Can we look at astrology from a scientific point of view?

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
Astrology from all around the world: Mesopotamian/Mediterranean merges with the MesoAmerican/Mayan. December 21, 2012 - our solar system should be in the exact Galactic Center of our Milky Way between 29-30' Scorpio and 00-01' Sagittarius or in astrology, 29-30' Sagittarius cusping 00-01' Capricorn which is the start of northern hemisphere's winter and within a western calendar year's last 10 days including Christmas or Saturnalia in pre-Christian Roman times. In 1582, the Gregorian calendar was moved 11 days to be astronomically correct, but February 22 may be 4 days until Jesus Christ's probable birthdate in 7 AD with his circumcision a week later on March 3rd...in the first month of spring.

Then you have revisionists studied Mayan prophecies and our adjusted modern calendar contend that February 22, 2020: the very day the COVID-19 pandemic lockdowns were implemented in Lombardy region, Italy; also a month or 2 after a new disease originated and hard hit the Hubei province in China (January 23, 2020 is their new year). The Maya represent the Americas (North and South), Spain is whom colonized Mexico and South America, Italy is where Catholicism is headquartered and the Maya's theoretic ethnogenetic connection with China or East Asians thought to visited and settled Mexico by sailing the North Pacific to intermingled with peoples already present in this section of North America.

Perhaps, the Maya felt the entire world not just limited to their empire will face the biggest challenge they could imagine 500-some years ago, ironically their civilization were conquered by the European Spaniards, the Mayans continued to flourish after they racially mixed with the conquistadors who converted the Native American peoples in Mexico into the (Roman Catholic) Christian religion headquartered in Italy (Vatican City or the Holy See in its capital, Rome)...and Feb 22, 2020 may be the Dec 21, 2012 in astronomical terms after the 11-day adjustment of the Gregorian calendar. And the US (historical Northern Mexico) and Spain (out of all of the European Union) were hardest hit in the pandemic.
 

ja7me

Well-known member
The title pretty much explains itself. I am no skeptic, I'm just wondering if there is any way for us to look at astrology and explain it scientifically. Just why does astrology work, and how can it influence our lives, individually and collectively? Also are there any books on this particular topic that I can read on?

Hello HYHOANG,

Sorry that I am late to the party on this one, I do realise this is an old thread. But this is probably the best question someone can ask on here, and the most difficult to answer. For astrology to progress, us astrologers need to figure out why it works. I can see many people have responded, but few have put forward any type of logic or reasoning behind why astrology should work.

So here is my opinion on How Astrology Works. Please note this is just my opinion, as I admittedly cannot prove it. But, with the right technology and software, maybe I could….

A few years ago I decided to think hard about astrology, and the mechanics of it. I posted an article on my website About How I think Astrology Works. I welcome your opinions, even if you are a sceptic.

I compared astrology predictions with weather and crime predictions.
If I told you I could predict the weather with good accuracy hundreds of years ago, you would have thought I was crazy. But we live in a different world now, one which we can collect huge amounts of data. Weather data proves there is a pattern to the weather, which makes it predictable. Now you could ask yourself, why should the weather have a predictable pattern? Well, it is part of a system of heating and cooling. It is simply a continuous cycle.

I believe everything is part of a system, including us. This must be true as we can create computer games which simulate our world. These games are created using the mathematical formula’s which dictate how things operate in the real world. Anything is predictable with the right amount of information. For example, you could predict what number a dice would land on if you collect enough information about its trajectory, velocity, etc. Chance is an illusion to us, because we are unable to collect every piece of data to predict the outcome for everything.

OK, what about predicting human behaviour? I believe we certainly can predict human behaviour if we have enough data to predict it. In fact, I can show you some real world example of predicting human behaviour.
I once read an article about predicting crime before it happens. That article shows that crime could be predicted if there was enough information. They could do this if a computer was to collect lots of data regarding crime behaviour. Once they have that data, then a prediction could be made about where the next crime zone will be. If this really can be done, then why is astrology any different? Did you check your social media today? It is well known social media platforms are able to predict your behaviour too. The only reason why some people are sceptical of astrology is because astrologers say planets affect human behaviour, but do not say why. And this is a fair point.

Here is my logic to why I think there is a link between our solar system and human behaviour.

1. Our planet has existed for millions of years. The driving force behind any major changes on our planet actually comes from outside it, such as the Sun and Moon. This means we do react to what happens outside of Earth. We are forced to live by natures rules. It is where the term as above so below comes from.
2. All living things on Earth, including us are in synchronization with events happening in space. For example, think of how a plant is in synchronization with the Sun. We are like cogs in a clockwork universe. And just like a machine with lots of cogs, you know that other cogs affect the outcome, but do not always no why. Because the system is too complex to comprehend.
3. I believe astrology would become more accurate if we were to harvest lots and lots of data, linking human behaviour to positions of the sun, moon and planets. Astrology has got to this point by our ancestors and modern astrologists collecting statistical data. I doubt there has been any astrologer take data collection to the next level. It would require a huge investment of money and time. Unfortunately, science is not interested in astrology, science could progress astrology massively. And it could do this by collecting data of people’s personality and linking this to there birth charts.


Anyways. I hope this was not too long. And I hope some of you found my comments interesting.
 

Zeuses

Well-known member
The title pretty much explains itself. I am no skeptic, I'm just wondering if there is any way for us to look at astrology and explain it scientifically. Just why does astrology work, and how can it influence our lives, individually and collectively? Also are there any books on this particular topic that I can read on?

I have come across research in the past but can't recall who undertook it or the objectives. Probably to try and disprove it by cynics. At one point I thought perhaps it could be done but there are so many strands to astrology eg modern, traditional etc that I can't see how it would be possible really. The best way to prove or disprove to yourself is to look retrospectively at your transits over the years which is what I continue to do. It isnt scientific but its a way of testing it for yourself and to see how accurate it is.
 

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
I don't know an astrological conjunction like the Full Moon/Mars/Chiron in Aries influences the world in a very negative manner. NYC (Brooklyn and Queens) are having block-by-block lockdowns soon, and already the entire city of Madrid in Spain had Europe's first major city lockdown in the second wave, these cities were earlier thought to have 25-35% herd immunity estimates (60-70% is the majority achieved) based on studied sampling of locals' COVID antibody tests. The (esp. full) Moon=emotions, Mars=illness, Chiron=medical intervention and Aries=mass suffering, just when US President Trump and the First Lady are now in 2-week quarantine and under medical supervision in case his mild or "cold-like" symptoms worsen to a point they have to be taken to a hospital.
 

Zeuses

Well-known member
If you post a question on here you can get a myriad of different responses from different strands of astrology. I can't see how you can scientifically prove it but that doesn't mean it isn't true to the individual.
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
You can't scientifically prove how Jesus/Yeshu'a was able to walk on water or change water to wine... yet, it did happen [There are yogis in India that can do the same things, so don't tell me "it never happened".]
When "science" accepts the fact that the universe was created, and that so was mankind, then they might begin to believe that there is much in the universe that they can't explain with present day science.

As for someones reply that human nature can be predicted if one has enough data... I say pshaw. If that were true then there is no "free will"... and I gave demonstration of this in my thread on the mutual validation of the Kabbalistic interpretation of the Bible [the Tanakh] in the book"Kabblistic Astrology", by the late rabbi Dobin with that of the Sabian Symbols, . This "creation" is one being allowed to "find its own nature"within the parameters of what it was given as a creation.
A great yogi, a guru, once said that everything was given a predetermined course to follow but that even God is surprised at times by the outcome of some events.

As Dane Rudhyar said each creation is from a seed of the previous, if you will study what I have, and did so present, in that aforementioned thread, you should come to realize that the previous creation was quite confined by limitations and thus was entirely predictable but that is not so as to this present one. It has been given a certain amount of 'slack"...and hence why there are allowable orbs of astrological influence, for one piece of evidence.

Why as to that "slack"? I can only conclude that it has been allowed "to find its own nature" in order for our creator to discover if it can become more than even they may have ever thought possible.
This is an empirical creation and being as such it is not predictable, not entirely, anyways.
 

AriesTiger

Member
I tried to do it in university by conducting a survey to see if people’s personality correlated with their sun signs. I didn’t get significant results, but my sample size was small (around 78 participants, if I remember correctly).
 

conspiracy theorist

Well-known member
I tried to do it in university by conducting a survey to see if people’s personality correlated with their sun signs. I didn’t get significant results, but my sample size was small (around 78 participants, if I remember correctly).

Hey, I noticed your thread and you seem to have the motivation to actually verify whether astrology has some realistic basis, beyond quibbling about it online.

Are you aware of these projects? If not, a possible area of inquiry for you to dive into. Maybe it will catalyse something in you.

http://www.astrology-and-science.com/g-hist2.htm
https://geocosmic.org/publications/
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
I tried to do it in university by conducting a survey to see if people’s personality correlated with their sun signs. I didn’t get significant results, but my sample size was small (around 78 participants, if I remember correctly).

The personality has far more to do with ones' rising sign than the Sun.
Years ago, way back before I really got "into a groove" with this "science", I came up with an explanation for people that had no, or very little, astrological understanding.
I would tell them that you are like potters clay that has been molded and painted to a unique piece... a piece that has the ability to contain something inside...like a cup, or vase, or pitcher, a bowl perhaps.
The Sun is the type of clay you are made of, how it was shaped and painted to look like and what it can be used for is your rising sign, and your Moon, is what it holds inside...

Of course there's so much more to a person than just that, but that is the gist of it... in the way I see it.

I'll skip the lecture on Sidereal precession here, as the descriptions for the Signs do seem to corelate as to where everything presently is by the Tropical Zodiac... more or less.

Me?
Taurus Sun, Scorpio Asc. [Sun conj Desc. by less than a degree orb], Moon in Aquarius, and conj. my nadir by less than 15" of a degree. [Pluto conj. M.C. by about 3* 30'.

The Sabian Symbol for my Asc. was described by Dane Rudhyar [in his book, on the Sabian Symbols, "An Astrological Mandala"] as [keyword] "Transfiguration" ... that is the ability to change how the world sees you... and the Asc. is what molds that clay to appear as. The Sabian for my Sun, is a symbol of the Spirit/Soul overcoming the Ego in a symbolical battle [a flaming torch battling a sword]...and the Sun does provide the ego. My Moon has a Sabian that is about [Dane's Keywords] "TRANSMUTATION OF EMOTIONAL ENERGIES"...that is the ability to rise above the emotional and be centered in the rational state of mind.
Pluto at the M.C. being the planet of 'transformation" and conj. the M.C. which is symbolically the "HOW" of ones natal chart as to achieving ones destiny, fulfilling their dharma, makes up the fourth element of this crucifixion of self, that is my natal chart. My natal Pluto has a Sabian Symbol that is [ibid] "THE PREMATURE EXPANSION OF CONSCIOUSNESS".

i'VE BEEN GIVEN AN ACCELERATED COURSE IN KARMIC CONFRONTATION, SO TO SPEAK.

MY YOGI FRIEND, SURYAKANT, DESCRIBES IT AS "BEING PULLED THROUGH THE COSMIC KNOTHOLE".. [Sorry about the caps, the dang caps lock was on again...too tired to write it again. ...but I just so love that metaphor of Suryakant's


There is such a myriad matrix of different Astrological energies that make up a human being...and each one of us is unlike any that was ever created before.
Sure, you'll find many similarities between individuals but you've got 12 Houses, and a very influential four of them at the char axis, the two Luminaries, 9 planets that we presently know of. A shattered planet that is now known as the asteroid belt, that produces random, and so far, unpredictable, influences opening and closing, like wormholes... Here... and now There, the Nodes of the Moon, and dozens and dozens, of Astrological Parts/Lots that are symbolically active You have a Part of Destiny, but without knowing what the Sabian symbol for the Sign and degree it is in it is as like nothing more than a featureless map... Your Part of Fortune provides the symbolism which you must literally employing someway or manner in your life as to provide the most fortuitous circumstances by which to best achieve your destiny...

...and the Part of Hyleg...the "King Of Parts"... reveals symbolically what all the other Astrological Parts are depositing into.

Let me use my own Part of Hyleg as an example in demonstaration here, if you will?

Mine is in the 3rd degree of Pisces [ibid.]

PISCES 3°: PETRIFIED TREE TRUNKS LIE BROKEN ON DESERT SAND.

KEYNOTE:
The power to preserve records of their achievements which is inherent in fully matured cultures.

When a vast group of men succeed in building a culture with strong institutions which express themselves in significant symbols and works of art or literature, such an effort of many generations is rarely lost altogether. In one form or another, records of this culture endure or are mysteriously preserved, simply because they reveal the place and function of this particular culture in the long process of unfoldment of the potentialities inherent in archetypal MAN. It is such a concept that has been mythified and popularized in the religious idea of the resurrection of the dead on the Last Day. The symbol of petrified wood in the Arizona desert, however, tells us that the actual preservation of the records is never perfect or total. Only fragments remain, significant enough to reveal the essential archetypal form.

This third symbol of the sixty-seventh five-fold sequence brings the promise of social immortality — i.e. the preservation of the enduring (because archetypally meaningful) factors in whatever man attempts within his culture. A symbol of
INDESTRUCTABILITY.


That is what I'm incessantly involved with. ...and in particular this ancient, but mostly lost, "science" of Astrology.

The Sabian Symbols were known of and that thery were used by some ancient civilization in the Middle East that was most adept in the practice of astrology...possibly more so than any other that existed then or since then... but had been entirely lost...that is until Marc Edmond Jones found the perfect channel, the most gifted clairvoyant, Elsie Wheeler...and that was now 95 years ago. Dane Rudhyar studied them for over 50 years before publishing his book on them Most of the world, and a great many 'astrologers" have never even heard of the man...but one day, in a not too distant future, I hope, He will be remembered as oone of the most influential men of the 20th century

As Dane once wrote, "someday, astrology will not only be recognized as a science, but also as the Mother of all science" ...I already have.

There is so much to what makes a human being who they are... so very much... the Sun Sign is just one branch on a many limbed tree
 

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
We're entering an age (Aquarius, we're currently in the tropical Capricornian, I thought we're in Piscean) based on clear scientific research and innovation to have started around 160 years ago. It's going to take 140 more years to the year 2160 AD, supposedly we're in a 300-year transitional period of the ages. Someone earlier on this thread wrote ancient Egypt was a Scorpion age culture, while the pre-Christian era of the Jewish people was in a Sagitarian age culture. Would the Egyptian empire thrived in the Taurus age (the bull) vs the Aries age (the Ram) attributed to the rise of a religion Judaism? Taurus and Scorpio for Egypt are polar opposites, Aries and Sagittarius are fire signs, and Pisces and Capricorn are in the advanced third or 4th trimester group of signs: Aquarius in two ways is doubling the upcoming new age meaning the peak of humanity.
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
We're entering an age (Aquarius, we're currently in the tropical Capricornian, I thought we're in Piscean) based on clear scientific research and innovation to have started around 160 years ago. It's going to take 140 more years to the year 2160 AD, supposedly we're in a 300-year transitional period of the ages. Someone earlier on this thread wrote ancient Egypt was a Scorpion age culture, while the pre-Christian era of the Jewish people was in a Sagitarian age culture. Would the Egyptian empire thrived in the Taurus age (the bull) vs the Aries age (the Ram) attributed to the rise of a religion Judaism? Taurus and Scorpio for Egypt are polar opposites, Aries and Sagittarius are fire signs, and Pisces and Capricorn are in the advanced third or 4th trimester group of signs: Aquarius in two ways is doubling the upcoming new age meaning the peak of humanity.

The Atlanteans arrived in Egypt about 12,500 B.C., that would allow plenty of time to pass from a Scorpionic age and a Taurean one...source of info... Edgar Cayce, who else?
The Sphinx and the Great pyramid were built by the Atlanteans that arrived soon after the last remaining portion of the once great continent of Atlantis slipped under the sea. That began around 75,000 B.C., and it was over a 62,500 year span for the complete destruction of Atlantis to occur. Those that had been misusing their science for their own gratification went West, into what new lands had formed that which we now cal the Americas. It was explained that the present East coast of the USA was once the furthest Western shoreline of Atlantis. The Atlanteans that had remained spiritually forthright and loyal to God went East, some became what are today known as the Basque, the others went into Egypt, particularly the Atlantean preisthood and they brought their religion with them, that of the Aten, or Aton... The Egyptians had their own of the Amen, or Amoun [no one knows exactly how these names were pronounced and certainly not as to how to spell them in English as they are only know from the hieroglyphs and only because of the Rosetta stone were we even able to understand what was written.

I find it interesting in that Cayce said that the reason Atlantis was destroyed by God is that a portion of that population, seeing as how the Atlanteans were so much more advanced than any of the other four Races of man, conspired to reduce the rest of the worlds population and "dumb down" the remnant in order to keep the earth an ecological paradise for their own pleasure and the dumbed down populace as for their servants so that they wouldn't have to do any physical or menial labor.

Pretty much what the NWO, the 2% have planned for all of us, from what I hear.
These are surely the same souls, reborn. Cayce said this is the time of Atlanteans being reborn, as past civilizations reincarnate as a group, generally as a rule.

There are some very studied members of an group of researchers that have studied all the readings given by Edgar Cayce that are about, or even just mention, astrology that told me that Cayce gave indication that the Age of Aquarius began in June or July of 1935. [or it may have been '36, they told me...I'll have to dig up some old emails to be sure.]
 

AriesTiger

Member

AriesTiger

Member
I’m not getting many replies in the thread I started. Can anyone help me collect data? What is your birth month? Describe your personality in three words. Then do the same for everyone else you know in real life or have known in the past. List birth months with personalities of each person you know born in that month.
 
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