The 28th degree
- Thread starter Balanced1
- Start date
piercethevale
Well-known member
Take my advice and save your self a lot of grief and use the Sabian Symbols as interpreted and presented by Dane Rudhyar for all degree symbolism questions... and use only the Sabian Symbols as interpreted and presented by Dane.
Ain't none better... and they are so spot on that you will eventually realize, as I did, that they are the ultimate tool for rectification.
If you don't understand how the symbolism is to be applied, you may have to read the entire text of the book but the link I'm providing has a chapter missing last time I checked. The book is currently out of print but this link provides all 360 degree symbols. You might want to read my thread "The Birth Chart of Jesus?" for the reason that if you know anything at all about the man so known as Jesus of Nazareth then it should be easy for you to see why these symbols are correctly identifying each Zodiacal degree's inherent precept and how they do apply.
and by the way, all those you have posted are in the 29TH DEGREE and not the 28th. Each sign of the Zodiac has thirty degrees numbered from 1 to 30 not 0 to 29.
Here's a taste for that Mars of your's you give as being in the 29th degree of Virgo (and this is very much similar in symbolism to the Mars in the chart I suggested reading, the proposed birth chart of Jesus of Nazareth... which has been proven to be authentic to my satisfaction and that of a good number of other people now)
The follow is from Dane Rudhyar's book "An Astrological Mandala"
"VIRGO 29°: A SEEKER AFTER OCCULT KNOWLEDGE IS READING AN ANCIENT SCROLL WHICH ILLUMINES HIS MIND.
KEYNOTE: After a crisis one should seek to realign the renewed consciousness with the primordial Revelation of the Truth of Man.
Any revolutionary movement, once it has succeeded in over- coming the inertia of the past and in toppling obsolete structures, needs to tap the most essential realities of what Man represents and signifies in the universal Order; or else it merely re-embodies in a superficially altered manner the very things it has destroyed. This is the crucial moment. In occultism the 'Pattern of Man' is an archetypal Power that may be contacted. It must be sought with undeviating determination. After each revolutionary crisis this Pattern and this Power can be contacted — always the same, yet at each new cycle perceivable in a different light.
This fourth stage symbol presents us with the technique required to 'reach the other shore'. But each individual, and each group or racial unit, must come in its own way to the ROOT KNOWLEDGE which provides the only safe foundation for rebirth."
Here's the link to the website that has the 360 Sabian Symbols listed online and most all of the aforementioned book by the late, great, Dane Rudhyar
http://www.mindfire.ca/An Astrological Mandala/An Astrological Mandala - Contents.htm
Ain't none better... and they are so spot on that you will eventually realize, as I did, that they are the ultimate tool for rectification.
If you don't understand how the symbolism is to be applied, you may have to read the entire text of the book but the link I'm providing has a chapter missing last time I checked. The book is currently out of print but this link provides all 360 degree symbols. You might want to read my thread "The Birth Chart of Jesus?" for the reason that if you know anything at all about the man so known as Jesus of Nazareth then it should be easy for you to see why these symbols are correctly identifying each Zodiacal degree's inherent precept and how they do apply.
and by the way, all those you have posted are in the 29TH DEGREE and not the 28th. Each sign of the Zodiac has thirty degrees numbered from 1 to 30 not 0 to 29.
Here's a taste for that Mars of your's you give as being in the 29th degree of Virgo (and this is very much similar in symbolism to the Mars in the chart I suggested reading, the proposed birth chart of Jesus of Nazareth... which has been proven to be authentic to my satisfaction and that of a good number of other people now)
The follow is from Dane Rudhyar's book "An Astrological Mandala"
"VIRGO 29°: A SEEKER AFTER OCCULT KNOWLEDGE IS READING AN ANCIENT SCROLL WHICH ILLUMINES HIS MIND.
KEYNOTE: After a crisis one should seek to realign the renewed consciousness with the primordial Revelation of the Truth of Man.
Any revolutionary movement, once it has succeeded in over- coming the inertia of the past and in toppling obsolete structures, needs to tap the most essential realities of what Man represents and signifies in the universal Order; or else it merely re-embodies in a superficially altered manner the very things it has destroyed. This is the crucial moment. In occultism the 'Pattern of Man' is an archetypal Power that may be contacted. It must be sought with undeviating determination. After each revolutionary crisis this Pattern and this Power can be contacted — always the same, yet at each new cycle perceivable in a different light.
This fourth stage symbol presents us with the technique required to 'reach the other shore'. But each individual, and each group or racial unit, must come in its own way to the ROOT KNOWLEDGE which provides the only safe foundation for rebirth."
Here's the link to the website that has the 360 Sabian Symbols listed online and most all of the aforementioned book by the late, great, Dane Rudhyar
http://www.mindfire.ca/An Astrological Mandala/An Astrological Mandala - Contents.htm
piercethevale
Well-known member
Balanced 1, I noticed that you tried to p.m. me today.
I cleared out some space and you may do so presently if you wish to?
I cleared out some space and you may do so presently if you wish to?
Thank you.
Just to clarify:
The Anaretic degree is usually referred to as the 29th degree. I assumed that the Anaretic degree had to be the end of the zodiac sign, and so I figured the 29th referred to 29 degrees and change.
But you're telling me that 28 and change is the 29th degree.
Does this mean the Anaretic degree is actually the 30th degree? Or is 28 and change still the anaretic degree?
piercethevale
Well-known member
The 30th degree is the anaretic degree. The last degree of every Sign.
A lot of sources refer to the anaretic degree as the 29th degree. You're saying that the anaretic degree is actually the 30th degree.
Either way, the degree before the "anaretic degree" is the 28th degree (for the 0-29er's) and the 29th degree (for the 1-30er's).
So wouldn't the link posted above still apply to my placement?
My degree's are right before the anaretic degree.
I understand your reasoning for saying that it's actually the 29th degree instead of the 28th degree, but if one is doing research online, then that can be confusing, as many people refer to your 29 as 28, and your 30 as 29.
----
I see that you're a major advocate for the Sabian symbol's, and understandably so, but I wish there was more information in regards to applying context.
Online there's a plethora of easily accessible information for planets in houses, planets in signs, signs in houses, etc. But not much for the Sabian's.
One can study them for further understanding, but I'm surprised no one has compiled it to make it easier for people, with less time to study it in depth, to apply them.
----
Edit:
It looks like it's actually this link that applies to my placements.
The previous link is for 27 and change.
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piercethevale
Well-known member
Please read the "Sticky" at near the top of the column for this subforum that is titled "Understanding the Enumeration of the Degrees" for a full explanation and hopefully a resultant understanding.
Or, if you'd rather have a personal explanation, then read on.
To put it in a nutshell [but, please, do read the "sticky" anyways] 29* and change IS THE 30th degree. 29* 00' 00" is the 29th degree but only for the very instant it occurs, the universe is not a static model, as you must surely know, it is ever active and ephemeral.
For instance, Pluto will come up at some point in time as being at 29* 00' 00" and it will remain at that reading according to astrodienst's computer ephemeris for quite a number of many minutes...yet it was only truly at exactly that coordinate for the briefest moment. I accredit such a coordinate to only the very first second after a given location was 28* 59' 59", the next second after it first reads 29* 00' 00" it has gone beyond that mark...infinitesimally so by an astronomers estimation yet Pluto moves in its orbit around the Sun at an estimated 10,623 mph. That's just shy of 3 miles per second.
There's no such thing as 00* 00' 00" degrees of any Sign. That is only correctly identified as being [as that is what it is] 30* 00' 00". But that only exists for the briefest of an instant, in less time than it takes to blink an eye.
Yet, I do consider the very first instant after the reading of 29* 59' 59" by astrodienst's calculations to be 30* 00' 00" as for the reason that my astrological concerns are oriented toward the Spiritual destiny of mankind, first and foremost. It may assist you in understanding what I mean by that by my offering the following statement; "If God has a reason for someone to be born at exactly XX* 00' 00" of any degree of the Zodiac then I haven't the least of any doubt that God has a very good reason that it did, or that it will someday, occur". For that reason alone is all the explanation I have to offer as to why I make such a consideration.
The beginning of any degree begins at XX* 00' 01" [but in the most accurate of possible coordinates it is at XX* 00' 00.00000...01"]
Let me give you an example derived from astronomical facts and data to provide you with, hopefully, a broader understanding or at least a clearer perspective.
As I stated earlier, NASA claims that Pluto travels at apprx. 10,623 mph in its orbit around the Sun. ..and by my use of the word approximate, I'm rather sure that it isn't exactly that measure of speed but almost undoubtedly so many feet more or less than a full mile per hour more or less than 10,623 miles traveled per hour.
On April 2nd of this year, 2018, by Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, U.S.A. time, at 12:01:04 A.M.by astrodiensts calculations Pluto was at 21* Capricorn 10' 59",. At 12:01:05 A.M Pluto was at 21* Capricorn 11' 00".
According to astrodienst at 12:40:34 A.M., Philadelphia, Pennsylvania time Pluto was still at 21* Capricorn 11' 00" and according to astrodienst at 12:40:35 A.M. Pluto was at 21* Capricorn 11' 01"
Thus, according to astronomical measure, Pluto was at the exact same coordinate as to the nearest second of a degree for 39 minutes and 29 seconds in time. Yet at the speed that Pluto travels, it moved a distance of [apprx.] 6990.524 miles in that span of time.
Thus it can be easily deduced that at the distance Pluto was from the Earth during that span of time one second of one degree is equal to 6990,524 miles of space and that kind of puts into perspective what astrodienst did in 2012 [I think it was, I've forgotten exactly but have all the evidence filed away if anyone really cares so much as to want to see it] when it arbitrarily moved Pluto a distance of 00* 01' 59" forward from the original coordinates they gave me, eight years earlier, [on November 7, 2004] for April 2, 003 A.D. at 5:23 P.M.[as they moved Pluto from 00* Libra 58' 52 to 01* Libra 00' 51".] which then calculates to be at least [apprx.] 831.872.35 or as many as [apprx.] 838,859.92 miles of difference.
As the original position is that as calculated by JPL, the same computer program that NASA used to guide all its spaceflights well into the 1990's {although it may have been well into the 2000's. I can't recall exactly] I'm rather surprised that NASA was able to come near enough to any targeted objective as to declare that mission to be a success ...and that satellite they sent to Pluto so recently as to be able to photograph it so well as they had predicted beforehand certainly must have been the most luckiest shot of all "Lucky Shots" of all time.
Such luck that It just boggles my mind
But I have digressed here and into one of my PET PEEVES, [I'm so embarassed
] so if you will forgive me, let me just try to sum this all up by saying that I hope that I have given you some clarification as to how the degrees are enumerated when stated in proper astronomical terms.
If we want astrology to be recognized as the "Science" it truly is [or, I should say, 'once rectified it will as so undeniably be'?] we must conduct ourselves as just like scientists and giving the proper respect to the terminology is a must.
00* 00' 01' to 00* 59' 59" is in the 1st degree [so is 01* 00' 00", but you likely will never see it ever used and certainly not on any chart issued by astrodienst] 01* 00' 01 to 01* 59' to 59" is in the 2nd degree.
29* 00' 01" to 29* 59' 59" is the 30th degree and it is the anaretic degree
[and if by some oddest of circumstance or coincidence you see the coordinate 30* 00' 00" that too is also of the 30th degree and is also part of the anaretic degree]
...and least not forget that the solar system and the galaxy it is a part of are also moving at great speed and that the Tropical Zodiac is ever sliding retrograde at an apprx. speed of 1 degree every 71.5 years...so there is that to take into consideration also and, when done so, that all but renders the notion of anything in space possibly being truly static at any coordinate given in Zodiacal degrees to be about as ridiculous an assumption as anyone might possibly make.... but I'm no astrophysicist, so what do I know?
Or, if you'd rather have a personal explanation, then read on.
To put it in a nutshell [but, please, do read the "sticky" anyways] 29* and change IS THE 30th degree. 29* 00' 00" is the 29th degree but only for the very instant it occurs, the universe is not a static model, as you must surely know, it is ever active and ephemeral.
For instance, Pluto will come up at some point in time as being at 29* 00' 00" and it will remain at that reading according to astrodienst's computer ephemeris for quite a number of many minutes...yet it was only truly at exactly that coordinate for the briefest moment. I accredit such a coordinate to only the very first second after a given location was 28* 59' 59", the next second after it first reads 29* 00' 00" it has gone beyond that mark...infinitesimally so by an astronomers estimation yet Pluto moves in its orbit around the Sun at an estimated 10,623 mph. That's just shy of 3 miles per second.
There's no such thing as 00* 00' 00" degrees of any Sign. That is only correctly identified as being [as that is what it is] 30* 00' 00". But that only exists for the briefest of an instant, in less time than it takes to blink an eye.
Yet, I do consider the very first instant after the reading of 29* 59' 59" by astrodienst's calculations to be 30* 00' 00" as for the reason that my astrological concerns are oriented toward the Spiritual destiny of mankind, first and foremost. It may assist you in understanding what I mean by that by my offering the following statement; "If God has a reason for someone to be born at exactly XX* 00' 00" of any degree of the Zodiac then I haven't the least of any doubt that God has a very good reason that it did, or that it will someday, occur". For that reason alone is all the explanation I have to offer as to why I make such a consideration.
The beginning of any degree begins at XX* 00' 01" [but in the most accurate of possible coordinates it is at XX* 00' 00.00000...01"]
Let me give you an example derived from astronomical facts and data to provide you with, hopefully, a broader understanding or at least a clearer perspective.
As I stated earlier, NASA claims that Pluto travels at apprx. 10,623 mph in its orbit around the Sun. ..and by my use of the word approximate, I'm rather sure that it isn't exactly that measure of speed but almost undoubtedly so many feet more or less than a full mile per hour more or less than 10,623 miles traveled per hour.
On April 2nd of this year, 2018, by Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, U.S.A. time, at 12:01:04 A.M.by astrodiensts calculations Pluto was at 21* Capricorn 10' 59",. At 12:01:05 A.M Pluto was at 21* Capricorn 11' 00".
According to astrodienst at 12:40:34 A.M., Philadelphia, Pennsylvania time Pluto was still at 21* Capricorn 11' 00" and according to astrodienst at 12:40:35 A.M. Pluto was at 21* Capricorn 11' 01"
Thus, according to astronomical measure, Pluto was at the exact same coordinate as to the nearest second of a degree for 39 minutes and 29 seconds in time. Yet at the speed that Pluto travels, it moved a distance of [apprx.] 6990.524 miles in that span of time.
Thus it can be easily deduced that at the distance Pluto was from the Earth during that span of time one second of one degree is equal to 6990,524 miles of space and that kind of puts into perspective what astrodienst did in 2012 [I think it was, I've forgotten exactly but have all the evidence filed away if anyone really cares so much as to want to see it] when it arbitrarily moved Pluto a distance of 00* 01' 59" forward from the original coordinates they gave me, eight years earlier, [on November 7, 2004] for April 2, 003 A.D. at 5:23 P.M.[as they moved Pluto from 00* Libra 58' 52 to 01* Libra 00' 51".] which then calculates to be at least [apprx.] 831.872.35 or as many as [apprx.] 838,859.92 miles of difference.
As the original position is that as calculated by JPL, the same computer program that NASA used to guide all its spaceflights well into the 1990's {although it may have been well into the 2000's. I can't recall exactly] I'm rather surprised that NASA was able to come near enough to any targeted objective as to declare that mission to be a success ...and that satellite they sent to Pluto so recently as to be able to photograph it so well as they had predicted beforehand certainly must have been the most luckiest shot of all "Lucky Shots" of all time.
Such luck that It just boggles my mind
But I have digressed here and into one of my PET PEEVES, [I'm so embarassed
] so if you will forgive me, let me just try to sum this all up by saying that I hope that I have given you some clarification as to how the degrees are enumerated when stated in proper astronomical terms.If we want astrology to be recognized as the "Science" it truly is [or, I should say, 'once rectified it will as so undeniably be'?] we must conduct ourselves as just like scientists and giving the proper respect to the terminology is a must.
00* 00' 01' to 00* 59' 59" is in the 1st degree [so is 01* 00' 00", but you likely will never see it ever used and certainly not on any chart issued by astrodienst] 01* 00' 01 to 01* 59' to 59" is in the 2nd degree.
29* 00' 01" to 29* 59' 59" is the 30th degree and it is the anaretic degree
[and if by some oddest of circumstance or coincidence you see the coordinate 30* 00' 00" that too is also of the 30th degree and is also part of the anaretic degree]
...and least not forget that the solar system and the galaxy it is a part of are also moving at great speed and that the Tropical Zodiac is ever sliding retrograde at an apprx. speed of 1 degree every 71.5 years...so there is that to take into consideration also and, when done so, that all but renders the notion of anything in space possibly being truly static at any coordinate given in Zodiacal degrees to be about as ridiculous an assumption as anyone might possibly make.... but I'm no astrophysicist, so what do I know?
Ukpoohbear
Well-known member
I just looked up the degree for one of ny conjunctions. The descriptions are like little stories but it’s not even like I need to think of a meaning related to me because I knew it instantly. Im just not ready to accept it or I know it’s a weakness of mine, a theme I’m already aware of but not very good at keeping up.
...dang Dane Rudhyar.
...dang Dane Rudhyar.
piercethevale
Well-known member
Yes, you're so right and Pluto's perihelion is in the Sign of Scorpio. It takes Pluto just eleven years and one month, give or take a few days, for Pluto to traverse the Sign of Scorpio. That's the Sign Pluto travels through the fastest. It takes twelve years and ten months, give or take a few days, for Pluto to traverse the Sign of Libra.
As the figures I quoted are an average speed for its entire orbit around the Sun then Pluto was apparently moved less a distance by astrodiensts' action than I stated.
But, I believe you have got it backwards as to Plutos' speed being the most variable. Pluto moves the slowest of all the planets and its ellipse is also the most angular. A Planet does move it fastest while in perihelion but it is relative to its distance from the Sun and Pluto is the furthest away from the Sun...except that it did get closer to the Sun than Neptune was in the last half of its traverse through the Sign of Scorpio. Therefore it's orbital speed is the most constant of all the planets.
Although I still greatly doubt astrodiensts's ability to determine that JPL was in error.
As I do have two former classmates of mine that work for JPL of which one graduated from Harvey Mudd, which is noted for its math dept., I will write him and ask what JPLs' assessment is about the matter.
Thank you for your astute observation and input.
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piercethevale
Well-known member
In addition, as astrodienst did move Plutos' position 00* 01' 59" for that date of April 2, 003 A.D. [or C.E. for those that prefer] then every position of plutos' from that time point forward would also have bee affected as to what astrodienst stated them to have been prior to their day of changing that data.
The difference as to where astrodienst said my natal Plutos' position was in 2004 compared to a chart I have that astrodienst issued in August, 2015...which is well after the date that they changed Plutos' position for the year 003 A.D. ... is but only 00* 00' 01" less.
Do I really need to bother with writing that friend of mine?
The difference as to where astrodienst said my natal Plutos' position was in 2004 compared to a chart I have that astrodienst issued in August, 2015...which is well after the date that they changed Plutos' position for the year 003 A.D. ... is but only 00* 00' 01" less.
Do I really need to bother with writing that friend of mine?
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