Contradictory placements ???

There is something that is very puzzling to me. That is, how do you interpret two seemingly contradictory placements( I do not mean oppositions) such having mars in libra and the moon in aries? What I mean by contradictory is that one placement would indicate a more aggresive nature and the other suggests a less aggressive nature (at least in this example). How would the person really be? More agressive like aries or more "peaceful" as in libra?

That goes for other examples as well that do not necessarily involve aggression or assertiveness. Could be simply two placements that would take away from the other as in one placement would suggest one thing and the other would suggest the opposite.

I hope my question is clear enough. Any advice on this would be really appreciated!

Hi,
The puzzle could seem contradictory because of how you are looking at it. It may not be a question of either/or but and/and.
The planets represent functions, the signs characters or modes of expression.
Moon will say how someone automatically responds to outer influences through one's feelings, as per the sign it is in.
Mars will show how and in what manner one expresses one's active energy.

The question with all planets is whether the traits within an individual are able to work for, with, or against each other.

E.g.
Moon may show an Aries automatic quickly fired and aggressive type 'me first' behaviour pattern when Libra's ability towards mutual cooperation doesn't work because Mars tends to wants things done its own way. Yet if Mars is able to work in 'active thought' within Libra's Air social skills and diplomacy, a lot of emotional friction in the Moon could be curbed.
OR; Mars simply has to realise that it has difficulty working in a cooperative capacity with another and prefers to let all its mentally (air sign) creative energy be utilised towards , and for, the strengthening of its own ego. It may not make it very sociable in company, though.

Where 'duo's' work together, you could find a Mars in Libra expressed positively, yet with Moon in Aries taking the automatic lead.

A) They cancel each other out, leading to a moderation in that trait.
B) They surface at different periods. A person who is talkative and obnoxious may not always be like that, for example. Maybe past a certain age, they mellow out. My sister told me that I was talkative as hell when I was younger (<14 years old). The me now is a lot more quieter, a lot more introverted.

Another example would be where a person can be anxious at times, and yet calm in other situations.

This is one reason why Time Lord methods are valuable.



Larxene Xenohart

Thank you both for your input. I guess one of my issues is understanding the actual difference between the planets' functions. For example: The Moon is said to represent emotions and one's instinctual reactions...etc. Mars is the way we express physical action and anger etc.. To me there is overlap between both planets, then. Mars represents anger and assertiveness. Isnt anger an emotion (which would fall under the Moon's meaning) ?? So you see how I can get a bit confused when the moon says something and mars says another.

The same applies to Ascendant and Sun, etc. I guess I am trying to figure out how to differentiate more clearly between the different placements in a chart since at this point, the cookbook method can be really confusing when reading a chart with obvious contradictions. I know astrology is a synthesizing art par excellence, but first we must know the individual parts well before being able to synthesize. I am having trouble with some of the definitions of the functions of planets, rising sign, etc..in that I see much overlap and sometimes become a bit confused.

p.s. I have thought about the possibility of them "cancelling" each other out, but there is also the possibility that they come out a different times/circumstances. How does one know which placement is dominant? How does one know when one or the other would play out...? These is the line of questioning thaty bugs me.

jg1982 said:

There is something that is very puzzling to me. That is, how do you interpret two seemingly contradictory placements( I do not mean oppositions) such having mars in libra and the moon in aries? What I mean by contradictory is that one placement would indicate a more aggresive nature and the other suggests a less aggressive nature (at least in this example). How would the person really be? More agressive like aries or more "peaceful" as in libra?

That goes for other examples as well that do not necessarily involve aggression or assertiveness. Could be simply two placements that would take away from the other as in one placement would suggest one thing and the other would suggest the opposite.

I hope my question is clear enough. Any advice on this would be really appreciated!

Click to expand...

Let's take your example:

So someone has Mars in Libra and their Moon in Aries.

When you see that someone has their Moon in Aries, it is important to look at where the 'dispositor' [ruler] of the Moon is, to evaluate the level of possible aggression. Mars rules Aries so the dispositor of the Moon is Mars.

Then we see that the native has their Mars in Libra. So this modifies their emotional aggression somewhat. They are still going to feel those feelings of anger or annoyance that come with the Aries Moon. But Mars describes how one physically reacts to internal feelings. How does one behave in reaction to the angry feelings?

If the Mars was in Aries alongside the Moon, then the native might be short tempered and might react physically, impulsively and start fights.

But the Libran influence will possibly allow one to talk things through with others and try to come to a consensus. The anger will still be expressed but in a more diplomatic way, hopefully. Although if the Moon is opposed the Mars it may still end up in quite a few fisticuffs.

jg1982 said:

Thank you both for your input.

I guess one of my issues is understanding the actual difference between the planets' functions.

For example:
The Moon is said to represent emotions and one's instinctual reactions...etc.
Mars is the way we express physical action and anger etc..
To me there is overlap between both planets, then.
Mars represents anger and assertiveness.
Isnt anger an emotion (which would fall under the Moon's meaning) ??
So you see how I can get a bit confused when the moon says something and mars says another.

The same applies to Ascendant and Sun, etc.
I guess I am trying to figure out how to differentiate more clearly between the different placements in a chart
since at this point,

the cookbook method can be really confusing

when reading a chart with obvious contradictions.
I know astrology is a synthesizing art par excellence,
but first we must know the individual parts well before being able to synthesize.
I am having trouble with some of the definitions of the functions of planets, rising sign, etc..in
that I see much overlap and sometimes become a bit confused.

p.s. I have thought about the possibility of them "cancelling" each other out,
but there is also the possibility that they come out a different times/circumstances.
How does one know which placement is dominant?
How does one know when one or the other would play out...?
These is the line of questioning thaty bugs me.

Click to expand...

Robert Schmidt of Project Hindsight http://www.projecthindsight.com/
explains more specifically that:

SUNS nature is to select

MOONS nature is to gather and include

MERCURYS nature is to contest and to destabilize

VENUS nature is to reconcile and to unify

MARS nature is to sever and to separate

JUPITERS nature is to confirm and stabilize

SATURNS nature is to reject and exclude

I agree with previous posts. What I have found with oppositions is a back and forth energy. Sometimes the person expresses one, sometimes the other. Also, projection is the name of the game; they may play one end and see/receive the opposite energy from others (especially with the outer planets).

Determining which will be dominant is the same way you would judge the strength of any planet. Dispositors, sign (Mars expresses itself in Leo more easily than in Pisces, for example), angularity, connection to important points/planet in the chart, etc.

I found the example given by the OP interesting and relevant since my closest friend has Moon in Aries and Mars in Libra - and to mix things up a bit Mars and Moon are in quite close opposition, and Neptune conjuncts Mars (5 deg orb)

I agree with the assessment of Moon in Aries and Mars in Libra given by katydid. This is certainly so for my friend. I would also expect her Aries Moon to be `activated' by the opposition to Mars, but it generally isn't. She appears rather passive and `nice' (she has Taurus Asc), but I know her well enough to be aware of the rumbling core of discontent and unspoken thoughts which she keeps to herself. And when she decides to air her grievances, she is more often than not met with disinterest in `the other', or a whole lot of obfuscation and excuses (in this country we summarise that as bull$h*t!) In her case, the Neptune-Mars conj in Libra further muddies her ability to gain clarity through communication with others in an attempt to sort things out.
However she can express her Aries Mars through impulsive behaviour, which tends o be expressed through spending money on things she doesn't really need.

I guess what I'm saying is that it is never as clear cut as Aries Moon with Libra Mars - which one wins?