Astrologers' Community  

Go Back   Astrologers' Community > General Astrology > Horary Astrology

Horary Astrology Ask and answer any horary questions, and discuss theory and technique. Please post a chart of the time, date, and place you asked the question. Please do not ask the same question repeatedly, hoping for a different result: horary works best when you ask the question ONCE and then interpret the chart that results from when the question FIRST came into your mind. Horary forums are ONLY for discussion of horary charts and techniques.


Reply
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Unread 09-13-2007, 11:13 PM
Kaiousei no Senshi's Avatar
Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Richardson, TX, USA
Posts: 2,609
Send a message via MSN to Kaiousei no Senshi Send a message via Skype™ to Kaiousei no Senshi
Differentiations of Gifts?

I know the Fifth house is the house one looks to in questions concerning gifts, but I was wondering if this Fifth house is the gifts we receive from others, the gifts we give to others, or both.

Case in point, I ordered a birthday present for a friend of mine, so after the order was all complete I asked the question 'When will he obtain the gift?/When will it arrive?' I had hoped it'd be there just before or on his birthday (I think gifts arriving afterwards are a little tacky and I'd be kicking myself if I couldn't project correctly to get it there on the desired day), but as I got to looking at the chart I got to wondering if there was a difference in houses. Now, I'm the First house, no problem there. My friend is the Eleventh, okay, that's simple. Now, the gift is the Fifth house. Wait, it's not MY gift, as in it's not a gift that I will obtain and keep, so does it count if it's MY gift as in I gave it to him? Or perhaps gifts to other people are the Eleventh house? Or the Fifth from the house that signifies the person? In this case, Fifth from the Eleventh is the Third. I did want to make the gift the Third house, since it would be going through the post, however what makes it special is that it is indeed a gift and not a letter or something similar.

Okay, to make this a lot more simple, I guess what I'm asking is if gifts you give to people and gifts you receive from people are the same house or are in some way derived off of another house.

__________________
Coming events cast their shadows before them.

www.medievalastrologyguide.com
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Unread 09-14-2007, 10:07 PM
starlink's Avatar
starlink starlink is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: I live in peace
Posts: 6,350
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Hi KNS, as far as I can "feel" this one, there are the gifts you give and the gifts you receive. The one's you give out, come from the 5th house. It is the generous Leo house and it represents your expression of gratitude, good wishes, whatever, towards another person.
Now, just imagine, you get a gift from someone else. It becomes your possession, so I think that the "received gift" falls in the 2nd house of possessions. What do you think of this deduction?
You can also maybe look at if from the axis point of view. 5th versus 11th. 5th is giving and 11th receiving. I dont know, the first suggestion seems somehow better to me. But I am guessing here. I have not read about this anywhere, I am just trying to think logically (or am I?) Cheers, Star.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Unread 09-14-2007, 11:51 PM
Kaiousei no Senshi's Avatar
Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Richardson, TX, USA
Posts: 2,609
Send a message via MSN to Kaiousei no Senshi Send a message via Skype™ to Kaiousei no Senshi
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Quote:
Now, just imagine, you get a gift from someone else. It becomes your possession, so I think that the "received gift" falls in the 2nd house of possessions. What do you think of this deduction?
I thought something along those lines too, at first, however if they do become the second house, then shouldn't gifts you give start out as the Eighth house? Even if I buy it, the mentality behind it is "That's P's birthday present" so it was never really mine. Eighth house.

Quote:
5th versus 11th.
That was my second idea. I enjoy it a little bit more, especially since the Eleventh house is that of benefactors. You know, people who give us stuff.

Quote:
But I am guessing here. I have not read about this anywhere, I am just trying to think logically (or am I?)
I haven't found it written anywhere else either. Maybe I'm just thinking too much into it.
__________________
Coming events cast their shadows before them.

www.medievalastrologyguide.com
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Unread 09-15-2007, 01:45 PM
starlink's Avatar
starlink starlink is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: I live in peace
Posts: 6,350
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Hi there again!
Quote:
gifts you give start out as the Eighth house? Even if I buy it, the mentality behind it is "That's P's birthday present" so it was never really mine. Eighth house.
This is an acceptable hypothesis, : the present I buy here in this shop is not my possession.Is it then also not the shopowners possession as he got it from the manufacturer? 8th house is someone elses money or possessions. If you say that the present is not your possession, then the 8th is wrong, because it shows to the second house guy, that it is your possession. So 8th house I dont feel good with. I am still for the 5th and 2nd. The 11th house is a very generous house, giving to and thinking of the welfare of other people. So this house also gives out, does not receive, unless from sponsors for 3rd world countries necessities. It is not personal, but general. Nope, I stay with the one's I mentioned, 5th and 2nd.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Unread 09-15-2007, 08:41 PM
Kaiousei no Senshi's Avatar
Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Richardson, TX, USA
Posts: 2,609
Send a message via MSN to Kaiousei no Senshi Send a message via Skype™ to Kaiousei no Senshi
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Quote:
This is an acceptable hypothesis, : the present I buy here in this shop is not my possession.
Well, to me, personally, if I buy someone a present in a shop, then no, it's not mine. Like in my example above, if I were with a friend and they saw this hypothetical present and asked me what it was, my answer would be something like 'Oh, that's P's birthday present.' It's not my anything, so I don't think it belongs in my Second.

Quote:
Is it then also not the shopowners possession as he got it from the manufacturer?
Well, in purchasing elections the item one is buying is the Eighth as the Seventh is person or company you are buying it from.

Quote:
If you say that the present is not your possession, then the 8th is wrong, because it shows to the second house guy, that it is your possession.
Woah, wait, what? I am the Second house guy. At least, I think I am. I'm confused. The turned Second from the house signifying the recepient of the gift would make sense to me, since it is technically theirs, even if they do not yet have it. Just like when my father bought me my car, it wasn't his Second house, but his Sixth house as Second to his Fifth which was me. So, back to the example of the previous horary (which, by the way, the gift did not make it there on time -.-'') my friend's gift could be shown as the radical Twelfth house since it is the Second to my friend's house.

But then, why even have a seperate house for gifts and possessions? Ah, because the mentality behind them is different. This must be the reason.

Honestly, I think I'm reading too much into it, however, I've always seen things taken off of the radical houses to be in relation to the one represented as the First house. My health (First), my car (Second), my letters (Third), my house (Fourth), my son (Fifth), my cat (Sixth), my partner (Seventh), blah blah blah. So, when I see that gifts are the Fifth house, I think of them as my gifts, my Fifth house. So, then other people's gifts must be derived off of their radical house significator (Fifth from whatever).
__________________
Coming events cast their shadows before them.

www.medievalastrologyguide.com
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Unread 09-15-2007, 08:59 PM
Buttercup Buttercup is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

I have second house as gifts bestowed and received. According to: http://www.bizhostnet.com/us734827/a...ect090707.html
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Unread 09-15-2007, 09:28 PM
Kaiousei no Senshi's Avatar
Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Richardson, TX, USA
Posts: 2,609
Send a message via MSN to Kaiousei no Senshi Send a message via Skype™ to Kaiousei no Senshi
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

SkyScript says Fifth house.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Houses: Temples of the Sky
Pleasure, gifts and all pleasant things.
__________________
Coming events cast their shadows before them.

www.medievalastrologyguide.com
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Unread 09-15-2007, 10:43 PM
Buttercup Buttercup is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Fifth house gifts are things that money can't buy. The second house is tangible gifts.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Unread 09-15-2007, 10:53 PM
Kaiousei no Senshi's Avatar
Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Richardson, TX, USA
Posts: 2,609
Send a message via MSN to Kaiousei no Senshi Send a message via Skype™ to Kaiousei no Senshi
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Like what?

That was a rhetorical question. I think the Medicine Garden article you provided got their house meanings from something else and got them confused. The Second house rules 'gifts' as in skills we have. I hate using the word 'gifts' for the Second house, because it is so easily confused. It's just like the Eleventh house, people say that's the house of dreams. It isn't and it is. It's the house of dreams if you're referring to goals you have. However, actual dreams and the significance of said dreams are Ninth house objects. The Fifth house as gifts makes some sense, considering it also rules parties and such occasions when one would normally receive gifts.
__________________
Coming events cast their shadows before them.

www.medievalastrologyguide.com

Last edited by Kaiousei no Senshi; 09-16-2007 at 12:37 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Unread 09-16-2007, 05:05 AM
Buttercup Buttercup is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

My thought was that the second house is a material house in the physical sense. A party isn't something that you can hold in your hand. I read the skyscript page, so I know where you are coming from. I just understood gifts as second house. I'll be interested to see how you figure this out.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Unread 09-16-2007, 06:38 AM
Kaiousei no Senshi's Avatar
Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Richardson, TX, USA
Posts: 2,609
Send a message via MSN to Kaiousei no Senshi Send a message via Skype™ to Kaiousei no Senshi
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Parties are physical in that they're confined to a place. Kind of like water. I can't really hold water, but I can contain it in a glass. Parties are contained within places. Bad example? Perhaps...but it makes sense to me.

I'm liking my turned Fifth off of the significator's house...even though it's kind of shoddy. Just wanted to see other people's mentalities.
__________________
Coming events cast their shadows before them.

www.medievalastrologyguide.com
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Unread 09-16-2007, 06:51 AM
ASTROWISDOM ASTROWISDOM is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: New Delhi,India
Posts: 2
Send a message via AIM to ASTROWISDOM Send a message via Yahoo to ASTROWISDOM
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

ud you not like to look at the 12th house correlation with the 5th...espacially when you are on Giving end..

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaiousei no Senshi
I know the Fifth house is the house one looks to in questions concerning gifts, but I was wondering if this Fifth house is the gifts we receive from others, the gifts we give to others, or both.

Case in point, I ordered a birthday present for a friend of mine, so after the order was all complete I asked the question 'When will he obtain the gift?/When will it arrive?' I had hoped it'd be there just before or on his birthday (I think gifts arriving afterwards are a little tacky and I'd be kicking myself if I couldn't project correctly to get it there on the desired day), but as I got to looking at the chart I got to wondering if there was a difference in houses. Now, I'm the First house, no problem there. My friend is the Eleventh, okay, that's simple. Now, the gift is the Fifth house. Wait, it's not MY gift, as in it's not a gift that I will obtain and keep, so does it count if it's MY gift as in I gave it to him? Or perhaps gifts to other people are the Eleventh house? Or the Fifth from the house that signifies the person? In this case, Fifth from the Eleventh is the Third. I did want to make the gift the Third house, since it would be going through the post, however what makes it special is that it is indeed a gift and not a letter or something similar.

Okay, to make this a lot more simple, I guess what I'm asking is if gifts you give to people and gifts you receive from people are the same house or are in some way derived off of another house.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Unread 09-16-2007, 07:07 AM
Buttercup Buttercup is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 58
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

I realize you don't like my second house mentality Does it make sense though that the gift would become your friends possession. With that rationale it would be in the twelfth house because it is the second (possession) from the eleventh (friend).
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Unread 09-16-2007, 05:44 PM
Kaiousei no Senshi's Avatar
Kaiousei no Senshi Kaiousei no Senshi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Richardson, TX, USA
Posts: 2,609
Send a message via MSN to Kaiousei no Senshi Send a message via Skype™ to Kaiousei no Senshi
Re: Differentiations of Gifts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Me!
So, back to the example of the previous horary (which, by the way, the gift did not make it there on time -.-'') my friend's gift could be shown as the radical Twelfth house since it is the Second to my friend's house.
I most certainly did.

So, gifts we give are our Fifth house, and gifts we receive become our Second? Hmm...
__________________
Coming events cast their shadows before them.

www.medievalastrologyguide.com
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
differentiations, gifts

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My karmic Reading Miss Saturn Karmic Astrology 35 08-23-2008 10:27 PM
Interpreting the Nodal Axis! Howl Natal Astrology 5 01-08-2008 12:30 AM
Which house rules gifts? eonechoes Horary Astrology 3 07-27-2007 06:18 PM
The moon over London Lenvdb Mundane Astrology 10 05-07-2007 12:34 AM



All times are GMT. The time now is 01:49 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2005-2018, AstrologyWeekly.com. Boards' structure and all posts are property of AstrologyWeekly.com and their respective creators. No part of the messages sent on these boards may be copied without their owners' explicit consent.