he must be superior, he can have no equals. Just as Saturn in Leo finds it painfully difficult to express his uniqueness in an open way, Saturn in Aquarius often finds it painfully difficult to express his ordinariness, his similarity with every other human being—although it is this ordinariness, this blending with the group, which he desires the most. Saturn in the eleventh house is often interpreted as having few and faithful friends; and it is the quality, rather than the quantity, which is important.

Overcompensation is often expressed by this Saturnian placement, and it is common to find the individual who crams his life full of social activities so that he scarcely has time to be alone. He will
often fill his time so that he rarely needs to have personal confrontations, and it is often so important to him that he demonstrate his belonging that he will subdue his own individuality in order to cater to the standards and ideas of the group. So Saturn in the eleventh house may become a follower rather than the leader which he essentially needs to be. His own ideals, his wishes, and his dreams are worthless when compared to the final and inexorable word of the great They. Saturn in the eleventh house may sometimes symbolise this kind of social butterfly in the same way that Saturn in the third house may suggest a chatterer and Saturn in the seventh a perpetual Don Juan. But this butterfly often has wings of lead. He remains as essentially isolated and apart, as if he were alone, because inwardly he seeks a deeper and more meaningful sharing. But the work involved in achieving that deeper level of interchange would lead him into himself and into a search for a different set of social values as well as a deeper understanding of society itself and its purpose.

The opportunity which is offered by Saturn in the eleventh is not easily utilised without the kind of broad view of human oneness and gradual evolution and unfoldment which marks the truly progressive mind. This has little to do directly with political involvement although this area is a natural adjunct to the kind of vision which is often found in the Aquarian temperament. But Saturn has little to do with theories; he offers his wisdom through the more difficult but more meaningful channel of personal experience and realisation; and the understanding of the psychology of the group and the direction in which man's consciousness is slowly striving is an understanding which can be the inner illumination of the individual who has Saturn in Aquarius or in the eleventh house. Esoteric literature speaks repeatedly of "the Plan" for man, and this plan must remain in the realm of the theoretical and the visionary for the majority of people. To the discerning eye of an eleventh house Saturn, it is possible that the reality and nature of this plan may become visible if he seeks long enough and deeply enough the inner group which means so much to him.

If he permits his vision to be narrow, Saturn will rarely find the solution to his isolation, and we may then observe the fulfilment of the prophecy of hard luck through friends which is said to accompany this placement. For one who sets himself apart to such a degree, and who feels such mistrust of others is bound to attract something similar in return from his fellows. Like forever attracts like, and the bristly defensiveness which may often be seen in an eleventh house Saturn—even in those who have polished the surface of social charm until it shines but who cannot permit deeper friendships—usually attracts defensiveness back.

Each individual contains the potential of the higher or more universal meaning of the eleventh house to unfold along with the more personal. Few people are conscious of this potential because a more careful investigation of values and a more inclusive interest in humanity is generally a prerequisite for its unfoldment; however, the eleventh house is present on every birth chart, and the challenge of finding meaningful expression for the urges which are symbolised is present in every life. This becomes more urgent a task for the person who has Saturn in the eleventh house, or in Aquarius, because as with any other Saturnian position, second choice is not acceptable, and with this placement the sense of commitment to and participation in group life must be real.
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Unread 06-18-2007, 09:42 PM
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Re: I was wondering what this means?

WOW! That is amazingly relevant, Tsquare, despite it being the eleventh house. It's almost scaring me. That passage described my inner and outer nature in ways that I could never explain myself. I have always had a tendency to withdraw and a distinct need for solitude, accompanied by a certain ineptness in social situations. I also find it difficult to be ordinary and I am very comfortable with weirdness, as such, and people can see me as somewhat zany, reclusive and eccentric( I know I sound mad, but it's the truth!). I am very much an outsider from groups because of this and for seemingly unexplicable reasons (I guess that they are shown in my chart), which makes me feel incredibly lonely. On the plus side, however, I have a very small close knit group of friends whom I can rely on and generally understand me (although I still have trouble with my awkward tendencies and feeling slightly removed).
I don't know whether saturn in aquarius in the seventh house is a blessing or a curse but I hope I can make the most of it. I will strive for acceptance and try to be more trusting- then maybe perhaps I might just succeed. I think I'll stick with my poetry and try not to become too unhinged!

Thank you so much!


Fishy
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  #7  
Unread 06-20-2007, 06:29 PM
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Re: I was wondering what this means?

Hi, fishy.

If you don't mind telling me so, what is the month, day, year and exact location (hospital name and/or address) of your birth? You can either post it on the forum or tell me via private message.

By the way, what you described about yourself reflects Cancer rising. While not all Leo rising natives are flamboyant (that would be ridulous and inconsiderate of the many differences that appear in - and pertain to - the natal chart of each individual), there is hardly, if ever, a shying away from the limelight. Leos tend to be born leaders, like to manage the affairs of other people and things and often become the center of attention. As for Cancer, she likes to lead as well but prefers working behind the scenes or in small groups (unless aspects show otherwise) and is often the power behind the scenes.

To the contrary, that's not to say this sign does not like the attention received from others. In fact, popularity is likely (another Jurisdication governed by the Moon), but overall, Cancer is more quiet than noisy and prefers working in small, close-nit and personal settings (as opposed to large crowds). While Cancer is not necessarily more than a participant in conversations (or likely to dominant the scene) it does like to share and tell stories, is a good teacher, quite creative and very sensitive. Paramount importance is placed on close-nit friendships, family ties and bondings with the significant other.

Also, while somewhat conservative, this sign still does have an independent streak (for it is a cardinal-water sign) and is cautious in readily accepting the opinions of others. While more research needs to be done, one thing I've noticed with those who actally have Cancer rising (i.e., as shown from their verified horoscopes) is that they do not ordinarily follow a tried and true (or beaten) path. For some reason, too, Uranus or Pluto tends to be quite strong (and there are a few ways in which planets gain strength in a horoscope).

Well, let me know what you determine and from that point we can move to the next level.

Warm regards,

Shaun

Last edited by Shaun; 06-20-2007 at 07:05 PM.
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Unread 06-21-2007, 08:23 PM
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Re: I was wondering what this means?

Sorry about that Shaun- I forgot that I'd erased my details from the chart out of paranoia!

I'm PMing you now.

Fishy
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