Pluto-Mars in Libra conjunct Virgo Ascendant
- Thread starter 07.Re
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astro09
Well-known member
Once in a sign, they take the attributes of that sign the planet are in—that is also true even for 29th degree position of any sign.
However, the ascendant it is influenced by the presence of the planet(s) there. So. Your ascendant is the one to take the Pluto-mars conj 'flavor'. By finding them in Libra, the strength of that is not as strong as if they were in Scorpio…
However, the ascendant it is influenced by the presence of the planet(s) there. So. Your ascendant is the one to take the Pluto-mars conj 'flavor'. By finding them in Libra, the strength of that is not as strong as if they were in Scorpio…
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astrologer50
Banned
As you are so late in Virgo the and Asc is your physical body, mode of expression and mask and persona that we all wear and hide behind, but definitely not what's going on underneath. Pluto is only 2' off Asc and pluto is conj mars, so all your planets are 'in your shop window' and visible for others to see.
So the body appearance is Virgoan, the Pluto and mars is all about action, control, deterimination, in first house naturally ruled by Aries, I would imagine, it's very direct and to the point like Aries, tad impatient and impulsive?
I hope you do some kind of sports, as physical energy needs expanding either into competition or kick boxing something to channel the energy in a positive way...
So the body appearance is Virgoan, the Pluto and mars is all about action, control, deterimination, in first house naturally ruled by Aries, I would imagine, it's very direct and to the point like Aries, tad impatient and impulsive?
I hope you do some kind of sports, as physical energy needs expanding either into competition or kick boxing something to channel the energy in a positive way...
waybread
Well-known member
Some interesting things about your first house.
1. Pluto stays in a sign for a very long time; sometimes decades. So everyone within a broad age spectrum would have it. What interests me is not that your Pluto is in Libra, but that it is so close to your ascendant, that people may find you very intense, powerful, and even magnetic.
2. With Virgo rising, your chart ruler Mercury is in Libra. This will tend to "pull" your personality more into Libran territory.
3. In the Placidus house system, your sign of Libra (and its polar opposite, Aries] are intercepted. Usually this means that Libran planets will not have the full outward expression that we would otherwise expect. Example: Although Mars in Libra is supposedly in its detriment, people with this placement are oftentimes fearless fighters against injustices [notably against them.] Pluto/Mars can be quite aggressive: I'd hate to face you in a tennis match, because I know I'd lose!! But in the interception, these energies get toned down.
4. Virgo rising supposedly gives a very neat, tidy appearance; but this will be difficult to maintain with your Uranus in the first! In fact, this is often a signature for someone who looks unusual in some way; notable her hair. With such a loaded first house, my guess is that you don't look like anybody else--or shouldn't, if you're trying to cover up your "electrifying" presence in order to draw less attention to yourself.
I hope this helps. Especially in your case, it is important to move beyond simple sign descriptions to see the synthesis.
1. Pluto stays in a sign for a very long time; sometimes decades. So everyone within a broad age spectrum would have it. What interests me is not that your Pluto is in Libra, but that it is so close to your ascendant, that people may find you very intense, powerful, and even magnetic.
2. With Virgo rising, your chart ruler Mercury is in Libra. This will tend to "pull" your personality more into Libran territory.
3. In the Placidus house system, your sign of Libra (and its polar opposite, Aries] are intercepted. Usually this means that Libran planets will not have the full outward expression that we would otherwise expect. Example: Although Mars in Libra is supposedly in its detriment, people with this placement are oftentimes fearless fighters against injustices [notably against them.] Pluto/Mars can be quite aggressive: I'd hate to face you in a tennis match, because I know I'd lose!! But in the interception, these energies get toned down.
4. Virgo rising supposedly gives a very neat, tidy appearance; but this will be difficult to maintain with your Uranus in the first! In fact, this is often a signature for someone who looks unusual in some way; notable her hair. With such a loaded first house, my guess is that you don't look like anybody else--or shouldn't, if you're trying to cover up your "electrifying" presence in order to draw less attention to yourself.
I hope this helps. Especially in your case, it is important to move beyond simple sign descriptions to see the synthesis.
By whole sign (which as you know is what I use exclusively) your ascendant and Virgo are your 1st house; by this reckoning the mass of planets in Libra are in your 2nd natal house; bythis reckoning also Venus is in your first house, and thus modifies the Virgo ascendant. By Manilius decans, you are a "double Virgo", the ascendant degree not only being in the full sign of Virgo but also in its Virgo (Manilius) decanate as well. In my approach, your massive 2nd house planet load is disposited by Venus in your 1st house-thus you (1st house/ascendant) "control" that mass of planetary influences in the succedent 2nd house (Mercury, your ascendant dispositor, contains the "bottom end" of that planetary mass, while your 1st house placed Venus, as dispositor of the 2nd house, controls that planetary mass "at the top end") I believe the Venus/Libra quality dominating, with a strong Virgo addition, is explained by Libra and Venus dispositing all those 2nd house planets. Also, for me there is no conjunction between Pluto and the ascendant degree, nor between Mars and the ascendant (the orbs are too large in my outlook)
Please note that my delineations are not conventional-I stand by them; however, most modern and even traditionalist practitioners will find them highly questionable.
Please note that my delineations are not conventional-I stand by them; however, most modern and even traditionalist practitioners will find them highly questionable.
waybread
Well-known member
07.Re: thanks for the feedback. Congratulations on your steps towards a more true you!
BTW, I also have Virgo rising at a late degree. But with Uranus square my ASC, there is no way I am going to look like Ms. Nita N. Tidy.
Venus, among other things, is your sense of your femininity. In the 12th house, it suggests an energy that is hidden or mysterious to you. But its house cusp ruler is the sun in your first. Let it shine.
BTW, I also have Virgo rising at a late degree. But with Uranus square my ASC, there is no way I am going to look like Ms. Nita N. Tidy.
Venus, among other things, is your sense of your femininity. In the 12th house, it suggests an energy that is hidden or mysterious to you. But its house cusp ruler is the sun in your first. Let it shine.
Venus, ruler of Libra, is posited in the 1st (whole sign) house: though weakened by its Fall in Virgo, this is compensated for by Venus being angular, in the strongest angular house (the 1st) and also being in the angular part of that house (if Venus were in the cadent 12th house and also in its Fall, it could not have any influence as dispositor over the mass of planets in Libra, and Pluto and Mars-in my opinion-would have, and still be, running all over you) But Venus is strengthened by position (it is also above the other planets in Libra vis a vis chart position) So this "strengthened" Venus (cool and moist) as dispositor of Pluto and Mars and Sun, "modifies" their potential intensity, and draws off some of their qualities, filters these and "pours" them in a Venusian-modified "form" into your first house.
Mercury, "on the bottom end" of the 2nd (whole sign) house, is still strong (succedent house, rising up toward the other 2nd house planets) and is the dispositor of your ascendant sign (also of your ascendant Manilius decanate) Mercury is also a "cool" planetary element, again mdoifying the extreme "heat" (fire) represented by Pluto + Mars + the Sun (and the electric fire of Uranus too) So, 2 planets intimately connected with your "essence" (ascendant/1st house), Venus (in 1st house and dispositor of all the planets in the 2nd house) and Mercury (double dispositor of the actual ascendant degree) "contain" the mass of 2nd house planets, and thus bring them-to a significant extent-under control (or at least influence) of your "will" (essence, ascendant, 1st house)
Hope this explains my meaning in the above quotation from my previous post.
Mercury, "on the bottom end" of the 2nd (whole sign) house, is still strong (succedent house, rising up toward the other 2nd house planets) and is the dispositor of your ascendant sign (also of your ascendant Manilius decanate) Mercury is also a "cool" planetary element, again mdoifying the extreme "heat" (fire) represented by Pluto + Mars + the Sun (and the electric fire of Uranus too) So, 2 planets intimately connected with your "essence" (ascendant/1st house), Venus (in 1st house and dispositor of all the planets in the 2nd house) and Mercury (double dispositor of the actual ascendant degree) "contain" the mass of 2nd house planets, and thus bring them-to a significant extent-under control (or at least influence) of your "will" (essence, ascendant, 1st house)
Hope this explains my meaning in the above quotation from my previous post.
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Please note that I am not trying to convert any one to whole sign-but I shall say that it was enlightening for me (after using Placidus for several decades) Obviously domification has significant ramifications-one reason why it is, and long has been, such a controversial topic, with strong opinions on every side. In your own chart, relative to the position of Venus, the ramifications of domification are clearly apparent: in both Placidus and Equal House, Venus is in the cadent 12th house; by whole sign it is in the all-important, primary angular 1st house. By Placidus and Equal House, all those planets (Pluto, Mars, Sun, Uranus,Moon) are loading up your 1st house (to me that would translate into an overwhelming influence upon the ascendant)-by whole sign, these planets lose the power of angularity, and are modified by being succedent (being posited in the 2nd house) Which is right? Or, perhaps, which is "more correct"? It' s a significant issue in practice, and only personal experience will decide the matter, for each individual.
astrologer50
Banned
Dr Farr, I've sent you a PM.
as always it's your chart and ultimately up to YOU as to where you feel your venus functions and in what house system. So here you have 3 interpretations, pls come back and enlighten as to which YOU feel is most appropriate? with Equal and placidus of course venus is 12th but will always be in 'detriment' in virgo cos it tends to overanalyse the affectional nature...
waybread
Well-known member
Alternatively, I will sometimes use more than one house system if I really want to spend a lot of time with a chart....oh, like mine, for example. Depending upon the chart, you may not see much difference between several of them. I do this especially for charts with high latitude births, where Placidus houses get really skewed.
Just remember with the whole sign system, your angles will be deep within the sign, not at 0 degrees of that sign.
Just remember with the whole sign system, your angles will be deep within the sign, not at 0 degrees of that sign.