SunConjunctUranus
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Why are you become so cold in this past weeks, uk?
Random Thoughts, strictly Text
- Thread starter david starling
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Why are you become so cold in this past weeks, uk?
conspiracy theorist
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Mars is currently transiting the sign of my MC and the last new moon was exactly on the MC degree in my chart. So you can imagine where the focus has been this past month.
Also on the astrological front, Jupiter is currently on its natal location, and over the weekend something happened to me that exemplified it's natal position - ruling the 4th sign (Pisces), Saturn in Pisces, and the issue of "return". It is ancestral and completely unknown to me. Astrology proves itself more and more to me everyday. It might be easier for me to see the effects in my chart because it's "chrematistikos". I'm aware that some charts don't show astrological effects so readily.
http://www.astrology-x-files.com/zodiac/glossary.html
Ukpoohbear
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All the lonely people, where do they all belong...
david starling
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david starling
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Merc in Scorpio is a Benefactor (12/12). Helps with revelatory thinking.
Mars is moving into an activating Square with its nemesis, Saturn:
Advantage, Saturn (in
versus Mars in 
). Caution is advised.
Mars is moving into an activating Square with its nemesis, Saturn:
Advantage, Saturn (in
versus Mars in ). Caution is advised.
conspiracy theorist
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Overpowering, how so?
conspiracy theorist
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Because I don't have such an emotional reaction to killers, atrocities and the like, I can think about other things related to their lives no problem. But I get your point. I took it as exemplifying the fact that essential dignity does not equal good, competent or dignified in the common sense. Which I've noticed based on real life chart examples, yet the formulaic treatment of essential dignities remains in the people who call themselves traditional astrologers today. Medieval followers more so than those inspired by Hellenism. But even that difference isn't acknowledged by some practitioners.
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conspiracy theorist
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Maybe the sensationalism of serial killing captures the imagination more than a billionaire media tycoon?
Here's another one of his chart analysis articles, with a look on the brighter side of things. http://www.sevenstarsastrology.com/bio-shorts-jim-carrey-and-the-astrology-of-comedy/
Liz Greene and the psychological astrologers weren't the inventors of qualitative reading of planets in signs (i.e. Moon in a Mars sign means something beyond it's dignity). I remember reading a lot of that type of delineation in Maternus a few years back.
Here's another one of his chart analysis articles, with a look on the brighter side of things. http://www.sevenstarsastrology.com/bio-shorts-jim-carrey-and-the-astrology-of-comedy/
Liz Greene and the psychological astrologers weren't the inventors of qualitative reading of planets in signs (i.e. Moon in a Mars sign means something beyond it's dignity). I remember reading a lot of that type of delineation in Maternus a few years back.
david starling
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Speaking of Daumer's chart, score one for 12/12, keying off the Ascendant to determine the final Dispositor. Conventionally, in both Trad and Mod, Venus is Domicle-ruler of both Libra and Taurus, so with Asc in Libra and its Domicle-ruler also Domicled in Taurus, Venus would have held that position. But, according to 12/12, the Domicle-ruler of Taurus is the Age-indicator, now in Capricorn, Saturn's Domicle, which makes Saturn the final Dispositor, squaring Moon in Aries, and the leg of the T-square with the Moon opposite the Ascendant.
The Age-relationship between Saturn and Venus has resulted in the hybrid villain, "Lucifer", in Milton's Paradise Lost, in place of the original, benevolent, Roman version of the planet Venus as the Morning-star, or "Light-bringer". It's a combination of Saturn, the Domicle-ruler of this Age of Capricorn (as "Satan") and Venus, the Regulating-ruler of Capricorn, which attempts to balance out Saturn's influence. Given the Tyrannosaurus Rex nature of Saturn, that attempt is fraught with difficulties. More people have a real problem with Saturn in their Charts than any other Sign-ruler, as witnessed by the appellation "Greater Malefic" in Traditionalistic astrology.
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conspiracy theorist
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If Mars still rules Aries in 12/12, how can Saturn be final dispositor? Mercury in Gemini?
david starling
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I'm keying off the Ascendant in Libra, Domicile-ruled by Venus in Taurus, Domicile-ruled by the Age-indicator in Capricorn, Domicile-ruled by Saturn.
david starling
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Exact on Oct. 27, separating 5 degree Orb on Nov. 1st.
conspiracy theorist
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A final dispositor can't occur if you have more than one domiciled planet in the chart. What makes a dispositor final is that every other planet leads back to it. Since Mars rules Aries, it is its own dispositor and does not go through the rulership chain to Capricorn, same for Mercury.
An example of a chart with a final dispositor would be: Sun in Aries, Moon in Cancer, Mercury in Taurus, Venus in Aries, Mars in Cancer, Jupiter in Libra, Saturn in Libra, Uranus in Gemini, Neptune in Leo, Pluto in Leo.
No matter which planet you start with everything leads back to the Cancer Moon.
Pluto - > Sun -> Mars -> Moon
Neptune -> Sun -> Mars -> Moon
Saturn -> Venus -> Mars ->Moon
Jupiter -> Venus -> Mars -> Moon
Venus -> Mars -> Moon
Mars -> Moon
Mercury -> Venus -> Mars -> Moon
etc
An example of a chart with a final dispositor would be: Sun in Aries, Moon in Cancer, Mercury in Taurus, Venus in Aries, Mars in Cancer, Jupiter in Libra, Saturn in Libra, Uranus in Gemini, Neptune in Leo, Pluto in Leo.
No matter which planet you start with everything leads back to the Cancer Moon.
Pluto - > Sun -> Mars -> Moon
Neptune -> Sun -> Mars -> Moon
Saturn -> Venus -> Mars ->Moon
Jupiter -> Venus -> Mars -> Moon
Venus -> Mars -> Moon
Mars -> Moon
Mercury -> Venus -> Mars -> Moon
etc
david starling
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Interesting. That's not in the glossary you linked to, and I hadn't heard of it. The word "final", as I understood it, is that it's a Dispositor sequence ending with a Domicled planet, so it stops there. I just see the Domicled Mars in this case, as a "firm" placement, on its own. (Notice the description "firm", instead of "strong".
)Is there another Trad description of the method I use?
conspiracy theorist
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afaik final dispositorship isn't a traditional thing. From what I've seen, the immediate ruler is looked at and no further in the older material.
david starling
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I could describe what I'm doing as the Asc-Sequence Dispositorship, with a final Dispositor only in the case of a Domicled placement.
If what you described for "final Dispositor" isn't Trad, whose requirement is it?
conspiracy theorist
Well-known member
I could dig into the origin of it, but I'm not particularly motivated at the moment. I see it a lot on more modern-oriented blogs. Similar to how you won't see Sabian symbols or Marc Edmund Jones patterns on sites dedicated to traditional techniques.
david starling
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Okay, looked around and found varying opinions. So, I'll drop the "Dispositor" label, and call it the Ascendant rulership sequence. If it stops at a Domicle-ruler, that's the sole Asc ruler. If not, then it's the Ascendant rulership group. In 12/12, Asc in Sagittarius is its own, sole ruler.
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conspiracy theorist
Well-known member
@David
So, in a 12/12 situation, the primary influencer on the personality would be the final dispositor according to your rulerships? Or would the nuance come from every link in the chain?
@passiflora
There are also astrologer's degrees but I doubt all of the working astrologers have them. I happen to have my Moon on one of them but I don't do this for a living. I don't think the criteria for operating is getting a paycheck, though.
At the time I wasn't in a position to be a connoisseur about my sources, so I read what was freely available on the internet. That same blogger has a lot of suggestions regarding good sources for traditional material. I've read Ben Dykes' translations before and they always struck me as lucid and clear.
So, in a 12/12 situation, the primary influencer on the personality would be the final dispositor according to your rulerships? Or would the nuance come from every link in the chain?
@passiflora
There are also astrologer's degrees but I doubt all of the working astrologers have them. I happen to have my Moon on one of them but I don't do this for a living. I don't think the criteria for operating is getting a paycheck, though.
At the time I wasn't in a position to be a connoisseur about my sources, so I read what was freely available on the internet. That same blogger has a lot of suggestions regarding good sources for traditional material. I've read Ben Dykes' translations before and they always struck me as lucid and clear.
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david starling
Well-known member
In Daumer's chart, it stops at Saturn. But there's a power struggle between Saturn and Venus, due to the dominating nature of Saturn, with Venus included in the sequence, along with the Earth's Age-indicator. Remarkable synchronicity, since that's the exact same power struggle as what's occurring in the Age of Capricorn, with Saturn as Domicile-ruler and Venus as Regulating-ruler.
To give a contrasting example, Apollo's Triangle is Domicle-ruler of the Sagittarian Age (now background Age to foreground Capricorn), and Jupiter is Regulating-ruler. But they operate as a team, with Apollo accepting Jupiter's leadership role and Jupiter supportive of Apollo.