Astrology is divination! (Loosing my faith)

Astrology is a mystery. I have been impressed over and over again with regards to Birth Charts and their interpretations. Though I have not seen the same accuracy in predictions, the birth interpretations ring true to me on many levels.

However, that said, there isn't really any true answer to life's problems in astrology and, so far as I can tell, through any other esoteric or supernatural method. (So why would you have faith in anything such as this? Is astrology an individual? Is astrology a supernatural being who has intelligence?) I think, the only one who can know forsure anything would be God, but He is a rather difficult person to get in contact with. However, it doesn't hurt to pray and see if He answers your questions.

I'm sorry, I'm having a hard time taking this post seriously, as it reads like an attempt at religious (Christian) trolling.

You have a right to believe, or not believe whatever you want, so does everyone else.

I didn't tell her what she had to believe, I just gave my opinion based on personal experience. Take it or bloody leave it, it was never meant to be any different than that.

Elaine said:

I'm sorry, I'm having a hard time taking this post seriously, as it reads like an attempt at religious (Christian) trolling.

You have a right to believe, or not believe whatever you want, so does everyone else.

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Yes
I am in this forum because I like astrology and it it fun
but its divination anyways

Re: Astrology is divination? (Losing my faith)

Oh, where to begin? Firstly, astrology is a discipline of study. The positions of the planets at a particular moment aren't random. In fact, astrology is built around their predictability. Each wheel in the astrological clock turns at its own rate, with its own peculiarities. Reading useful information out of the relationships between them is astrology. The planets are not gods that dictate human condition, but they can be used as indicators of qualities. Every human has free will. In fact, we are supposed to be learning to lead the planets, not be lead by them. To use astrology to try to find the easiest time to do something makes you a subject of the planets. All of the things in Life worth accomplishing are difficult, not easy. One of the really big problems with modern usage is that people expect astrology to answer many questions that it was never supposed to address in the first place. Astrology has correct and incorrect applications. Astrology is not divination. Perhaps the act of interpretation could be seen as divination, but the astrology itself is nothing but calculation. It's all number-crunching until you start to interpret it. Math doesn't lie, including the statistics that prove the principle of rectification.

The point of "natalisation," the time when astrological tendencies crystalise in an individual (the correct time of the natal chart), is a variable point between the first breath and about 4.5 hours prior to the first breath. This means that if you use the first breath time, the houses could be off by two whole signs. The process of rectifying a birth time starts from the qualities of a person and the first breath time, and ticks the clock backward throughout that 4.5 hour window to find the chart that matches 100%. Normally, you can narrow that window down to an hour or less by simple observations. If you rectify a birth time correctly, you will have a chart that is 100% functional, accurate, and true. If you do not rectify, then your chart is "fuzzy." Without rectification, nobody gets a chart that is 100% accurate. Most people can get most information right without rectifying, but some people must have their birth time rectified or the chart won't make any sense at all. Nearly all charts used by modern astrologers are flawed in some way.

Further, you shouldn't get me started on how much astrology is in the Bible. Generalisations about "Christian trolls" don't help the conversation. Also, He isn't that hard to contact. He wants to commune with you. You're the only thing that's stopping it.

Re: Astrology is divination? (Losing my faith)

A good post Mark. Would you be interested in starting a seperate thread on astrology in the Bible? It sounds like a fascinating topic, and I don't have much knowledge on it.

Well,

My comment wasn't to you, so I guess there's not a problem

I started to guess that afterward. I'm sorry, I see what you meant.

It's Ok.

When the poster clarified his/her remarks the intent became clearer to me.

No harm done, goodnight

virgo18 said:

I am losing my faith in Astrology. I don't want to offend no one that believes blindly in this stuff.

I think that Astrology is esoteric, divination and all that stuff. At first because is related to the Zodiac signs.
The same as a random bunch of tarot cards can tell you the future, a coffee cup, the hand lines, and a crystal ball that can tell you a couple of true predictions, and a couple of failed predictions.... Astrology is the same...but not with cards, now its with planets at random. They all are related to the zodiac and paranormal situations that dont have scientific explanation.

How can 10 planets and some asteroids at random places when you were born, can tell you how you will your life be?? At second place... life begins when you are when you are conceived.
Is like if I hide in a cabin of meat, I will not be influenced by the planets and their configurations?

How can the planets at random signs and in random places can tell you how you are, how you love, how much intelligence you have, how liberal you are, and how passionate you are??? Just because the Greeks put the name of their Gods to the planets in the sky?

Why the twins don't have the same destiny and personality?

I went with an astrologer the last year, she told me that I will get married the next year... some people in this forum confirmed to me this prediction, and surprise! I don't have a boyfriend yet. I hanging out with a person who matches with the one signed in my chart... but surprise! He doesn't get serious and committed!... BTW one person told me that he is the one, and another person told me he is not the one.


This is not a science, this is not real, and I am truthfully loosing my faith.

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You raised some interesting points, Virgo18. However, just out of curiosity, do you think that debunking astrology and occult sciences in general simply because there's no guarantee that you're always going to get what you want when you want it based on your natal chart, tarot readings, tea leaves, etc., is a form of antipathy that borders on arrogance? I say that because it seems as if the atheists and/or evolutionists I've run across (and by the way, I'm not saying you're either. Just making a point here.) tend to debunk God's existence because maybe at one time in their lives they prayed for something and it didn't come true, or because they can sometimes apply formulas to what some people simply accept as their God's handiwork or unexplained phenomena (e.g., scientific vs religious postulations as to how the Red Sea may have parted.)

Hmmm..

First off, I was under the impression that the planets merely influenced life, not controlled it. Anybody can be anything if they wanted.

And second, having said that, predicting the future with astrology is not really more different than predicting what a well-known adversary would do against you in a battle of wit. You know the tendencies and the methods, as well as the interferences and other obstacles both neutral and otherwise, and you formulate a best guess based on that information. So it is very possible you were to meet someone you liked soon, but due to that person's own personal problems they weren't able to meet you. Or, you did what my third thought on the subject details...


Third, and this is my own personal take on the matter, if you were to predict the future accurately, and then you set about trying to change the future, you would in fact change the future... If I seen in a vision from some holy spirit that you were to fall down a flight of steps tomorrow, and I told you about it, and you stayed in bed all day and never left your bedroom once... you can't come crying to me about how I'm wrong about my psychic vision. Its not set in stone.

Nothing is set in stone. Like Mark said, even the best astrologers in the world can't be 100% beyond-doubt accurate. Free will can change even the most subtle nuances.. small things that critics would look to and say "see?! Look it isn't real!"

Re: Astrology is divination? (Losing my faith)

I'd rather put it as: Even when a birth time is properly rectified and the astrological calculations you derive are 100% accurate, they can only tell you as much as astrology itself can tell you. Astrology is a series of interpreted calculations based on Life. It was never supposed to give you any ultimate answers. Astrology is, in itself, a key to understanding the Universe; one of many keys.

P.S. Sorry for being an ***.

I don't know if it's fair to blame astrology for the inaccuracies of an astrologer who misinformed you. There are people who are good at it, and there are people who aren't so good at it, as is the case in all trades. When perfecting any art or science, there are walls that are constantly bumped into and have to be worked out. We wouldn't have gotten very far in many experiments if we gave up when the first person got confused. I know there's a lot of conflicting information out there, and that's why these things have to be taken in with discrimination and personal testing, rather than faith.

Astrology is only divination to the person who chooses to use it as such, as it seems you were. I'm doubtful of whether astrology can accurately predict the future. More realistically, I'd say astrology can predict future conditions and opportunities, and it's up to the human being to choose how to work with those conditions.

How the planets can affect human behavior is a question often asked, and I don't think anyone can give a definite answer to that. The most satisfying answer I've found came from a thread on this forum, when a skeptic asked how astrology worked, and a member named Futurist responded with this:

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=22706&postcount=22

When I read his theory my imagination lead me to thinking how a newborn could instantaneously tap into the current harmonics of the solar system and achieve life on that frequency. New life is ultra-sensitive, and some regulation with the immediate environment would have to be reached. (When a child is still in the mother's body it's not an actual independent life-form, because it is living off of the mother rather than itself.) I'm not saying that's what happens, I'm simply stating that this thought was remarkable because it made some sense to me, which is something I've not gotten from any other theory.

The Sun and Moon have an obvious effect the conditions of nature on Earth, so it seems practical to me that they might also have an effect on human beings and animals.

Ultimately, the case is in the evidence. To have so many bad astrologers running around making assumptions is doing nothing good for astrology as an art or a science. Don't take anyone's word for it. Every profession has people just waiting to pull one over on their clients and make dirty money, but it doesn't say anything about the trades themselves. Everything should be examined carefully before total acceptance.

I recommend that you stop biting off more than you can chew, and try to learn about astrology before utilizing it, or else you're likely to run into more walls.

Good luck.

Re: Astrology is divination? (Losing my faith)

Mark said:

I'd rather put it as: Even when a birth time is properly rectified and the astrological calculations you derive are 100% accurate, they can only tell you as much as astrology itself can tell you. Astrology is a series of interpreted calculations based on Life. It was never supposed to give you any ultimate answers. Astrology is, in itself, a key to understanding the Universe; one of many keys.

P.S. Sorry for being an ***.

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Not at all an ***! That's what I was trying to say, I just can't find the words sometimes!

Very well put, my friend.

If you go to one or two astrologers and their predictions don't fit, then you say astrology in its entirety is "divination".....

But if you go to a doctor and their medicines dont work, you don't say that medicine in its entirety is a fraud, do you?

It's human activity, so it's bound by human flaws. But, even though we don't know how, it works, and you will know it if you care to study it in depth.

It's not a matter of faith either, it's a matter of understanding the language and checking the facts. Belief and faith are totally unnecessary when dealing with astrology.

RockFish said:

If you go to one or two astrologers and their predictions don't fit, then you say astrology in its entirety is "divination".....

But if you go to a doctor and their medicines dont work, you don't say that medicine in its entirety is a fraud, do you?

It's human activity, so it's bound by human flaws. But, even though we don't know how, it works, and you will know it if you care to study it in depth.

It's not a matter of faith either, it's a matter of understanding the language and checking the facts. Belief and faith are totally unnecessary when dealing with astrology.

Click to expand...

Excellent analogy, IMO, Rockfish.

Today it is full Moon, exciting the transit of Ura/Jup opposing Sun (yours). People loose their faith. Just an indication that planets do influence. This can continue for few months.

The key indicators of Astrology, Uranus, Mercury and Jupiter are challenging or opposing each other. So interest will continue.

Why the twins don't have the same destiny and personality?

**** well .. lets put it this way, there is a time difference between 2 twins. 5 minutes apart will put 1 deg apart. If you use solar arcs, 1 degree apart which is 5 minutes in real time = 1 year ... As far as I understand and I do use very tight orbs esp when it comes to midpoints, diff midpont allignment will be the key why they have a diff faith. I knew a twin girl her sister died shortly after they were born. Pluto / Uranus / Asce midpoint was not present in surviving twin but it was present in a twin that died from heart failrure. *****


I went with an astrologer the last year, she told me that I will get married the next year... some people in this forum confirmed to me this prediction, and surprise! I don't have a boyfriend yet. I hanging out with a person who matches with the one signed in my chart... but surprise! He doesn't get serious and committed!... BTW one person told me that he is the one, and another person told me he is not the one.

***** problem with astrologers is they dont look at how transiting planet affecting person case by case or event by event. Let me throw you an example, when something happens you run to transit chart and say AHA that is what was transiting that brought me that event!" right? Do you look at non-event producing transiting plantary aspects? 9 out of 10 you dont. I never looked at person's chart without looking at major past events and feeling out which planets are event bringing and mute. I knwo a few people who had a TOUGH time with Saturn return. I know 2-3 peopel who didnt even a thing - which is my case. astrologers a lot of them dont take time looking in depth beforethrowing a judgement. I would cross with horary and progressed / solar arcs / transits. ****



This is not a science, this is not real, and I am truthfully loosing my faith
*** we discussed this extensivly. astrology should not be treated as science. Astrology is all about learning about yourself and your surrounding.. I do not see astrology as art either.****

Don't blame your frustrations on a bad astrologer.

/thread