Astrology and it's enemies

I know astrology has many supporters including Kepler, Newton and Jung.
However it has it's share of enemies including Cicero and Voltaire. I found these quotes of holy man opposed to astrology.

``Star-gazing and astrology, forecasting lucky or unlucky events by signs, prognosticating good or evil, all these are things forbidden.''
Gautama the Buddha

``You will find that astrology and all these mystical things are generally signs of a weak mind; therefore as soon as they are becoming prominent in our minds, we should see a physician, take good food and rest.''
Swami Vivekananda

"I know nothing of the science of astrology and I consider it to be a science, if it is a science, of doubtful value, to be severely left alone by those who have any faith in Providence."
Mahatma Gandhi

they dont sound like enemies (like they didnt demand to ban astrology) but they were nonbelievers

I've always found it amusing how supposed "spiritual leaders" or "holy men" who are supposed to be bringing light to the inhabitants of earth speak ill of observing the lights in the sky, usually using the excuse it speaks of some sort of lack of faith. I understand why some people buy it; but I'll leave the reader to form his own conclusions on that matter.

Funny, because I've always found that the demonstrated validity of astrology and demonstrated synchronicity between the heavens and earth confirms an intelligent design to our cosmos, and therefore the existence of a higher power of many faces.

Of course, if people realized they didn't need some "holy man" or "guru" to "guide" them, where would that leave these supposed "holy men"? Are these supposed "holy men" really as selfless as they'd likes us to believe? Somehow I doubt it.

I think the holy men were wrong, however partially right about what they say. Living a holy life is more important than knowing astrology. However they were too harsh of something they didn't know and perhaps fear, I suppose they didn't want an astrologer to analyse them, they were afraid of that. Besides Vedic astrology is very fatalistic and there are many charlatans in India that pose as astrologers, so it's not surprising they think this way.

I think that astrology is a very high occult science, and I consider occult sciences to be superior to orthodox science. However religion and philosophy are higher knowledge than astrology. So I consider these holy men to be higher than any astrologer, unless they are holy men as well. You can see from this that I'm very aristotelian in my thinking, with this whole hierarchy of knowledge, and I consider it essential in an age of moral and intellectual relativism.

deleted post.

Not everyone should study Astrology,not even "like" it.To me,personally,Astrology is a great tool for self-knowlegment and self-improvement,however,it's a little bit too much to try to impose it on others.

Different people chose different tools to help them with their lives.We have chosen Astrology.

However,I do agree that the real problem is when ill-informed people give Astrology a bad name in the public arena,simply because they feel like spekaing about what they really don't know.Not everyone should use Astrology in their lives,however,I sincerely believe that people need to recofnize that Astrology is just as valuable as any other science.

Well, I have to say that Lord Buddha's words quoted in this topic was meant as a rule for monkhood, not for general population (Buddhism does not enforce any rule on non-monks. Teachings are given as guide telling you which paths lead to bliss and which paths lead to troubles but you are the one who decide to walk any path, and sure enough take your karmic responsibility for that decision)

Astrology as well as many other occult activities, forms of non-Buddhism worships, and most of worldly "career" activities are apparently forbidden for Buddhist monks.

I speculate that old-fashioned "determinate" astrology would be spiritually unhealthy, uncivilized in context of modern philosophy as well as worldwide-accepted religions such as Buddhism, Christianity, Islam, etc. But I believe in "free-will compatible" astrology, which goes along nicely with synchronicity/karmic concepts.

Hi Michael i would like to know in which text Buddha says that? I know lamas that are astrologers, and tibetan astrology is very interesting, and they follow the indications of the new moon, or the full moon to do some meditations or puyas, or prayings on auspicious days.

It's true that Buddhism and Hinduism are
more tolerant of diversity of spiritual
discovery. They have tolerated and even
integrated practices like yoga, astrology,
and even some magic rituals.
However according to astrological theory,
religion and religious leaders are represented
by Jupiter, and astrology and astrologers by
Mercury. And it turns out that both planets
are exact opposites, that means each planet
is weak in the other planet signs. So it's no
surprise that religions in general have problems
with systems like astrology.

"The Buddha taught that one's future is conditioned primarily by one's kamma, not by the stars and he condemned astrology and expressly forbid his monks and nuns to practice it. One story in the Jataka pokes fun at those foolish enough to make decisions based upon astrological predictions. Despite this astrology is widely believed and practiced in most Buddhist countries and not uncommonly monks act as astrologers." (1)

(1) http://www.buddhanet.net/e-learning/dharmadata/fdd45.htm

The quote you mention I copied from this site:
http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/2001/04/10/stories/13100372.htm

I don't know the primary source.

Uranus, to Michael

Michael,

You said:

However according to astrological theory, religion and religious leaders are represented by Jupiter, and astrology and astrologers by Mercury

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True, but according to modern astrology, astrology and astrologers are ruled by Uranus, which is "sextile" (energy goes easily with) to Jupiter by house ruler (i.e., Uranus rules the 11th house, Jupiter rules the 9th house, which are "sextile" (2 houses away)). So maybe now astrology goes much better with religion.

Imagining the possibilities,

Tim

True, but according to modern astrology, astrology and astrologers are ruled by Uranus, which is "sextile" (energy goes easily with) to Jupiter by house ruler (i.e., Uranus rules the 11th house, Jupiter rules the 9th house, which are "sextile" (2 houses away)). So maybe now astrology goes much better with religion.

Click to expand...

Good point. I think that we are having a change in the perception of astrology by religious gurus and leaders.
For example The Dalai Lama is a supporter of tibetan astrology, Srila Prabhupada founder of the Hare Krisna
movement was a patron of vedic astrology, and Osho the sex guru talked about the important role of astrology
in the development of human knowledge. The only problem is that they are very partisan with their branch of
astrology, they tend to think it's the best, or the only one that is legitimate.

Astrology is being furthered by a change in conciousness, thanks in part to the fall of orthodox religions, rise of
the new age movement, and a more tolerant way of thinking. All this is reflected in the change of the traditional
ruler of astrology mercury, to uranus as the new ruler of modern astrology. As above so below, or as below so
above. Well, either way there seems to be a correlation.