Know Thyself

sibylline said:

I did read the entire post, and the following posts. Good read. And I'm familiar with that astrologers' work.

8th house can resonate with someone if they've got strong Scorpio since the two have similar themes but if you want to consider yourself 8th house Sun, that's great. I was just giving my views, adding to the discussion. Your first post said, "Everyone is welcome to comment whether it be to suggest, correct, or observe." So that's what I did. If you didn't mean that in actuality, feel free to ignore my post.

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I did that's why I didn't ignore your post.

There are some sites that bump my Sun to the 9th house and some that don't. I noticed this so I found what I could on both. One said for the 9th House you spend time in another country, learn a foreign language, that's true but that's about where it stopped for me. But what do I know, I'm the one who just started here. Maybe it does both, maybe it does one, maybe none of this even means anything.

IfIKnewBetter said:

Is the 11 and 12th house gap wide enough? I'm bad at counting degrees.

Usually if my inner life is going well so is my outer. I tend to manifest what I feel or want very easily when I operating at a high octave. But then those ******* Pluto Squares and my weak-*** Saturn who just so casually opposes my Leo Stellium AND MC... The banes of my existence both of those. I want to do a lot, I want so much of this world, but then Saturn whispers, "It's not realistic, nobody does that, it's doomed from the beginning, you're not good enough, no one would like that in fact you wouldn't either..." So instead I do the "realistic and responsible" thing that's not really me and anguish about it. Funny enough though, it feels like I'm dying to do whatever thing is. Because of the work I've done in the last few days I understand why now. It's like Pluto changes his mind and goes, "Actually you need to do this right now or we'll regret it forever, I'll drown you in regret if you don't. We'll never forget." If that's a See Saw then yes.

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Yes, there is 75 degree open space between Moon/Mars and 145 between Sun/Saturn.

The Sun to Mars grouping, in 9th and 10th vs the Moon/Saturn grouping in the 1st quadrant.

The see-saws are formed upon oppositions. Yours is the Mercury opposed Uranus and Saturn opposed Jupiter/Venus/Mars.

Pluto is basically squaring the Leo/Aquarius opposition. So that brings that tension into the mix, personally.

here is a good description of a see-saw pattern:

This suggests a teeter totter in motion, an often repeated attempt at readjusting an uncertain equilibrium. The characteristic genius of the Seesaw type is as Marc Jones stated "a tendency to act at all times under a consideration of opposing views or through a sensitiveness to contrasting and antagonistic possibilities. The Seesaw temperament has its existence in a world of conflicts, of definite polarities."
http://mindfire.ca/Person Centered Astrology/Chapter Sixteen - Planetary Patterns.htm

katydid said:

Yes, there is 75 degree open space between Moon/Mars and 145 between Sun/Saturn.

The Sun to Mars grouping, in 9th and 10th vs the Moon/Saturn grouping in the 1st quadrant.

The see-saws are formed upon oppositions. Yours is the Mercury opposed Uranus and Saturn opposed Jupiter/Venus/Mars.

Pluto is basically squaring the Leo/Aquarius opposition. So that brings that tension into the mix, personally.

here is a good description of a see-saw pattern:

This suggests a teeter totter in motion, an often repeated attempt at readjusting an uncertain equilibrium. The characteristic genius of the Seesaw type is as Marc Jones stated "a tendency to act at all times under a consideration of opposing views or through a sensitiveness to contrasting and antagonistic possibilities. The Seesaw temperament has its existence in a world of conflicts, of definite polarities."
http://mindfire.ca/Person Centered Astrology/Chapter Sixteen - Planetary Patterns.htm

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The two opposed groups of planets in your chart represent the two opposing views you are trying to balance or harmonize.

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Career, Reputation (10) vs Home, Emotions (4)
Communication, Early Education(3) vs Abstract, Higher Education (9)
-Beliefs vs Progress (Mercury-Uranus)
-Responsibility (Saturn) vs Do (Mars) what inspires (Jupiter) you and makes you feel good (Venus)
-Conditioning/Responsibility (Saturn) vs Optimism/Expansion (Jupiter)
-Conditioning/Responsibility (Saturn) vs Relationships/Artistic Expression (Venus)
-Conditioning/Responsibility (Saturn) vs Force/Desires (Mars)

Or Tim Wilsons' interpretations:

Expansion (10) vs Home (4)
Thinking (3) vs Transformation (9)

I'm going to take a crack at this and say: Not leaving comfort zone to further career. Not expanding thinking or integrating new ideas that can transform or lead to change. For the Saturn Oppositions pretty much speak for themselves.

With more squares or trines, however, the see-saw indicates equilibrium, stability and reliability, although it sometimes leads to a lack of flexibility and openness.

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You become a stubborn jack*** to quote the wise Shrek.

It's not surprising that people with this configuration have two different sides

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Jekyll and Hyde. I think we saw that today. I'm not having a great time right now. That tends to make me an butt cheek. Definitely owe someone an apology.

Thanks for your research and effort Katydid. This continues to be a much needed eye opening experience.

[b]"Astro-Sentences" And Planets in the Houses[/b]

"Astro-Sentences" And Planets in the Houses

This is what I mean by "sentence". I'll also be using this and this (thank you Katydid .) Each House with Planets will get one sentence for each Planet:

First House [Scorpio:]
-Transformation modifies home focus on being. (Moon)
-Transformation modifies transformation focused on being. (Pluto)

Third House [Capricorn:]
-Duty modifies spiritual focused on thinking/daily work. (Neptune)
-Duty modifies friends focused on thinking/daily work. (Uranus)

Fourth House [Aquarius:]
-Friends modifies duty focused on home. (Saturn)

Eighth House [Gemini:]
-Thinking modifies self expression focused on transformation. (Sun)

Ninth House [Cancer:]
-Home modifies thinking focused on expansion. (Mercury)

Tenth House [Leo:]
-Self expression modifies being focused on duty. (Mars)
-Self expression modifies physical/relationships focused on duty. (Venus)
-Self expression modifies expansion focused on duty. (Jupiter)


Sun:

-I am a person whose intrinsic character is [mental, inquisitive, communicative] and I find my greatest development in [transformation.]

Moon:
-My temperament is [piercing, emotional, intense] and it instinctively draws me in the direction of [Self Awareness.]

Ascendant:

-My role and my feeling for life are [transforming, deep, healing,] supported or impeded by [my emotions, feelings, and daily habits,] and [my capacity to transform and renew myself.]

Mercury:

-My thinking is [emotional, sympathetic, receptive] and I prefer to use my mind in [Expansion of Awareness.]

Venus:

-My idea of love, relationships, and beauty is [dynamic, playful, romantic.] I mainly express my sense of beauty in [Social Integration.]

Mars:

-I am a [self-assured, loyal, commanding] fighter and frequently carry out my conflicts in [Social Integration.]

Jupiter:

-The attitude toward life that I consider valuable and impressive is [radiant,self-confident, generous.] I feel rich in the area of [Social Integration] and in everything that Jupiter touches [Self-projection, Desire, Attraction, Beauty, Limitation, Universal Law, Regeneration, and Transformation.]

Saturn:

-I have difficulties with [reforming, progress, friendliness.] My limitations, inhibitions, feelings of guilt, as well as my greatest opportunities for growth lie in [Establishing Foundations] and in everything Saturn touches [Self-projection, Desire, Attraction, Beauty, Expansion, Optimism, Self Awareness.]

Uranus:

-I live my independence and/or change my standpoint in the area of [writing, conversation, relatives] and in everything Uranus touches [Intangibility, Idealism, Thought, Communication, Regeneration, Transformation.]

Neptune:

-I experience deep longings and desires for liberation in the areas of [day-to-day environments, relatives, routine interactions] and in everything Neptune touches [Inspiration, Deviation, Regeneration, Transformation.]


Pluto:

-I experience power and helplessness, "tunnel experiences," obsession and deepest transformations in the area of (Self Awareness) and in everything Pluto touches [Self-projection, Desire, Attraction, Beauty, Expansion, Optimism, Self Awareness, Inspiration, Deviation, Intangibility, and Idealism.]

Yep, you have the right idea but it needs some tinkering. I think you are putting the sentences backwards, so to speak.

Here are some other suggestions, ideas, about how to order the keywords:

http://www.earthwitchery.com/astrology.html


I am a person whose intrinsic character is (Keyword for SIGN your Sun is located in) and I find my greatest development in (Keyword for HOUSE your Sun is located in).

Find the Moon in your chart, then complete the following sentence:

My temperament is (Moon SIGN keyword) and it instinctively draws me in the direction of (Moon HOUSE keyword.)



OR

http://www.rosicrucian.com/aks/akseng01.htm

[ this has a good discussion about how to synthesize your chart]

Knowing, to Better

Better,

You said:

IfIKnewBetter said:

"Astro-Sentences" And Planets in the Houses

This is what I mean by "sentence". Each House with Planets will get one sentence for each Planet:

First House [Scorpio:]
-Transformation modifies home focus on being. (Moon)
-Transformation modifies transformation focused on being. (Pluto)

Third House [Capricorn:]
-Duty modifies spiritual focused on daily work. (Neptune)
-Duty modifies friends focused on daily work. (Uranus)

Fourth House [Aquarius:]
-Friends modifies duty focused on home. (Saturn)

Eighth House [Gemini:]
-Thinking modifies self expression focused on transformation. (Sun)

Ninth House [Cancer:]
-Home modifies thinking focused on expansion. (Mercury)

Tenth House [Leo:]
-Self expression modifies being focused on duty. (Mars)
-Self expression modifies relationships focused on duty. (Venus)
-Self expression modifies expansion focused on duty. (Jupiter)

Click to expand...

Great job! One correction: the third house is the THINKING house so the "astro-sentence" should be:
Third House [Capricorn:]
-Duty modifies spiritual focused on thinking. (Neptune)
-Duty modifies friends focused on thinking. (Uranus)

Also notice that two planetary energies and have TWO keywords so:
Ninth House [Cancer:]
-Home modifies thinking/Daily Work focused on expansion. (Mercury)

Tenth House [Leo:]
-Self expression modifies relationships/Physical focused on duty. (Venus)

Already you've seen there is tension between:
Home (4th house) vs. Duty (10th house)
Thinking (3rd house) vs. Expansion (9th house)

notice that these two houses are opposite each other in the astrological chart and opposite each other in meaning as well.

And remember the first part of the lesson, showing you have a stronger focus on Self (7 planetary energies there) than Other (3 planetary energies there). As well you are balanced between your Inner World (5 planetary energies there) and your Outer World (5 planetary energies there).

Also notice whether you have your planetary energies ON any of the four major dividing lines in the chart...and you do: Moon (home) on your Ascendant (self) and Saturn (duty) on your IC (inner world).

So, to sum up all of this so far:
You balance yourself between both your thinking (analyzing) and your expansion (wider knowledge), and your home and career. You naturally focus on yourself but can move back and forth easily between focusing on your inner world and your outer world. You have a natural focus on your Being, Thinking, Home, Transformation, Expansion, and Duty.

Now let's simply look at how many times keywords come up in your "astro-sentences":

Now putting them in order:
Duty: 5
Transformation: 4
Self-expression: 4
Thinking: 4
Being: 3
Home: 3
Friends: 2
Expansion: 2
Relationships: 1
Physical: 1

So you have a strong sense of Duty, Transformation, Self-expression, and Thinking and very little on Relationships. This fits with what you yourself said: "I don't think you should sacrifice your potential or who you are for the love of another. I don't believe that love affairs are the only thing that matters in this world or in life. We could all do so much if we delved into ourselves and saw what we could find then used it."

So that's a lot of information right there! The "astro-sentences" will give you more insight into HOW you focus on those key areas (houses) in your life.

One step at a time,

Tim

katydid said:

Yep, you have the right idea but it needs some tinkering. I think you are putting the sentences backwards, so to speak.

Here are some other suggestions, ideas, about how to order the keywords:

http://www.earthwitchery.com/astrology.html


I am a person whose intrinsic character is (Keyword for SIGN your Sun is located in) and I find my greatest development in (Keyword for HOUSE your Sun is located in).

Find the Moon in your chart, then complete the following sentence:

My temperament is (Moon SIGN keyword) and it instinctively draws me in the direction of (Moon HOUSE keyword.)



OR

http://www.rosicrucian.com/aks/akseng01.htm

[ this has a good discussion about how to synthesize your chart]

Click to expand...

Super helpful, thank you! Those sentences I wrote based on your first link made a lot more sense to me. I'll be coming back and fixing them piece by piece. I'll be using the second link for aspects in my chart. You've been so helpful with me here, I appreciate it. When I took on this project I didn't think it was going to this difficult lol

Re: Knowing, to Better

wilsontc said:

Better,

You said:


Great job! One correction: the third house is the THINKING house so the "astro-sentence" should be:
Third House [Capricorn:]
-Duty modifies spiritual focused on thinking. (Neptune)
-Duty modifies friends focused on thinking. (Uranus)

Also notice that two planetary energies and have TWO keywords so:
Ninth House [Cancer:]
-Home modifies thinking/Daily Work focused on expansion. (Mercury)

Tenth House [Leo:]
-Self expression modifies relationships/Physical focused on duty. (Venus)

Already you've seen there is tension between:
Home (4th house) vs. Duty (10th house)
Thinking (3rd house) vs. Expansion (9th house)

notice that these two houses are opposite each other in the astrological chart and opposite each other in meaning as well.

And remember the first part of the lesson, showing you have a stronger focus on Self (7 planetary energies there) than Other (3 planetary energies there). As well you are balanced between your Inner World (5 planetary energies there) and your Outer World (5 planetary energies there).

Also notice whether you have your planetary energies ON any of the four major dividing lines in the chart...and you do: Moon (home) on your Ascendant (self) and Saturn (duty) on your IC (inner world).

So, to sum up all of this so far:
You balance yourself between both your thinking (analyzing) and your expansion (wider knowledge), and your home and career. You naturally focus on yourself but can move back and forth easily between focusing on your inner world and your outer world. You have a natural focus on your Being, Thinking, Home, Transformation, Expansion, and Duty.

Now let's simply look at how many times keywords come up in your "astro-sentences":

Now putting them in order:
Duty: 5
Transformation: 4
Self-expression: 4
Thinking: 4
Being: 3
Home: 3
Friends: 2
Expansion: 2
Relationships: 1
Physical: 1

So you have a strong sense of Duty, Transformation, Self-expression, and Thinking and very little on Relationships. This fits with what you yourself said: "I don't think you should sacrifice your potential or who you are for the love of another. I don't believe that love affairs are the only thing that matters in this world or in life. We could all do so much if we delved into ourselves and saw what we could find then used it."

So that's a lot of information right there! The "astro-sentences" will give you more insight into HOW you focus on those key areas (houses) in your life.

One step at a time,

Tim

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There's so much information in one chart, no wonder people give up after the basics. The only reason I'm patient is for those "aha! that's why..." moments and the times I learn a little more about myself and the tools/gifts I have.

Your summaries resonated with me and what I've learned so far from my chart. Looking at the tally... It's no joke, those top four are basically all I think about and I tend to use them against/with each other, also that's probably why relationships aren't my strongest point.

I have a question:

Also notice whether you have your planetary energies ON any of the four major dividing lines in the chart...and you do: Moon (home) on your Ascendant (self) and Saturn (duty) on your IC (inner world).

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What does that mean then?

Planets on the points, to Better

Better,

You asked:

IfIKnewBetter said:

There's so much information in one chart, no wonder people give up after the basics...

I have a question:

Also notice whether you have your planetary energies ON any of the four major dividing lines in the chart...and you do: Moon (home) on your Ascendant (self) and Saturn (duty) on your IC (inner world).

Click to expand...

What does that mean then?

Click to expand...

I think you're right, basic astrology is VERY powerful. You can stop right there with the basics and get a LOT of information. For those who want to go further, learning more in-depth astrological methods will get even more information.

As to the planets on the points (i.e., "dividing lines"), this indicates a STRONG focus in one of four areas: Self (Ascendant), Others (Descendant), Outer world (Midheaven), Inner world (IC). Since your focus is on your Ascendant and IC, you have a strong focus on yourself and your inner world.

Astro-simply,

Tim

TWilson -

You rock. I love your sporadic but meaningful set it straights when you talk astrology. You're probly a Saturn in Libra, huh?

Know your sharp edges and how they get sharpened or dulled. I learned that too, from my mom. "Wha's on the angles?"

She told me in her sag benevolence with merc 0 opposite my mars 0 that "you'll be waiting at a trainstop a few times in your life. make the best of it."

I have fixed and cardinal angular houses.

Re: Planets on the points, to Better

wilsontc said:

Better,

You asked:


I think you're right, basic astrology is VERY powerful. You can stop right there with the basics and get a LOT of information. For those who want to go further, learning more in-depth astrological methods will get even more information.

As to the planets on the points (i.e., "dividing lines"), this indicates a STRONG focus in one of four areas: Self (Ascendant), Others (Descendant), Outer world (Midheaven), Inner world (IC). Since your focus is on your Ascendant and IC, you have a strong focus on yourself and your inner world.

Astro-simply,

Tim

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You're a gold mine of knowledge, I can't resist, I want to crawl into your brain and absorb your neurons. Teach me so I can suck the marrow out of my chart, please.


I'm making an educated guess here and assuming the planet that occupies the lines makes a difference in interpreting that as well?

Wow, KD, thank you for all this information! x x x

Planets on the points continued, to Better

Better,

You said,

IfIKnewBetter said:

You're a gold mine of knowledge...the planet that occupies the lines makes a difference in interpreting that as well?

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Thank you! Yes, planets on a point indicate a strong focus on that point. The TYPE of planet on the point indicates HOW the strong focus occurs. So in your chart Moon moon: emotions) is on your Ascendant (self), so you are personally very emotional. Saturn saturn: duty) is on your IC (inner world) so you have a deep sense of duty and responsibility.

Astro-simply,

Tim

Katydid, with a See saw pattern is there a tendency towards something like a "split" personality/life? If so I must be living on one side because sometimes while I researching for this thread I have my, "That couldn't possibly be right" moments.

IfIKnewBetter said:

Katydid, with a See saw pattern is there a tendency towards something like a "split" personality/life? If so I must be living on one side because sometimes while I researching for this thread I have my, "That couldn't possibly be right" moments.

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I am not sure if it ever indicates a split personality. Maybe...?

But often it can work by the native taking on one set of attributes, and the opposition can be shown by 'OTHERS' they must deal with. So an opposition to Saturn may bring authority figures into one;s life that they have to battle with. Or a Pluto opposition sometimes brings in obsessive types or stalkers..etc.


Also, keep in mind, if something you read feels like it is not correct and does not fit, then that aspect/placement may just be presenting itself in a different way than is being described. Not every one with Jupiter conjunct the Moon in Taurus is fat. Some are multi-talented artists or are really hedonistic or sex addicts...or incredibly lazy or super stubborn....[ KIDDING...]

IfIKnewBetter said:

Katydid, with a See saw pattern is there a tendency towards something like a "split" personality/life? If so I must be living on one side because sometimes while I researching for this thread I have my, "That couldn't possibly be right" moments.

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Doubting is the first sign of intelligence. Don't you worry

katydid said:

I am not sure if it ever indicates a split personality. Maybe...?

But often it can work by the native taking on one set of attributes, and the opposition can be shown by 'OTHERS' they must deal with. So an opposition to Saturn may bring authority figures into one;s life that they have to battle with. Or a Pluto opposition sometimes brings in obsessive types or stalkers..etc.


Also, keep in mind, if something you read feels like it is not correct and does not fit, then that aspect/placement may just be presenting itself in a different way than is being described. Not every one with Jupiter conjunct the Moon in Taurus is fat. Some are multi-talented artists or are really hedonistic or sex addicts...or incredibly lazy or super stubborn....[ KIDDING...]

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I didn't express myself very well I meant... Compartmentalizing your life... You're one person somewhere and then another elsewhere... I don't know. Upon further research I'm pretty sure I've nailed myself to the bottom portion of the See Saw or something.

I don't think there's anywhere else to go for Planets in Houses so that's done. The next logical step is aspects, I have this and this to kind of help me interpret everything but I'm not feeling great about my ability here so far. With how fatalistic everything seems it's bummed me out enough.

I don't know why I decided to make this so public lol. It makes me look really egotistical in hindsight. I wanted to pin point why certain things are the way they are, why certain things suck and maybe what I could do. Find the personal interpretations. I just wanted to learn and not have to pay someone else to read my chart. I'm not getting it though. I might come back to this thread who knows.

IfIKnewBetter said:

I don't think there's anywhere else to go for Planets in Houses so that's done. The next logical step is aspects, I have this and this to kind of help me interpret everything but I'm not feeling great about my ability here so far. With how fatalistic everything seems it's bummed me out enough.

I don't know why I decided to make this so public lol. It makes me look really egotistical in hindsight. I wanted to pin point why certain things are the way they are, why certain things suck and maybe what I could do. Find the personal interpretations. I just wanted to learn and not have to pay someone else to read my chart. I'm not getting it though. I might come back to this thread who knows.

Click to expand...

The aspects are the most important step. Don't give up until you translate the meaning of the aspects. It will unlock a lot and be very revealing.

I don't see this thread as 'egotistical' on your part. I see it as an efficient and productive way to power through a lot of information.