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  #1  
Unread 01-03-2015, 05:19 AM
astralrabbit astralrabbit is offline
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Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

Hello everyone and thank you for sharing your thoughts and guidance pertaining to Horary Astrology. I realize that it does take time to seriously answer what you see in a chart and I just want to say thank you to all who do answer in effort to learn more and to teach the rest of us.

I do have a question that I feel that I know the answer to already, but I feel this will be one to add to the known outcome.

I am supposed to have visitation with my boys every other weekend since I returned from overseas after losing in court my bid to have them for the summer as promised.
So far over the last 2 mos I have travelled 7 hours every other saturday to visit with my children. There mother has not brought them or allowed me to speak with them. I am leaving in the morning and so I would like to ask now;

Will she bring the boys at 2 pm tomorrow for visitation so that I can give them there Christmas presents? Thank you in advanced as always.

AR

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  #2  
Unread 01-03-2015, 05:21 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

yes you will

saturn rules the kids
venus you directly applies nicely

moon/jupiter nice aspect

Let us know
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  #3  
Unread 01-03-2015, 05:24 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

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Originally Posted by tikana View Post
yes you will

saturn rules the kids
venus you directly applies nicely

moon/jupiter nice aspect

Let us know
Thank you Tikana, I will let you all know as soon as...!
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  #4  
Unread 01-03-2015, 11:22 PM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?



They did not show up today~
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Unread 01-03-2015, 11:48 PM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

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Originally Posted by astralrabbit View Post


They did not show up today~
I am so sorry.
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  #6  
Unread 01-04-2015, 12:12 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

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Originally Posted by astralrabbit View Post


They did not show up today~
Interesting. I might have gone the same way tikana did, except for the Moon's application to Jupiter. Jupiter is retrograde (so returning, meaning he can't accept what Moon is pushing) and Moon is applying from Jupiter's detriment. Classic not-reception/rejection. Jupiter is a natural significator of children, but beyond that I can't readily see how Jupiter ends up representing the kids in this chart. The only thing I can think is that as the greater benefic in the 11th (hopes and wishes) then Jupiter is just there to say no. Though, Jupiter is L3 and L6. Was there a miscommunication, travel delay, or did someone get sick? Angles are all cardinal, which could mean something initiated and then later broken off...just thinking out loud here.

As to Venus applying to Saturn, Venus has to change signs for that aspect to perfect. Once she does Venus is received by Saturn. I'd say you will see your children at some point, though as you already know not "tomorrow."
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Unread 01-04-2015, 12:17 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

UGH

the only logical explanation is mars in 5th and jupiter retro - delay.

but then "tomorrow" clause doesnt always work

moon out of 9th applying to jup -- timing???

T
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Unread 01-04-2015, 12:21 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

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Originally Posted by tikana View Post
UGH

the only logical explanation is mars in 5th and jupiter retro - delay.

but then "tomorrow" clause doesnt always work

moon out of 9th applying to jup -- timing???

T
I've been caught in that a few times. We assume that the answer is going to just be yes/no, but rafaella reminded me (I forget which thread) that we always have to check the chart to see if the "yes/no" is now, later, or never, lol.
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  #9  
Unread 01-04-2015, 12:30 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

I do not do horary the same way as most do here on this forum, in that I use the sidereal zodiac and whole signs. I might be able to explain the missing children.



Querent: 1st, Virgo, Mercury in 5th (concern for children).
Quesited Layer 1 (woman): 7th, Pisces, Jupiter(in turned 5th, similar concern for children).
Quesited Layer 2 (children): 3rd from 7th (as they are with her) 9th from you (long distance away), Cancer, Moon.

Now that the significator are properly set up, it can be seen that the woman applies to the children (Jupiter sextile Moon) and you do not. You make no aspect to the children.


I would say that she might have had the intention to bring them - or promised to (Venus, significator of travel in her turned 3rd conjunct your mercury). But Venus also applies to Saturn indicating delays or obstructions.

Seeing as Saturn was in your 3rd, were the two of you planning on meeting halfway?

Last edited by duenderoja; 01-04-2015 at 12:35 AM.
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Unread 01-04-2015, 12:30 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

it moon had been anglular i would def would be scratching my head with WHAT THE HECK!

btw i didnt even test radicality of the chart.. hour agreement


i actually raised the question on FB group

when you box in the question with timing, does the timing override the question's timing or does it stick within the question's time?
i think it overrides the timing in the question.

T
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Last edited by tikana; 01-04-2015 at 12:43 AM.
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  #11  
Unread 01-04-2015, 12:42 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

I'm very sorry that it turned out this way for you.

I did notice that Venus (ruler 1st) is at 29 degrees and this usually indicates changeable situation beyond your control. The moon (as a last aspect) was going to make an inconjunct to Venus (you) which causes a break and adjust in the path which adds to the uncertainty of the situation. Neither of these would favor a positive outcome on the question.

I usually use the moon to identify the question and in this case, it falls in the 9th (note, I use whole sign and all planets). If you had to travel to see the children, this could explain this position.

I did notice that you asked if she would bring children tomorrow, yet the time the question was framed, it would have been today ...


Also, even though you have not included all the planets (which I use), the 5th is ruled by Uranus which is in the 7th which would be the other person and this could also suggest that they would be keeping them close and be another small negative for your question.

I wnet back and checked the chart again to see where Mars is (ruler of the 7th) and it happens to be in the 5th. Very tight connection between the 7th and 5th ... hmmm ... avery suggestive that the ex-partner is not letting them out of sight.


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Last edited by Marinka; 01-04-2015 at 12:45 AM. Reason: edited to add ruler of 7th in 5th
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  #12  
Unread 01-04-2015, 01:48 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall View Post
Interesting. I might have gone the same way tikana did, except for the Moon's application to Jupiter. Jupiter is retrograde (so returning, meaning he can't accept what Moon is pushing) and Moon is applying from Jupiter's detriment. Classic not-reception/rejection. Jupiter is a natural significator of children, but beyond that I can't readily see how Jupiter ends up representing the kids in this chart. The only thing I can think is that as the greater benefic in the 11th (hopes and wishes) then Jupiter is just there to say no. Though, Jupiter is L3 and L6. Was there a miscommunication, travel delay, or did someone get sick? Angles are all cardinal, which could mean something initiated and then later broken off...just thinking out loud here.

As to Venus applying to Saturn, Venus has to change signs for that aspect to perfect. Once she does Venus is received by Saturn. I'd say you will see your children at some point, though as you already know not "tomorrow."
Would Jupiter's retrogradation have some say in the matter with the moon. Meaning Jupiter's optimism is more internalized within me, "the querent", in the house of hopes and dreams?

Thank you
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Unread 01-04-2015, 02:02 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

Rabbit

jupiter rules children naturally

page 226 William Lilly Christian Astrology II "consider Jupiter, who naturally signifieth Children..."

T
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  #14  
Unread 01-04-2015, 02:06 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

[QUOTE]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marinka View Post
I'm very sorry that it turned out this way for you.


Thank you, it's okay, I will not lose hope~

Quote:
I did notice that Venus (ruler 1st) is at 29 degrees and this usually indicates changeable situation beyond your control.
So when there is a planet or a significator in the Anaretic degree of any sign, this would add complications because of the energy waning and preparing to enter a new sign?


Quote:
The moon (as a last aspect) was going to make an inconjunct to Venus (you) which causes a break and adjust in the path which adds to the uncertainty of the situation. Neither of these would favor a positive outcome on the question.
I find this interesting for I was thinking of this earlier pertaining to quincunx aspects; if they were considered in determining an outcome to the question.

Quote:
I usually use the moon to identify the question and in this case, it falls in the 9th (note, I use whole sign and all planets). If you had to travel to see the children, this could explain this position.
423 miles to be exact

Quote:
I did notice that you asked if she would bring children tomorrow, yet the time the question was framed, it would have been today ...
Quote:
Yes I was up late not able to sleep reflecting and hoping for the best. Time became irrelevant quickly, once I started reading a wonderful thread on Horary.
Quote:
[FONT=Book Antiqua][SIZE=3]Also, even though you have not included all the planets (which I use), the 5th is ruled by Uranus which is in the 7th which would be the other person and this could also suggest that they would be keeping them close and be another small negative for your question.
If you would also notice the applying square between the 7th house ruler and the 5th....unhappiness

Quote:
I wnet back and checked the chart again to see where Mars is (ruler of the 7th) and it happens to be in the 5th. Very tight connection between the 7th and 5th ... hmmm ... avery suggestive that the ex-partner is not letting them out of sight.
Sigh....Transiting Saturn Trining her Sun conjunct Asc Square pluto conjunct Saturn aspect....as well as the sun/asc inconjunct moon....Boy I tell you... She wins the, "I am going to crush you like a little bug contest" with that whole control thing happening.
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Unread 01-04-2015, 02:12 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

Quote:
Was there a miscommunication, travel delay, or did someone get sick?
No. She never responded to acknowledge that I was coming to have my visitation. It has been this way for the last two months now. I have to make this journey every other weekend no matter what. She just will not be cool you know.
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Unread 01-04-2015, 02:13 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

cant you do anything legally against this? cause this is ******* up.. violation of an agreement?
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Unread 01-04-2015, 02:16 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

[/QUOTE]Seeing as Saturn was in your 3rd, were the two of you planning on meeting halfway?[QUOTE]

Thank you for your response, and to answer your question, Nope...I have to travel there at this time.
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Unread 01-04-2015, 02:19 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

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Originally Posted by tikana View Post
cant you do anything legally against this? cause this is ******* up.. violation of an agreement?
Yes! I emailed my attorney and he is going to initiate a show cause in the current action; so ....I am hoping that the new judge will be more impartial....finger's crossed...and find her in contempt.
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  #19  
Unread 01-04-2015, 02:32 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

[QUOTE=astralrabbit;594058]Yes! I emailed my attorney and he is going to initiate a show cause in the current action; so ....I am hoping that the new judge will be more impartial....finger's crossed...and find her in contempt.[/QUOTE

see here is the thing
venus was weak in cap
all of a sudden it get help NOT only from getting into aquarius where it is stronger
but collection of light between merc/venus/saturn

so tech speaking merc could be your attorney

i wonder if you could get a full custody
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Last edited by tikana; 01-04-2015 at 02:37 AM.
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  #20  
Unread 01-04-2015, 02:39 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

[QUOTE=astralrabbit;594052]
Quote:

So when there is a planet or a significator in the Anaretic degree of any sign, this would add complications because of the energy waning and preparing to enter a new sign?
An important planet at this degree indicates a possibility of being "out of control" with someone else pulling the strings and not in a good way. The energy is not necessarily waning, it's chaotic as it readies to explode into the new sign. With this planet signifying you, not the best sign that it will go according to plan.

[QUOTE=astralrabbit;594052]
Quote:

I find this interesting for I was thinking of this earlier pertaining to quincunx aspects; if they were considered in determining an outcome to the question.
Speaking for myself and my procedures, the inconjunct has become the "missing link" in my interpretations across the board. I have found this aspect to be very powerful in understanding when things must shift and take a new direction.

[QUOTE=astralrabbit;594052]
Quote:


If you would also notice the applying square between the 7th house ruler and the 5th....unhappiness


Sigh....Transiting Saturn Trining her Sun conjunct Asc Square pluto conjunct Saturn aspect....as well as the sun/asc inconjunct moon....Boy I tell you... She wins the, "I am going to crush you like a little bug contest" with that whole control thing happening.
As to the square between Mars and Saturn, I use all planets/rulerships and as such, Uranus rules the 5th.

As to her Saturn trining her sun ... you lost me there, how is her sun in the chart?
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  #21  
Unread 01-08-2015, 10:54 AM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

Hi folks I dont know if anyone noticed but before Venus can connect with Saturn there is a Prohibition. Mercury is significantly faster and connects with Venus first before Venus perfects the aspect with Saturn. So this would be a No to the question. There is also the widely held belief that aspects made out of signs that are indifferant to each other, as is the case here with Saturn being in Saggitarius, and Venus being in Capricorn, then they are not proper aspects. Like Frawleys conjunctions not in the same house are not conjunctions theory, ie you cant conjunct someone if they are in someone elses house. In answering questions we have to keep common sense uppermost in regards to the question also. The heavens are very mechanical in answering your query. The question asked was Will she bring the boys tomorrow. We know the boys cannot travel by themselves, so the reality of the situation is implicit in the question. He should be looking for an aspect with the 7th ruler ie wife. There is the aspect with the Moon, but connections with the Moon are always doubtful as this shows more wishful thinking and it would have to be very strong . In this case there is no reception. So unfortunately it still produces a negative answer. Just food for thought folks.
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  #22  
Unread 01-08-2015, 05:31 PM
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Re: Will she bring the boys tomorrow?

merc is L9 which is an attorney
saturn are the kids
and there is L1

sounds like the querent will need help from an attorney to see his kids
that is collection of light
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