Technology fetishes, rejection of the natural world for the "artifical"

So, I keep finding more and more reasons to be depressed about the ideological direction we're taking the next generation of children.

There is a renewed interest in science, which is great, but it's tinged with a creepy, religious, fanatical kind of enthusiasm that destroys the value of science-based approaches to exploring the world (namely, a rejection of dogmatic thinking at it's inception).

We've had the reboot of Carl Sagan's Cosmos, which sounds like a good idea until you actually watch it. Fascination and wonder are replaced with haughtyness and political agendas, open mindedness with condemnation of spiritual faith, and an attempt to draw in children though cinema-like visuals that color the perception of the universe as the next action-thriller sci-fi blockbuster movie.

Now I hear they want to reboot another popular science show for children from the early 90s: Magic School Bus. Growing up watching this show, I was excited. Then I read more about it: http://www.theverge.com/2014/6/11/5799928/netflix-rebooting-magic-school-bus-in-2016

A much different generation awaits the reboot, and Scholastic has modernized The Magic School Bus 360 accordingly. That all starts with the animation, which will now be computer generated. The bus will be different and fitted with upgraded technology, and the students will gain access to "the latest tech innovations such as robotics, wearables and camera technology."

Click to expand...

http://mashable.com/2014/06/11/magic-school-bus-netflix/

Netflix and Scholastic Media announced in a press statement that the new series will use CGI animation to feature a "modernized Ms. Frizzle" and an "inventive high-tech bus" — so it looks like the companies are not afraid to take chances and make mistakes (and probably get messy in the process). The very 21st-century show will also focus on modern tech innovations, including robotics and wearables.

"The all-new episodes also leverage advancements in animation, science and technology in a way that will delight a new generation of young viewers, and like its predecessor, will help kids around the world discover the magic and value of exploration and innovation," a press statement reads.

Click to expand...

Reading this, it seems like they are completely missing the point of what made that show great. It wasn't "cool gadgets" but it was that you learned something about the world from it, using basic tools like your own senses that everyone can relate to and experience. It also looks like they've decided to make Ms. Frizzle more "sexy" instead of, you know, an elementary school teacher.

I don't understand why there is so much fetishism over technology that 9/10 wastes peoples time and lives, separating them from these very things they want to study, placing them into a fantasy world that they "know truth" and where absolute devotion and everyone believing the same thing is the expectation (see how the CEO of Mozilla Corp was forced to leave the company because he personally donated a small sum of money to prop 8 supporting that "defense of marriage" act). It is like we're rejecting attempts to have a relationship with reality and nature and instead hide in this artificial world that we find more comfortable. I still think this all has to do with that Neptune/Uranus in Capricorn, and perhaps Pluto's transit there is bringing all this to a light.

I'm not totally crazy feeling this way, am I? I can't be the ONLY person noticing these trends.

absolutely. If you want to find a fool's paradise,complete fantasy land, just look up this thing called "the internet". I don't care what you look up, you'll get the wrong information. My question is, what is it astrologically that tilts perception away from reality, in favour of the almighty rational mind. (I looked it up online, honest, and it says it's true! ). And everyone not only believes this, but is forced to believe it, because they are very concerned about "what others have to say", you wouldn't want to have any opinion that is different than the internet, would you? That would be bad. It almost isn't allowed.
So , what are the influences creating this, because it certainly is an epidemic. Just tell the kids, well, "it's Pluto, it'll take awhile". I'm not sure anyone has that kind of time.

amrum11 said:

absolutely. If you want to find a fool's paradise,complete fantasy land, just look up this thing called "the internet". I don't care what you look up, you'll get the wrong information. My question is, what is it astrologically that tilts perception away from reality, in favour of the almighty rational mind. (I looked it up online, honest, and it says it's true! ). And everyone not only believes this, but is forced to believe it, because they are very concerned about "what others have to say", you wouldn't want to have any opinion that is different than the internet, would you? That would be bad. It almost isn't allowed.
So , what are the influences creating this, because it certainly is an epidemic. Just tell the kids, well, "it's Pluto, it'll take awhile". I'm not sure anyone has that kind of time.

Click to expand...

Good job.

I'm hoping to hear some non-defensive perspectives actually conducive to discussion (as I'd like to think we're not pretending there is absolutely nothing going on with changing trends/attitudes about science and technology).

If no one is willing/cares to do that, then I'd rather see the thread sink to the depths. Or trolled by Jesse Booth.

Well, the internet and technology are tools and it depends how you use it. You can waste your time playing games, etc., or you can use it to gain useful information. I, for example, was able to reduce my blood pressure medicine dosage, thanks to good tips I found on the internet (isometric hand grip excercises, tomato juice, beet juice, etc.), improved my tennis thanks to tennis forums, found lots of good books to read, finally found forums to discuss interests such as astrology, theoretical physics, etc.

What I don't find particularly healthy is the over exposure of children to the internet to the extent that they do not go outdoors and play games with other children anymore.

You are correct that science and the people that engage in it and disparage those of faith and belief, are as dogmatic and engaged in faith as those they ridicule. The perfect example is environmentalism and the "climate change" lobby - while ALL of us see the value in reducing pollution and increasing efficiency, many of that group are as dogmatic and place their belief in non-provable theories or facts as any religious person. So what is at work here?

The farther society moves from spirituality and faith, the more they will seek to fill that void with something else. Today, that "something" is technology, environmentalism, socialism, you name it. Everything but the only thing that will fill the void - a personal connection with spirit and source. Even dogmatic religions fail to fill that void because they interrupt that connection with human-created artificial institutions, just as science does.

No one in the media dares to reconnect with spirit and source, thus they fill the void with other garbage. And on it goes.

Phil said:

Well, the internet and technology are tools and it depends how you use it. You can waste your time playing games, etc., or you can use it to gain useful information. I, for example, was able to reduce my blood pressure medicine dosage, thanks to good tips I found on the internet (isometric hand grip excercises, tomato juice, beet juice, etc.), improved my tennis thanks to tennis forums, found lots of good books to read, finally found forums to discuss interests such as astrology, theoretical physics, etc.

What I don't find particularly healthy is the over exposure of children to the internet to the extent that they do not go outdoors and play games with other children anymore.

Click to expand...

Yes, this is true. It is interesting that there is an expectation among myself and often others I talk to that you should be able to learn anything from the internet. Google it, wikipedia it, etc.

Just the other day a friend of mine said that she was very disconcerted that when she went to the doctor to ask about some symptoms he used wikipedia to look them up. Online medical care is also being pushed as reaction to the Affordable Care Act and the inability for clinics to cope with the influx of patients (of course, somehow this was hardly discussed before the roll-out). So far, the reaction to it has been mostly negative from what I've read; the "online chats" with doctors being largely unproductive. I heard one proponent who is on a committee in my state handling the implementation of the ACA say that he at once thought we should have more complete care and closer interaction with doctors and in the same breath said they were going to push "virtual care"!

I can cite numerous, numerous examples of this idea of technology as a panacea for largely social problems that technology cannot fix but only delays or hides. I love how Joseph Weizenbaum, one of the fathers of modern computer science, said that computer technology has become a "conservative force" (Uranus/Capricorn), giving the example of how the banking systems avoided restructuring their operations socially and politically by relying on technology to keep the status quo (online banking, financial tools, etc.). I think that is one of the most insightful commentaries on modern technology use.

There is nothing wrong with new technology (before I'm labelled a luddite). But I completely agree with you Phil that it is a tool, and I wish people would see that more often. Instead I hear far too many comments turning technology into a philosophy of thought (which has gone on for ages, really... for example, comparing humans to machines during the rise of the industrial revolution.. interestingly, also during Uranus/Neptune conjunction in Capricorn), turning it into an identity, into a religion (see this study).

I've read that Uranus/Neptune cycles coincide with the rise of new religions, or at least the rise in popularity or alteration of a religion. And I sincerely believe that "science" and virtual life is becoming the new religion of masses, slowly and steadily, around the world (as Neptune hardly works in any overt way). It seems to be coinciding with a rise in a bizarre mixture of communist and libertarian ideals which first sprang forth during the last conjunction. Those ideals work hand in hand with the philosophies championed by the "thinkers" coming out of the computer science industry in particular. Creative commons, open source licensing, bitcoins, self-enforcing contracts, crowd intelligence, you name it. And all these could be interesting concepts, if it weren't for the fanaticism and expectations of utopia behind it.

It is refreshing when I hear stories like yours, though. There are a lot of great things that can be done with emerging technologies. For instance, I really enjoy the advancements in prosthetic. Of course, there is a shadow side here too, such as the idea that people should replace their limbs with artificial ones (I'm not kidding, I've heard proponents for this), rejecting their own bodies. However, largely there is as lot of good coming out of it such as the paralympics, giving full mobility to amputees and empowering them, and so on.

Smartphone "apps" have very interesting promise for doing useful things, as well. Even though you get mostly time-wasters and some sketchy apps leading to surveillance, there is a lot of potential there for real communication, too.

And in the end, I would just like to see some balance, and I see very little.

mdinaz said:

You are correct that science and the people that engage in it and disparage those of faith and belief, are as dogmatic and engaged in faith as those they ridicule. The perfect example is environmentalism and the "climate change" lobby - while ALL of us see the value in reducing pollution and increasing efficiency, many of that group are as dogmatic and place their belief in non-provable theories or facts as any religious person. So what is at work here?

The farther society moves from spirituality and faith, the more they will seek to fill that void with something else. Today, that "something" is technology, environmentalism, socialism, you name it. Everything but the only thing that will fill the void - a personal connection with spirit and source. Even dogmatic religions fail to fill that void because they interrupt that connection with human-created artificial institutions, just as science does.

No one in the media dares to reconnect with spirit and source, thus they fill the void with other garbage. And on it goes.

Click to expand...

It is apt to say not only "social ails" in my previous comment but spiritual ones as well.

Humans seem to escape that periodically though history (though short lived). Transcendentalism is interesting that way (also rising just after the Neptune/Uranus conjunction in 1821). Thoreau is basically a case study on this issue.

“We must learn to reawaken and keep ourselves awake, not by mechanical aids, but by an infinite expectation of the dawn, which does not forsake us even in our soundest sleep. I know of no more encouraging fact than the unquestionable ability of man to elevate his life by a conscious endeavour. It is something to be able to paint a particular picture, or to carve a statue, and so to make a few objects beautiful; but it is far more glorious to carve and paint the very atmosphere and medium through which we look, which morally we can do. To affect the quality of the day, that is the highest of arts.”

--

As another example of "lack of balance" and being totally in la-la land with technology on a mass scale... I read an article recently that said NASA is trying to produce a warp drive engine for space travel. They have actually designed a space ship already that looks like it's from Star Trek and they named it Enterprise. But they haven't proven that that warping is even physically possible yet. Let alone practicable and done at the scale of a ship carrying a large crew of people. But they've already got their collaboration going with their 3D modeler of what the ship should look like! The lead scientist on the project (funded but the US government) actually expects they will produce a ship and travel around the universe Star Trek style within his lifetime. Can't make this stuff up...

I would also like to add, that when one has really special interests, technology offers discussion forums like this one, which I really like. I have absolutely nobody I know with whom I can discuss astrology, cosmology, theoretical physics, biomechanics of tennis. Thanks to the internet, I have found others with whom I can discuss these topics, and, subsequently gain knowledge and experience. There is also lots of up to date information I can find on these topics, which otherwise would be difficult finding the right books and, in the right books, the relevant pages. So, intellectually, I find technology very stimulating.

Smartphones even help me with:

• my tennis: I have a motion sensor mounted on the end of my racket handle, with an application which, when the sensor is connected via bluetooth to transmit data when I played, shows me the trajectory of my serve and statistics on my groundstrokes.
• astromony: apps which when I point my smartphone towards the sky, give me the names of constellations, stars, planets currently visible.
• nutrition: a barcode scanner app which informs me which products have unhealthy substances, or too much glucose, salt etc.
• Skype allows me to communicate with friends and relatives abroad.

As I mentioned, it is a tool to intelligently employ, and certainly better than passively watching TV for hours...

Phil said:

I would also like to add, that when one has really special interests, technology offers discussion forums like this one, which I really like. I have absolutely nobody I know with whom I can discuss astrology, cosmology, theoretical physics, biomechanics of tennis. Thanks to the internet, I have found others with whom I can discuss these topics, and, subsequently gain knowledge and experience. There is also lots of up to date information I can find on these topics, which otherwise would be difficult finding the right books and, in the right books, the relevant pages. So, intellectually, I find technology very stimulating.

Smartphones even help me with:

• my tennis: I have a motion sensor mounted on the end of my racket handle, with an application which, when the sensor is connected via bluetooth to transmit data when I played, shows me the trajectory of my serve and statistics on my groundstrokes.
• astromony: apps which when I point my smartphone towards the sky, give me the names of constellations, stars, planets currently visible.
• nutrition: a barcode scanner app which informs me which products have unhealthy substances, or too much glucose, salt etc.
• Skype allows me to communicate with friends and relatives abroad.

As I mentioned, it is a tool to intelligently employ, and certainly better than passively watching TV for hours...

Click to expand...

Well, I'm supposing if you didn't have the internet, you'd be forced to join groups that meet in person, or through mail, or read books found at a local shop, or make other such tangible connections with your environment. I don't think the internet is better here, just different. And it definitely easier and depersonalized form of communication in many respects, having pros and cons that way.

It's been nice to look up the FIFA World Cup games in a newspaper and watch it on basic cable... no internet/smartphones/apps involved. I could have searched for local channel/times/info for 4 minutes in front of a screen on google, which I guess would be faster.

Instead, I took a lovely walk on Sunday morning to the mail box, found the listing... not among 1,000,000 search results, but on a small back page of the paper locally printed, and I found the time without ever looking at a computer screen. It's so bizarre how something like that feels refreshing now.

Someone could see my stroll to get the newspaper as "more difficult" than punching a question into a search engine, but it feels more like living to me.

The only Smartphone use that you mentioned that couldn't be easily achieved through other means (or simply using your own brain) is the Tennis stats. I really like the idea of using something like that application because instead of "being your brain" it's being your senses, so your brain has more to work with.

I heard on the news about using a smartphone application designed to monitor insulin and send instructions to regulate insulin balance for diabetics, which is pretty dang neat and very relevant use of that technology.

On a personal note, this is the most disappointing thread with "fetish" in its name that I have ever seen. Seriously, don't say fetish unless there's some wierd sexual stuff in the topic.

I think flapjacks may be concerned with how disconnected from reality a lot of people are becoming. For example, parents getting Facebook pages for their newborns, the people that have died from blood clots in their *sses over in South Korea from spending too much time online, that sort of thing.

I noticed someone mentioned that the internet is a tool to "intelligently employ?" Funny thing! I actually have a thread going in the social group I made here on the forum called "the Nerd Herd." The thread is the Cultural Corner, and once a week on Saturdays I post the address of one website that I have found to be particularly useful or interesting. I include a short description of what the site is used for, what it's about, etc. By the way, anybody reading this post is free to join the Nerd Herd. I'm trying to keep things going, but I'm always looking for new members to sign up.

If nothing else, I would appreciate it if Phil sent me a list of where to find those apps. I bet some of them would be an excellent addition to the Cultural Corner.

Flapjacks said:

Well, I'm supposing if you didn't have the internet, you'd be forced to join groups that meet in person, or through mail, or read books found at a local shop, or make other such tangible connections with your environment. I don't think the internet is better here, just different. And it definitely easier and depersonalized form of communication in many respects, having pros and cons that way.

Click to expand...

I beg to differ, I have been reading books on various topics mentioned for close to 50 years, but never found any group discussing quantum mechanics, for example. I use both approaches now: I still read technical books, and then discuss them on the internet. Only by discussing with knowledgeable persons can you really learn. The one does not exclude the other. You can do both.

Flapjacks said:

It's been nice to look up the FIFA World Cup games in a newspaper and watch it on basic cable... no internet/smartphones/apps involved. I could have searched for local channel/times/info for 4 minutes in front of a screen on google, which I guess would be faster.

Click to expand...

As I said, it is a tool. It is however not a Swiss Army knife to be used for everything, only where it makes sense to do so.

Flapjacks said:

Instead, I took a lovely walk on Sunday morning to the mail box, found the listing... not among 1,000,000 search results, but on a small back page of the paper locally printed, and I found the time without ever looking at a computer screen. It's so bizarre how something like that feels refreshing now.

Someone could see my stroll to get the newspaper as "more difficult" than punching a question into a search engine, but it feels more like living to me.

Click to expand...

Again, I am not advocating doing everything on the internet, you misunderstood me. I use the internet often as a replacement for TV in the evenings, which is just a passive state, with a sleep-like REM state. And, yes, I also read good books in the evening.
I still enjoy nature, do plenty of sports, meet friends, etc. I just use the internet as a turbo extension mind tool in my search for knowledge. I certainly don't indulge in playing games on it.

Also, as you can see in my "Big Cats" thread, I also find time to paint (yes, not CGI, real water color...)

And most important of all, after years of fruitless searching, using the internet, we managed to find my wife's long lost family, which was her greatest desire in life...

Well its simple. Its us getting used to the Age of Aquarius. Aquarius rules technology, so its no wonder its gaining in importance. I think though, that the biggest task Earth will face in this age is that of Individual vs society and how they relate to one another. Luckily, this will allow us to come together as a whole and hopefully eliminate barriers that separate people. Humanity will surely become more connected and more of a single consciousness, but the key is to retain individuality in that more connected of societies. The internet is a prototype of this phenomena. Earth is now more connected than ever, but each individual still has their own uniqueness in this invisible network.

Here's the astrodentist article on the Leo-Aquarius axis that is going to be of extreme importance in this age: http://www.astro.com/mtp/mtpt46_e.htm

It will no doubt be the most important axis of the age. Leos and Aquarius's everywhere must learn to share their gifts with society and the individuals in it in order to integrate this polarity successfully. self-expression (Leo) and appreciation of the right to that expression for everyone (Aquarius) is going to be a defining theme. We're seeing this already with Instagram and the new-found obsession with "selfies". Leo: Individuals taking selfies. Aquarius: Society as a whole embracing this concept and allowing everyone to take selfies. I must say, however, that I was one of the first to be taking selfies with their phones xD. I was acting out the Leo axis (Because I am one lol) in the myspace days when it was still "socially unacceptable" to do that (Aquarius axis hadn't caught up.) It really is crazy to realize just how impressionable humanity is to the astrological influences. I find it endlessly awesome and fascinating though.

Phil said:

Again, I am not advocating doing everything on the internet, you misunderstood me.

Click to expand...

I understand what you're saying. I am not meaning to disagree with you, but how you interpret things is not how most people behave, and that's what I was commenting on. You are older and know what living without things like the internet is like (increasingly less so now that kids born in 2000 are becoming adults!!), and that seems to help moderate your approach. I like your perspective very much.

LeoJeo said:

Well its simple. Its us getting used to the Age of Aquarius. Aquarius rules technology, so its no wonder its gaining in importance. I think though, that the biggest task Earth will face in this age is that of Individual vs society and how they relate to one another. Luckily, this will allow us to come together as a whole and hopefully eliminate barriers that separate people. Humanity will surely become more connected and more of a single consciousness, but the key is to retain individuality in that more connected of societies. The internet is a prototype of this phenomena. Earth is now more connected than ever, but each individual still has their own uniqueness in this invisible network.

Here's the astrodentist article on the Leo-Aquarius axis that is going to be of extreme importance in this age: http://www.astro.com/mtp/mtpt46_e.htm

It will no doubt be the most important axis of the age. Leos and Aquarius's everywhere must learn to share their gifts with society and the individuals in it in order to integrate this polarity successfully. self-expression (Leo) and appreciation of the right to that expression for everyone (Aquarius) is going to be a defining theme. We're seeing this already with Instagram and the new-found obsession with "selfies". Leo: Individuals taking selfies. Aquarius: Society as a whole embracing this concept and allowing everyone to take selfies. I must say, however, that I was one of the first to be taking selfies with their phones xD. I was acting out the Leo axis (Because I am one lol) in the myspace days when it was still "socially unacceptable" to do that (Aquarius axis hadn't caught up.) It really is crazy to realize just how impressionable humanity is to the astrological influences. I find it endlessly awesome and fascinating though.

Click to expand...

Very insightful commentary! Thank you. I do see the Leo/Aquarius polarity a lot as well. But one effect we seem to be working through with individuality/creative expression vs. social connection and technology is the depersonalization of expression. This can be seen very poinently in blog websites and social media sites where the expression of individuals are bound in specific, limited templates, check boxes, preset options for how you can describe who you are and that is the face you get to put into the "public consciousness". It looks artsy, it looks smart, but ultimately someone else decided how you get to present yourself. "You Are Not a Gadget" is a great book exploring what is essentially the Leo/Aquarius dilemma: individual vs. group consciousness and knowledge, freedom and restriction in technology, personal creativity and innovation. The author himself is both a computer scientist and musician. Here is a good review: http://www.nytimes.com/2010/01/15/books/15book.html?_r=0

It is very interesting, but so far I'm seeing little to hope for that it will be resolved in a manner that is equitable. It definitely seems like the individual is being completely sacrificed so far. When I ran across Lanier's book, it gave me some hope that at least someone with influence understands what's wrong.

So, the current children generation will be more attracted to holograms, 3D images and robots? I heard about HDTV shows more of people's faces you didn't need to know: more wrinkles. Will this mean our kids will be turned on by wrinkles? Imagine a Vocaloid character personified by an anime girl with a huge crow's feet you noticed while she sings.

Cancer, Virgo (most of the earth signs), Scorpio (esp this one), Aquarius (unconventional) & Pisces are linked to sexual fetishes. I'm an Aquarius sun/moon, Cancer rising, Mercury in Pisces, Mars/Jupiter/saturn in Virgo, Uranus in scorpio & Venus/Eris/Ceres in Aries. I have a pregnancy fetish or attraction to women in that state, and my natal chart points it out.

And resorting to the internet for a romantic relationship...does the old fashioned way even work anymore? Over half of all marriages will fail. In high school, more girls view boys as "chav pigs" who don't respect them at all. And finally, you can't date a co-worker, so you're gonna be single for a real long time. No wonder more people find comfort in finding someone on dating sites.

Now, if you want to meet the person you met online, after you gotten to know them for awhile in a closer, personal level. You're either being tricked or "catfished" or the person you planned to meet IRL is a creep, weirdo or can't relate to you if they see your face. It can also be a scam for money, income or credit data. It's worse to have online romance than the natural non-tech way.