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Electional and Event Astrology Discuss here astrologically good times to do things, and what's happening astrologically when something major happens. Includes sports astrology.


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Unread 02-17-2019, 08:55 PM
Balanced1 Balanced1 is offline
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Question Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Hello, I was hoping I could get some assistance in picking a date for my wisdom teeth surgery.

I have to remove all 4. They have to put me to sleep. And there's risk of nerve damage.

My natal chart:
https://i.imgur.com/JzRuZ8S.png

From my limited astrological knowledge, I know that the surgery shouldn't be done during Retrogrades, and so I'm hoping to get the surgery done within 2 date ranges:

Between now and March 5th. (Before Mercury retrograde)
Between March 28th and April 10th. (After Mercury goes direct and before Jupiter Retrograde)

A couple things I've noticed about the dates within those date ranges:

- Applying Neptune square Saturn: I know this isn't a good time to be put to sleep. One might not wake up This makes me feel as if my best bet would be to do it in the second date range, where the square would be leaving.

- February 28th looks nice, but I see that the Moon is in Capricorn. I know you're not supposed to operate when the moon is in the sign that rules what's being operated on. Technically, that's the head. So I shouldn't do it when the moon is in Aries. But should I avoid Capricorn as well, since that rules the teeth?

- Uranus is gradually leaving an inconjunct to my Mars. I know the further it is away from my natal Mars, the better.

- Mercury is squaring my Saturn March 30th, so I should probably stay away from that date +- a day or two.

- April 2nd looks good, but Sun is exactly opposite my sun and the moon is in mutable Pisces.

- April 6th looks nice with Sun trine Saturn and moon in Fixed Taurus

- Pluto is approaching a square to my natal Venus, but it also is conjuncting my Part of Fortune. Should I worry about transiting Pluto?

I've been putting this surgery off for some time now because I know they'd have to put me to sleep, but I feel now's the time for me to get it done. If you feel I'm wrong about my date ranges and decide to look beyond that please do so, it'd be much appreciated. Thanks for your time.

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Unread 02-18-2019, 05:17 AM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Hey Balanced,

Your Neptune is severely afflicted in the radical chart by the Moon, Saturn and Mars. I say severely because ... well, doesn't matter. Point being is that you don't handle anesthetics well at all in general.

That's point one.

You shouldn't worry about Mercury retrograde so much. Where did you get that info on retrogrades?

Unfortunately, I have no idea where you are located. I could figure it out but not enough time (and not money $$$ heheh)

Okay. The date for you is March 7, 2019 7:30 PST. Neptune is Cazimi with the Sun. Moon is Waxing. Put Aries at the ascendant. Wherever you are. Don't tweak so much. Always make sure Neptune is Cazimi.

Your house placement will be different for March 7th, probably 10:30 to 9:30 for you I would imagine, is the day and time. Just tweak it a bit. Or don't tweak it at all. Actually, DO NOT TWEAK IT. You'll heal fast this way. Just leave it like I said.

Hope this helps buddy
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Unread 02-18-2019, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cypocryphy View Post
Hey Balanced,

Your Neptune is severely afflicted in the radical chart by the Moon, Saturn and Mars. I say severely because ... well, doesn't matter. Point being is that you don't handle anesthetics well at all in general.

That's point one.

You shouldn't worry about Mercury retrograde so much. Where did you get that info on retrogrades?

Unfortunately, I have no idea where you are located. I could figure it out but not enough time (and not money $$$ heheh)

Okay. The date for you is March 7, 2019 7:30 PST. Neptune is Cazimi with the Sun. Moon is Waxing. Put Aries at the ascendant. Wherever you are. Don't tweak so much. Always make sure Neptune is Cazimi.

Your house placement will be different for March 7th, probably 10:30 to 9:30 for you I would imagine, is the day and time. Just tweak it a bit. Or don't tweak it at all. Actually, DO NOT TWEAK IT. You'll heal fast this way. Just leave it like I said.

Hope this helps buddy

Try to make it look exactly as the chart I’ve shown. I hope you can schedule for that day and that you aren’t on the pacific coast.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 02:47 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cypocryphy View Post
Try to make it look exactly as the chart I’ve shown. I hope you can schedule for that day and that you aren’t on the pacific coast.
I'm EST.

I really appreciate this C. I remember reading that I wouldn't handle anesthetics well some time ago, but I forgot the context with which I came by that conclusion. I've never been put to sleep before.

After looking up Cazimi, I understand the benefits of Neptune Cazimi but I read some stuff about more spirituality, intuition, and encounters with the divine. I hope that won't mean literally in this case Also Cazimi is supposed to be within 17 minutes or so, so if it's not exactly 17 minutes or under does that equal combustion? And would I lose the benefits?

Also with Transiting Neptune and Sun Cazimi at 16 pisces, that means they're both forming an exact square with my Saturn. I didn't realize this would be ok.

My understanding was that mercury retrograde might not have the doctors/surgeons in their best form. Also, I thought that one needed to have the moon in a fixed sign to keep their hands steady. (Especially since nerve damage is a fear). I didn't think moon in Pisces would be ideal. There's lots of Pisces energy, with Sun/Moon/29 degrees Mercury(R)/Neptune.

I also noticed that the day after that (the 8th), 3 transits are exact:

Venus square Mercury, Venus square Pluto, and Mercury square Chiron.

Could this just be a reflection of the surgery I just had?

I would have never guessed that this would be the most optimal day, so I appreciate your input. But just to further my understanding I'd like to understand why.

Is Neptune Cazimi so beneficial that it outweighs other potentially negative transits? Or am I just not understanding what counts as negative? Is my Neptune so harshly afflicted that I need to focus on the best case scenario for me to wake back up?

Thanks again for this.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 04:14 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

You are right. My bad. Here's the correct chart:

It wasn't Cazimi for one. Yeah, same degree and within 17'. And don't worry too much about reading these charts together because the Election will override. I did do some tweaking with on your behalf. The here is fortified in Capricorn. It's opposing your ascendant but cadent. So too is , but is forming trines to your and .

in Pisces is fine. retrograde is over-rated in this situation because wisdom teeth extraction is not difficult. It's the anesthetics that are dangerous. Plus, is fortified by being ruled by , latter in own sign. The squares are minimized by house placement. Plus it's conjoined your .

I don't think you should worry about mutable signs in this situation. You're undergoing a complex procedure.

Looking at your chart, you want to be protected and with here protects you from anything bad regarding anesthesia, and I fortified the . That's the biggest issue for me and for you.

Technically I don't use outers but this seems to be a special case.

I wouldn't worry about those transits. Negligible

I hope this helps! Got to run but will try to answer questions

P.S. regards here with a . That leaves as the odd man out that I couldn't deal with properly. Things will rarely be perfect. And will be in its detriment and has probably about another Month in (maybe less) But you lose this wonderful protection from the anesthesia. And it can be argued that ruled by , albeit in is strengthened by so that the energies are controlled. in is actually a relatively good thing here. Plus, near perfectly conjoined MC and ascendant is awesome, despite being retro and in its detriment and fall.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 06:27 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

I mean 4:20:30pm. Your location. My bad for previous time your local. Moon in Al Fargh al Mukdim lunar mansion and no combustion of moon. Good for surgery. It’s a private matter so good. All is good now. Hour of Saturn so good for doctors, etc. Teeth are bone and of Saturn. Etc.

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Unread 02-18-2019, 07:55 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Some of the guidelines for dental surgery are:
- Moon not in Aries or taurus.
- Mars and Saturn free from affliction.
- Afflictions to Jupiter or such as involve the fixed signs should also be avoided.
- If anaesthetics are to be used, take care that Neptune is well aspected, both in the radical and electional maps.

From Electional Astrology by Vivien Robson.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 08:28 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

In surgical operations:
- let the moon be increasing in light and motion, in good aspect with Jupiter or Venus, unaspected by mars.
- let the moon be in a fixed sign, but not in the sign ruling the part to be operated upon.
- see that the ascendant and its lord are not in this sign
- don't let the moon and lord of the ascendant be cadent.
- it is important to fortify the sign and its lord ruling the part of the body to be operated upon.
- place the lord of the ascendant in the ascendant or midheaven, unaspected by mars
- keep the moon free from hindrance or affliction.
- in a general way the moon is better in a fixed sign than in a cardinal or mutable one, but this consideration is a secondary one, and it is of far greater importance to keep it out of the sign ruling the part of the body to be operated upon.
- afflictions from Saturn or mars tend to cause festering and other complications, and are specially dangerous when the moon is near the conjunction of the sun, and until it has separated by fully twelve degrees.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 08:49 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElenaJ View Post
In surgical operations:
- let the moon be increasing in light and motion, in good aspect with Jupiter or Venus, unaspected by mars.
- let the moon be in a fixed sign, but not in the sign ruling the part to be operated upon.
- see that the ascendant and its lord are not in this sign
- don't let the moon and lord of the ascendant be cadent.
- it is important to fortify the sign and its lord ruling the part of the body to be operated upon.
- place the lord of the ascendant in the ascendant or midheaven, unaspected by mars
- keep the moon free from hindrance or affliction.
- in a general way the moon is better in a fixed sign than in a cardinal or mutable one, but this consideration is a secondary one, and it is of far greater importance to keep it out of the sign ruling the part of the body to be operated upon.
- afflictions from Saturn or mars tend to cause festering and other complications, and are specially dangerous when the moon is near the conjunction of the sun, and until it has separated by fully twelve degrees.
Is this also from Vivian Robinson? I have to disagree with some of this. First, the being combust is minor in circumstance and it is more important that it is waxing. This is more inline with horary. The Moon is concealed or in this instance, native wants this to be private and not public.

I absolutely and completely disagree with the statement. is of surgery and though in detriment, this is good because Mars is hot and dry and Earth/Taurus is cold and dry, so reduces the aggressiveness of Mars. A sextile to the for surgery and a positive harmonic from to the and is not only ideal but, in a sense, mandatory as this is surgery and of bone.

(I apologize as you haven't seen the new chart)

Also, nothing can be perfect all the time, and though I'm reluctant to use Neptune as Robinson states, it truly is the planet of narcotics and dreams, i.e., anesthetics. This is the biggest concern and the natives chart has no hope of redemption in this regard. So Cazimi is really the only way to protect the native from something going awry. Also, if he waits a year or longer, then he could have serious problems if surgery and anesthetics are involved.

I disagree with the 's positional statement here. Cardinal creates for hurried healing, if it can be achieved, especially when ascendant is trine . The person is protected in this instance. Mercury so close to Aries takes part of both signs. I'm an avid proponent of this. If conjunctions cross signs, then planetary positions at anoretic degrees do so too.

Provided the time and situation, this is the only way I see for success given a small window of time and that you'll never find a perfect chart.

Also, you forgot about the hour. Always start with the hour, then consider the lunar mansions.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 08:53 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

I won't post the new chart to allow for OP's identity to remain anonymous.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:00 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

"Is this also from Vivian Robinson?"
Yes, sorry I didn't state this.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:03 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Sorry, who is " OP's identity"?
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:08 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

So, narrowing things down a bit:
- Between March 28th and April 10th. (After Mercury goes direct and before Jupiter Retrograde). This is a good window to avoid silly errors taking place. Also avoiding the Neptune/saturn square.
- should I avoid Capricorn as well, since that rules the teeth? Definitely to be avoided.
-Uranus is gradually leaving an inconjunct to my Mars. Good. Also, you have a moon/mars opposition in the natal that you don't want to activate.
- Mercury is squaring my Saturn March 30th. Eliminated.
- April 2nd looks good, but Sun is exactly opposite my sun and the moon is in mutable Pisces. No. Stay away from pisces. This would mean activating your mars/moon opposition just after the operation.
- April 6th looks nice with Sun trine Saturn and moon in Fixed Taurus. No. Moon in taurus not good.
- Pluto is approaching a square to my natal Venus, but it also is conjuncting my Part of Fortune. Should I worry about transiting Pluto? Your natal Venus opposes natal Jupiter, let's try to not irritate this with pluto.

So we have eliminated: March 30, April 2, April 6.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:09 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

How much say do you have in choosing the time for the surgery?
Can you decide the hour of day?
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:20 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

In the framework of mercury going direct, it remains near that prickly Neptune, and then Venus enters that area. Also, it moves towards late pisces where you have your natal moon/mars opposition.
So, how important is Jupiter retrograde? Can we widen the window to eliminate the pisces activity, and perhaps reinforce Jupiter even though it is retrograde?
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:32 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

P.S. just to clarify, none of my comments are in reference to your notes or chart, they are simply addressing the querent's original post. Please don't misunderstand me. Regards.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:47 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cypocryphy View Post
Is this also from Vivian Robinson? I have to disagree with some of this. First, the being combust is minor in circumstance and it is more important that it is waxing. This is more inline with horary. The Moon is concealed or in this instance, native wants this to be private and not public.

I absolutely and completely disagree with the statement. is of surgery and though in detriment, this is good because Mars is hot and dry and Earth/Taurus is cold and dry, so reduces the aggressiveness of Mars. A sextile to the for surgery and a positive harmonic from to the and is not only ideal but, in a sense, mandatory as this is surgery and of bone.

(I apologize as you haven't seen the new chart)

Also, nothing can be perfect all the time, and though I'm reluctant to use Neptune as Robinson states, it truly is the planet of narcotics and dreams, i.e., anesthetics. This is the biggest concern and the natives chart has no hope of redemption in this regard. So Cazimi is really the only way to protect the native from something going awry. Also, if he waits a year or longer, then he could have serious problems if surgery and anesthetics are involved.
C, as Elena said, the notes posted were general, and not a counter to your date. I was wondering though, do you also disagree that the moon should be waning if you want to remove something from the body? And that surgery shouldn't take place on the exact day of the New moon? Is Cazimi good enough to save me from other potential problems? By the looks of it, Cazimi is good enough to disregard many of the general rules. I think it's very interesting that I'm so doomed in regards to anesthetics. Scary, but interesting nonetheless.

In regards to me wanting this to be private...How did you determine this? I do in fact want the operation to be private and am trying to keep it lowkey. Did you do a horary?

Quote:
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How much say do you have in choosing the time for the surgery?
Can you decide the hour of day?
Hours can be between 8:30 AM and 4:30 PM - No Saturday or Sunday.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElenaJ View Post
In the framework of mercury going direct, it remains near that prickly Neptune, and then Venus enters that area. Also, it moves towards late pisces where you have your natal moon/mars opposition.
So, how important is Jupiter retrograde? Can we widen the window to eliminate the pisces activity, and perhaps reinforce Jupiter even though it is retrograde?
You know much more about this than I do. If Retrograde Jupiter isn't a problem then I'm fine with that. I only assumed that it would be best if the benefic wasn't retrograde.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:52 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

"Hours can be between 8:30 AM and 4:30 PM -"
How much control do you have over this? Not sure what type of institute you are going to, a large hospital, a dental office, a small clinic. Because if you can't decide the time, we need to find a good day but needless getting as fine tuned as the hour. Or no?
" if the benefic wasn't retrograde."
In an ideal situation this would be a good idea, but compared to having the pile up in pisces this is the minor of problems.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 09:58 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElenaJ View Post
"Hours can be between 8:30 AM and 4:30 PM -"
How much control do you have over this? Not sure what type of institute you are going to, a large hospital, a dental office, a small clinic. Because if you can't decide the time, we need to find a good day but needless getting as fine tuned as the hour. Or no?
" if the benefic wasn't retrograde."
In an ideal situation this would be a good idea, but compared to having the pile up in pisces this is the minor of problems.
It's a dental office. There's flexibility in selecting the hour. Especially if the date is further out.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 10:23 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Using my technique the best date I can find is Friday, March 15th. Any time of day within the hours you say are available will be ok but before 3 PM would be a little better.

Certainly not the 14th!

There will be some discomfort but hopefully the pain killers will keep it to a minimum.

The chart below is calculated to 3 PM but the angles advance very slowly. The MC advancing about 1 degree in 2 hours.

Best wishes for success.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 10:33 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Quote:
Originally Posted by Balanced1 View Post
C, as Elena said, the notes posted were general, and not a counter to your date. I was wondering though, do you also disagree that the moon should be waning if you want to remove something from the body? And that surgery shouldn't take place on the exact day of the New moon? Is Cazimi good enough to save me from other potential problems? By the looks of it, Cazimi is good enough to disregard many of the general rules. I think it's very interesting that I'm so doomed in regards to anesthetics. Scary, but interesting nonetheless.
The Moon should be increasing in light. Period. It's not a simple situation of waxing = gain and wanning = loss of teeth. Moon should be increasing in its power. This is really, in my experience, that general the native experiences loss with the Moon losing its strength. We are talking about teeth but really we are talking about healing, so you want it to be waxing.

Quote:
In regards to me wanting this to be private...How did you determine this? I do in fact want the operation to be private and am trying to keep it lowkey. Did you do a horary?
No. I work as a psychic too.

Quote:
Hours can be between 8:30 AM and 4:30 PM - No Saturday or Sunday.


You know much more about this than I do. If Retrograde Jupiter isn't a problem then I'm fine with that. I only assumed that it would be best if the benefic wasn't retrograde.
Technically, what I gave you in regards to Mercury, a concern of yours, is that Mercury is stationary. Has not gone retrograde yet. You won't get more stable hands than that.

Jupiter is fortifiying your election chart, with a Jupiter trine to ascendant, and part of fortune is in the first house. Furthermore, your natal chart has Saturn by trine to ascendant, conjunct Jupiter from the election chart, and this fortifies the peregrine nature of Saturn, and it's in a sign of rulership by Jupiter. The lord of the ascendant is Leo, with the Sun, though in the 9th, in its Joy. The moon, Sun and Neptune are (1) conjoined your own Moon, which is within 15º of North Node. So the fact that Jupiter is squaring your Sun, etc. is offset by the trine to the ascendant.

Dorotheus had different ideas, but having the malefics dignified or positively aspecting Moon and chart ruler were used extensively by the Arabic astrologers. So you have difference of opinion.

But I think common sense dictates that you want these to interact like the Arabic scholars/astrologers often used them. Mars is surgery; Saturn is teeth, all in favorable formation/aspect.

The most dangerous component of your surgery is the anesthesia, and working with doctors, they'll all tell you the same. And your radical chart is not good in this way.

You are free to use whatever time others give you, obviously, but you will not go wrong with what I've given you if you can get scheduled at 4 p.m. on that day.

Best of luck!
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Unread 02-18-2019, 10:37 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Also, as far as I can see, none of the others have considered all the aspects of erecting an election. P.S. Elections morphed into horary charts. they are the father/mother of horary astrology.

I'm only saying this cause I want you to have the best chance of success.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 10:38 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElenaJ View Post
"Hours can be between 8:30 AM and 4:30 PM -"
How much control do you have over this? Not sure what type of institute you are going to, a large hospital, a dental office, a small clinic. Because if you can't decide the time, we need to find a good day but needless getting as fine tuned as the hour. Or no?
" if the benefic wasn't retrograde."
In an ideal situation this would be a good idea, but compared to having the pile up in pisces this is the minor of problems.
No. This is wrong. I'm sorry. You're not even considering the planetary hours. You need to do this.
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Unread 02-18-2019, 11:55 PM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

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Originally Posted by Cypocryphy View Post
No. This is wrong. I'm sorry. You're not even considering the planetary hours. You need to do this.
Oh, I see. Read this hurriedly on my phone. Okay. But hours are the starting point. They've always been the starting point as far as I know. And there was no consideration of lunar mansions, albeit it might be better to use sidereal here since these are absolutely determined by the fixed stars. I haven't don't the research into the lunar mansions as I have the zodiac.

Regardless, the moon in pisces between those degrees is favored for surgery in regard to lunar mansions. It is unanimously considered "good for healing." So I have no idea where ElenaJ considers this "bad."
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Unread 02-19-2019, 01:09 AM
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Re: Wisdom Teeth Surgery

One simple advice, your natal Moon should better stay away from the event MC. Try not to choose an hour where your Moon is in the event 10H, you may also avoid choosing an hour where your ASC falls in the event 8H. Be careful with Chiron and Nodes transits to sensitive points of your natal chart.
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