Cypocryphy
Well-known member
What is the nature of this personality and its effect?
What type of person did this person grow up to be? Round Two
- Thread starter Cypocryphy
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DreamingTheSeas
Well-known member
1.This person, man or woman i can't know, is either adopted or she or he has 2 fathers or 2 mothers, maybe because death of one parent. He or she did not have a happy childhood in the step house. (4th house ruler in 11th house-11th house ruler in same house- Sun square Moon)
2. Seems an attractive person and a very strong personality (Aries-Venus-Jupi in 1st house).
3. Her or his reputation afflicted somehow by a sex or money scandal.
2. Seems an attractive person and a very strong personality (Aries-Venus-Jupi in 1st house).
3. Her or his reputation afflicted somehow by a sex or money scandal.
Cypocryphy
Well-known member
I'm not going to say a word about what anyone has said so far. But I will say, thanks for showing the "math." It'll be interesting what other's say. I'm going to make another new post, too. The new chart will add some dimension to this.These exercises are useful, particularly for those of us who are still trying to improve our amateur astrological skills! My impression of this chart:
This person's personality makes a very strong impression on others, especially with Venus in Libra and Mars in Libra conjunct the Libra Ascendant. Also, this person's 3rd House cusp ruler (House of Communications) lies in the 1st House, so he or she is a good communicator. In addition, 7th House ruler is located in the 1st, which means that this person can easily persuade others. However, things may not be as they seem with this person, given that Neptune is also located in the 1st House.
With Venus conjunct the Libra Ascendant, this person likely has a very attractive physical appearance.
Is obsessed with acquiring power (Jupiter quindecile Pluto, Moon quindecile Saturn) and being in the spotlight (Mercury in Leo quindecile Chiron).
Parents had a rough relationship (Sun square Moon).
Likely serves in a leadership capacity (plenty of Cardinal planets, plenty of Fire planets, plenty of Fixed planets showing determination). However, he or she is fairly stubborn, comes across as emotionally cold (no Water planets), not particularly grounded (only 1 Earth planet), and not particularly adaptable (only 1 Mutable planet). This person is also ruled primarily by his or her self-interest (8 planets in the Eastern Hemisphere).
Likely irreligious: atheist or agnostic (Uranus, the planet of rebellion, is in Gemini and in the House of Philosophy and that house is ruled by Gemini in the chart).
Possibly makes a living from humanitarian efforts of some sort, as the 2nd House/House of Value cusp ruler is in the 11th House. Also, 11th House cusp ruler is in the 11th House. Might be related to public service, as his or her 6th House cusp ruler is in the 1st House.
This person's personality makes a very strong impression on others, especially with Venus in Libra and Mars in Libra conjunct the Libra Ascendant. Also, this person's 3rd House cusp ruler (House of Communications) lies in the 1st House, so he or she is a good communicator. In addition, 7th House ruler is located in the 1st, which means that this person can easily persuade others. However, things may not be as they seem with this person, given that Neptune is also located in the 1st House.
With Venus conjunct the Libra Ascendant, this person likely has a very attractive physical appearance.
Is obsessed with acquiring power (Jupiter quindecile Pluto, Moon quindecile Saturn) and being in the spotlight (Mercury in Leo quindecile Chiron).
Parents had a rough relationship (Sun square Moon).
Likely serves in a leadership capacity (plenty of Cardinal planets, plenty of Fire planets, plenty of Fixed planets showing determination). However, he or she is fairly stubborn, comes across as emotionally cold (no Water planets), not particularly grounded (only 1 Earth planet), and not particularly adaptable (only 1 Mutable planet). This person is also ruled primarily by his or her self-interest (8 planets in the Eastern Hemisphere).
Likely irreligious: atheist or agnostic (Uranus, the planet of rebellion, is in Gemini and in the House of Philosophy and that house is ruled by Gemini in the chart).
Possibly makes a living from humanitarian efforts of some sort, as the 2nd House/House of Value cusp ruler is in the 11th House. Also, 11th House cusp ruler is in the 11th House. Might be related to public service, as his or her 6th House cusp ruler is in the 1st House.
Wames
Well-known member
I like these! 
Greenbaum's temperament analysis gives him/her a more Melancholic (earth) temperament with 4 points than sanguine, choleric, or phlegmatic combined which received an even 2 points a piece. This means when faced with a new situation he may fall back on a pessimistic, analytical, or anti-social approach.
I think this person is of a very fixed belief, hard to change their mind, with their oriental Mercury in Leo conjunct Saturn. He/she has a profound impact on others - dispositer Sun in their own domicile/11th house. Mars on the asc in Libra can make for a competitive person, a strong me vs them appeal for the native or combative with others, a contrarian of sorts. Ruler 7th in the 1st can benefit/gain from his/her relationship partner (and conjunct venus in domicile near the asc).
Zuri, I liked what you said about 3rd in the 1st. It was a good all-around analysis. Does this person do any public speaking for a living?
Greenbaum's temperament analysis gives him/her a more Melancholic (earth) temperament with 4 points than sanguine, choleric, or phlegmatic combined which received an even 2 points a piece. This means when faced with a new situation he may fall back on a pessimistic, analytical, or anti-social approach.
I think this person is of a very fixed belief, hard to change their mind, with their oriental Mercury in Leo conjunct Saturn. He/she has a profound impact on others - dispositer Sun in their own domicile/11th house. Mars on the asc in Libra can make for a competitive person, a strong me vs them appeal for the native or combative with others, a contrarian of sorts. Ruler 7th in the 1st can benefit/gain from his/her relationship partner (and conjunct venus in domicile near the asc).
Zuri, I liked what you said about 3rd in the 1st. It was a good all-around analysis. Does this person do any public speaking for a living?
Cypocryphy
Well-known member
I agree! Although, I'm not really getting to participate.
It also acts as a learning experience for those who are reading the thread. Thanks for posting!
Cypocryphy
Well-known member
This is an interesting analysis here.
Cypocryphy
Well-known member
Should we assume that no one else is going to add to the thread and reveal the secret identity?
Cypocryphy
Well-known member
That's the one, Nightfire. Was this a challenge for people? I have a fear that the charts are familiar and people might be going off of simple chart recognition. I'm not saying that's what happened here, but I think a chart that is more obscure would be best. There is, of course, the bonus round chart.
Aside from that, I think what people posted is remarkably insightful. I always get stoked reading the posts.
Wames: "public speaker"
Zurie: "makes living from humanitarian efforts"
Gen6K: "president"
DreamingTheSeas: "adopted," "reputation afflicted by a sex or money scandal"
It's amazing!
Aside from that, I think what people posted is remarkably insightful. I always get stoked reading the posts.
Wames: "public speaker"
Zurie: "makes living from humanitarian efforts"
Gen6K: "president"
DreamingTheSeas: "adopted," "reputation afflicted by a sex or money scandal"
It's amazing!
I had not previously seen Bill Clinton's natal chart, so this was new for me.
Bill Clinton has a very strong personality. He is an excellent communicator. Wames was correct about public speaking being important to his living. He is considered one of the best American presidential orators of all time, and has made millions as a popular motivational speaker since his presidency. He got Americans to elect him twice, so he is obviously persuasive. I do wonder how that 1st House Neptune plays itself out in his life though?
He's no George Clooney, but Bill Clinton is generally considered a handsome man by American standards. People who guessed this one were correct.
Given his background as an elected official (Arkansas attorney general, Arkansas governor, then the U.S. president), this is a given.
His mother and stepfather definitely had a rough relationship (abusive, alcoholic, and gambling stepfather), just as DreamingTheSeas's post pointed out. DreamingTheSeas was also correct about the "adoption" part, as Bill Clinton chose to take his stepfather's surname of Clinton at age 15. His birth name is William Jefferson Blythe III.
Bill Clinton's birth father died a few months before he was born, so we don't know what that relationship with his mother was like (although the natal chart says it was a troubled relationship).
Headed up student government in high school and college. Of course, he's been a political leader for more than 30 years.
Clinton is officially listed as Southern Baptist and is known for being well versed in the Bible. However, that could be due to his upbringing (Southern Baptists are a stronghold in his native U.S. South region, especially so in the era when he was born and raised) and for public image purposes.
Publicly stated atheism / agnosticism is a losing position if one wishes to rise to the top of American politics, and remain there. He would've never been elected dog catcher in Arkansas (much less the state's attorney general and then governor) as an agnostic or atheist, which would've then bluntly prevented him from further rising onto the national political scene. This may be one area where Clinton's 1st House Neptune (i.e., things not being as they may seem with him) kicks into play, because his chart strongly suggests that his publicly-stated religious faith isn't genuine.
According to his autobiography, Clinton wanted to be a politician ("I knew I could be great in public service") since age 16, deciding that he wasn't quite talented enough to pursue either music or medicine as a career.
Since he exited the presidency, Clinton has become famous for his humanitarian efforts: William J. Clinton Foundation focuses on public health, poverty, and tolerance issues. He teamed up with former president George H.W. Bush to raise private funds in the Hurricane Katrina aftermath. Clinton worked with the United Nations on relief efforts after the Asian tsunami as well. He also wrote a best-selling book in 2007 about philanthropy and social change.
Bill Clinton has a very strong personality. He is an excellent communicator. Wames was correct about public speaking being important to his living. He is considered one of the best American presidential orators of all time, and has made millions as a popular motivational speaker since his presidency. He got Americans to elect him twice, so he is obviously persuasive. I do wonder how that 1st House Neptune plays itself out in his life though?
He's no George Clooney, but Bill Clinton is generally considered a handsome man by American standards. People who guessed this one were correct.
Given his background as an elected official (Arkansas attorney general, Arkansas governor, then the U.S. president), this is a given.
His mother and stepfather definitely had a rough relationship (abusive, alcoholic, and gambling stepfather), just as DreamingTheSeas's post pointed out. DreamingTheSeas was also correct about the "adoption" part, as Bill Clinton chose to take his stepfather's surname of Clinton at age 15. His birth name is William Jefferson Blythe III.
Bill Clinton's birth father died a few months before he was born, so we don't know what that relationship with his mother was like (although the natal chart says it was a troubled relationship).
Headed up student government in high school and college. Of course, he's been a political leader for more than 30 years.
Clinton is officially listed as Southern Baptist and is known for being well versed in the Bible. However, that could be due to his upbringing (Southern Baptists are a stronghold in his native U.S. South region, especially so in the era when he was born and raised) and for public image purposes.
Publicly stated atheism / agnosticism is a losing position if one wishes to rise to the top of American politics, and remain there. He would've never been elected dog catcher in Arkansas (much less the state's attorney general and then governor) as an agnostic or atheist, which would've then bluntly prevented him from further rising onto the national political scene. This may be one area where Clinton's 1st House Neptune (i.e., things not being as they may seem with him) kicks into play, because his chart strongly suggests that his publicly-stated religious faith isn't genuine.
According to his autobiography, Clinton wanted to be a politician ("I knew I could be great in public service") since age 16, deciding that he wasn't quite talented enough to pursue either music or medicine as a career.
Since he exited the presidency, Clinton has become famous for his humanitarian efforts: William J. Clinton Foundation focuses on public health, poverty, and tolerance issues. He teamed up with former president George H.W. Bush to raise private funds in the Hurricane Katrina aftermath. Clinton worked with the United Nations on relief efforts after the Asian tsunami as well. He also wrote a best-selling book in 2007 about philanthropy and social change.
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Clinton was partly raised by his grandparents for awhile. Does that show up in his natal chart?
I assume that Neptune in Libra in the 1st House would explain his deep passion for music (saxophone player, once aspired to be a professional musician)?
How did people come to the conclusion that this chart indicated someone who was in a sex or financial scandal? I assume that it relates to his 8th House Moon placement, but I'm not seeing that interpretation? Is it the Moon square Pluto?
Gemini ruling his House of Philosophy (9th House), combined with 5 planets in Air signs, would explain his high intellect. Clinton attended Georgetown University on scholarship because of his poor background. He was later a Rhodes Scholar at Oxford University and graduated from Yale University's law school. This configuration -- combined with his True Node in Gemini also inhabiting the 9th House -- guaranteed that his chosen profession (he was a law professor and attorney prior to entering politics) would be intellectual in nature. The 9th House would also explain his love for the foreign (B.A. degree in Foreign Service from Georgetown, Rhodes scholarship time in England, the global focus of his post-presidential philanthropy work).
Perhaps Gemini ruling the House of Philosophy also explains his "New Democrat" / Third Way duality bent (for which he was often criticized, by both liberals and conservative, during his presidential tenure)?
I assume that Neptune in Libra in the 1st House would explain his deep passion for music (saxophone player, once aspired to be a professional musician)?
How did people come to the conclusion that this chart indicated someone who was in a sex or financial scandal? I assume that it relates to his 8th House Moon placement, but I'm not seeing that interpretation? Is it the Moon square Pluto?
Gemini ruling his House of Philosophy (9th House), combined with 5 planets in Air signs, would explain his high intellect. Clinton attended Georgetown University on scholarship because of his poor background. He was later a Rhodes Scholar at Oxford University and graduated from Yale University's law school. This configuration -- combined with his True Node in Gemini also inhabiting the 9th House -- guaranteed that his chosen profession (he was a law professor and attorney prior to entering politics) would be intellectual in nature. The 9th House would also explain his love for the foreign (B.A. degree in Foreign Service from Georgetown, Rhodes scholarship time in England, the global focus of his post-presidential philanthropy work).
Perhaps Gemini ruling the House of Philosophy also explains his "New Democrat" / Third Way duality bent (for which he was often criticized, by both liberals and conservative, during his presidential tenure)?
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Nightfire
Well-known member
That's the one, Nightfire. Was this a challenge for people? I have a fear that the charts are familiar and people might be going off of simple chart recognition. I'm not saying that's what happened here, but I think a chart that is more obscure would be best. There is, of course, the bonus round chart.
Aside from that, I think what people posted is remarkably insightful. I always get stoked reading the posts.
Wames: "public speaker"
Zurie: "makes living from humanitarian efforts"
Gen6K: "president"
DreamingTheSeas: "adopted," "reputation afflicted by a sex or money scandal"
It's amazing!
I had seen the chart b4 when i was reading an astrology book, they had explained his chart in detail thus this coincided w/ the insights i saw here. I guess i remembered some of the details from the chart and instinctively knew
Cypocryphy
Well-known member
I had seen the chart b4 when i was reading an astrology book, they had explained his chart in detail thus this coincided w/ the insights i saw here. I guess i remembered some of the details from the chart and instinctively knew
Thanks for confessing, though this is not really a confession.
I should have known that it would have been a chart that was used in an astrology book. It's a distinct chart and a good study.
Cypocryphy
Well-known member
Wow Zuri! I felt guilty for not doing the analysis that you did, as a follow up. I feel that it is kind of my responsibility since I started the post. I've been kind of busy. I don't think I would have done as good a job as you anyway, so this worked out better. Thank you!
I think it would have something to do with the 10th house, in relation to either the 8th, 5th or 2nd, the first two regarding the sex scandal and the later regarding the money scandal. Usually I would look to Neptune in the 10th, but it is not there. The alternative would be Uranus, a planet Aleister Crowley considered to be detrimental to one's reputation, but this planet is in the 9th. So it comes down to Saturn in the 10th, being influenced by Pluto and the Moon in the 8th or Pluto itself, since it is the ruling planet of the second. I think it would be much more evident with transits, so I'm not sure exactly. The prime indicator that has set the situation for loss of reputation is Saturn in the 10th, that is for sure, but from there, I do not know where one would go by just looking at the chart.
Anyway, that was a remarkable analysis Zuri. How long have you been studying astrology? Just curious.
I think it would have something to do with the 10th house, in relation to either the 8th, 5th or 2nd, the first two regarding the sex scandal and the later regarding the money scandal. Usually I would look to Neptune in the 10th, but it is not there. The alternative would be Uranus, a planet Aleister Crowley considered to be detrimental to one's reputation, but this planet is in the 9th. So it comes down to Saturn in the 10th, being influenced by Pluto and the Moon in the 8th or Pluto itself, since it is the ruling planet of the second. I think it would be much more evident with transits, so I'm not sure exactly. The prime indicator that has set the situation for loss of reputation is Saturn in the 10th, that is for sure, but from there, I do not know where one would go by just looking at the chart.
Anyway, that was a remarkable analysis Zuri.
How long have you been studying astrology? Just curious.Wow Zuri! I felt guilty for not doing the analysis that you did, as a follow up. I feel that it is kind of my responsibility since I started the post. I've been kind of busy. I don't think I would have done as good a job as you anyway, so this worked out better. Thank you!
I think it would have something to do with the 10th house, in relation to either the 8th, 5th or 2nd, the first two regarding the sex scandal and the later regarding the money scandal. Usually I would look to Neptune in the 10th, but it is not there. The alternative would be Uranus, a planet Aleister Crowley considered to be detrimental to one's reputation, but this planet is in the 9th. So it comes down to Saturn in the 10th, being influenced by Pluto and the Moon in the 8th or Pluto itself, since it is the ruling planet of the second. I think it would be much more evident with transits, so I'm not sure exactly. The prime indicator that has set the situation for loss of reputation is Saturn in the 10th, that is for sure, but from there, I do not know where one would go by just looking at the chart.
Anyway, that was a remarkable analysis Zuri.
I've been studying astrology for about six months...
Wames
Well-known member
Oh my goodness! It was Bill Clinton! I didn't figure it would be someone THAT prominent and famous. Geez, no wonder there weren't alot of responses. He is such a popular figure so it would be a popular chart to dissect and interpret.
Cypocryphy, I've seen Clinton's chart before but never really paid it much attention or attempted to analyze it. I recognized the other mystery chart of Dahmer's, so I didn't participate in that one. I hadn't a clue about this one though. Thanks for allowing us to learn through this process. I'm still a novice and rough around the edges.
I went with public speaker because of his really good condition of Mercury and location. He's a day birth. So his Sun, Jupiter, and Saturn are of the diurnal sect; this includes his Mercury because he is oriental. This could mean those planets are more featured and highlighted. Mercury is free from the Sun's beams, oriental, and in a masculine sign. So he is in sect (more of a natural ebb & flow in communicating?) & in an extroverted sign. It makes a bodily conjunction to his other planet of the diurnal sect and their ruler is of the same sect. So all 3 of these planets in the same element are like allies/friends working for the same cause, so to speak. I use whole signs for topics. So the location of Mercury would be in the 2nd of the 10th house - how one profits (2nd) from the career (10th). So the 11th is another career house for me. I really couldn't figure out the 10th house ruler Moon in the 8th and what it would mean for one's calling or honors. His Moon does connect with the Sun though. Sometimes I look at the 10th House of the POF house for work also.
Unfortunately, I messed up on the temperament for Clinton. I should double-check my calculations.
Earth element:
Ascendant Almuten - Saturn (1 point)
Moon Sign - Taurus (2 points)
Moon Phase- full to last quarter (1 point)
Air element:
Ascendant sign - Libra (2 points)
Moon Ruler by sign - Libra (1 point)
Fire element:
Season of Birth - summer (2 points)
Water element:
Ascendant ruler by intrinsic quality - Occidental Venus (1 point)
Most people have combination temperaments. So Bill Clinton has a Melancholic 4pts/Sanguine 3pts temperament. Earth/Air combo - a social intellectual type.
Dorian Greenbaum says: "These compound temperaments again have no quality in common, so these people also tend to alternate between temperaments. The disjunction combined with the fact that sanguine and melancholic are natural opposites often makes it difficult for the two sides to intergrate. Yet they have a unique perspective: they can see and relate to the viewpoints of both the young and the old, which gives them a certain timelessness."
She goes into greater detail in her book, "Temperament; Astrology's Forgotten Key". That sounds much better than me stating that Clinton has some underlying anti-social tendencies. That was an epic fail right there!
I didn't figure it would be someone THAT prominent and famous. Geez, no wonder there weren't alot of responses. He is such a popular figure so it would be a popular chart to dissect and interpret. Cypocryphy, I've seen Clinton's chart before but never really paid it much attention or attempted to analyze it. I recognized the other mystery chart of Dahmer's, so I didn't participate in that one. I hadn't a clue about this one though. Thanks for allowing us to learn through this process. I'm still a novice and rough around the edges.
I went with public speaker because of his really good condition of Mercury and location. He's a day birth. So his Sun, Jupiter, and Saturn are of the diurnal sect; this includes his Mercury because he is oriental. This could mean those planets are more featured and highlighted. Mercury is free from the Sun's beams, oriental, and in a masculine sign. So he is in sect (more of a natural ebb & flow in communicating?) & in an extroverted sign. It makes a bodily conjunction to his other planet of the diurnal sect and their ruler is of the same sect. So all 3 of these planets in the same element are like allies/friends working for the same cause, so to speak. I use whole signs for topics. So the location of Mercury would be in the 2nd of the 10th house - how one profits (2nd) from the career (10th). So the 11th is another career house for me. I really couldn't figure out the 10th house ruler Moon in the 8th and what it would mean for one's calling or honors. His Moon does connect with the Sun though. Sometimes I look at the 10th House of the POF house for work also.
Unfortunately, I messed up on the temperament for Clinton. I should double-check my calculations.
Earth element:
Ascendant Almuten - Saturn (1 point)
Moon Sign - Taurus (2 points)
Moon Phase- full to last quarter (1 point)
Air element:
Ascendant sign - Libra (2 points)
Moon Ruler by sign - Libra (1 point)
Fire element:
Season of Birth - summer (2 points)
Water element:
Ascendant ruler by intrinsic quality - Occidental Venus (1 point)
Most people have combination temperaments. So Bill Clinton has a Melancholic 4pts/Sanguine 3pts temperament. Earth/Air combo - a social intellectual type.
Dorian Greenbaum says: "These compound temperaments again have no quality in common, so these people also tend to alternate between temperaments. The disjunction combined with the fact that sanguine and melancholic are natural opposites often makes it difficult for the two sides to intergrate. Yet they have a unique perspective: they can see and relate to the viewpoints of both the young and the old, which gives them a certain timelessness."
She goes into greater detail in her book, "Temperament; Astrology's Forgotten Key". That sounds much better than me stating that Clinton has some underlying anti-social tendencies. That was an epic fail right there!