Has anyone ever used two house systems?

Cupid Arrow

Well-known member
Hey everyone,

Im kinda having a dilemma here. When I use whole house system for example my Venus is in the 12H, when I use Placidus, its in the 11th, howeverr; I realized that both of them seem correct. has anyone gone back and forth between house systems? I know that something that we have to pick up a system but what if you can use to understand yourself as a whole? astrologers disagree on a lot of things so who's to say that we shouldn't use both or that we should choose one, I would like to hear you guys opinions. Thanks for your input.
 

Bina

Well-known member
Hi,
yeah I used to use Placidus, but have some pretty big and some very small houses in that, so I started looking at equal houses, and that seems to make more sense for most placements. But a few seem to fit better in Placidus, which makes it hard to decide and stick with one system...Quite a lot of planets change houses in my chart between the two systems...:sideways:
 

david starling

Well-known member
Hey everyone,

Im kinda having a dilemma here. When I use whole house system for example my Venus is in the 12H, when I use Placidus, its in the 11th, howeverr; I realized that both of them seem correct. has anyone gone back and forth between house systems? I know that something that we have to pick up a system but what if you can use to understand yourself as a whole? astrologers disagree on a lot of things so who's to say that we shouldn't use both or that we should choose one, I would like to hear you guys opinions. Thanks for your input.

I always check both Placidus and Whole-sign to see which fits better. I believe it's about a choice in Life-path, and that choice may vary. I can see when my own Life-path changed to Whole-sign and I stayed with it. It was before I knew much about the Houses, and Placidus had already stopped working for my own Chart. I made the mistake of thinking it didn't work for anyone else's Chart, just because it didn't work for mine. For years, I stopped using Houses at all! Then I joined the Community and found about about Whole-sign, and started learning about Houses again. You can do A LOT without them, but more, with them. Same with Sect.
 
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JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Hey everyone,

Im kinda having a dilemma here.
When I use whole house system for example my Venus is in the 12H,
when I use Placidus, its in the 11th, howeverr;
I realized that both of them seem correct.
has anyone gone back and forth between house systems?
I know that something that we have to pick up a system
but what if you can use to understand yourself as a whole?
astrologers disagree on a lot of things
so who's to say that we shouldn't use both
or that we should choose one,
I would like to hear you guys opinions. Thanks for your input.
Hey :smile:
I use BOTH whole signs AND Alcabitius

and in fact
tsmall uses BOTH whole signs AND Placidus

some use whole sign AND Regiomontanus
there are multiple house systems
its a matter of personal choice


I shall quote tsmalls comment
posted on another thread at
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=94683

I useboth whole signs and Placidus.
The original idea of quadrant based house systems was to determine angularity,
and never to replace the concept of topics.
So I count signs for topics and use a house system overlaid onto it.
Because, as I mentioned above,
capibility
and
angularity/ability to act are two different things.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member

If you were doing a reading for someone,
would you stick too one or use both simultaneously?
Tsmall explained :smile:
'.....The original idea of quadrant based house systems was to determine angularity,
and never to replace the concept of topics.

So I count signs for topics and use a house system overlaid onto it.

Because, as I mentioned above,
capibility
and
angularity/ability to act are two different things.....'
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member

I take both into account if it makes sense
keep in mind that
the current understanding of whole signs
differs from the way astrologers originally utilised whole sign houses

as dr. farr has stated many times
the 0 degrees beginning every sign in whole sign houses is the BORDER of the whole sign house
NOT the CUSP :smile:


then keep in mind dr. farrs synopsis
that the original meaning of the word "cusp" meant "point"
such as cuspal teeth (bicuspids) and the point of a sword
-so originally the term cusp meant the "point" of something,
and in astrology originally the "cusp" of the whole sign house meant its "point"
NOT THE BORDER BETWEEN ONE HOUSE AND ANOTHER
BUT INSTEAD
THE POINT (cusp) for EACH house was the sensitive point of that house
i.e.
the ascending degree.

So the 0 degrees of whole sign houses determines the INGRESS point of planets
while the SENSITIVE POINT of whole sign houses is linked to the ascending degree
 

Cupid Arrow

Well-known member
Tsmall explained :smile:
'.....The original idea of quadrant based house systems was to determine angularity,
and never to replace the concept of topics.

So I count signs for topics and use a house system overlaid onto it.

Because, as I mentioned above,
capibility
and
angularity/ability to act are two different things.....'

I'm sorry but I do not know what you speak of. I'm new to astrology so what you say needs more explaining. If you would don't mind.

But I did notice planets change depending on house systems and like the example, I agree with the explanations of the my Venus being in the 11H and 12H.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
I'm sorry but I do not know what you speak of.
I'm new to astrology so what you say needs more explaining. I
f you would don't mind.

But I did notice planets change depending on house systems
and like the example,
I agree with the explanations of the my Venus being in the 11H and 12H.
1st, 4th, 7th and 10th HOUSES are ANGULAR

There's a link to a good explanation of ANGULARITY for you
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/horary1d.html :smile:
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
here's dr. farr's original :smile:
clear, succinct explication/synopsis on WHOLE SIGN HOUSES history
posted at
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...413#post311413


Cusps:


Today
(and for the past thousand years or so)
we define cusps as "borders" (coasts),

but that is not the original meaning of the word "cusp":
it means "point"

such as
cuspal teeth (bicuspids)
and
the point of a sword

-so originally the term cusp meant the "point" of something,

and
in astrology originally the "cusp" of the house meant its "point"
;

now, when quadrant systems were developed, this "point" of the house came to mean its "beginning",
which later came to mean its "border",
ie, the "border" between one house and the other.

And later astrology also began using these "borders" (cusps)
for various prognostic applications
(Charles Carter came to believe that, for timing of events, the "cusps" of the Campanus house system gave the best results,
among the various quadrant house systems)


But now notice this:
in whole sign the cusps are NOT the 0 degree "borders" of sign/houses at all, and never were so regarded!

In whole sign, the "cusp" retained its original meaning,
not as a "border"
but rather as A POINT


-and that POINT (cusp) for EACH house,
was the sensitive point of that house,
viz,
the sensitive point in whole sign houses
-each house
-that is the "cusp" of each house
-is a direct projection from the ascending degree.


Example:
-the ascending degree of a chart is 18 Taurus:
what are the house cusps
(sensitive points, original meaning of the word "cusp")
in the whole sign houses of this chart?
Cusp of 1st house = 18 Taurus
Cusp of 2nd house = 18 Gemini
Cusp of 3rd house = 18 Cancer
Cusp of 4th house = 18 Leo
Cusp of 5th house = 18 Virgo
Cusp of 6th house = 18 Libra
Cusp of 7th house = 18 Scorpio
Cusp of 8th house = 18 Sagittarius
Cusp of 9th house = 18 Capricorn
Cusp of 10th house = 18 Aquarius
Cusp of 11th house = 18 Pisces
Cusp of 12th house = 18 Aries

Now it is these "cusps"
(sensitive degrees, original meaning of the word "cusp" as a "point")
that are
(and were)
used for progressions, timing of events, etc,
and the fact is that they work for these purposes, quite well
(in expert hands)

Whole sign does not use the BORDERS between houses
(always 0 degree of any sign) for anything,
but it DOES use "cusps"
(points in the house, projected from the exact ascending degree)
for timing
(and other)
delineative purposes.


Whole sign suddenly vanished
(both in the West and in Vedic astrology)
during the same period of time
-ie, late 8th to early 9th century
-this sudden disappearance suggests a sudden turn in astrological thinking and practices,
rather than a gradual supplanting of a less effective traditional method
(whole sign)
by a new and more effective method
(rheotrius/alchabitius in the West,
and the closely related to whole sign Equal house, in Vedic astrology)


I quite agree with Waybread in the statement, "so what?" (if old time astrologers did or didn't do something)
For me, there is only 1 reason I switched to whole sign
-it worked better (FOR ME)
I could care less if it were the oldest house system
(which it is)
or whether it was invented by Badda Bing at Barney's Beanery in Bayonne, 10 years ago:
only things I consider are:
-does it seem to make sense?
-does it "taste good" to me
(ie, does it "feel right" to me)
-and, if yes to the above,
does it work
(producing delineations and predicitions)
better than what I have previously been doing?

Well, whole sign did all that, for me, so I switched;
but I am not going to try to convince anyone of anything about it,
except for beginners
-to you who might just be starting out,
I would say: try whole sign first,
and see how well it might work for you...

 

Cupid Arrow

Well-known member
here's dr. farr's original :smile:
clear, succinct explication/synopsis on WHOLE SIGN HOUSES history
posted at
http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...413#post311413



That's the thing. Using whole signs places my sun in the 10H but it gives me a stellium in the 11th with Jup conj Saturn and Jup conj Pluto and Pluto conj Mercury. But if I chose Placidus, the 10th is occupied with the sun with Jup and Saturn which seems rather correct for that house, as I come to realize what I want too do in my too life now. Having these planets in Placidus describes later success, I didn't know what I wanted too do in life until now. Lool. Neither has my mother, even though working for jobs but she found her passion now, which is later on in her life. So, I wondered if people simultaneously between both to see the full picture?
My Venus is in the 11th but whole its in the 12th. I would like my husband best friend but the 12th says I don't know my beauty or can't see it which is true.. Do you understand where I'm getting at? It seems like both describe me.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
That's the thing. Using whole signs places my sun in the 10H
You have not stated the SIGN of your Sun
but it gives me a stellium in the 11th with Jup conj Saturn and Jup conj Pluto and Pluto conj Mercury.
No SIGN is mentioned for those planets
But if I chose Placidus, the 10th is occupied with the sun with Jup and Saturn w
hich seems rather correct for that house, as I come to realize what I want too do in my too life now.
Having these planets in Placidus describes later success,
I didn't know what I wanted too do in life until now. Lool.
Neither has my mother, even though working for jobs
but she found her passion now, which is later on in her life.
So, I wondered if people simultaneously between both to see the full picture?
SIGN the planets occupy makes a difference
otherwise it's unreliable generalisation


My Venus is in the 11th but whole its in the 12th.
I would like my husband best friend
but the 12th says I don't know my beauty or can't see it which is true..
Do you understand where I'm getting at?
It seems like both describe me.
A chart to view would clarify :smile:
 

Cupid Arrow

Well-known member
On astro.com extended chart selection page there is WHOLE SIGN HOUSES option
and so comparison is simplified
- that link you posted may expire at any time by the way

If you read the article on ANGULARITY then that explains why
planets being in different houses affects them
:smile:

The chart link still works but I will try to add the whole sign chart if I can.
 
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