Multiple sudden deaths. Eclipse?

katydid

Well-known member
And as for Pluto representing REBIRTH, as a part of the cycle of Death, I see that very clearly as well.

As my Pluto Moon transit indicated the painful situation with my Mom's battle with cancer, it also indicates rebirth in my self as a mother.

My first grandchild was born in 2015. So my Moon has been rejuvenated. I get to make Easter baskets and stuff Christmas stockings and plan birthday parties again. :wink: I LOVE it. :love:
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
I do indeed have an eighth house sun.
All that eclipse activity happened in my eighth house.
Which is why I suspect it.

Then again, there was an eclipse on that same degree 19 years earlier, and no one in my life died that year. So, obviously, an eighth house eclipse with my sun isn't enough all by itself. Maybe the combination of eclipse, other astrological factors, and me being at the age when, if your relatives haven't started dying off already, they soon will, and your peers are just starting to be susceptible to things like stroke or heart disease.

On that line of thought, I just looked up eclipses for 2012-2013, when my
two uncles died within five months of each other, and for the years when
each of the 3 grandparents I knew died (there was one who died before I was born), and
those were all years when eclipses happened on some sensitive point in my chart.

So, maybe eclipses play a part.
But August 2017 was the only total solar eclipse in my lifetime that happened where I could see it.
As well as the obvious links to eclipses you have outlined :smile:
consider as well the natal charts of the people who died
clearly more research is required
 

Osamenor

Staff member
As well as the obvious links to eclipses you have outlined :smile:
consider as well the natal charts of the people who died
clearly more research is required

I don't have complete birth details on any of them. Even for the family members, I only know birth dates, not birth times.

My cousin who just passed away had her birthday a few days after the eclipse last August, so that eclipse touched her sun. I know that much.
 

waybread

Well-known member
I am sorry for your respective losses.

Both my parents had died by the time I was 35, and a brother died in 2014. To have a parent live to the age of 88 seems to me to suggest normal actuarial tables and average life expectancies.

The problem I still have with astrological death signatures, is that all kinds of people have Pluto-moon conjunction transits, eclipses conjunct their natal sun, and so on. Some people are born with these transits.

I haven't seen that one size fits all.
 

Osamenor

Staff member
I am sorry for your respective losses.

Both my parents had died by the time I was 35, and a brother died in 2014. To have a parent live to the age of 88 seems to me to suggest normal actuarial tables and average life expectancies.

The problem I still have with astrological death signatures, is that all kinds of people have Pluto-moon conjunction transits, eclipses conjunct their natal sun, and so on. Some people are born with these transits.

I haven't seen that one size fits all.

One size doesn't fit all. I'm not trying to say it does. I'm not sure anyone else in this thread is trying to say it does, either.

My sense of astrological transits is, there are many ways any given transit can play out. An eclipse with Mars near my sun in the eighth and Pluto coming in for a quincunx might be related to me seeing a spate of sudden deaths in the next year... but for all I know, I might have a birth chart twin out there who's experiencing the same transits, and they're seeing something else entirely. Maybe nobody died on them, but something's stepped up related to taxes or sex or secrets or any of the other things that live in the eighth.
 

Osamenor

Staff member
And as for Pluto representing REBIRTH, as a part of the cycle of Death, I see that very clearly as well.

As my Pluto Moon transit indicated the painful situation with my Mom's battle with cancer, it also indicates rebirth in my self as a mother.

My first grandchild was born in 2015. So my Moon has been rejuvenated. I get to make Easter baskets and stuff Christmas stockings and plan birthday parties again. :wink: I LOVE it. :love:

Congratulations on being a grandma!

Here's a macrocosmic thought on Pluto and clearing out the old to make room for the new: in the grand scheme of things, the oldest living generation always has to die for the newest generation to be born. Your mother's time is ending--even if she beat the cancer, no 88-year-old has much time left--and your grandchild's time is beginning. That's the natural way of things.

Your mother your grandchild may be able to coexist on this earth as individuals, but if her generation didn't die off, and then yours, there wouldn't be enough room on the planet for everyone in your grandchild's generation, and the generations after them. If this is Pluto, then it's Pluto clearing out the old generation to allow for the new one.
 

katydid

Well-known member
I am sorry for your respective losses.

Both my parents had died by the time I was 35, and a brother died in 2014. To have a parent live to the age of 88 seems to me to suggest normal actuarial tables and average life expectancies.

The problem I still have with astrological death signatures, is that all kinds of people have Pluto-moon conjunction transits, eclipses conjunct their natal sun, and so on. Some people are born with these transits.

I haven't seen that one size fits all.

I have not seen one size fits all either.

And I agree, many have Pluto conjunct Moon transits, without any loss of relatives.

But in some specific cases, it CAN indicate the loss of a loved one.

In my case, it is the 8th house and Pluto, so there's that double influence of loss/death as a possibility. And the Moon, so that beings in the family. And in Capricorn, so once again, possibility of loss, sorrow, illness.

So it is not really a one size fits all scenario.


At the same time that this happened, we were audited by the IRS for our tax return from a few years earlier, and it was a total stressful headache. :sad:
 

waybread

Well-known member
Oh, gosh. Because I file income tax in two countries, I nearly always get audited. Every year. I am kind of used to it by now.

Also, because my husband and I moved to an area that attracts a lot of retirees, the mortality rate around here is fairly high. I've lost track of the number of friends, acquaintances, and neighbours who have died since we moved here 10 years ago, but it is something around a dozen.

I've thought of volunteering to do hospice work, but think we travel too frequently to make this type of commitment.

Natally I have moon widely conjunct Pluto but parallel in the same degree. I've read this as saying something about my experience of my mother, vs. her final illness and death-- which was Plutonian in many ways. (She was a sun-Scorpio.)

What is coming out of this thread, for me, is that the death of loved ones may be a unique experience for each of us, that we each assimilate in different ways.
 

Osamenor

Staff member
Natally I have moon widely conjunct Pluto but parallel in the same degree. I've read this as saying something about my experience of my mother, vs. her final illness and death-- which was Plutonian in many ways. (She was a sun-Scorpio.)
Out of curiosity... was there a slow moving planet, or a progressed planet, transiting your moon in any way when your mother died? Perhaps that activated the moon/Pluto conjunction in a new way.

No reason the moon/Pluto conjunction couldn't signify both your experience of your mother and the way she eventually died. It would just be different meanings at different times in your life. Or one meaning layered on top of another.
 

waybread

Well-known member
I went back and checked, and actually not much pops out about my transits and secondary progressions when my mother died. (Although there's kind of a long story.) Progressed moon in Sagittarius partile trine my natal Leo moon, and counter-parallel my natal moon within a degree. Solar arc Mars in Aries partile trine my natal moon. I also looked at tertiary progressions but wasn't getting any hits.

The long story is that my mother (a sun-Scorpio who died in 1984) went through a really difficult time towards the end of her life: depression and alcoholism. I think that if she thought that suicide was morally justified, she would have committed suicide in one go. As it was, she became a recluse, and I think she effectively killed her self by drinking to the point of passing out, with a few hematomas as evidence of falling and hitting her head. My siblings and I naturally felt dreadful about this, but she didn't want anyone monitoring her and rebuffed our offers of support and help. None of us was living near her at the time, and we were all working.

I read once somewhere that an unhappy Scorpio goes through 3 stages:

1. Lashing out with her stinger at others,
2. Stinging herself,
3. Dying from her own poison.

Yes, I think so.

My mother died with transiting Pluto partile conjunct her natal sun. However, she had been living a very difficult Bad Pluto kind of life for about 6 years before she died, and I think of her generation as opposed to psychotherapy on the grounds that it was just for "crazy people," so she rebuffed any help. She was treated for depression with medication. Transiting Pluto at the time was inexorably activating her natal T-square, and I think it all became too much for someone who was already terribly fragile.

My mother died alone in her apartment, discovered by my cousin in town, who had a key to my mother's apartment. No autopsy was done. Back then, age 71 was apparently considered death of old age.

I flew back home to clean out my mother's apartment, including the feces she had smeared on the bathroom walls.

Very Scorpio-Plutonian, and I do think of her death more as a lengthy suicide, which complicates the "death star" matter. Was my mother's death a welcome release for her? For me??

Needless to say, however, a lot of people survive transiting Pluto conjunct their suns.
 

Osamenor

Staff member
Waybread... wow. What a story.

Yes, Scorpionic/Plutonic in the extreme. You just can't make that stuff up.

Of course people survive Pluto conjunct their suns. If no one ever did, we could reliably predict the death of everyone whose sun sign is being transited by Pluto.

Your mother's story actually sounds a bit similar to my ex boyfriend's mother, who was, I think, a very early Scorpio (possibly very late Libra, she had a cusp birthday). It wasn't that extreme in her case, but she deliberately did not follow doctor's orders or care for herself properly when she was diagnosed with diabetes, and expressed not caring if she lived. She died of diabetes complications, in her fifties. But that was a different era. Pluto was in Sagittarius then.

I don't know what was in the rest of her chart, but the effect it had on my then-boyfriend was, I would say, extremely Plutonic. He never could get past it... of course, nobody just gets over the death of their mother, but my sense is that because of the difficult relationship they'd had, compounded by how she died, it was especially shattering for him. And, in the wake of her death, he learned some secrets that she'd kept, which shattered some things he'd always understood to be true about his family.
 

waybread

Well-known member
Thanks, Osamenor. This isn't easy stuff.

While I wouldn't say Pluto is never involved in a death (what planet would not be?) Pluto has its own way of operating, which can involve secrets, skeletons in the closet, the seamy underbelly of life, shutting oneself off from family, and living in one's own private hell (underworld.)

One other thing I might mention about Scorpio suns, is that some time ago I read (maybe Linda Goodman??) that when a Scorpio dies, another child will be born to the family within a year before or after the death. This actually happened in my case, with my daughter born in 1983. But again, I think a skeptical mind is healthy.

Are you familiar with Judy Hall's book, Hades Moon? While I think she goes too far with her moon-Pluto themes and examples, I'd have to say that I have it in my horoscope.
 

Osamenor

Staff member
One other thing I might mention about Scorpio suns, is that some time ago I read (maybe Linda Goodman??) that when a Scorpio dies, another child will be born to the family within a year before or after the death. This actually happened in my case, with my daughter born in 1983. But again, I think a skeptical mind is healthy.

How often does that happen when the deceased wasn't a Scorpio? I can think of a few examples in my extended family. Mostly related to people having children at the age when their grandparents' generation is dying off, or maybe the first of their parents' generation is, but in one of the examples I can think of in my family, a cousin (not a Scorpio) was born two months before another cousin (also not a Scorpio) was killed in an accident.
 
Top