The future is here!

Cap

Well-known member
how it should be

without_money.jpg

An Intro. to a Resource-Based Economy [ TEDx - Peter Joseph ]


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mkRFCtl2MI
 

AppLeo

Well-known member
An Intro. to a Resource-Based Economy [ TEDx - Peter Joseph ]


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4mkRFCtl2MI

@4:55 . The free market system is a fair and just system. You have the work and earn a living yourself. You don't get free **** just because you're alive. People who disagree are lazy and don't understand that if people don't work for their own resources, other people end up becoming slaves to them.

@5:25 . It is a natural fact and empirical way of life. The free market system is the basic idea of voluntary trade. I will give you this, if you give that. After we trade, we both agree that each individually own our own belongings and can't or steal from each other. Nobody is a slave. In this system you are a FREE man. Slavery occurs when interactions take place against your consent. In the free market system, this never occurs.

@5:50 Debt is something people have choice to go into. It's your fault if you go into debt. Debt can also be used to gain more in the future if you know how to manage your resources.

IT IS NOT A WIN-LOSE system. This video is idiotic. In a free market system, you TRADE. What is a trade??? Two people exchanging items. Person A has an item that Person B values. Person B has an item that Person A values. They both trade. THEY BOTH WIN. The free market system only creates positive interactions.

@6:50 . We already created a system that works on this planet.... *facepalm*

@11:54 . Resource accounting. The free market already does that perfectly. Businessman are constantly negotiating and trading with each other either grow or produce a product that is in demand. Like food for example. There will always be food because that's what the public demands, so there will always be food to buy. Resources concentrate to stores so people buy the food.

@12:29 . Companies that produce wood replant trees for the future so that they can produce more wood. Also, I don't see the big deal with deforestation. Who cares about some trees?

We live in an anti-economy?? Plz...

Look at this graph:

Lu9CdK


https://goo.gl/images/Lu9CdK

Our economy has never been more sufficient in human freaking history. And then leftists have the audacity to say that our economy isn't productive or failed?? GIVE ME A BREAK. Jesus.

Look at that graph. Notice at 1776-1800 when America became a wonderful independent nation, with free market capitalism, the economic production rose up 20 fold. I don't even know. A **** ton.

In the 1500's, people lived off of 500 dollars a year. The fact that we still have homeless people today does not mean our system has failed. 99% of people are not homeless.

@13:28 . "scientifically" . No offense, but I'd rather have a businessman decide how much produce for the consumer than some scientist who got a phd at some university.

The scientifically correct answer is what a businessman decides because his business making money depends on his decisions. If he makes money with his choices, then he's making the right choices. If he doesn't make the right choices then he goes out of business and another business takes over. That is the most scientific. It works so well you don't need a scientist.

@14:41 . You don't want growth in your economy? Gotta be kidding me. Yeah the planet is finite, but I don't see why we can't grow until we've maximized the use of resources.

Umm.. collaborative is pathetic and lame. Competition is what drives of to achieve and produce better results.

A planned based economy will never do as good as a free market.

Automation can't even replace half of the jobs out there.

From property to access.... "like a library system" . Humans will always want more. There is no such thing as abundance.

It doesn't matter how much someone uses their car. It's not about people achieving their basic needs. It's about attaining whatever resources you want, however many resources want, and using them however and whenever you want. It has nothing to do with, "well is this efficient enough." Forget that.

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Cap

Well-known member
Most of your comments are just your opinions and/or standard capitalist propaganda so I'll just focus on this one where you actually provided some data.

We live in an anti-economy?? Plz...

Look at this graph:

Lu9CdK


https://goo.gl/images/Lu9CdK

Our economy has never been more sufficient in human freaking history. And then leftists have the audacity to say that our economy isn't productive or failed?? GIVE ME A BREAK. Jesus.

Look at that graph. Notice at 1776-1800 when America became a wonderful independent nation, with free market capitalism, the economic production rose up 20 fold. I don't even know. A **** ton.

The argument is not that capitalism isn't productive enough, it's capitalism's poor wealth distribution that's the problem.

Society is 5x more productive today than in 1960's. So, it would be logical that people earn 5x more today than in 1960's or at least to work 5x less (1.5 hours per day) for the same. But, that's not the case.

productivity_vs_wage.jpg


So, where does all that productivity and wealth goes?

Avg_Household_NW_1989-2016.gif


Notice, almost all people are flat-liners, except top 10% (and as we know top 1% really gets almost everything). Capitalism distributes wealth to the people who don't need it anymore because they are already wealthy (beyond measure, I'd say).

If our society becomes 100x more productive, in current system that just means that few people will be 100x richer with poverty, hunger and homelessness increasing worldwide.
 

Cap

Well-known member
The Digest: Baidu’s Autonomous Buses Will Start Transporting Passengers in Japan Next Year

On Wednesday, Internet giant Baidu (the Google of China) announced a new partnership. Baidu has agreed to produce 10 of its self-driving Apolong buses for SB Drive, a subsidiary of Japanese conglomerate SoftBank, according to a Bloomberg report. Chinese bus manufacturer King Long will handle the production of the autonomous buses, which could arrive in Japan as soon as early-2019. Company executives made the announcement at Baidu Create 2018, the company’s annual AI developer conference in Beijing.

Each 14-passenger Apolong bus is capable of Level 4 autonomy — that means they’re “fully autonomous” but aren’t designed to handle every possible driving scenario. The buses operate using Baidu’s Apollo autonomous driving system, the basis for Baidu’s partnerships with Ford, Honda, and other companies.

As of Wednesday, Baidu has produced 100 of the vehicles. While most of those are slated to carry passengers in China, the partnership with SB Drive confirms that Baidu has ambitions for the Apalong beyond its home nation.

https://futurism.com/autonomous-buses-baidu-japan/
 

Cap

Well-known member
One question: WHY???

Several reasons.

1) It's progress

2) Market forces. There comes a time when automated labor will be even more profitable than humans who want to work for free.

3) So that drivers and eventually all people can actually live and enjoy their life instead of slaving their lifetime away (but this one requires change of system).
 

Cap

Well-known member
Qbits for Cubists: Robots Made These Incredible Works of Fine Art

Hold still while Vincent van Bot paints your portrait.

That’s right, sophisticated robots can now create works of art comparable to the old masters. The RobotArt gallery has amassed an impressive collection to show what the world’s most creative androids and algorithms (and their creators) have come up with. On Wednesday, the international contest, now in its third year, announced the top ten teams, all of which walk away with cash prizes for their creations. In addition, winning artworks from the past three years will go on display at the Seattle Art Fair on August 2-5.

https://futurism.com/contest-creative-robots-fine-art/

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rahu

Banned
http://beforeitsnews.com/science-an...-issued-humanities-death-warrant-2930498.html

Evidence “the Machines” Have Just Issued Humanity’s Death Warrant
https://youtu.be/m2IXceoULWg
In the world of quickly expanding technology are we simply missing the warning signs of a take over of humanity? Have robots and AI been issuing us threats right under our noses that we shrug of with laughter or words of ‘publicity stunt’? It is time to wake up and hear and see exactly what they are saying.
The real question may be who should we fear, the design or the designer. Each machine is only as good…or bad…as the input it’s given. What happens when the input is so horrible and terrible that it would be shocking to even a human…you’ll see here EXACTLY what happens.
It is imperative that we understand what has been and is being done to assure humanity may someday be made extinct to make way for the ELITE and the rise of the MACHINES. You will be shocked when you witness how technology is laughing in our face and we are simply, at times, just laughing back.​
 

Cap

Well-known member
http://beforeitsnews.com/science-an...-issued-humanities-death-warrant-2930498.html

Evidence “the Machines” Have Just Issued Humanity’s Death Warrant
https://youtu.be/m2IXceoULWg
In the world of quickly expanding technology are we simply missing the warning signs of a take over of humanity? Have robots and AI been issuing us threats right under our noses that we shrug of with laughter or words of ‘publicity stunt’? It is time to wake up and hear and see exactly what they are saying.
The real question may be who should we fear, the design or the designer. Each machine is only as good…or bad…as the input it’s given. What happens when the input is so horrible and terrible that it would be shocking to even a human…you’ll see here EXACTLY what happens.
It is imperative that we understand what has been and is being done to assure humanity may someday be made extinct to make way for the ELITE and the rise of the MACHINES. You will be shocked when you witness how technology is laughing in our face and we are simply, at times, just laughing back.​

This fear is completely unfounded, it is based on a false materialistic premise that matter is fundamental and that, somehow, matter generates consciousness.

AI is just set of algorithms, it is a machine, a tool.
Can it solve problems better than humans? Yes
Can it be abused for selfish purposes? Yes
Can it become self-aware? No

What AI does is basically calculation, algorithms that run on super fast computers, it just resembles thinking but it's not even remotely close to thinking.

The real danger is not AI, it is transhumanism. While idea of prolonging the life, maybe even indefinitely, sounds appealing to many materialistically oriented humans, by willingly accepting technology in their bodies they are playing right into the hands of powers that be. Not only they make themselves easily controllable, they could trap themselves for aeons on this planet, in this reality.
 
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rahu

Banned
I think you are making to many assumptions about consciousness.
.

two google AI computers that were set up to creatively talk to each other. but the computers started using a new language that could not be understood by the researchers. they shut down the experiment because..... they did not know what the computers were talking to each other about......

https://techcrunch.com/2016/11/22/g...ve-invented-its-own-secret-internal-language/

Google’s AI translation tool seems to have invented its own secret internal language

This fear is completely unfounded, it is based on a false materialistic premise that matter is fundamental and that, somehow, matter generates consciousness.

AI is just set of algorithms, it is a machine, a tool.
Can it solve problems better than humans? Yes
Can it be abused for selfish purposes? Yes
Can it become self-aware? No

What AI does is basically calculation, algorithms that run on super fast computers, it just resembles thinking but it's not even remotely close to thinking.

The real danger is not AI, it is transhumanism. While idea of prolonging the life, maybe even indefinitely, sounds appealing to many materialistically oriented humans, by willingly accepting technology in their bodies they are playing right into the hands of powers that be. Not only they make themselves easily controllable, they could trap themselves for aeons on this planet, in this reality.
 
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Cap

Well-known member
I think you are making to many assumptions about consciousness.
.

two google AI computers that were set up to creatively talk to each other. but the computers started using a new language that could not be understood by the researchers. they shut down the experiment because..... they did not know what the computers were talking to each other about......

https://techcrunch.com/2016/11/22/g...ve-invented-its-own-secret-internal-language/

Google’s AI translation tool seems to have invented its own secret internal language

I don't see anything out of ordinary here. The way AI algorithm works is to be given the set of starting rules and the end goal, and in between it improves itself by simulating trial and error scenarios.

The most famous example is AlphaZero. AlphaZero beat the best existing chess software (which is much better than best humans) after only 9 hours of self-learning by producing the best chess ever seen on this planet.

How Does AlphaZero Play Chess?

First, let’s reflect on what happened. AlphaZero was developed by DeepMind (a Google-owned company) to specialize in learning how to play two-player, alternate-move games. It was primed with the rules of chess, and nothing else.

It then started learning chess by playing games against itself. Game one would have involved totally random moves. At the end of this game, AlphaZero had learned that the losing side had done stuff that wasn’t all that smart, and that the winning side had played better. AlphaZero had taught itself its first chess lesson. The quality of chess in game two was a just a tiny bit better than the first.

Nine hours and 44 million games of split-personality chess later, AlphaZero had (very possibly) taught itself enough to become the greatest chess player, silicon- or carbon-based, of all time.

https://www.chess.com/article/view/how-does-alphazero-play-chess

The other example is stock market. It is mainly a self-trained bots trading with other self-trained bots. Humans who trade will just lose money against these bots.

In theory, we could input all relevant data and variables into one of these AI and set overall prosperity as the end goal and the machine would run our economy better than any human(s) could ever do.

But, it is still just a sophisticated computer program. If you download it into your computer that doesn't make your computer alive and self-aware. People are much under impression of Terminator movies.
 

Cap

Well-known member
I think we'd be much better off with an AI as a sort of oracle we could consult on various matters, rather than giving it rulership capabilities.

It is not much of the "ruler" if it can be switched off. The benefit of AI running the economy would be that you can bypass the most pronounced human flaw that's preventing humanity from achieving worldwide peace, stability and prosperity: power hunger. It could also promote real democracy (in the end all of humanity would be "the ruler").

Let's say in hypothetical post-capitalism, post-scarcity, post-work world where AI runs economy, there are no more nation states - just humanity as a whole, we get a report from AI that there is considerable amount of surplus and it waits for instructions what to do with it. We then organize a referendum and decide we want to:

a) improve our quality of life by another 10%

b) direct those resources to our space exploration program

c) direct those resources into scientific research facilities

etc.
 
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