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wan

wan

Well-known member
Very interesting, Osa.

Also, it could be that when people say you have an accent, they meant compared to their own regional one (for example, you are from California and they are from New York). The US is a vast country and there are many different, regional accents even within the same country. Strangely this is not the case for Canada though, for some reason. I have been to Toronto and I found their accent to be identical as the kind we have here in Vancouver.
 
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Osamenor

Osamenor

Staff member
aquarius7000 said:
I feel it is very necessary to stay in touch with your roots, and understanding and speaking the language of where your roots are from is the best way to do it. I admire parents that are wise enough to speak their own native tongue with their children at home. They will learn English from their surroundings, media, school, friends any way, but unless parents make the effort of keeping their native tongue 'alive' at home, it will be lost to their next generation. You don't use a language, you lose that language.

Some people misunderstand this as 'not letting one integrate'. To me, it is yet another test of how tolerant a society is.

When Europeans came into America, they brought their own native tongues along as well. In NY, you will still find some Italian or French-origin grandparents speak French with their children. I have a first generation Slovak in my circle that seems to speak her language fluently with her parents (from what I can make out, since I don't speak it). There are Indians that seem to speak their own native languages along side English and they should keep up with that.

There is beauty in diversity and sheer ugliness in intolerance.
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I'm fifth generation German, in one branch of my family (the other branches make me a mutt). Only the first generation or two spoke German at home, though. It's a lost language to the rest of us, barring learning it later. Which means it's a lost language to all of my close relatives living today.

It would really take effort to make many generations fluent in the ancestral language if they're not around people who speak it. As generations go by, people will inevitably marry people from different backgrounds, and the family won't be purely Chinese, German, Italian, etc., anymore.

On the other hand, I knew a family growing up where the mom was French and the dad, though not a native French speaker, had learned it fluently, and they spoke it at home. The kids became completely bilingual. Trilingual, actually; their dad was half Filipino and his parents spoke Tagalog, and spoke it with the kids. None of them except the mother have an accent in English that I can hear.
 
Osamenor

Osamenor

Staff member
wan said:
Very interesting, Osa.

Also, it could be that when people say you have an accent, they meant compared to their own regional one (for example, you are from California and they are from New York). The US is a vast country and there are many different, regional accents even within the same country. Strangely this is not the case for Canada though, for some reason. I have been to Toronto and I found their accent to be identical as the kind we have here in Vancouver.
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It's people from my hometown who tell me that. Oddly enough, I haven't gotten that in other parts of the country.
 
Osamenor

Osamenor

Staff member
Dirius said:
To be fair, I am more able to understand americans speaking bad spanish, than some central-american spanish accents.

I can't undersand mexicans, such an ugly accent.
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Mexican Spanish is the most common kind where I am, and it's interesting: the accent itself can sound... I guess I would say harsh and in your face, sometimes, but what they actually say can be so beautiful. Spanish has so many depths to it that English doesn't. The first accent I got much exposure to, though, was Cuban--my first Spanish teacher--and Cuban Spanish is so distinct it's almost a language in itself. I would say the same about Argentine Spanish, really. And I'm talking about how they sound in Spanish. All Spanish speakers have more or less the same accent when they're speaking English.

I spent some time living in the borderland, and the local accent there was fascinating. Most people spoke both English and Spanish to some degree, it's just as easy to get around there knowing one as the other, and the English version of the borderland accent is beautiful. The Spanish version didn't sound so harsh, either, although we are talking about Mexican here.
 
Osamenor

Osamenor

Staff member
Dirius said:
To be fair, I am more able to understand americans speaking bad spanish, than some central-american spanish accents.
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I'm humbled by how well Spanish speaking people always treat me when I make half the effort to speak Spanish! Seriously, it brings out so much friendliness. If only we norteamericanos were as nice to them....
 
aquarius7000

aquarius7000

Well-known member
wan said:
Lolwut? How did a thread about racism turn into accents? This can only happen on astrologyweekly!
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Because there is racism connected with English accents also.

There is diversity in the reasons for racism also. It doesn't just have to do with skin colour.
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Osamenor said:
Geographically, yes. Culturally, no. I was taught that in the Spanish speaking world, Norteamerica means the U.S. and Canada. The English speaking north.
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Well, "Green Grow the Lilacs"!* Language has a lot to do with geological divisions. Religion also.

Story is, American Troops were singIng the song during the Mexican American War, which resulted in the term "Gringo".
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Most U.S. Americans are pretty casual about how words should be pronounced. As long as it's easy to understand what someone is saying, that's good enough.

In contrast, I've noticed that people who speak languages other than American English are very picky about pronunciation in their own native language.

Probably because we pinched "our language" from England in the first place!
 
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waybread

waybread

Well-known member
The United States has no official language. English is just a custom or a convention.

I think it's great that people keep their ancestral languages. Once the immigrant descendants lose these languages, they lose touch with a big part of their ancestral culture.

Some of the nicest people I know, people with hearts of gold, speak ungrammatical English. I'd prefer someone to be a good person than a grammatically correct person.

The United States is becoming more bilingual all the time. If I lived in the US, I'd probably take a Spanish class.

Dirius, this is an old cowboy song, "Spanish is the Loving Tongue." (This would be Mexican Spanish.) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YTeuRjknxE
 
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david starling

Well-known member
waybread said:
The United States has no official language. English is just a custom or a convention.

I think it's great that people keep their ancestral languages. Once the immigrant descendants lose these languages, they lose touch with a big part of their ancestral culture.

Some of the nicest people I know, people with hearts of gold, speak ungrammatical English. I'd prefer someone to be a good person than a grammatically correct person.

The United States is becoming more bilingual all the time. If I lived in the US, I'd probably take a Spanish class.

Dirius, this is an old cowboy song, "Spanish is the Loving Tongue." (This would be Mexican Spanish.) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YTeuRjknxE
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It's about communication. I would try to learn the customary language of any country I lived in, instead of pretending I'm still living where I'm from. It's the second generation immigrants that do that automatically, although most first generation immigrants do it also. Arnold Schwarzenegger is a prime example.

In California, I started learning Spanish, but it became clear to me that native-born Spanish speakers preferred to learn American English rather listen to me attempt to speak Spanish.

Canada appears to have a French-speaking enclave that considers French to be its customary language.
 
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