applying opposition without reception.

Hi,

I wonder how are you guys' expereices for an applying opposition?

I cast a relational horary chart, the signifitors are moon in Taurus and saturn in Scoprio, the aspect are applying and in very tight orb. moon at 15.23' / Saturn at 15.28'

some says opposition could sometimes mean yes if applying, but it could means no without mutual reception.

what's your experiences? I'd appreciate your opinions and sharing. Thanks.

SC8 said:

Hi,

I wonder how are you guys' expereices for an applying opposition?

I cast a relational horary chart, the signifitors are moon in Taurus and saturn in Scoprio, the aspect are applying and in very tight orb. moon at 15.23' / Saturn at 15.28'

some says opposition could sometimes mean yes if applying, but it could means no without mutual reception.

what's your experiences? I'd appreciate your opinions and sharing. Thanks.

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Moon in Taurus is exalted, Saturn in Scorpio at his current degree is combust and out of sect, not to mention in the fall of the Moon. Where is the Sun? As in, is this a day chart or night chart?

Opposition implies contention or a possible compromise, reception will show which. Saturn combust (though escaping) is like cowering in the corner, and Moon exalted is pushing whatever she wants onto Saturn. In Saturn's weakened state, there really isn't much he can do about it, except to return it back to Moon, and depending on how far out of sect Saturn is, possibly with corruption. Moon is exalted and can take it, but it wouldn't be particularly pretty. Of course, all is speculation without an <ahem> chart.

Significator Moon in the same sign as SN is always a negative indcation.
By the Ankara horary method I follow (where reception plays no role at all) with Moon flowing by body toward the other significator Saturn, this would be a + testimony; applying to an opposition would lessen the + indication considerably' significator Moon with the SN in Taurus would cancel out the exaltation of the Moon, and would cast an net overall somewhat negative interpretation to this question (by the Ankara horary method which is NOT standard/generally practiced horary doctrine...)

dr. farr said:

Significator Moon in the same sign as SN is always a negative indcation.
By the Ankara horary method I follow (where reception plays no role at all) with Moon flowing by body toward the other significator Saturn, this would be a + testimony; applying to an opposition would lessen the + indication considerably' significator Moon with the SN in Taurus would cancel out the exaltation of the Moon, and would cast an net overall somewhat negative interpretation to this question (by the Ankara horary method which is NOT standard/generally practiced horary doctrine...)

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It may not be standard horary (via traditional, tropical, Western dilineative methods) but isn't interesting how often we can get to the same net result (whithout a chart, I was hesitant about SN, so glad you brought it up)?

Hi,

I thank both of your contributions. I learned a bit more about horary methods now.

tsmall said:

Where is the Sun? As in, is this a day chart or night chart?

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the sun was in scoprio, it was a night chart.

It would be easier if you cast a chart.
Opposition is yes, but something you wished it never happened.
It depends on question. Aspect is important, but we mustn't overlook dignities. Sometimes there's also 3rd part involved. So, cast a chart

SC8 said:

Hi,

I wonder how are you guys' expereices for an applying opposition?

I cast a relational horary chart, the signifitors are moon in Taurus and saturn in Scoprio, the aspect are applying and in very tight orb. moon at 15.23' / Saturn at 15.28'

some says opposition could sometimes mean yes if applying, but it could means no without mutual reception.

what's your experiences? I'd appreciate your opinions and sharing. Thanks.

Click to expand...

I did a horary question, while Moon was in Taurus opposing Saturn Scorpio. No mutual reception. The main signficators were Sun/Saturn and they did NOT aspect; however, Moon is the co-significator. There are also two other applying aspects (connected to the significators), one a semi-square between Sun and Venus, and another a trine between Jupiter (the significator's almuten) and Saturn. Sun and Jupiter was in excellent condition, and the Moon was in Hayz. The Moon was slow. Sun and Saturn fast. Venus slow, and Jupiter Rx.

It turned out to be a "yes", to the question I asked.
It was at 8° and it happened in 8 days.

ognjenka said:

It would be easier if you cast a chart.
Opposition is yes, but something you wished it never happened.
It depends on question. Aspect is important, but we mustn't overlook dignities. Sometimes there's also 3rd part involved. So, cast a chart

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Are you saying that it would be better that it was NOT a yes? That if we get a "yes", we would wish that it wasn't? 3rd part or 3rd party?!

Just a note: in the alternative (non-standard) Ankara horary method (from oldtime Ottoman astrology) which I follow, if significator A flows by body toward significator B, this always indicates + testimony: any applying aspect is (with this method) a minor secondary considertion (VERY different than in standard horary doctrine)-so, if say Sun were flowing by body toward Saturn, that would be a + testimony regardless of any aspect of any nature which the Sun might be applying to Saturn (if such aspect existed it would only be considered a secondary, modifying testimony, by the Ankara method)

Jucy said:

Are you saying that it would be better that it was NOT a yes? That if we get a "yes", we would wish that it wasn't? 3rd part or 3rd party?!

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I'm saying you have to see what every planet involved is doing, dignities, location etc. not only aspect.

Thank you for the clarification.

okay

Opposition with reception mean "2 people will meet IF the reception is not in debilitation but they will split relatively soon"

Opposition with no reception means "meeting but regretting, then splitting" it does not mean NO..

see, in horary aspect is everything.. aspect means an action .. reception/dignity are how the planets feel about the other / wanted / desired subject.

Lilly writes

"The 33rd Consideration is, To see whether either of the Infortunes be the Significator of anything, and be joined to another Infortune impeding him, or has joined to him the Lord of the Ascendant or the Moon, by a square or Opposition; for then this Infortune will perfect the business, but the business will not be good, or rather it will be destroyed after it seems perfected. But if the Infortune that Impedes be the lighter of the two, so that he apply to a Conjunction, with the Significator, it will hinder less than if the Significator apply to the other.

The 37th Consideration is, To look is the Fortunes are the Significators? Whether the Infortunes behold them with Oppositions or Squares; for that will much lessen their kind effects, and diminish the good they otherwise promised."

Then in 1st book he writes

"
the Opposition is an aspect or argument of perfect hatred; which is to be understood thus: A Question is propounded, Whether two persons at variance may be reconciled? Admit I find the two Significators representing the two Adversaries, in Square aspect; I may then judge because the aspect is of imperfect hatred, that the matter is not yet so far gone, but there may be hopes of reconciliation betwixt them, the other Significators or Planets a little helping. But if I find the main significators in opposition, it’s then in nature impossible to expect a peace betwixt them till the suit is ended, if it be a suit of Law; untill they have fought, if it be a Challenge.


In your chart, Moon/Saturn it means that MOon will regret meeting Saturn because Moon and Saturn are cold enemies in a way because Saturn is rigid and you are dealing with Moon which is "warm" in Taurus being rejected in Scorpio since it is opposition. So no luck, Sherlock.

cheers
T

What if the opposing planets are in domiciles? I casted the chart asking if someone will reach out to me? The Lord of the Ascendant is Saturn (Rx) placed in 1st house Aquarius with Jupiter. The subject of the question is in 7th house Leo, with sun in 7th house, conjunct Mercury. Sun is applying to to Saturn. How to Interptet that?

Put up the chart.

IleneK said:

Put up the chart.

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https://ibb.co/PYNMkt0

Forel said:

What if the opposing planets are in domiciles? I casted the chart asking if someone will reach out to me? The Lord of the Ascendant is Saturn (Rx) placed in 1st house Aquarius with Jupiter. The subject of the question is in 7th house Leo, with sun in 7th house, conjunct Mercury. Sun is applying to to Saturn. How to Interptet that?

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Saturn and Sun oppose each other and are in domicile. In this particular opposition of planets in domicile, they are also in mutually adverse reception.

So based on reception, I don't think this person will be inclined to reach out to you. If this person does, this chart does not point to it going well thereafter.

IleneK said:

Saturn and Sun oppose each other and are in domicile. In this particular opposition of planets in domicile, they are also in mutually adverse reception.

So based on reception, I don't think this person will be inclined to reach out to you. If this person does, this chart does not point to it going well thereafter.

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Isn't the fact that the Lords see each other and are in good dignity also making an applying aspect signification of yes answer? Having in mind that Mercury is also applying and moon in 3rd whole sign house is making a trine with Lord of 7th where Jupiter is also applying to 1st house Lord?

Forel said:

Isn't the fact that the Lords see each other and are in good dignity also making an applying aspect signification of yes answer? Having in mind that Mercury is also applying and moon in 3rd whole sign house is making a trine with Lord of 7th where Jupiter is also applying to 1st house Lord?

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I think reception really matters, in addition the significators aspecting.
It is hard for me to get past the mutual adverse reception. They may get together, but I don't think it will last [with the opposition] or that they will like it [with the reception].

IleneK said:

I think reception really matters, in addition the significators aspecting.
It is hard for me to get past the mutual adverse reception. They may get together, but I don't think it will last [with the opposition] or that they will like it [with the reception].

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I may be aware that horary might go by different rules, but it synastry or natal astrology I see oppositions as an axis of completion. It's the opposties that attract, that complement each other in different way, especially when it comes to 1st and 7th house axis. Because you know looking for an ideal partner you usually go to 7th house which is naturally in opposition to the 1st house.

Forel said:

I may be aware that horary might go by different rules, but it synastry or natal astrology I see oppositions as an axis of completion. It's the opposties that attract, that complement each other in different way, especially when it comes to 1st and 7th house axis. Because you know looking for an ideal partner you usually go to 7th house which is naturally in opposition to the 1st house.

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Thank you for your thoughts, Forel.
Yes, as you say, horary is different than natal. The opposition in horary points to a coming together that does not stay together. As I understand it, all aspects in a relational horary chart between the primary significators point to some kind of coming together: a favorable coming together in horary is the conjunction, sextile and trine; an unfavorable coming together is the opposition and the square. These are all generalities which will vary based on other things like essential dignity, reception, domicile of the signficators, and other variables as well.

And what you say is true in natal/synastry about opposites attract. I am so clear how you connect completion with the opposition aspect. With the Moon and Sun, the opposition is the Full Moon, which is not completion in the lunar cycle; rather the completion is at the conjunction, the New Moon.
I would also mention that opposites are open enemies/7th house, so not always so easily coming together and complementing.
I would think that in synastry, trines ,for example, between suns and moon are preferred and more favorable than oppositions?