Birth Chart of Mary?

piercethevale

Well-known member
PLEASE NOTE: This is an old thread that I revived today after deleting all my posts after this one... I was not off on my calculations as I had believed five years ago.

I just finished coming up with these with in this hour. I sent them off to a couple of fellow astrologers [ whom some of you members will, no doubt, be able to guess]
I'm going to post them with out going over the chart axis this morning as I'm tired...it's about 4 am here.
Most of you that have any interest in my Sabian work know how to interpret a chart axis by Sabian Symbology. In this instance I am proposing that the M.C. be read as the 'HOW' of the chart and the I.C. as the 'WHY"...I also recommend that those of you that have Jeffery Furst's book, "Edgar Cayce's Story of Jesus", utilize it to 'see' the corresponding story of Mary and her selection as the mother by the Angel and the ceremony as it was performed to that of the Sabian Symbols. [The 'HOW' is most interesting I think...but it is all interesting for that matter...]
I'm including the letter I sent off to my astrologer friends so I don't have to spend a lot of time here this late [or early] and will let you all noodle with it also.
Rant, Rave, Scream, Cheer, Razz, Applaud, Love it or Leave it...it's all up to each of your individual sensibilities.
Have at.

[the letter]

...As Edgar Cayce said that Mary and Joseph got married when she was 16. Cayce also said that Mary was carrying child between the age of 16 to 17. And Cayce said that when Joseph went to claim his bride he found her already bearing the child. And Cayce said that the two of them go married while Mary was 16.
This means the minimum age of Mary at the birth was 16 years and a couple of days [Yes, I know that is WAY extreme...but this a math equation taking in all the parameters] and the maximum age she could have been at birth would have been 17 years 8 mos. and about 28 days.
This means that Mary was born between [apprx] March 30, 14 BC & July 2, 16 BC [this was in error...]

I came up with these two I find very interesting.
My theory had to do with Cayce saying Mary and Jesus were true soul mates..one half each of the divided soul all men and women have among some significant other. I theorized that Marys' Lilith would be conj Yeshu'a's Moon. and/or [I figured and, actually...] their composite Venus would be the 14th of Aries as per the Sabian Symbol for that [You see, Miss X, aka [name removed], and I have a composite Venus in the 14th of Aries and her Lilith is conj. my moon...and Clarisse wasn't entirely sure about the question I asked her regarding all the signs and hints i was given if 'Miss X' and I were indeed 'Soul Mates' [for once...she's usually very confident in her replies...I figure she didn't really know what the image she saw was representing as she had obviously never been confronted/asked this question..] when I asked if [name removed] and I were in fact 'soul mates' and Clarisse said 'I think... so"
What I got was one chart with Lilith conj the 14th of Aries and a profound chart axis of Sabians when interpreted as Rudhyar explained [and in the Theosophic school of Esoteric Astrology i.e. the evolutionary direction of progression ...in the opposite direction the M.C. becomes the HOW of the chart axis and the I.C. the WHY.
Recall that the selection process according to Cayce was 12 maidens ..."On this day as they ascended the steps all were bathed in the morning Sun; which not only made a beautiful picture but clothed all as in purple and gold." ...and of course the Angel choosing Mary and all the hoopla...described by Cayce.
So check out the Sabian arrangement for the axis and consider where Lilith is.
The second chart has a Star of David [Grand Sextile] matrix...but it's missing in Aries...and as Clarisse said that I'm correct in assuming that there was a planet between Mars and Jupiter that must still be accounted for but there's no way of knowing when or where it's influence arise ["I see wormholes opening up here then closing and then opening up there and closing..."] that could very well be or one of the major asteroids may have been in the spot.
Anyways I'm attaching the two charts and let you noodle with them.

ps. both of he attached charts are no longer being considered as I pointed out one was too late for the birth of Mary...by about at least 3 weeks...and the other chart, I realized, is way more believable if moved back a couple of days to July 30
 

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piercethevale

Well-known member
Greetings...Phoenix Venus got me interested in looking for Mary's chart again and after studying what old charts i had already I realized I made a grave error in the first post (I've now deleted all posts that followed)... the April 19, 14 B.C. chart attached above is within the parameters! ...and what it reveals is absolutely fantastic!

Goin by Edgar Cayce's words that she conceived when she was 16 years of age she had to have been born between July 2, (day is apprx. Phoenix Venus will clarify later on... if she will?) 15 B.C.E. gregorian calendar and July 2, (day apprx.) 14 B.C.E. (add one year for use on astodienst emphemeris as because the computer demands that there is a "0 B.C.E or B.C. for those that prefer"... which there isn't in reality. It goes from 1 B.C. to 1 A.D. (or 1 B.C.E. to 1 C.E. for those that prefer)
Here's an image of the chart for non members



The Part of Fortune for the above is 11* Cancer 07' 43" ...that's the 12th degree of Cancer and incidentally it is the I.C. of the uSA natal chat (the "Zero Hour" chart, 12:00:01 A.M. July 4, 1776 Philadelphia, Pennsylvania)

From Dane Rudhyars wonderful book on the Sabian Symbols, "An Astrological Mandala" we get the following as the Sabian Symbol for the 12th degree of Cancer.

"CANCER 12°: A CHINESE WOMAN NURSING A BABY WHOSE AURA REVEALS HIM TO BE THE REINCARNATION OF A GREAT TEACHER.
KEYNOTE:
The revelation of latent worth in an experience once it is seen in its deeper meaning.

In contrast to the 'clown' symbol, which shows us man’s capacity to criticize and laugh at his superficial mannerisms and automatic habits or gestures, we now have a symbol which demands that we look beyond common appearances and try to discover the 'occult' (i.e. hidden) character of every person and every experience. This symbol has been unduly glamorized: there is no particular reference here to an avatar or messiah, except in the sense that every man is potentially the avatar or manifestation of a Soul that has a definite and relatively unique function in the vast field of activity we call the Earth. To discover this occult potential of being, one requires a deeper or higher 'vision', a holistic perception — which is usually, but not always justifiably, called clairvoyance. The caricaturist also has to develop a special kind of 'seeing' to enable him to extract the salient features of an outer personality or of a face. He picks
out the most characteristic parts of a whole; the true clairvoyant perceives the essential meaning (or 'message' and function) of the whole.

The contrast between the first and second symbols of this twenty-first five-fold sequence is indeed very significant. There may be no particular meaning in the fact that the nursing woman in this symbol is Chinese. Perhaps the psychic who visualized the scene may have mistaken a Tibetan for a Chinese woman, and unconsciously thought of the rather familiar process through which a new Dalai Lama, or other great Lamas, are searched for among newborn babies. The Keyword is
REVELATION."


WOW....!

...more to come... bet on it....!
 
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piercethevale

Well-known member
The Hermetic Lot of Nemesis aka the Part of Sudden Advancement is at 16* Aries 59' 42" ...the 17th degree of Aries...(ibid.)

"ARIES 17°: TWO DIGNIFIED SPINSTERS SITTING IN SILENCE.
KEYNOTE:
The ability to transform a natural lack of potency into poise and inner serenity.

Here we have a symbol which contrasts with the preceding one. In our culture, the 'spinster' represents the woman who has been unable to meet or accept the vitalizing power of love and organic fulfillment through biological polarization. Yet the symbol depicts two spinsters, emphasizing that refusing the natural expression of bipolar love has produced a special kind of dualism of experience. The two women are silent because this dualism has a narcissistic character. Life has turned inward seeing itself in a self-created mirroring. We have here the result of a negative inward approach to potency. The ascetic or saint also turns inward, but he accepts a higher non-biological type of polarization: man and God. Just as the activity of nature has a compulsive character, so the resistance of the spinster to biological fulfillment is also compulsive.

This is the second stage of the fourth five-fold sequence. Like all second stages it reveals a contrasting potentiality of experience which can also be seen to complement or polarize the symbol of the first stage. It refers to the value of a dignified
INWARD WITHDRAWAL."



...amazing...
 

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
Mary's Sun in Aries-8th squares Moon in Aquarius-5th, these two houses of maternity (5th for pregnancy, 8th for childbirth). An indication of her claim of fame as the mother of God in Christianity, Jesus Christ, and her symbolism of the mother goddess which the Christian faith adapted from European pagan religions 2,000 years ago. I happen to have a 8th house Sun (Aquarius) and a Moon in Aquarius on my natal chart (Feb 15, 1980), as well my own Mom's Aquarian Moon when she was born (Apr 29, 1951).
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
According to Edgar Cayce there were 12 maidens chosen from the Essene tribe as candidates for being the ''receptacle" ... likely one from each Sun Sign or Moon Sign... and Mary was an alternate that was asked to participate at pretty much the last minute... the 12 strolled across some sort of stage ...as I recall... and then ascended some sort of stairway and it was then on the stairs that Mary was chosen by an Angel.
The position of Jupiter in this chart in the 30th degree of Gemini may be another "sign". (ibid.)

"GEMINI 30°: A PARADE OF BATHING BEAUTIES BEFORE LARGE BEACH CROWDS.
KEYNOTE:
The setting of social standards through personal excellence and competition.

In this very American scene we see a very ancient and basic process which can operate at several levels. Society sets certain collectively acceptable cultural standards, and recompenses by prestige and fame the persons who embody them, physically or mentally. This generates emulation and the desire to bring the social images to their most perfect and concrete manifestation. The archetypal image or canon of proportion is thus incarnated for all to behold and be fascinated by. The process of exteriorization is completed.

This is the last phase of the sixth scene. In the zodiac the spring season has come to a close. It is summer solstice. Fulfillment leads to new demands upon the individual human consciousness. The
SHOW is over. Now comes the hour of decision."
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
The Hermetic Lot of Eros; One of the seven Hemetic lots (or Parts).
It is described thus (source: Chris Brennan) " Eros is associated with
yearnings (ὀρέξεις) and desires (ἐπιθυμίας) that are actualized because they are deliberately chosen, as well as friendship (φιλίας)."

Well, from what I remember reading from Edgar Cayce's reading the candidates were kept apart from the rest of the community and were kept together in a group.

From the chart above we get 11* Pisces 22' 15" (ibid.)

"PISCES 12°: IN THE SANCTUARY OF AN OCCULT BROTHERHOOD, NEWLY INITIATED MEMBERS ARE BEING EXAMINED AND THEIR CHARACTER TESTED.
KEYNOTE:
The ever-repeated challenge presented to the individual by the group in which he has claimed acceptance — the challenge to prove himself and his ability to assume responsibility effectively.

At any level of activity, sooner or later life itself demands of the individual that he or she stand up clearly and unequivocally to the ideal he himself has declared publicly his own. At the occult level the testing seems to be controlled and irrevocable. The 'initiate' has become a constituent part of an integrated field of mental-spiritual activity. He is therefore controlled by the structural order of the group. He is no longer seeking; having found his place, he must prove himself able to fulfill the function associated with it. He is no longer 'free' as an individual, for he has become a part of an integral Whole operating under structural principles of immense antiquity.

This second symbolic stage of unfoldment stands in contrast to the first in that the individual is now bound by collective laws and traditions. At a mundane political or business level he is the junior executive incorporated in a hierarchical institution. He has at all times to prove his worth.
QUALIFICATION is an apt Keyword."
 

Phoenix Venus

Well-known member
Hi folks. I'd like to talk about the chart of The Immaculate Conception and how it relates, in a remarkable way, to Mary's natal chart.

Piercethevale and I have been discussing this topic for the past few days now and have come up with a very strong case for the chart.

Our first theory was that since Yeshua was born as the "Perfect form of Man" (according to his ascending symbol), that his gestation period would likely be close, if not exact, to perfection. So we decided on the same time of day that He took His first breath.

Next, to find a date. The gestation period is considered to be 280 days from the first day of the womans last period, or 266 days from the woman's ovulation.

280 days from Yeshua's birth brings us to June 26, 02 greg, and 266 days brings us to a date of July 10, 02 greg.

Piercethevale suggested that he held the belief that the ASC of the chart would be right around the 19th degree of sagittarius, as that was the position of Pluto on the day of Yeshua's death. Makes sense as Pluto is the planet of rebirth and the ascendant represents the body. (seeing as how the chart we've got is proving itself to be the Real Deal, how he narrowed in on that and spotted that is beyond me... He must have a psychic sense about this stuff.. The mental vision of a hawk with a birds eye view of these charts... He does have pluto on His MC, after all..)

EDIT: So the precise degree of Pluto the day of Yeshua's death was at approx 18.29 sag. This produces a corresponding ascendant on the day of July 4th. I choose instead a date of July 3rd for various reasons. The ascendant was at approx 17.33 sag that day, so just about a degree conjunction.

Some of you all might be aware of this fact and i mention it because it does fit in with this theory that the gestation cycle was fulfilled to "perfection". Womens menstruation cycles often synch up with the phases of the moon. Mary, specifically, as an Essene and a chosen candidate for the mother of christ, was trained throughout her youth to perfect her physical, mental and spiritual being in order to become a proper channel. (Edgar Cayce even said that she was without original sin.)

So it only makes sense that a woman with a body in keeping of perfection would be in cyclic alignment with the moon phases.

And the Moon phases fit in remarkably towards their perfect distance from Yeshua's birth!! The new moon took place on June 27th, the full moon on July 11th. July 3rd was right in the middle, the day of the half moon. (the conception event chart was just hours before the exact square of the moon to the sun.) And July 3rd was the date right in the middle of 280 and 266 days from Yeshuas bith, the "perfect" gestation days.

So we see that the conception took place in alignment with the moon phase, the heavenly representations of the Father and the Mother, halfway between the Moon's "menstruation" and "ovulation" cycle, at the same time that Yeshua Himself took his first breath.... A perfect gestation indeed. The Immaculate Conception!

Now, in regards to this event's relation to Mary's natal chart, I'd like to quote a few things that Piercethevale said to me.

I inquired to him about Rudhyar's inferred statements pertaining to the theory of Yeshua containing a "Star of David" in His natal chart.

Here is what he said:

"The Jews infer it.
that the MESSIAH has to have that [the star of david]
...Yeshu'a wasn't the Messiah
Cayce said that the Messiah is an event not a person
it will be the descent of the Holy Spirit on humankind
makes sense to me
the descent of the Christ Spirit...
Yeshu'a became one with the Christ ... not born as
so... in a sense it will be his 'Second Coming'"

Well the Mother Mary chart has five points of a six point sextile matrix; A Magean David star.

The sixth point is being filled by transitting mars in this conception chart!!!

Here is what Cayce said of The Immaculate Conception:

"It's like many proclaiming today that the Master was immaculately conceived; they say, "Impossible!" They say it isn't in compliance with the natural law. IT IS A NATURAL LAW, as has been indicated by the projection of mind into matter, and thus making of itself a seperation to become encased in same- as did man (in the beginning.)" (from reading 5749-8)

&

"As the spirit was made manifest in the body purified by consecration of purpose in the lives manifested in the earth, so might the spirit- bring to the organs of (its own) flesh, a body through which the spirit may itself manifest in the earth (As its twin soul.)" (reading 2072-4)

... So taking all that into consideration, it's VERY FITTING that her Star of David matrix would be complete during the time of conception.

This missing matrix point was being filled by transitting Mars at 19.43.11 aries. This degree also happens to be Mary's natal Hermetic Lot of Victory, found at 19.56.20 aries.

The sabian symbol for 20 aries which is (from Dane Rudhyar's "An Astrological Mandala"):

"
A YOUNG GIRL FEEDING BIRDS IN WINTER.

KEYNOTE: Overcoming crises through compassion.


Nature's seasonal rhythms imply an oscillation between living and dying. Through creative imagination man can "fly over" the cycle, and discover means not only to escape from the fatality of seasonal decay or deprivation, but to assist other living entities to survive through crises. Migrating birds fly south (cf. symbol of Aries 12°), but by establishing a partnership with other creatures unable to escape wintry deprivation or death, man can maintain the life of the spirit (symbolized by birds) steady through all crises if, like a "young girl," he is widely open to the promptings of love and sympathy.

At this fifth stage of the symbolic sequence we witness human activity motivated by sympathy overcoming the seasonal phase of impotency. Life potency in nature spirits reaches a higher level in the human being. The theme is THE TRANSMUTATION OF LIFE INTO LOVE."


Wow... WOW... "Overcoming the seasonal phase of impotency"... WOW... An oscillation between living and dying.. Transmutation of Life into Love.. Remarkable!

Heres the chart. It's a jawdropper for sure. I might make a thread going over the symbols and the implications of the conception chart. Ill link to it here as i don't want to create any confusion if i start going into it too much... We can stick to the natal chart here.

 
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CapAquaPis

Well-known member
It appears we're certain by Edgar Cayce on when exactly the conception and birth of Jesus Christ occurred, with astronomical and astrological data to back the dates up with a great deal of accuracy. The belief whether or not Jesus Christ is the messiah depends on the person's religious belief and faith, the other mystery is whether Jesus Christ was fathered by a non-human source when the teenage Mary wasn't with a man, nor was sexually active at the time of conception. The chart shows the Sun in descendant (sunset) when Mary was told of the conception, with the first quarter moon in midheaven (and Libra or Virgo-the cusp), and Mars conjunct Uranus in Aries, Mary's sun sign (Apr 20 birthday).
 

Phoenix Venus

Well-known member
Let's look at Mary's AC/DC axis, shall we? The "Who" and the "Whom-to"

The AC is found to be at 20.19.17 Virgo.

Here is the symbol [ibid]:


"A GIRL'S BASKETBALL TEAM.

KEYNOTE: Physical training as a means to inculcate the feeling of participation in a collective culture.


Basketball presents an interesting symbol. The ball must be thrown into a narrow opening high above the head of the player. The ego-consciousness (the ball) must be driven upward to a focal point or circle that is ready to receive it. In a sense, this parallels what the boy on the merry-go-round (Virgo 6°) can do if he succeeds in penetrating the ring with his stick, but there are notable differences. Here the players operate as a team; in the original formulation of the symbol there was no reference to two teams and thus to the competitive character of the game. What should be stressed here is the formation of a group acting as an organic whole and training itself to operate in a social context.

This is the first stage of a second-level sequence of five symbols, as was the symbol of the merry-go-round. A definite type of educational activity is implied with cultural, and as well emotional, overtones. It implies the training for GROUP INTEGRATION of "girls," i.e. of a type of consciousness more specifically receptive to collective forces."


This is the perfect ascending symbol for Who Mary was; her incarnation into earthly existence at the time.

She was part of the group known as the Essenes. Essenes literally means "expectancy". The main purpose of the group was to raise individuals who would be fit channels for the birth of Jesus Christ.

Mary was among a group of girls being prepared for such a task. She and the others went through arduous physical training.

From reading 5749-7 by Cayce:

"Q. Please describe the training and preperation of the group of maidens.

A. Trained as to physical exercise, first; trained as to mental exercises as related to chastity, purity, love, patience, endurance. All of these by what would be termed by many in the present as persecutions, but as tests for physical and mental strength; and this under the supervision of those that cared for the nourishments by the protection in the food values. These were the manners and the way they were trained, directed, protected."

Her DC, the "Whom-To" or who she was to become, was at 20.19.17 pisces.

The symbol:

"
UNDER THE WATCHFUL AND KIND EYE OF A CHINESE SERVANT, A GIRL FONDLES A LITTLE WHITE LAMB.

KEYNOTE: Growth in consciousness in its earliest tactile awareness of the wonders of unsophisticated living.


This symbol recalls the one for Phase 174 (Virgo 24°) — "Mary and her little lamb" — but it occupies a different position in the five-fold sequence and a new factor is added: the "Chinese servant." According to the occult tradition, the original Chinese race was an extension of the humanity (or "Root Race") preceding ours — thus the stress upon the biological factors of family and ancestors, and also on the dualism of the Yang and Yin interplay. The "Chinese servant" represents the past as a servant of the new evolution. (The "white lamb" suggests the sign of all beginnings, Aries.) This new evolution is just about to begin during the late Pisces phase of the year cycle. It is as yet an ideal, a white loveliness. The girl discovers the new feeling of the touch of wool and of animal warmth. The preceding five-fold sequence began with a symbol suggesting the inspiring revelation of new truths or facts which the creative person is seeking to formulate. Now we witness another kind of discovery — a sensuously emotional discovery, perhaps a presentiment of the mother-feeling.

This is the first symbol of the seventy-first sequence. It brings together past and future, an overlapping of levels. The Chinese kindly watching the white girl; the girl fondling the white lamb. There is charm and ingenuousness in the scene — a vision of WHITE HOPE, a hope for a future that can only be felt, almost naively."


... Geez, I couldn't think of a symbol more fitting.

... Without remarking too much, I just wanted to point out this connection. Rudhyar says the white lamb suggests the sign of all beginnings, Aries. Well Yeshua's DC was Aries 1. And here we have the DC of Mary as the little girl holding the lamb.... Beautiful!
 
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Phoenix Venus

Well-known member
Let's look at Mary's MC-IC axis.

This axis is rather significant in Her chart as its the focal point (the opposition involved) in her six point sextile matrix, or Star of David.

The MC, representing the spiritual How, at 20 gemini:

"A MODERN CAFETERIA DISPLAYS AN ABUNDANCE OF FOOD, PRODUCTS OF VARIOUS REGIONS.

KEYNOTE: The assimilation of multifarious knowledge through the synthesizing power of the mind.


From the One, the Many arise in due time. The Original Source gives birth to the mountain stream which, gathering to itself the down-flow of rain water, becomes the large river around which cities are built. These in turn pollute the river on its way to the vast ocean. This modern symbol expresses the fact that man, now at the close of a cultural cycle, is able to gather foodstuffs - mental as well as physical - from many regions of the globe. His diet has acquired a planet-wide foundation; history tells us that the search for salt and spices, then for commodities rare in local regions, provided the impetus for global trade and thus eventually for a planetary consciousness. The results may be satiety and indigestion, and mental confusion caused by lack of discrimination.

This is the last symbol of the sixteenth five-fold sequence. As is most often the case such a fifth stage implies a certain kind of synthesis or at least a preparation which leads to a new level. The keynote here is indeed ASSIMILATION; the negative potentiality of the symbol is WASTE. "


Assimilation essentially means to take on a concept, idea, or cultural way of being, and to make it ones own, thus ressembling it.

And the IC, the spiritual Why, at 20 sag:

"IN AN OLD-FASHIONED NORTHERN VILLAGE MEN CUT THE ICE OF A FROZEN POND FOR USE DURING THE SUMMER.

KEYNOTE: The foresighted use of natural resources to supply future needs.


At the close of this series of symbols we again see a reference to the relationship between man and nature. Man’s ingenuity and foresight make it possible for him to plan for the future in terns of his knowledge of the seasonal rhythm of cold and heat and, by implication, of even larger cycles of change. Quiet and relaxation may have to be sacrificed, and some hardships endured, in order that another type of problem, which may involve survival though proper feeding, may be met at some later time.

This is the fifth and last phase in the fifty second section of the cycle. It stresses the value of actively planning for future need, and of foresight based on the knowledge of cyclic processes. Keywords: ASSURING SUPPLY."


So we see here that the how is about assimilation and the why is assuring supply... And while at first glance this might not sound very imperative in the life of Mary, the Mother of the one who became One with Christ, if we think about it, we might realize that these precepts were ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY.

I'd like to share a blurb of text made by Edgar Cayce, in reading 262-61, regarding the preperations made for the coming of Jesus Christ.

"YE say that there were those periods when for four hundred years little or nothing had happened in the experience of man as a revelation from the Father, or from God, or from the sources of light. WHAT was it, then, that made the setting for the place and for the entering in of that consciousness into the earth that YE know as the Son of man, the Jesus of Nazareth, the Christ on the Cross? Did the darkness bring the light? Did the wandering away from the thought of such bring the Christ into the earth? Is this idea not rather refuting the common law that is present in spirit, mind and body that 'Like begets like?' As was asked oft, 'Can any good thing come out of Nazareth?'

Isn't it rather that there were those, that ye hear little or nothing of in thine studies of same, that dedicated their lives, their minds, their bodies, to a purpose, to a SEEKING for that which had been to them a promise of old? Were there not individuals, men and women, who dedicated their bodies that they might be channels through which such an influence, such a BODY might come? "


This is precisely what her MC-IC axis was accomplishing... And its involvement in her Star of David matrix was essential... Next to post some more of the symbols involved in the matrix...
 
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piercethevale

Well-known member
Let's look at Mary's MC-IC axis.

This axis is rather significant in Her chart as its the focal point (the opposition involved) in her six point sextile matrix, or Star of David.

The MC, representing the spiritual How, at 20 gemini:

"A MODERN CAFETERIA DISPLAYS AN ABUNDANCE OF FOOD, PRODUCTS OF VARIOUS REGIONS.

KEYNOTE: The assimilation of multifarious knowledge through the synthesizing power of the mind.


From the One, the Many arise in due time. The Original Source gives birth to the mountain stream which, gathering to itself the down-flow of rain water, becomes the large river around which cities are built. These in turn pollute the river on its way to the vast ocean. This modern symbol expresses the fact that man, now at the close of a cultural cycle, is able to gather foodstuffs - mental as well as physical - from many regions of the globe. His diet has acquired a planet-wide foundation; history tells us that the search for salt and spices, then for commodities rare in local regions, provided the impetus for global trade and thus eventually for a planetary consciousness. The results may be satiety and indigestion, and mental confusion caused by lack of discrimination.

This is the last symbol of the sixteenth five-fold sequence. As is most often the case such a fifth stage implies a certain kind of synthesis or at least a preparation which leads to a new level. The keynote here is indeed ASSIMILATION; the negative potentiality of the symbol is WASTE. "


Assimilation essentially means to take on a concept, idea, or cultural way of being, and to make it ones own, thus ressembling it.

And the IC, the spiritual Why, at 20 sag:

"IN AN OLD-FASHIONED NORTHERN VILLAGE MEN CUT THE ICE OF A FROZEN POND FOR USE DURING THE SUMMER.

KEYNOTE: The foresighted use of natural resources to supply future needs.


At the close of this series of symbols we again see a reference to the relationship between man and nature. Man’s ingenuity and foresight make it possible for him to plan for the future in terns of his knowledge of the seasonal rhythm of cold and heat and, by implication, of even larger cycles of change. Quiet and relaxation may have to be sacrificed, and some hardships endured, in order that another type of problem, which may involve survival though proper feeding, may be met at some later time.

This is the fifth and last phase in the fifty second section of the cycle. It stresses the value of actively planning for future need, and of foresight based on the knowledge of cyclic processes. Keywords: ASSURING SUPPLY."


So we see here that the how is about assimilation and the why is assuring supply... And while at first glance this might not sound very imperative in the life of Mary, the Mother of the one who became One with Christ, if we think about it, we might realize that these precepts were ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY.

I'd like to share a blurb of text made by Edgar Cayce, in reading 262-61, regarding the preperations made for the coming of Jesus Christ.

"YE say that there were those periods when for four hundred years little or nothing had happened in the experience of man as a revelation from the Father, or from God, or from the sources of light. WHAT was it, then, that made the setting for the place and for the entering in of that consciousness into the earth that YE know as the Son of man, the Jesus of Nazareth, the Christ on the Cross? Did the darkness bring the light? Did the wandering away from the thought of such bring the Christ into the earth? Is this idea not rather refuting the common law that is present in spirit, mind and body that 'Like begets like?' As was asked oft, 'Can any good thing come out of Nazareth?'

Isn't it rather that there were those, that ye hear little or nothing of in thine studies of same, that dedicated their lives, their minds, their bodies, to a purpose, to a SEEKING for that which had been to them a promise of old? Were there not individuals, men and women, who dedicated their bodies that they might be channels through which such an influence, such a BODY might come? "


This is precisely what her MC-IC axis was accomplishing... And its involvement in her Star of David matrix was essential... Next to post some more of the symbols involved in the matrix...

Great post...thoughtful and insightful.
 

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
Hi CapAquaPis, thanks so much for your interest and participation. :) It is a fascinating subject, for sure.

You're welcome :joyful: I'm trying to figure all this out, from a more neutral or non-religious perspective (I happen to be agnostic, but still a Christian or Protestant). Nobody doubts the importance of the Virgin Mary in Jesus' life and in Christianity (revered by Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodoxy).

All I know is the birth of Jesus Christ heralded the age of Pisces, which is currently ending in the 3rd millennia AD or 21st century (age of Aquarius). It could also be a new or third epoch of 26,000 years in the history of modern humanity going back 54,000 years: the epoch of Cancer/Capricorn, both ruled by the Moon (ruler of Cancer, opposite-detriment for Capricorn).

The Moon in astrology symbolizes femininity and maternity, and the Virgin Mary is a powerful symbol of these subjects, a metaphor and a religious figure, with mentions of her found in the world's largest religions (the Qu'ran in Islam features her, but doesn't view her as "mother of God").
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
You're welcome :joyful: I'm trying to figure all this out, from a more neutral or non-religious perspective (I happen to be agnostic, but still a Christian or Protestant). Nobody doubts the importance of the Virgin Mary in Jesus' life and in Christianity (revered by Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodoxy).

All I know is the birth of Jesus Christ heralded the age of Pisces, which is currently ending in the 3rd millennia AD or 21st century (age of Aquarius). It could also be a new or third epoch of 26,000 years in the history of modern humanity going back 54,000 years: the epoch of Cancer/Capricorn, both ruled by the Moon (ruler of Cancer, opposite-detriment for Capricorn).

The Moon in astrology symbolizes femininity and maternity, and the Virgin Mary is a powerful symbol of these subjects, a metaphor and a religious figure, with mentions of her found in the world's largest religions (the Qu'ran in Islam features her, but doesn't view her as "mother of God").

According to Edgar Cayce we entered the age of Aquarius in either June of July of 1936... (I forget which....when I come across the info again I'll share it here)
 

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
Speaking of epochs (24-26,000 years made up of 12 ages), we're actually in the sixth one in human history, according to some New Age believers and theosophists. The Wikipedia article has an image of the zodiacal constellation of Capricorn, which means the first age was under Gemini or Sagittarius (the signs co-ruled by either the North or South Nodes). The comparison of the USA in this century and millennia with the Holy Land, as this country is the "new Galilee" with Judeo-Christian biblical references.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Galilee_(Sixth_Epoch)
 
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piercethevale

Well-known member
Speaking of epochs (24-26,000 years made up of 12 ages), we're actually in the sixth one in human history, according to some New Age believers and theosophists. The Wikipedia article has an image of the zodiacal constellation of Capricorn, which means the first age was under Gemini or Sagittarius (the signs co-ruled by either the North or South Nodes). The comparison of the USA in this century and millennia with the Holy Land, as this country is the "new Galilee" with Judeo-Christian biblical references.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Galilee_(Sixth_Epoch)

Edgar Cayce was once asked about that. He said that the creation of the five Adams and five Eves occurred 223,000 years ago so that would put us presently in about the 10th Great Yuga. He confirmed the existence of the avatar Ram (Rama, Sri Rama... Hare Rama) and that He was alive 198,000 years ago...but He also said that His story had gotten added to it by great men of India that followed that also had the name of Ram.
The first destruction of the continent of Atlantis happened 75,000 B.C (or B.C.E. for those that prefer) the last remnant of the once great continent went under the sea in 12,500 B.C. (E.) and that the segment of that society that was following the Path of Light migrated to Egypt and they built the Great Pyramid, the Sphinx and buried a "time capsule"...that is referred to as "The Hall of Records" beneath somewhere in a way that it wouldn't be found until mankind had elevated in wisdom and spirituality again. There's allegedly two more such capsules and they al contain identical info...so as to leave no doubt about the veracity of what info they contain.

Edgar said all that years ago..in the 1930's I think most of that was revealed....and it's only just very recently that arche/geologists have decided that the Great Pyramid and the Sphinx were probably built around 12,500 B.C.(E.)
The Basque, Cayce said, also originated from Atlantis.
The Aton or Aten religion of Egypt was introduced there by the Atlanteans, according to Edgar.
I figure the Great Yugas to be 26,640 years in length... although such astronomical cycles are never precise as far as a measuring in time goes.
Pluto makes 108 orbits around the Sun in that time... It's when It returns to the first degree of libra the 108th time that the Avatar is born. The Magi knew this.
A Hindu mala...which represents a cycle of transformation is made of 108 beads... the tulsi nut is the preferred bead. The Catholic Rosary has 54 beads.

It also has to do with cycles of 666 years and 888 years...those two astronomical/astrological cycles will only conjunct at the same point every time. ...and that's right where they were when everything in our solar system was created by a large "spew" of matter from our Sun out into space...which broke up and deposited lumps of that mass which became our Planets.
The was with the Sun Mercury and Venus in the 1st degree of Aries and all the outer planets from us in the 1st of Libra. THAT was perfection...and it's when the cycle returns to that state...as long as Pluto is there , even if it's the only planet there... the Avatar is born.
Three times 888 and four times 666 equal 2664. Ten of those conjunctions make u a Great Yuga... and Pluto will be there give or take a hundred years...

What does the cycle of 666 correspond with? That is the big question and I'm still tinkering with the study... I'm rather certain that the 666 year cycle has to do with the Soros... the 888 I still haven't got a good lead.
One theory I started with is that they are two planets beyond Pluto. every 666 years is a period of time that "evil" holds sway over the Earth. ...and the half and quarter portion of that cycle as well. The cycle of 888 does the opposite. (Twice 888 is 1776, for an example). I have convinced myself that the Prince of Peace was born in the year 3 A.D. (or C.E. for those that prefer) So add 3 to timeline studies. Three times 666 is 1998 and add 3 and you get 2001...1776 plus a quarter portion of 222 is 1998...add 3 and... Go forward and backward from the year 3 A.D. (C.E.) with those cycle and portions of cycles and you will find that you have very significant periods of exactly that as I mentioned above.

Rabbi Dobin in his book Kabbalistic Astrology wrote that by legend the Hebrews know that the first day of our planets corresponds to what we nowadays know as the first day of Fall.
That would mean that the Sun would have to be in the first degree of Libra, along with Mercury and Venus and all the outer planets in the first of Aries... wouldn't it?

One would tend to have to agree ...but not if the greater number of the worlds' population was at one time in the Southern Hemisphere.... :wink:
 

piercethevale

Well-known member
I had forgotten in the excitement of reviving this thread last year and realizing that it is an excellent candidate for submission as being recognized as Mariam's ( the Virgin Mary) birth chart... much more so than I first even imagined... that I had chose the day as for the relative position of Venus it produces to that of Venus on the chart I have submitted to be recognized as being that of Her son, Yeshu'a (Jesus, if you insist)

As Edgar Cayce said that Mariam/Mary and Yeshu'a/Jesus were each of one-half of the same soul (true soulmates... as we all have another half whether it be presently incarnate or not.) that it is the reason He gave as for why Mary could give virginal birth to a male child.

As the woman I met and became intimately involved with, (as to the point of becoming engaged with Her to be married) and whom became the basis for the book I have published, I found to m complete surprise was relatively easy to have a true tantric experience with (She has Pluto conj. the Asc and I conj. the M.C.) I theorized that she and I were two halves of the same soul and to which my, long time friend and clairvoyant, Clarisse Conner confirmed that indeed we are. (Cayce warned to not go looking for that person as for the reason that much more often than not you'll find that you wish you had never done so. Almost always there are major incompatibility issues.) That womans' natal chart and mine produce a composite Venus in the 14th degree of Aries.
Cayce said that Yeshu'a/Jesus and Miriam/Mary had been Adam and Eve of the Red Race, originating on Atlantis, and were the two halves of the same soul.
This chart, I submitted as being that of the Virgin Mother, when in composite with the chart I contend is that of Yeshu'a/Jesus produces a composite Venus in the 14th degree of Aries.

The
Sabian Symbol for the 14th degree of Aries (From Dane Rudhyars book on the Sabian Symbols, "An Astrological Mandala")

"ARIES 14°: A SERPENT COILING NEAR A MAN AND A WOMAN.

KEYNOTE:
Identification in bipolar relationship with the impersonal rhythm of natural energy.

The symbol for Phase 4 pictures a man and a woman in love walking together. At this new and more mentally stimulated level of experience and consciousness, a third factor appears: the serpent, whose coiling represents the spiral-like process of evolution - not merely 'sex' according to the maker of cathartic symbols, Sigmund Freud. We can understand this 'triangular' image — man, woman and the serpent — if we relate it to the preceding one in the series, the unexploded bomb of the anarchist or activist. The urge to blow up some structure which somehow has become in the activist's mind a symbol of the Establishment — the ruling elite — is usually the protest of an alienated and often immature mind that refuses relationship, because in the relationship he would occupy a subservient position. In this symbol, the serpent represents the acceptance of relationship by the two polarized human beings.
There must be a polarization before there can be fulfillment. The tragedy of so many contemporary lives is that, having become sharply individualized, the men and women cannot find their truly matching polar-opposite. Because they are not fulfilled at the root level of human emotions and vitalistic forces, they pass their lives seeking the ideal complement, often glamorized as the 'soul mate'. This search can find its expression at several levels. At the mystical level we have the examples of the 'spiritual marriage' of Saint Francis of Assisi and Santa Clara, or recently of Sri Aurobindo and Mother Mira.
The Adam and Eve story (in Hebrew, Ish and Isha - much more significant names!) refers to this principle of polarization, although the story has been turned upside down by priestly intellects to serve their purposes. Adam and Eve accepted the Presence, not of the Tempter, but of the Individualizer, who sought to have them born out of the womb of unconscious passivity to Nature's God. But the result of the experience frightened them. They 'hid'; they failed in the great test of individualization, and in this sense the archetype of that failure is deeply imbedded in man's generic unconscious. It is repeated time after time.
Modern 'individuals' are confronted with another test, but they do not understand its meaning. It is the test of polarized conscious participation in the evolutionary process - a polarization that could dissolve alienation, isolation and egocentricity. In a sense at least, this was the old Tantric concept in India; but today many young people accept the concept only superficially and miss its real essence. They cannot understand the meaning of entering into the serpent, i.e. of developing eonic consciousness and that transpersonal living which once was characterized by the words: Not I live, but Christ lives me - Christ, whose symbolic number in Gnosticism is 888.

At this fourth stage of the third five-fold sequence, we are confronted with an image suggesting the transpersonal way to the 'cosmification' of desire and the conscious acceptance of polarization as the solution of the problems generated by individualization. But this need not mean what is currently meant by "sex" and the glorification of the orgasm. It implies rather the
RITUALIZATION OF RELATIONSHIP."
 
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piercethevale

Well-known member
Lucky was the day that Phoenix Venus arrived and the day she took an interest in the search for the chart of the Virgin Mother. I never pursued this chart any further after I had convinced myself that the math was all wrong... if not for her it probably would have never gotten another look, or thought in consideration, from me.

Thank you, Phoenix Venus... I do so love the way your mind works:love:
...and housed in such a pretty head, too.
:joyful:
 
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