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  #1  
Unread 09-10-2011, 02:15 PM
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Moog Moog is offline
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Personal transcendance stories?

Hi there astrologers. :-)

At the moment, I'm butting up against this idea of free will vs. determinism (an old chestnut around here, I guess)

I feel that for astrology to be really useful (in my eyes), we need to use it to learn how to operate ourselves more effectively. Or are we just looking at the track we're on, learning to enjoy the ride, as it were?

I suppose that I'd like to ask the following:

1. Are you a determinist or a free willer? What philosophy of astrology do you subscribe to?
2. Is it possible to use knowledge gleaned through astrology to transcend difficult placements and aspects, or do we simply have to wait for better conditions?
3. If you have a personal story or stories about how you have used astrological knowledge in order to create significant differences in how you behave, live, experience, would you be kind enough to share them please?


Last edited by Moog; 09-10-2011 at 11:09 PM. Reason: Terrible typing
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  #2  
Unread 09-10-2011, 08:51 PM
Choe Choe is offline
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

What a great thread.

Personally, I don't have much gain from knowing my chart.

It helps me understand many things in my life, it explains everything that happens.

YET, knowing,and understanding does not change things much


They seem to stay the same, even though you got conscious about them.

That's why I started to believe in destiny and pre-determined life. However,I don't see the point in suffering and life in general. Often ,everything seems absurd to me.

Last edited by Choe; 09-10-2011 at 08:54 PM.
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  #3  
Unread 09-10-2011, 09:19 PM
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

To some extent i used it.

When i realized that my father knows astrology i knew i can use it to have better knowledge of people.

For example:

1. When i know from Horoscope that person is very sensitive then i will be careful not to hurt that person.
2.When i know this person get angry then i will be careful.
3.When i know this person can any use wrong methods to achieve then i will be careful.

One incident i Tell you.My grandfather was going to get marry.But suddenly from his nose blood started coming out at that time.Then the parents of girl said they won't give their daughter in marriage because this boy is ill.Then third person came in between and tried to solve the problem.Due to that third person marriage of my grandpa happened.

That third person had mean interest.he knew through astrology that my grandfather's wife will die.so he planed to give his own daughter in marriage to my grandfather when 1st wife will die.For this reason he helped in marriage of my grandfather.

This story shocked me that astrology can be misused.Or i should say that this was also destiny.
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  #4  
Unread 09-11-2011, 08:50 AM
JerryRR JerryRR is offline
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

Suggested reading,"Sophie's World."by Jostein Gaarder.
All Astrologers should own a copy.

"The Dice Man."by Luke Rhinehart."
"I find The Dice Man very funny indeed and sometimes almost terrifying in its accurate evocation of the amount of nonsense American psychoanalysts talk and believe in!"
Professor H.J.Eysenck.
J.

Last edited by JerryRR; 09-11-2011 at 09:42 AM.
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  #5  
Unread 09-11-2011, 02:39 PM
Choe Choe is offline
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JerryRR View Post
Suggested reading,"Sophie's World."by Jostein Gaarder.
All Astrologers should own a copy.

"The Dice Man."by Luke Rhinehart."
"I find The Dice Man very funny indeed and sometimes almost terrifying in its accurate evocation of the amount of nonsense American psychoanalysts talk and believe in!"
Professor H.J.Eysenck.
J.
Thanks for the suggestions
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  #6  
Unread 09-11-2011, 03:22 PM
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Njorwhald Njorwhald is offline
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

I think life is pre-determined, but that's no excuse to sit on your *** all day! :P

For me, I think astrology is useful in the sense that simplifies a person's character which makes them easier to understand, therefore easier to solve a character problems.

I do think, though, that people can pick up bad habits regardless of what their chart says, which is why I think a lot of people, rather than actually make a plan to solve their problems, come on places like this to try and work out habits which have nothing necessarily to do with their natal chart, and expect to find an answer, but to no or little avail.

The transits can help supplement something you're trying to do, but it's the person who has the strongest influence over their lives, not the planets. If you do nothing, not much happens, if you do a lot, many things happen. (Which includes getting rid of your negative belief patterns!) This is why there are successful people in certain fields who have what an astrologer would consider "unsuccessful" in that area.

Hardwork > your chart. And there is no getting around that.
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  #7  
Unread 09-11-2011, 05:22 PM
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Astrodawn Astrodawn is offline
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

I have found astrology to be the most enlightening of subjects when it comes to myself and self improvement.
All of us operate on a level that is created through past experiences, family upbringing and the likes, we react to things from our deep subconscious which is very difficult to see or become aware of, many have no idea why they are non committal or abusive etc but if you delve into the past the reasons are always there.
I began with Robert Hands books about 18 years ago, and through his way of writing, especially the esoteric side, I was able to step back, reflect and analyse my reactions, the causes and ultimately the understanding then became visible to me and I was able to deal with the 'subconscious reactions' and put them aside, thus creating an inner calm and an ability to move forwards.
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  #8  
Unread 09-11-2011, 05:25 PM
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

another book that had a massive influence on me is;

Rodney Collins - Man, the universe and the cosmic mystery.
Its about cycles and octaves, i used to read a paragraph and then spend the rest of the night gobsmacked at the new thoughts and understandings I had of the universe.

Amazing book, although quite deep and not for everyone.
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  #9  
Unread 09-12-2011, 08:46 PM
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

So many people complain that astrology is if no use. They have not experienced true knowledge of astrology that's why they are saying this.

so many useless and nonsense things are there in astrology.

The person who have understood the subject correctly He only knows the POWER of astrology.
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  #10  
Unread 09-15-2011, 06:27 PM
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Choe View Post
What a great thread.
Thank you :-)

Quote:
Personally, I don't have much gain from knowing my chart.

It helps me understand many things in my life, it explains everything that happens.

YET, knowing,and understanding does not change things much


They seem to stay the same, even though you got conscious about them.

That's why I started to believe in destiny and pre-determined life. However,I don't see the point in suffering and life in general. Often ,everything seems absurd to me.
So you feel that the knowledge you gain about what's happening doesn't help to effect any positive changes at all?
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  #11  
Unread 09-15-2011, 06:28 PM
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Still thinking View Post
One incident i Tell you.My grandfather was going to get marry.But suddenly from his nose blood started coming out at that time.Then the parents of girl said they won't give their daughter in marriage because this boy is ill.Then third person came in between and tried to solve the problem.Due to that third person marriage of my grandpa happened.

That third person had mean interest.he knew through astrology that my grandfather's wife will die.so he planed to give his own daughter in marriage to my grandfather when 1st wife will die.For this reason he helped in marriage of my grandfather.

This story shocked me that astrology can be misused.Or i should say that this was also destiny.
That's quite a dark story. Did it come to pass?
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  #12  
Unread 09-15-2011, 06:48 PM
Choe Choe is offline
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moog View Post
Thank you :-)

So you feel that the knowledge you gain about what's happening doesn't help to effect any positive changes at all?
some positive changes, yes

It could be.
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  #13  
Unread 09-22-2011, 04:33 AM
Crystal Starseed Crystal Starseed is offline
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Re: Personal transcendance stories?

Hi.

Determinism = stasis and disempowerment; free will = change and empowerment.

I'm definitely a non deterministic free wheeling willer! For me, astrology is a language, which, when used positively, can enable us to have more choices in our approach to solving problems or enigmas. But it is not the only language and we can communicate quite well without it! What I personally find beautiful in astrology is synchronicity and symbolism, because this unlocks the universe in a myriad of different ways and becomes a form of magic.

I also believe we can choose our mode or level of consciousness at will and that we are not fixed in any way; therefore, no outcome is fixed, except in as much as each positive outcome has it's own particular dynamic, and aims to be positive, rather than negative.

When I was a child I realised, through precognition (dreams and visions) and peristent, pervasive deja vu, that many events in my own life at least, were predetermined. This realisation was, on the whole, not helpful to me at the time, because it not only made me a little wierd in the classroom, it also made me consider that, not only could my entire existence be predetermined, but that I may even be reliving this same particular lifetime like a big cosmic Groundhog Day joke.

This was stressful to consider at such a young age, since by the age of four, I also knew things which children would not normally know about (like tantric sex and kundalini - and no I wasn't an abused child - these were only visions!), and been told by a guide that this was my 'last chance lifetime', so it didn't help my perception of myself as being like a butterfly caught on an endlessly spinning wheel.
I had a mission in this life - but what was it and how could I ever actualise it if I was at the mercy of the Fates? I also became aware of astrology at a very young age, and also wondered why I was nothing whatsoever like my chart said I was supposed to be, or what the astrological mainstream suggested I should resemble. This set up what was to become a love-hate relationship with the subject for many years as I instinctively felt there was something in it, but yearned to understand why I did not conform to any of the popular stereotypes. And so this was how my journey began.

However, as I grew up I realised that my own thoughts and perceptions really did create my own reality to a extent, and that I had even experienced this fully in real time ('no' time) as a child but not understood the connotations of the experience then.

I now understand that more than any individual's will alone,that our own will as a species can determine our own individual reality as well as the collective reality of humanity; our collective creative will can literally transform the world into a world of our own choosing, rather than one which has been predetermined by the vested interests of a few others. And it will happen, and is happening, because we make it so. This is a much more positive place to be!

I enjoy astrology, but I don't appreciate what I would term the short-sightedness of astrologers who actually believe that the same belief system will work for everyone, or that everyone will resonate with the same system they use, because I know they don't. (But they've studied it properly, haven't they? And it's scientific - almost)
I don't entirely resonate with the western system, for example, even though I am a westerner. Yet my tropical astrological persona on this site gives me a footing of sorts. Everything is really a kind of experiment in consciousness, after all.
So, like any other form of divination - if you read it well, it works, and it works the way you express it at that particular time for that particular reader, because that is the message that needs to be expressed, and we are just the messengers, if you like. If you don't read it well, it doesn't work; but that result in itself is another lesson for the perception of that reader, and will lead onto something else for them - perhaps new creative challenges which could benefit us all.

This is why I don't get hung up on whether Mr A is right and Mrs B is wrong, or whether Jesus was a Virgo or an Aries, (he has to have been a Plaeidian, surely...:-))or the fact that some people think you're only spiritual or enlightened if you have planets in the 12th house - because that's what they've been lead to believe, so they're just reinforcing that particular meme which will satisfy the 'believers' and challenge people who have a different experience. But we are all 'right' - what it tells us is more about ourselves and why we believe, or want to believe what we do. And that for me is always more interesting, because it tells me more about astrology itself and how and why it works the way it does...

Namaste!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moog View Post
Hi there astrologers. :-)

At the moment, I'm butting up against this idea of free will vs. determinism (an old chestnut around here, I guess)

I feel that for astrology to be really useful (in my eyes), we need to use it to learn how to operate ourselves more effectively. Or are we just looking at the track we're on, learning to enjoy the ride, as it were?

I suppose that I'd like to ask the following:

1. Are you a determinist or a free willer? What philosophy of astrology do you subscribe to?
2. Is it possible to use knowledge gleaned through astrology to transcend difficult placements and aspects, or do we simply have to wait for better conditions?
3. If you have a personal story or stories about how you have used astrological knowledge in order to create significant differences in how you behave, live, experience, would you be kind enough to share them please?
__________________


We are one consciousness
experiencing itself subjectively.
Therefore love yourself, be true to yourself,
and watch the world transform.

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