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Traditional Astrology For discussions on Traditional Astrology only. (Note: Typically, traditional astrology is defined as using techniques developed prior to 1700 by astrologers from the Hellenistic, Persian, Hebrew, and Renaissance eras. In general, it relies on Ptolemaic aspects (sextile, trine, square, opposition and conjunction) though there may be some exceptions, and always excludes modern planets (Neptune, Uranus and Pluto,) as well as any asteroids. The focus is less on what would be considered modern psychological chart interpretation and more on prediction. Members who wish to explore a combination of traditional and modern ideas should feel free to start a new thread in an appropriate forum for further discussion.)


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  #1  
Unread 04-26-2012, 04:06 AM
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Delineating Marriage (Medieval Method)

This is very intriguing subject isn't it?

Well, I must mention in the very beginning in explaining the methods here that they are of medieval astrology type (Bonatti, Abu Ali, Al Khayat and etc.).
To say that the method is 'Traiditional' is really using very wide range of time span in which different techniques for delineating marriage were used.
For example, the Hellenistic Astrologer's (Valens, Dorotheus and etc.) have used methods on their own, methods which I'll probably (not even later) not explain on this thread, but we can open another thread for that matter.
As this section of Traditional Astrology is quite new and in its beginnings, we now trow out the techniques here and there and title them as "Traditional". I hope that in the future we can make sub sections of traditional astrology, such as: "Medieval Astrology", "Hellenistic Astrology", Renaissance Astrology" and etc..

There are certain rules in Medieval Astrology compiled which can give quite good and workable methods for delineating marriage. The rules one can learn for a short period of time, but the practice is what is needed in order these rules to become second nature of the astrologer's intuitive tool in delineating such things as Marriage in the chart. This is what I would like to do on this thread: to practice as much charts as I/we will have the time to do it.


The Technique

The Compound Almuten is what is very practical thing in almost all methods used in medieval delineation. It seems that Bonatti and other medievals were very fond on Compound Almutens.
I will first give delineation for male charts, and in some later post will explain the delineation for female charts.

Finding the Compound Almuten for Marriage:

Find the Rulers of all 5 dignities for these places:

1. 7th house cusp

2. Lord of the 7th house

3. Planets in 7th house (if any)

4. Moon

5. Venus

6. Part of Marriage (According to Hermes) (ASC + VE - SA) for Men.

The Planet which gets most points over these places is Almuten of Marriage.
But consider also if there are impediments to these places.
If there is affliction to 7th house (by some Malefic's square or opposition), to the Moon (aspect, combust, cadent, retrograde and etc.)

See if one of the individiaul Almutens over these places is joined to the Lord of the Ascendant or its Almuten or the Lord of the 7th or its Almuten.
If they are in trine or sextile, and if especially in reception, then the native will rejoice in living beautiful life with his wife according to his desire.

But if the aspects were without reception, or if the aspects were square or opposition, then the significations will be judged lower.

Bonatti:
Quote:
But if the lord of the Ascendant were joined to the lord of the 7''', so that the former were lighter than the latter, it signifies that the native will want to copulate with women. If indeed the 7'h sign were Cancer or Scorpio or
Pisces or there were a conjunction of the lord of the 7
th or its Almuten with the lord of the first or its Almuten in these (signs) or from these (signs) or with one of them, it signifies that the native will have many wives or a great number of other women. If however you find the contrary, you are able to judge otherwise."

Example:


This is the chart of Akihito, Emperor of Japan

His chart is given on astrodatabank site as a chart of a man with successful marriage.

First we make Compound Almuten for these places:

1. 7th House Cusp at 28 Gemini:
Mercury 5, 3,
Saturn 3, 2
Jupiter 3
Sun 1

2. Ruler of 7th, Mercury in 16 Sag
Jupiter 5, 3
Sun 3
Saturn 3
Venus 2
Moon 1

3. Planets in 7th - there are no planets here

4. Moon 20 Pisces
Jupiter 5
Venus 4, 3
Mars, 3, 2, 1
Moon 3

5. Venus 15 Aquarius
Saturn 5, 3
Mercury, 3, 1
Jupiter 3, 2

6 Part of Marriage at 29 Sag
Jupiter 5, 3
Sun 3
Saturn 3, 1
Mars 2

Total:
Mercury 12
Saturn 20
Jupiter 29

No need to calculate further, Jupiter is Almuten of Marriage.
Look how strong is that Jupiter up there on MC.
He is receiving the Sun by sextile and the Part of Marriage on the Ascendant.

7th house cusp not impeded.
Its lord - Mercury, cadent (but in the first sign), not afflicted by Malefic's square or opposition, not by combustion.
Moon - not afflicted.
Venus - Saturn receives here in Aquarius.
Part of Marriage not afflicted, but indeed highlightened by ASC and Sun.

Lord (and also Almuten) of the 1st, and the Lord (and also Almuten) of the 7th are in Sextile. Jupiter receives Mercury.

Quite fortunate chart for marriage.

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Unread 04-26-2012, 02:41 PM
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Timing of Marriage

According to Bonatti, if Venus is angular or succedent, fortunate and strong (without afflictions), and the triplicity rulers of her sign are also fortunate and strong and angular or succedent, and all (with Venus) are Oriental, signifies that the man will contract marriage when young and the marriage will bring him delight.

The same is with Moon, if she is in her First quarter (from new moon to 1st quarter) or in Third Quarter (from full moon to the third quarter), both quarters which Ptolemy considered to be Oriental, his marriage will be delayed somewhat more and he will contract it with a young girl, and he will be fortunate with woman, but a little less then in the first example (with Venus).

If Venus is impeded, i.e. cadent, combust, retrograde, joined with malefics, and also her triplicity lords are impeded, and if she and the lords are occidental and are between the AC and IC or between DC and MC, or in the 2nd quarter of the Moon or in the last (occidental quarters), it signifies that the marriage of the natus is a little postponed and he will marry a little older woman in older years and he will be unfortunate because of women.

But if Venus is fortunate and strong, angular or succedent, but her Lords were impeded, then the native will marry a good and appropriate woman, but evil detriment follows that marriage (because of the impeded lords); and you can judge the same for the vice versa example, i.e. when Venus is impeded but the lords of the triplicity are in good state, then the native marries inappropriate woman but the marriage will bring him happiness.

Aboali:

Quote:
"And Aboali said 'If Venus in the nativities of women or men were free
from the malefics and from impediments, in fitting places, it signifies that
the marriage will be good and fitting. But if she were impeded and in a
bad place, it signifies destruction and the malignancy of the marriage.'
But Aomar said, if Venus were exalted over Saturn from the tenth, the
marriage will be in middle age in a time fitting to her and the marriage
will be normal
and the [number of] children likewise moderate. But when
Venus in anyone's nativity were in a mobile sign, and especially in Cancer
or Capricorn, it signifies the firm stability of the native over one wife.
If indeed Venus and the Moon were opposed to each other or in square
aspect it signifies evil and impediment in marriage. And if they were in
Gemini, Virgo, Sagittarius or Pisces, it signifies that the native will contract
marriage with more than one woman."
Lets now look to the same example of the emperor Akihito (chart given above).
He married princess Michiko in 10 March 1959, when he was 25 years old.

Venus is Succedent, received by Saturn, she receives the Almuten of Marriage (Jupiter) with Trine in 10th, her Triplicity Lords (Mercury, Saturn and Jupiter) are all free from impediments. Mercury is cadent but in the same sign as the Ascendant.
Venus is Oriental.
Moon is in the First Quarter - Oriental.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 03:05 PM
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Some 'tips'

According to Bonatti,
if Venus is in Aries or Scorpio, and if Mars is in Taurus or Libra, will cause excessive venereal activity and impediment in his person.

If Venus is in Capricorn or Aquarius, and Saturn in Taurus or Libra,
or Venus is in Gemini or Virgo, and Mercury in Taurus or Libra,
or Venus and Mercury were in Capricorn or Aquarius and the one seeks conjunction to the other, it
signifies the native's practice of sodomy and that he will delight more in
men than in women.


Quote:
But if Venus were in her house or exaltation, it will
elevate the woman above that native and she will dominate him and all
the more if the lord of the seventh is north from the lord of the Ascendant.
However if she were in her triplicity or term she will dominate him but far less. But if she were in her face she will once again dominate him much less."
Aomar says that if Venus, the Sun or Part of Marriage, or many of the significators of the native and the Lord of the house of marriage (7th) were in Aries, Leo, Libra or Capricorn - the signs of filthy coitus, it signifies that the native will be excessive in coitus with excessiveness in foulness and filthiness.

If Venus were corporaly joined with Mars (conjunction) or in Square or Opposition, and Mars were in Aries, Scorpio or Capricorn, it signifies that the native will be foully abusing the coitus of foul persons and the more so if Venus is in masculine sign because than she will be more prone to foulness and sodomites.
But if the native is a woman and Venus is in feminine sign she is made sport of by women. She will make the native insatiable and insatiate in respect to coitus and she will become a whore.
But if Venus is in masculine sign she will abuse women, and desire to rub them, she will be a woman who plays a male role.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 03:12 PM
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Technical data

Part of Marriage for Men:
ASC + VE - SA

Part of Marriage for Women:
ASC + SA - VE

Moon Quarters:
From 0 degrees to 90 (New Moon to 1st quarter) = 1st QUARTER (Oriental)
From 90 to 180 = 2nd QUARTER (Occidental)
From 180 to 270 = 3rd QUARTER (Oriental)
From 270 to 360 = 4th QUARTER (Occidental)

Chart Quarters:
From AC to MC = Oriental Quarter (Masculine)
From MC to DC = Occidental Quarter (Feminine)
From DC to IC = Oriental Quarter (Masculine)
From IC to AC = Occidental Quarter (Feminine)

Oriental vs Occidental Planets in regard to their position with the Sun:
Inferior planets (Venus and Mercury), behind the Sun are Oriental, before the Sun are occidental.
Superior planets (Mars, Jupiter, Saturn), behind the Sun are occidental, before the Sun are oriental.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 04:17 PM
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Example of 39 years old non married male



Looking for the Almuten of Marriage.

1. 7th house Cusp on 27 Cancer
Moon 5, 3, 1
Jupiter 4
Venus 3
Mars 3
Saturn 2

2. Lord of the 7th, Moon in 12 Cancer
Moon 5, 3
Jupiter 4
Venus 3, 2
Mars 3
Mercury 1

3. (Planets in 7th),
a) Sun in 14 Leo
Sun 5, 3
Jupiter 3, 1
Saturn 3, 2

b) Mercury in 16 Leo
Sun 5, 3
Jupiter 3, 1
Saturn 3, 2

c) Mars at 25 Leo
Sun 5,3
Jupiter 3
Saturn 3
Mars 2, 1

4. Moon in 12 Cancer
Moon 5, 3
Jupiter 4
Venus 3, 2
Mars 3
Mercury 1

5. Venus at 0 Cancer
Moon 5, 3
Jupiter 4
Venus 3, 1
Mars 3, 2

6. Part of Marriage at 9 Aquarius
Saturn 5, 3
Mercury 3
Jupiter 3
Venus 2, 1

Total:
Moon 33
Jupiter 30
Venus 20
Mars 17
Sun 24

Moon is Almuten of Marriage.

1. The 7th house is afflicted by Cauda Draconis.
2. Ruler of 7th (Moon) is Cadent.
3. Part of Marriage in opposition to the Sun in 7th. The Lord Saturn is free from affliction.
4. Moon is cadent.
5. Venus is cadent.
6. The Almuten of these places (Moon) is cadent.

The Majority of significators are afflicted. Remember that the cadency of planet is one of the afflictions.
The Ruler of 1st is not in Aspect with the ruler of the 7th (which happened to be Almuten of Marriage). BUT, Moon is in Antiscia ("Hidden Conjunction") of Saturn. This makes them connected.
Connection between the Lord of 1st and 7th is simply showing that the man wants to copulate with women.

Bonatti says:
Quote:
""If indeed the 7th
sign were Cancer or Scorpio or Pisces or there were a
conjunction of the lord of the 7th or its Almuten with the lord of the first or
its Alrnuten in these (signs) or from these (signs) or with one of them, it
signifies that the native will have many wives or a great number of other
women,"
It seems out that the man in our example simply wants to copulate with many women.

Venus angular or succedent shows marriage in youth.
In this man's chart Venus is in cadent 6th house. So, if the chart were promising marriage this man would have been married in older age.

Quote:
"If the lords of the triplicity she is in are fortunate, strong and oriental,
it signifies that the native will contract a marriage in his youth and that
he will be fortunate with women and that he will (receive) delight from
them."
Triplicity Lords of Venus are:
Venus - cadent
Mars - angular (Under the Sun's Beams)
Venus - cadent

Moon is in the last quarter, so she's Occidental, another indication of postponed marriage.
Venus is also occidental to the Sun.
Mars the other triplicity Lord is also Occidental.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 04:54 PM
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Gay

What about gay people, how is this shown in the chart?

Quote:
"And Aomar said that when Mercury were Almuten over Venus and the Moon or over the house of women and the Part of the same
or over many of these the delight of the native is in young boys and he delights in seducing them."


Venus at 7 Virgo
Mercury 5, 4
Moon 3
Venus 3, 2
Mars 3
Sun 1

Moon at 0 Sag
Jupiter 5, 3, 2
Sun 3
Saturn 3
Mercury 1

Mercury is Almuten alonside Jupiter.
But Mercury is Almuten of Venus only.

One more example.


Almuten of Venus is Mercury.
Almuten of Part of Marriage in Virgo is Mercury.
7th house is in term of Mercury.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 06:45 PM
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Re: Gay

These are great posts Omnisphericus, I appreciate them, and I appreciate that you've made the charts a better size now, I can follow the threads far more easily.

May I ask what the source of this quote is, and what the 'house of women' refers to?

Quote:
"And Aomar said that when Mercury were Almuten over Venus and the Moon or over the house of women and the Part of the same
or over many of these the delight of the native is in young boys and he delights in seducing them."
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Unread 04-26-2012, 06:51 PM
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Many Marriages

According to Abu Ali.

If the sign on 7th house cusp is mobile (cardinal), it signifies marriage of many women.

It is the same when Moon is joined with many planets in same sign, or in Ictifal (applying conjunction, sextile, square, trine, opposition) to them from a trine or sextile aspect.

If the sign is common (mutable) he will marry only two women.

If it is fixed sign, or the Moon is Void of Course, or were joined to only one planet, or had Ictifal, it signifies that the man will contract matrimony with only one woman.

See also if there are Malefic planets in the 7th or 4th house because that signifies death of the spouse in man's chart, or the husband in the woman's chart.

Brad Pit's chart:


Brad Pit was engaged in 3 public relationships:
Gwyneth Paltrow
Jennifer Anniston
Angelina Jolie

His Moon is in the same sign with other 3 planets. Mars, Mercury and Venus.
The sign of the 7th house cusp is Mutable and according to Abu Ali he should have been married with only 2 women.
He did indeed, because as far as I now, he didn't marry Gwyneth Paltrow, he only dated her for 3 years.
This may be indicated by the Moon's separation from Mercury applying to Venus (only 2 marriages, instead of 3 as Mars is also in the same sign).

Last edited by Omnisphericus; 04-26-2012 at 06:54 PM.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 06:52 PM
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Re: Gay

Quote:
Originally Posted by Moog View Post
These are great posts Omnisphericus, I appreciate them, and I appreciate that you've made the charts a better size now, I can follow the threads far more easily.

May I ask what the source of this quote is, and what the 'house of women' refers to?
This is from the Zoller's Diploma Course, where he quotes Bonatti and Bonatti quotes Aomar
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Unread 04-26-2012, 07:30 PM
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Timing of Marriage Example

Bonatti:
Quote:
"The contracting of this matrimony will be when the year of the nativity
reaches to its 7th house 11 or when the 7th
were the Ascendant of the revolution of the nativity. This signifies a man'iage in that year; or it will be when the Moon comes by the direction to the planet which is significator of marriage."
Look at the Brad Pit's chart in the post above.
His Almuten of Marriage is Mars.
Venus is Oriental.
Moon is in the 1st Quarter = Oriental.

Brad Pit married Jennifer Aniston in 29 July 2000 when he was 36 years old.

and if she and the lords are occidental and are between the AC and IC or between DC and MC, or in the 2nd quarter of the Moon or in the last (occidental quarters), it signifies that the marriage of the natus is a little postponed and he will marry a little older woman in older years and he will be unfortunate because of women.

Venus and all the planets (except Jupiter) are in AC-IC quarter, Mars (Almuten of Marriage and triplicity lord of Venus and Moon) is occidental. Jennifer was 31 when she married Brad. 31 is really high number of years for a medieval society and they would not classified Jennifer as a girl but as a woman instead.
In one interview Brad said that the years with Jennifer were the hardest years of his life.

In the profected year of December 1999 Sag was the Profected Asc of Brad Pit's chart. This is the same as of the natal chart. In these years the promised in the natal chart is most likely that it should be fulfilled.

Jolie and Brad engaged officially on 12 April 2012 after 7 years of living together.
And this is again year in which the profected Ascendant is on the natal position.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 10:32 PM
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Marriages of Women

In Women's chart the Sun is of great importance.
According to Ptolemy we seek to find the Sun in the two Oriental Quadrants: from AC to MC, and from DC to IC, because this signifies that the woman will be married in her youth and that she will take young man in her older years, but not an older husband.
But when the Sun is in the Occidental quadrants (from AC to IC, and from DC to MC), then her marriage is delayed or in youth she will take older man.

If the Sun is from the beginning of Aries till the middle of Taurus,
or from the middle of Leo all the way to the end of Virgo,
or from the beginning of Libra all the way to the middle of Scorpio,
or from the middle of Aquarius till the end of Pisces, and the significator (In women's chart this is the Lord or Almuten of the 7th house) is Occidental, she will marry in old age or with older man.

If the significator is under the Sun's beams, it signifies that she has no marriage.

If the Sun is in fixed sign signifies that she will be married to one man only.
But if in that sign there is Oriental planet, you will judge that the man will be young or that she will marry another one after that.
If the planet is Occidental, then he will be older.

If the Sun is in mutable sign she will have two husbands.
If the Sun is in cardinal sign she will have many men.



This is the chart of Jennifer Aniston.
She was very publicly married with Brad Pit and had numerous broken relationships after that.
Her Sun is in fixed sign, so she married once.
The problem is that this Sun is afflicted from the Lord of the 7th and the Sun itself is Almuten of the 7th. This is (and other testimonies) what brought divorce.

Jennifer was 31 years old when she married Brad, so not so young. Brad was 36, a little bit older then her.
Sun is in the Oriental Quarter, but from the Middle of Aquarius till the End of Pisces which testifies that the she will take older man and in her older years (older from Medieval viewpoint).
With the Sun in the same sign there is occidental planet, which again testifies about older man and marriage in older years.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 11:05 PM
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When the Chart is showing No Marriage

We must see all or most of the following conditions:

- Saturn as Almuten of the 7th, neither Saturn nor the ruler of 7th are not aspecting the 7th.
- The Moon's dispositor not aspecting the Moon
- The Lord of the Part of Marriage of Men (according to Hermes) not aspecting the Part of Marriage.
- The Lord of the Sign in which Venus is, is not aspecting Venus.


This is a chart of a person who never get married, the chart was given on astro dot com.

Lord of the 7th - Jupiter is not aspecting the 7th house cusp.
Moon is in Cancer in her domicile, so I will take the exaltation ruler Jupiter as dispositor and he do not aspect the Moon.
If we take Mars as one of triplicity rulers and term ruler, he do not aspect the Moon either.
The dispositor of Venus (Mars) in 6th (cadent and combust!) is not aspecting Venus too.
Part of Marriage is in cancer so disposed with the Lord - Moon here.

On my own, I have also seen Cauda Draconis and Saturn in 5th as afflictions to romances in general.

So, many of the requirements are fulfilled, this man never married.
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Unread 04-26-2012, 11:05 PM
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Re: Delineating Marriage (Medieval Method)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnisphericus View Post
This is very intriguing subject isn't it?

Well, I must mention in the very beginning in explaining the methods here that they are of medieval astrology type (Bonatti, Abu Ali, Al Khayat and etc.).

To say that the method is 'Traiditional' is really using very wide range of time span in which different techniques for delineating marriage were used.
For example, the Hellenistic Astrologer's (Valens, Dorotheus and etc.) have used methods on their own, methods which I'll probably (not even later) not explain on this thread, but we can open another thread for that matter.
As this section of Traditional Astrology is quite new and in its beginnings, we now trow out the techniques here and there and title them as "Traditional". I hope that in the future we can make sub sections of traditional astrology, such as: "Medieval Astrology", "Hellenistic Astrology", Renaissance Astrology" and etc..
A most intriguing subject indeed Omnisphericus and the guidance provided by you is much appreciated. Great idea to create specific sub-sections to distinguish "Medieval Astrology" from "Hellenistic Astrology" - as distinct from "Renaissance Astrology" as well

I agree that a separate thread illustrating the alternative approach of Hellenistic Astrologers' using the methods of Valens, Dorotheus et al would maintain the excellent standard of clarity and focus that you show

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Unread 04-27-2012, 12:07 AM
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Re: Technical data

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnisphericus View Post
Part of Marriage for Men:
ASC + VE - SA

Part of Marriage for Women:
ASC + SA - VE

Moon Quarters:
From 0 degrees to 90 (New Moon to 1st quarter) = 1st QUARTER (Oriental)
From 90 to 180 = 2nd QUARTER (Occidental)
From 180 to 270 = 3rd QUARTER (Oriental)
From 270 to 360 = 4th QUARTER (Occidental)
I have two questions, if I may. The first, does the formula for calculating the Part of Marriage differ between day and night charts? And second, I am a bit confused about the Moon Quarters. I admit I am asking without looking for the answer first myself, but I understand that the degrees/quarters you show above represent the chart itself. Do we not then consider the Moon's actual phase in the chart? Perhaps I'm not explaining my question properly, so I will give a quick example. In my own chart, I have Moon at 27* Pisces, which is 163* from the ASC. That would place it in the second quarter. Yet, my moon is 6 hrs from completely full. Wouldn't that be the start of a 4th quarter Moon?
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Unread 04-27-2012, 02:05 AM
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Re: Technical data

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall View Post
I have two questions, if I may. The first, does the formula for calculating the Part of Marriage differ between day and night charts? And second, I am a bit confused about the Moon Quarters. I admit I am asking without looking for the answer first myself, but I understand that the degrees/quarters you show above represent the chart itself. Do we not then consider the Moon's actual phase in the chart? Perhaps I'm not explaining my question properly, so I will give a quick example. In my own chart, I have Moon at 27* Pisces, which is 163* from the ASC. That would place it in the second quarter. Yet, my moon is 6 hrs from completely full. Wouldn't that be the start of a 4th quarter Moon?
The Part of Marriage is the same for night and day, because if you reverse it, it will become the Part for the opposite sex.

If your Moon is 163 from the Ascendant she is in the 3rd quarter.
First quarter is that of AC - MC, second MC-DC, third from DC to IC, nad fourth from IC to AC. This is the Moon's placement in the Chart's Quarters.
But I was talking about the Moon phases, not the Moon's placement in the chart's quarters.
When we say that the First Quarter of the Moon's phase is 0 to 90 degrees, this means that she is 0 to 90 degrees apart from the Sun. 180 is Moon in opposition to the Sun and 0 degrees is conjunction with the Sun.
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Unread 04-27-2012, 02:19 AM
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Re: Technical data

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnisphericus View Post
The Part of Marriage is the same for night and day, because if you reverse it, it will become the Part for the opposite sex.

If your Moon is 163 from the Ascendant she is in the 3rd quarter.
First quarter is that of AC - MC, second MC-DC, third from DC to IC, nad fourth from IC to AC. This is the Moon's placement in the Chart's Quarters.
But I was talking about the Moon phases, not the Moon's placement in the chart's quarters.
When we say that the First Quarter of the Moon's phase is 0 to 90 degrees, this means that she is 0 to 90 degrees apart from the Sun. 180 is Moon in opposition to the Sun and 0 degrees is conjunction with the Sun.
Thanks! Just for clarity, and specificity, we would always consider, using this method, that from the time the Moon is 90* from the Sun until the Moon reaches 180* from the Sun it is still 3rd quarter? So that even 179* from the Sun, which would read as an opposition/full Moon in the chart, it is still third quarter?
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Unread 04-27-2012, 02:39 AM
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Re: Technical data

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall View Post
Thanks! Just for clarity, and specificity, we would always consider, using this method, that from the time the Moon is 90* from the Sun until the Moon reaches 180* from the Sun it is still 3rd quarter? So that even 179* from the Sun, which would read as an opposition/full Moon in the chart, it is still third quarter?
Technically yes
There are nor orbs for Moon phases.

Actually, it is 2nd quarter.
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Unread 04-27-2012, 02:47 AM
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Re: Technical data

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnisphericus View Post
Technically yes
There are nor orbs for Moon phases.

Actually, it is 2nd quarter.
Oops. Sigh. That's what happens when you multi-task. Thank you so much, Omnisphericus, for all that you are explaining here!
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Unread 04-27-2012, 02:53 AM
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More on Timing

- One of the possible timing period for Predicting Marriage is when the Profected 7th house come to the Ascendant.
These are the years 18, 30, 42, 54, 66 and etc..

- It is possible to marry when the Profected 7th House come to the house where the ruler of 7th is in natal chart.
(Also be aware of the years when Ascendant or DC comes to the Signs which are ruled by the ruler of the 7th house.

- Watch out when the 7th house becomes Ascendant in the Solar Return.

- Direction of the Moon to the planet which is significator of Marriage in the chart. In male chart this significator is the Almuten of Marriage which we have calculated in the first post above.
In women's chart Significator is the ruler or Almuten of the 7th.
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Unread 04-27-2012, 03:52 AM
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Example - female non married



I'm having problems with Morinus software so I will post this chart in Solar Fire format.

Louisa May Alcott is 19th century writer who is well known for her book Little Woman.
She died at 50 years of age from a disease. She never get married.

Lets look at the chart.

According to Ptolemy:

" ... in the marriages of women we ought to consider the Solar qualities in their nativities ... if the Sun were between the Ascendant and the 4th or between the 7th and the 10th her marriage is delayed."

Her Sun is in 3rd, so in the AC - IC quarter = her marriage is delayed; in fact never happened.

In many occasions, number of aspects Sun makes is giving the number of important relationships the woman will have.
If you notice here, the Sun does not make any close aspects with none of the planets.

Note the modern named T-Square between Saturn in 1st, Jupiter in 7th and Mercury in 4th. This is quite important.
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Unread 04-27-2012, 04:32 AM
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Male non married



This is the chart of Hans Christian Andersen, the very famous writer.
He died at age of 70. He never get married though he was heterosexual according to his diary. It is very intriguing that according to the very same diary he never get involved in sexual act either. He stayed a virgin for the whole life. This is not proved but it may be so.
He was very amorous like and had a longing heart. He fell in love in the 18th years old daughter of his friend. She was not interested in him and ask him to stop his amorous letters.

Mercury is Almuten of Marriage, i.e. Significator of Marriage.
Mercury is combust and cadent in 3rd in the AC-IC section.

The dispositor of the Moon is not aspecting the Moon.
Dispositor of Venus is not aspecting Venus.
Venus is applying to no planet before she changes the sign, but only that Venus with a huge applying sextile.
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Unread 04-28-2012, 01:58 AM
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Example - Christina Onassis - 4 Marriages



How do we know that this person would marry 4 times?
There are 4 planets between the Sun and MC!


How did I get this?

Italian Astrologer Grazia Bordoni revealed a document of an unknown italian astrologer who got reading for the nobleman Alfonso D'Este.
You can read the article (with google translate) here:
http://www.armonics2zero.it/index.ph...alfonso-deste/

In the reading the unknown astrologer had predicted to Alfonso D'este that he will have 2 marriages because there are 2 planets between Venus and MC.
Venus is significator for men's chart, but Sun for female chart and this is why in the chart the number of planets between the Sun and MC is showing the exact number of marriages of Christina Onassis.
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Unread 04-28-2012, 04:32 AM
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Number of Marriages according to Dorotheus

Number of planets between Venus and MC in male chart shows the number of spouses.
Number of planets between Mars and MC in female chart shows number of husbands.
(If Mars happens to be on MC then you take Jupiter instead of Mars).
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Unread 04-28-2012, 04:38 PM
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Example Living Together Non Married



Prediction of Marriage in 21st century is a little bit heavier then it would have been in Medieval times. This is because today there are more and more couples who do not accept the official institution of Marriage. They live together but they are not officially married. Such is the example of Oprah Whinfrey and Stedman Graham the chart of who we are giving here.

As you can see, between Venus and MC there are no planets, so the person according to this technique would never get married. This is not always so, but in this particular example it is exactly like that.

"Graham and Winfrey were engaged to be married in November 1992, but later decided they would rather have a "spiritual union."

This is from wikipedia. They still live together but they are not married.

The ruler of DC (where also Part of Marriage happened to be in this chart) is not seeing its place of rulership. In this case it is Venus, which is also in Fall.
It is in aversion to the sign which rules on DC.
Venus is also cadent in 6th.

"But if the Moon were combust and Saturn shall aspect her from the
opposition or square aspect and Jupiter does not aspect her nor does Saturn
receive her, it signifies that the native will not accept a wife."


Moon is combust, Saturn aspect her by Sign Antiscia.

"But if she were joined with Mercury, it signifies that the wife will be learned, well cultivating intelligence."

Moon is with Mercury. Well, Oprah is not his wife, it is his girlfriend, but this description applies to her.
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Unread 04-28-2012, 06:35 PM
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Incest



This is the chart of Lord Byron.
On several occasions he was accused for committing incest. Namely, the one that it is proven is with his half sister.

Ptolemy said:
Quote:
But if in
masculine nativities the Moon were joined with Venus, Mars and Saturn,
it will signify that the native commits incest with two sisters or with two
of his relatives or with those belonging to the kinship of his parents.
Well, Moon, Mars, Venus and Saturn are not joined together, but look how they are grouped in two: Moon and Mars together, and Venus and Saturn together.

Quote:
"And Ptolemy said, if Venus and Saturn were in signs common to them,
as are Capricorn and Libra the marriage will be between blood relatives.
Moreover, if the Moon were of the aforesaid quality (in its own sign or the signs of Saturn and Venus?) and that quality
shall rule in the Ascendant or Medium Caeli, the native will perform
the venereal act with his mother or step mother or maternal aunt, but a
woman will perform the venereal act and dally with her own offspring or
father or sister's child or with her own kind or paternal uncle or mother's
husband."
astrodatabank gives this event in his data:
Relationship : First Sex 1797 (Age nine when nurse "awakened passions.")

The Nurse is a representative of the Mother.
Striking similarities isn't it?

Example 2


Quote:
"And he said that if the Sun should be of this aforesaid quality, and the planets were occidental, the native will commit incest with the daughters of his brother or sister or with his own children."
This is a man who perpetrated incest on his daughter.
Look all the planets in Aquarius:
Sun/Venus/Saturn/Caput Draconis/Mercury/Mars
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