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Horary Questions on Relational Issues For horary questions about relationships.

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Unread 10-01-2015, 07:10 PM
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byjove byjove is offline
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Delusion or Delight? Love Reconciliation

It's been a busy two years expanding my life and I've been really enjoying doing that. Probably the last area that I'm trying to make progress on is my love life.

How is dating? Thankfully, dates are coming in thick and fast. (PR Venus conjunct Sun, very nearly exact, trine 7th natal ruler). But none of these are working out. No emotional connection. And my goodness is a romantic man hard to find! I hate this period of time, dating after a strong connection with someone feels so sedate and dull. Nice guys, some of them, but no feeling. So many lemons, so few strawberries.

I find myself still longing for an ex. We met during my natal Pluto sextile Venus (in Pisces) transit. We went on very romantic dates. Firstly, he broke up with me. Next, we didn't have a good ending and the last time we communicated I was very angry. Looking back, I can't be absolutely sure of something I accused him of, or how far he went. I shot him 7 ways before I got an answer. Burnt bridges and sank the boats. But months later I find myself still longing for contact. It's time to figure out if this is delusion on my part, selective, nostalgic memory or if there's something.

My phrasing of the question relates to him as the 7th, but I wonder if it's acceptable to view him as a possible friend, 11th also? Or would the 7th ruler show that possibility.

My (emotional) phrasing at the time was: Will Z and I be together again?

Querent: Cancer rising, Moon in 6th of Sagittarius
Moon: Same
Quesited: Saturn, in the 6th of Sagittarius

So the two significators (1st and 7th) don't connect. I don't know if same-sign means anything in horary, I haven't come across this before. Probably not.

The Moon is in the Face of Saturn. The third night ruler of Sagittarius is Saturn, so he is the third triplicity ruler. I'm not clear, does that put the Moon in Saturn's triplicity? The Moon is near the end of the sign, I'm changing emotional states, but it is not void, it will complete a trine to the Mars next. As far as I can see, the Moon is peregrine, unable to act.

Saturn doesn't seem to have any connection to the Moon except for sharing the same house and sign. But I think that mean nothing. He has no regard? Saturn is the third triplicity ruler of the sign it's in. I don't know how dignified that really is. First or second ruler, yes, third? Is Saturn peregrine?

I can't see any testimony of hope here. But, on the other hand, I don't see enough reflection of my lingering feelings for him. Now why is that? Time for the radical check. Mercury rules the hour. It seems NOT radical. So, is there something else the chart is trying to tell me?

I don't understand why the Moon, me, doesn't show stronger feelings for him. I've been thinking about this for weeks, it's not a whim.
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Last edited by byjove; 10-01-2015 at 07:21 PM.
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Unread 10-01-2015, 07:13 PM
virgo18 virgo18 is offline
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Re: Delusion or Delight? Love Reconciliation

I dont see it
Theres no aspect or reception here.

Hope I am wrong.
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Unread 10-01-2015, 10:42 PM
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Re: Delusion or Delight? Love Reconciliation

Only the in-sect triplicity ruler counts in horary, so Saturn is in Jupiter's triplicity and is in no dignity of the moon.

It doesn't look like the situation is going to change from what is currently is.
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Unread 10-01-2015, 11:33 PM
junoisuppose junoisuppose is offline
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Re: Delusion or Delight? Love Reconciliation

Though I love horary & cast them for myself all the time I am also quite bad at reading them, and I see what they are saying much better with hindsight, so please don't take what I say as gospel.
I think that you being the moon does fit since the moon/cancer is 1) very emotional, and 2) the planet/sign of nostalgia and looking back to the past. The moon is in the 6th but it is close enough to the 7th house to be conjunct. I've read horary textbooks that say that the planet next to the ascendant shows what is on the querent's mind, but I think your ruler being conjunct the 7th could also show what is on your mind & where you want to be - you are almost in the 7th house - that could mean that in your head you are spending all your time thinking about the 7th house person & their life.
I don't see much of a positive outcome though - the moon will enter capricorn shortly where it will be in detriment, plus in its detrimental opposite house, so you will be idolizing/idealizing the 7th house person when you are in Capricorn (his sign & house) but you being in detriment means you will not be able to do anything to bring about a positive outcome.
More positively venus, the ruler of the 5th is approaching a conjunction with mars. Generally outside this horary it has already made the conjunction, then gone retrograde & now it is coming back again. & I'm sure you already know what venus and mars symbolise! I think this means good times, possible romances & flings, perhaps due to associations with friends (mars is ruling the 11th) in fun places (leo), but I think these will be with someone other than the 7th house person you asked about. So that fits with how you described your current situation.
Saturn ruling the 7th is in the 6th house in Sagittarius - does that fit with the guy you are asking about, right now is he involved in 6th house/Sagittarian activities, or do you see him in that way?
Generally also, and in the horary, mercury is retrograding making us think back over what we did in the past, also bringing past acquaintances back into our lives (although the recent venus retrogradation was also a time of thinking back over past relationships and trying to make amends for what we did wrong, venus retrograde was also a time when we reevaluated what we valued and whether we really valued some of our relationships or the things we were spending money on - sorry to go off the horary here, that's why I put it in brackets). In this chart mercury is in the 5th so it could mean going back over past romances, possibly even just in our heads.
I don't know if we should use final dispositors in horary or not, but if we do the fact that the two significators are in the same sign means they have the same dispositor - jupiter, making jupiter influential. Jupiter is at the cusp of the 4th house, which is sometimes referred to as the "end of the matter", also jupiter is in detriment, so again this indicates that there is no possible action to be taken to bring about a positive outcome, I think.
The moon is approaching a trine with mars, which in turn is approaching a square with saturn. This kind of aspect can bring the 2 significators together, so it could be through a mars person, e.g. a young man, an aries or somebody who strongly embodies the characteristics of mars, that you are brought together. This won't be a comfortable experience for the saturn person though, I think, as the aspect is a square. The moon being trine may be more positive about the experience, or may just "go with the flow" & the flowing energy of the trine. I think we can take aspects made after a change of sign into account - to any sceptics I read it in John Frawley's book We could possibly also, at a pinch, say that the moon is approaching a trine to jupiter, which again is square saturn, so after the mars person there is another chance to connect through a jupiter person, e.g. a teacher, a priest, a sagittarian, a foreigner, a jovial person etc.

Last edited by junoisuppose; 10-01-2015 at 11:36 PM.
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Unread 10-02-2015, 12:56 AM
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Bunraku Bunraku is offline
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Re: Delusion or Delight? Love Reconciliation

Trying out this new modern book stuff , correct me ppls if I'm wrong.

The moon conjunct Saturn earlier shows the meeting, the trine Venus shows the possible love the querent has for the person, but after the square from Jupiter.
Mars trine probably missing him physically

Moon and Saturn no aspect = nothing will come out of it no matter what the receptions are.

The final aspect is a square.
It means that the querent will regret the course of action he or she took.

Last edited by Bunraku; 10-02-2015 at 12:59 AM.
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Unread 10-02-2015, 06:25 AM
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byjove byjove is offline
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Re: Delusion or Delight? Love Reconciliation

Thanks kindly for taking a look!

It's good to get some closure. It's good to get things out of your head and see what the stars have to say.

No Testimony
I couldn't really see much testimony for a yes here either. But I'm not fluent in this!

Yes, there doesn't seem to be any reception from Saturn to the Moon.

The Chart Details

Juno, new to horary or not, I really appreciate the detail.

5th House Activities

So far, none of my recent dates have come through friends. But, two of my friends are trying to make things happen (one romantically, one phystically). I have no such attraction to them. I have to say I'm already getting tired of these 5th Leo activities. And if 5th is romance, it is not around me. Dates, but no romantic men!

I've been on a couple of dates with two people recently. Good guys, good personalities. And yet still, not a fraction of the depth and fun I had with the 7th house guy. But, if that bridge is truly burnt, it is burnt.

7th Lord in 6th
Well he is a career guy. Note, career, not job. He's been dedicated on this path for about 12 years or so. Years, and years of education. He's very involved with his work. He is about 7 years older and a little limited in the emotional department. I used to call him 'frosty the snowman' a bit. The truth is that was half of him. The other half was warm and thoughtful. So fairly Saturnian.

I noted that dispositor of the lords as Jupiter in detriment. I didn't know what it meant.

Very astute observations about the experiences upcoming! Trine from the Moon, square to Saturn. Hmm.

Mars/Jupiter Person, Friend Linking
I don't know if this Mars or Jupiter person might be his friends. To be honest, and I could be completely wrong, I wasn't convinved they were a fan of me. They were friendly to me in person, but who knows behind closed doors. He seemed so easily influenced by them. Chance meetings are possible. You know I started rowing classes this summer. Little did I know, he was there the same class time, same day, same club. There are several clubs, several classes and times. We chose the same one. It happens.

Physical Nostalgia
Missing him physically - there was an unusual level of depth physically. I 'felt' his caring like I'd never felt it before, even in longer, easier relationships. It marked me.

I can't be totally sure I'll regret my last action entirely. A friend recognised him, and described that my 7th guy was trying to chat up my friend - while we seriously dating. That's what triggered my reaction. I thought he was better than that.

Once again, thanks all. It means a lot to me.

Last edited by byjove; 10-02-2015 at 06:37 AM.
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Unread 10-05-2015, 06:43 PM
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heidy26 heidy26 is offline
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Re: Delusion or Delight? Love Reconciliation

Your 6th is his 12th. That should raise some questions, as you both are in there.
Being in the same sign signifies that you are into the same things - similar activities and approach to things - so you have things in common.
Your second sigs are Mars and Venus - you are Mars and he is Venus. Moon does perform translation of light, but Moon is not received by neither of you.
And Leo is Saturn's detriment, so from his
You both have little dignity there, Mars by term and face and Venus by term.
The separating conjunction shows what was between you, but that's that.
Funny thing is that the chart does not show emotional interest from none of the parties; maybe you should analyze your feelings - I'd say you let yourself confused by the physical connection and believe it's more than that, but the chart suggests otherwise.
God's delay is not his denial.

Last edited by heidy26; 10-05-2015 at 06:53 PM.
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byjove (10-05-2015)

delight, delusion, love, reconciliation

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