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  #1  
Unread 03-28-2015, 10:30 PM
Neptune Rising Neptune Rising is offline
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Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

Hi,

I was reading about 'Chiron and the will to live' just to explore my own natal Sun square Chiron in the 4th to get an understanding of the wound to self-esteem. Then came up in the news was a comment from the pilot Andreas Lubitz's old girlfriend that Andreas made saying he wanted to do something to make everyone remember him.
Quote:
“One day I will do something that will change the whole system, and then all will know my name and remember it.”
from this article. This stuck a chord with my own Sun square Chiron, which when it is untransformed and unconscious, manifests as a need to be noticed and usually going about it in unproductive or damaging ways. Brought to consciousness, the light of the Sun with Chiron brings deeper understanding of the patterns of life.

His words, "I will do something that will change the whole system" is so reflective of Sun/Mercury/Saturn/Uranus in Sagitarius. Saturn/Uranus together breaking barriers/boundaries or challenging authority, both personalised by Sun/Mercury. But opposite to a natal Chiron... maybe he felt wounded by the 'system', although a Chiron wound can be ancestral, going to childhood and before, into family history.

In looking later at his chart, Andreas Lubitz has a Sun/Saturn/Mercury/Uranus stellium at 23-26 degree Sagittarius, and right opposite is the Chiron. Triggering that wound of his need to be noticed and maybe feeling inadequate with low, or, exhalted-compensatory (unbalanced) self-esteem was the lunar eclipse on Scheat at 29 degrees Pisces. The eclipse was also on his natal north node square the Chiron/Sun- north node I have read is linked to the collective.

This article says a little about his history.

The rest of the chart speaks volumes about the actions that he took (Mars in Scorpio conjunct Pluto), and maybe Moon in Scorpio which is uncertain with no birth time.

The Chiron article mentions about scapegoating others when we do not or are unable to face our own internal wounding. It also mentions about how, if the wounding is not faced, the wounded becomes the wounder, projecting all their internal rage/frustration/despair outwards. I feel it is harder to honestly face this kind of pain when younger, but as one ages, wisdom can help in the patience needed to accept the wound (whether its delusionment at life and hopes, rage at unfulfilled needs of childhood, lack of self worth).

Quote:
If Chiron works against and overwhelms the Sun, the result can be depression, loss of confidence, and a sense of permanent damage or wounding... One expects failure, and because one expects it, one may very likely find it. A sense of being victimised or scapegoated can be very intense; or one may project one's woundedness on others and victimise or scapegoat them. If we fail to acknowledge this inner sense of bitterness and wounding, we may become arrogant and bask in our greater spiritual achievement, looking down on those whom we deem to be less evolved than ourselves. We may also become intolerant, and even cruel, toward those who inadvertently remind us that we are hurting. And so the wound festers in the darkness.
Just a few ideas about Chiron and how it can manifest.

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Last edited by Neptune Rising; 03-29-2015 at 12:46 AM.
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  #2  
Unread 03-28-2015, 10:59 PM
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

I also noted the grand cross in the chart activated by the eclipse -- I commented on this in post 24 in

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=83085

There is also a possible YOD to Chiron but, there is not an accurate birth time so, not possible to determine whether a YOD. At least one portion of this configuration would have been activated and that would have been Venus because of the square from Mars and the eclipse would have activated the Chiron placement ...

As to the Mars conjunct Pluto, there doesn't seem to be anything at the time of the event that is activating that particular configuration except for the Uranus which is at inconjunct aspect to the Mars and while significant, I'm not seeing a trigger aspect (another aspect to fire it off) from my brief glances at the chart. While, the grand cross has the eclipse and a Mars trine to the stellium.

One point that I also think is important -- at the 10:30am time when the descent started, the ascendant was at about 25-26 Gemini which would be moving right over Chiron. To my eyes, this is very significant as my research files suggest that this can be a "timing of the event".

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Unread 03-28-2015, 11:21 PM
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

Hi Marinka

Thank you for the link to your thread, I will have a read.
Ah yes, that is intersting about the timing of the actual event and how the ascendant is on his Chiron. It really set it off! The Uranus could add the instability and the way he suddenly took the opportunity as the pilot was going to the bathroom, to take control of the plane while locking the pilot out of the cockpit. Also how all the Gemini/Sagitarius energies have manifested themselves in his foreign flight.

This reminded me of Vincent Van Gogh, who shot himself in 1890, July. His chart also has a Sun hard aspect Chiron (Sun in Aries square Chiron in Capricorn). His Chiron configuration was triggered by two eclipses. There was a lunar eclipse opposite his natal Chiron in January of 1890, then 6 months later, the lunar eclipse on 2nd July 1890 conjuncted his natal Chiron (with the solar eclipse leading up to the lunar aspecting his Venus/Scheat conjunction in Pisces) with Van Gogh passing on 29th July 1890. His chart.

This is not intended to demonstrate that Chiron is always linked to suicide, but more to emphasise how the energy of Chiron can manifest, transformed and/or untransformed.
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Last edited by Neptune Rising; 03-28-2015 at 11:34 PM. Reason: sticky keyboard keys
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Unread 03-28-2015, 11:28 PM
Krewster Krewster is offline
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

Mars is mentioned (a transisting 150 from T-Uran).

So it is interesting to see his natal Mars is natally somewhat challenged by the septile-biseptile-triseptile triangle in which it participates with Jup and Nept (22 min averaged orbed); unusual to have that tight a septile-based triangle and I'm at least familiar with Mars - Nept being skewed/tangential in approach.

...though I first tuned into Sun/Uran 45 Pluto.
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Unread 03-28-2015, 11:42 PM
Neptune Rising Neptune Rising is offline
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

Interesting, Krewster, about the Mars/Uranus. I wonder if the angle of the ascendant made that into a yod during the process, as the Gemini angle reached 15 Gemini.

Also yes, Markina, I see possible natal yod now, though uncertain with no birth time. If that was the case, with Venus/Moon as well as the other personal planets, this guy was deeply hurt. He had had a breakdown in the past, unsure when.
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Unread 03-28-2015, 11:49 PM
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

I also noted in my post in the other thread, his Chiron configuration was set off by the eclipse at 29 degrees Pisces prior to this. I've done some research (not as much as I would like) on the later degrees (27,28,29) of a sign and find that events stemming from activation of planets at these degrees are predominantly NOT in the control of the person. Rather, they appear to be puppets being controlled by someone or something else.

Some of this no control might be from the way the media is handling this -- maybe it's just me, but this is looking more and more like a witch hunt. They are reporting gossip/hearsay as truth, yet this information has not been vetted by investigators. The prosecutor who is likely either up for re-election or looking to hold a higher office is putting data before the public and drawing conclusions on it (spinning the truth) that has not been fully investigated by the experts.

For example, much has been made that the plane made a streamlined straight descent and it has been shown that way on graphs -- but, hearing experts on this, the descent was more erratic then it has been made to appear as if the plane is not under control. Another point is that when a pilot enters the code to enter the cockpit, an alarm is supposed to sound in the cockpit to alert that the code has been entered and the door will be opened shortly ... well very much has been made that the only sounds in the cockpit are the captain banging on the door and the normal breathing of the co-pilot. They should be hearing the alarm sounding in the cockpit from someone entering the manual code -- but they don't mention that. Could the captain have forgotten the code and therefore, did not enter it correctly. There are other discrepancies but, they are only there if someone looks beyond the theories.

As an astrologer, I had to teach myself never to rush to judgement when looking at charts (or on the people they represent). This also proves invaluable in daily life when listening to theories being made to look as facts.


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Last edited by Marinka; 03-28-2015 at 11:50 PM. Reason: typo
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Unread 03-29-2015, 12:04 AM
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

Yes good point. So many agendas in the media, I find it incredible as to how much blatant corruption is in the media and many of those who hold high corporate positions. Could the later degrees be channeling the energy of the collective perhaps? Uranus in a later degree in that sense could be quite an energy to handle, along with the other planets and north node/Chiron. Maybe a collective wound of rage, or however Chiron manifests in unconscious collective energies. Jung wrote alot about the collective, maybe he was channeling through his own Sun/Chiron hard aspect.

I don't know much about the fixed star Scheat, especially in connection with natal north node, maybe it is significant and worth investigating.

The co-pilot, Andreas, is also being villified in the press, being called a murderer and having alot of collective rage directed at him. I can understand the anger this can provoke. From personal experience, when my mum's doctor misdiagnosed her first stroke, I had a rage (to put it mildly) towards him. But, behind that rage, was my dismay at the unfairness and plain ugliness of life/God/nature. Of course, I don't see all of life as unfair and ugly, there is light and dark. The Chiron article talks about this more indepth.
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Unread 03-29-2015, 02:36 PM
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

............................

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Unread 03-29-2015, 02:58 PM
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Inline View Post
Yes, i'd thought of that too....had the head pilot forgotten the code?

And the argument that the co-pilot deliberately locked the head pilot out of the cockpit....doesn't convince me either.

What would you have done if you were alone at the helm - wouldn't you lock the door too, to ensure that no one got in while you were flying the plane? And wouldn't you suppose that the other pilot would know how to get in?
Curious co-incidences
~ pilot conveniently leaves cockpit ~
just as
plane goes into immediate nose-dive

co-pilot meanwhile "is breathing normally"
and yet completely silent

no-one knows for certain exactly why the pilot left the cock-pit

pilot did not shout co-pilot's name
perhaps pilot already aware co-pilot could not/would not respond
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Unread 03-24-2017, 05:09 PM
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Re: Natal Chiron opposite Sun stellium - Andreas Lubitz Germanwings Pilot

Quote:
Originally Posted by Neptune Rising View Post

.........His words, "I will do something that will change the whole system" is so reflective of Sun/Mercury/Saturn/Uranus in Sagitarius......But opposite to a natal Chiron... maybe he felt wounded by the 'system'....

In looking later at his chart, Andreas Lubitz has a Sun/Saturn/Mercury/Uranus stellium at 23-26 degree Sagittarius, and right opposite is the Chiron.
It's interesting that today, Lubitz's father has given an interview claiming his personal doubt that his son deliberately crashed the Germanwings plane.

Today Pisces Chiron squares Sag Saturn, and Sag Saturn is conjuncting Andreas Lubitz's Sag stellium....exactly.

Link:
https://www.thelocal.de/20170324/co-...-father-claims
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