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  #1  
Unread 03-20-2015, 03:44 PM
Neptune Rising Neptune Rising is offline
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Which house rules refunds?

Hi, I'm stuck which house this rules. I am not sure if its the 8th house of other people's money, or if I'm asking about a refund from an education institution, it would be the 10th house (their 2nd)?

Thanks

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  #2  
Unread 03-20-2015, 04:54 PM
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Red face Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Originally Posted by Neptune Rising View Post
Hi, I'm stuck which house this rules. I am not sure if its the 8th house of other people's money, or if I'm asking about a refund from an education institution, it would be the 10th house (their 2nd)?

Thanks
Dear what about is your question? refunds from what-from whom
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Unread 03-20-2015, 05:03 PM
Neptune Rising Neptune Rising is offline
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Hi Sunrise
Its about a refund I want to get from a college course that I paid for. I have already made a complaint about the standard of teaching for the course.
I'm unsure whether to use the usual 7th house for opponent, as in claiming a refund, they are my opponent. In that case, 8th house for the money.
Or to use the 2nd from 9th being the money from the course?
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Unread 03-20-2015, 06:34 PM
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Red face Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Originally Posted by Neptune Rising View Post
Hi Sunrise
Its about a refund I want to get from a college course that I paid for. I have already made a complaint about the standard of teaching for the course.
I'm unsure whether to use the usual 7th house for opponent, as in claiming a refund, they are my opponent. In that case, 8th house for the money.
Or to use the 2nd from 9th being the money from the course?
I thank you for your details
Dear Neptun reading what you wrote and helped me a lot, I think it relates 7th = obvious enemies- you ask for your money from it, I think you should get the 7th = opponents and 8th. Clearly you look your-pocket your money = 2nd FOUND
please wait other opinion
if you want put the chart .... it will be more easy
hope the best
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Unread 03-20-2015, 08:16 PM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

10th house .. 2nd from 9th
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Unread 03-20-2015, 11:05 PM
Neptune Rising Neptune Rising is offline
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Thank you both for answers! Once I send the email to them, I'l create a chart and post it here. And I will post updates as to what happens, if anything happens. I'm in two minds whether to ask for a refund with the comments I'm giving them, but, I'm one of many students who have felt dissapointed with the teaching on the course for the cost of the course.
Thanks again
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  #7  
Unread 03-21-2015, 08:10 AM
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Red face Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Originally Posted by Neptune Rising View Post
Thank you both for answers! Once I send the email to them, I'l create a chart and post it here. And I will post updates as to what happens, if anything happens. I'm in two minds whether to ask for a refund with the comments I'm giving them, but, I'm one of many students who have felt dissapointed with the teaching on the course for the cost of the course.
Thanks again
Neptune did you finished the course or you left it and then you asked for your money?
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  #8  
Unread 03-21-2015, 02:56 PM
Neptune Rising Neptune Rising is offline
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Quote:
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Neptune did you finished the course or you left it and then you asked for your money?
Hi Sunrise, I left it then asked for my money, well both happened at same time.
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  #9  
Unread 03-22-2015, 07:38 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Hi Sunrise, I left it then asked for my money, well both happened at same time.
Thank you Neptune
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  #10  
Unread 03-22-2015, 07:58 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Originally Posted by Neptune Rising View Post
Hi, I'm stuck which house this rules. I am not sure if its the 8th house of other people's money, or if I'm asking about a refund from an education institution, it would be the 10th house (their 2nd)?

Thanks
Hello:

ALL personal monies, including refunds, are normally ruled by the 2nd house of the querent. But, it could be an 8th house matter, as well, IF it was a credit card refund, as personal credit is ruled by the 8th house.

The 2nd house from the 9th house is not YOUR money, but rather, rules the college's finances.


-HM
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  #11  
Unread 03-22-2015, 07:50 PM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Excerpt from Frawley The Horary Textbook. If you have lent/paid (given money for goods) to someone it is now that person's money. If you ask will he/she (the institution) repay me for whatever reason it is that person/place of business' 2nd house that is of interest. Page 183 2nd paragraph; 2nd house from the 9th.
Look for an aspect from the ruler of that house and from either Lord 1 or Lord 2.Watch out for severe afflictions to the ruler of that person's money. Their significator also in their 2nd house is also testimony that it is staying in their pocket.
When will the refund come to me should be the question? Institutions of credible means usually give refunds within a stated time period agreement (usually stated as a contract) of curriculum-"change of mind" adjustments. I see a 9th house concern here.
Hope you have the refund in your pocket soon.
All the best
Vyri
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  #12  
Unread 03-22-2015, 11:23 PM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Originally Posted by Vyri View Post
Excerpt from Frawley The Horary Textbook. If you have lent/paid (given money for goods) to someone it is now that person's money. If you ask will he/she (the institution) repay me for whatever reason it is that person/place of business' 2nd house that is of interest. Page 183 2nd paragraph; 2nd house from the 9th.
Vyri
Hello Vyri,

For many of us on the AW site, we have grown increasingly skeptical of Frawley. Just go to the sports section on AW and ask them what they think of Frawley - the false prophet !

That said, I don't dislike Frawley. He may even be likeable. It's just that he tends to b.s. people ?

However, to answer your comment above, not always, Vyri !

I used to work in the credit card business, (fraud investigations) so I know what I speak about.

I don't have the time here to educate you folks about consumer law, since AW is read by readers in over 100 different countries around the world. But, in laymans terms, every country, and indeed, every merchant or business, has different rules on refunds, including educational institutions.

Therefore, caveat emptor - let the buyer beware ! However, caveat emptor does not apply to countries with the Napoleonic code of justice (like in Africa?) or worse, the law of Hamurabi, 'an eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth' or, '***** unto others' ?

If we had a uniform, ISO type refund standard in place around the world, then perhaps Frawley's statement could apply.

However, we don't. What is allowed in England is completely not allowable in other European countries or even in North America.

For those educational institutes that say NO REFUNDS allowed, perhaps Frawley's rules could apply, but they don't apply everywhere.

However, I noticed that Frawley is a Sun in Gemini character with a few major planets in Taurus, so maybe HE is a "hard-*ss" when it comes to his OWN refunds for his OWN astrology courses ?

Meanwhile, Frawley seems to bend the rules of horary astrology to suite his OWN political or business agenda, so that is really nice of him ? (NOT !)

We already know that Frawley has changed his mind, TWICE, on the rules of horary astrology regarding the chart's radicalness, or fitness to be judged.

First, he claimed in his book that the normal strictures applied to sports event charts. Then, a few years later, he proclaimed that "ANY sports event chart could be read, even with strictures against judgement in place."

Well, that's quite the backwards flip !

The reason that Frawley claimed that any horary chart can be judged is, in my mind, to milk more money from people and from his sports bets, pure and simple !

And now, based on a post in the AW sports section a few months back, Frawley has since back-flipped a second time, and now, he gamely admits that some rules of stricture need to apply.

He even goes on to say that people ask too many sports horary questions, generally, of an inconsequential nature. Therefore, not all sports charts can be delineated.

Well, it clear to me that Frawley suffers from Gemini-itis. namely the incessant changing of one's own mind ?

One of my mentors, the late astrologer Llewellyn George, said nearly the very same thing about horary querents in his book, A to Z, Horoscope Maker and Delineator, more than 40 years ago !

Mr. George stated: (quote, page 738, Edition October 1977, A to Z) " All horary questions must stem from a personal equation. Unless a personal stake is involved, it would be unreasonable to expect the individual's passing curiousity to reflect the fortunes of two opponents or teams. A horary figure, to be valid, must be based on the significant moment of a crisis in experience. "

George goes on to say that exhibition games and contests are typically out of bounds and cannot be read.

But, here is the problem, folks. If you are going to peddle your book to the masses and media, as Frawley has done, don't "b.s." the public and call it THE BIBLE of HORARY, when it is merely a rehash of what William Lilly once said or even what Mr. George said !

Be honest with the public, folks...Integrity is generally lacking in today's astrology world and we need to teach the newcomers about a new ethical standard to astrology business.

Meanwhile, there is no uniformity with academic colleges, anymore, re: refunds. Some do and some don't.

However, if there IS the possibility of a refund, then obviously Frawley's comments would not apply at all.

At the time of the purchase, the consumer, (including our querent?) is supposed to understand in advance, the terms and conditions of the sale, but in MANY cases, consumers are lied to or not told the straight goods about refunds, a violation of local laws.

The main problem for consumers is that there is no standardization of refund rules and thus, there is huge confusion.

However, banks and big business want you to be confused, so you are easier to 'f' over and more easily robbed of your money ?

A student always has a prescribed period of time in which to ask for a refund for a course, whether paying with cash or any other instrument (unless there are no refunds).

After a period of time has passed, a pro-rated refund amount would then apply.

This is why the QUERENT'S 8th house would make sense for refunds, if the school's policy allowed for refunds.

So, did the querent pay for her course with a credit card, or with cash.

If PAID with her personal credit card, then the ruler of the 8th house ( would be compared with the ruler of the 1st house and judged accordingly.

If paid with cash, then it's a much more slippery slope and you have less rights as a consumer, pure and simple.

When you pay cash for something, kiss your cash goodbye, because you ain't gonna see it again !

Your chances of being f'ed over by the college are much greater when you pay cash.

THis is why many colleges are refusing credit cards as an instrument for purchases.

It's still about YOU, though, so the querent's 8th house of borrowed money still applies.

The 2nd house from the 9th house is THEIR CASH, THEIR LOOT, and has nothing to do with YOUR LOOT !

Your loot is the horary 2nd house, or THE HORARY 8th house, as in other people who keep your loot, in trust or escrow or keep it for taxes purposes, or draw interest on it, by renting your LOOT to others (8th house).


have a great day,



HM

Last edited by horarymaster; 03-22-2015 at 11:59 PM.
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  #13  
Unread 03-23-2015, 12:46 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Didn't see a chart Horary Master so I asked a question of my own about the situation, even tho I have no personal contact with the individual it would be interesting to evaluate a chart on the basis of yes or no by another. Am only a novice and thank you for your reply. It is done unto you as you believe.
Thanks for the regards
Vyri
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  #14  
Unread 03-23-2015, 02:52 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Good point, Vyri !

So, Neptune rising, can you post a chart please ?

later,

HM
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Unread 03-23-2015, 11:59 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

I never bought Frawley's book because I thought it had to be a scam. Anyone that publishes a book that rehashes William Lilly and wants $75 for it can forget about me buying it.

As for which house the refund is, I'd say the 8th because it represents support from other people, and other people's money. It's their money right now because they've got posession of it. Either your 8th or your 2nd are legitimate. I'd look at the 8th first. You can probably read the chart using either one and still come out with the same answer. In fact, you could use their 2nd, which is your 11th (your hopes and wishes), and you should still get the same answer.
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  #16  
Unread 03-25-2015, 12:27 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

it cannot be 8th house because it is a school. NR is not 1/7 with them.
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  #17  
Unread 03-25-2015, 01:28 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Hi all
Thanks so much for replying!
It would be a debit, not credit, card refund, at least that is what I think. They may even give me a cheque.
So many rip-offs out there, even educational institutions. Although, in UK, we have a Sales of Goods Act which deems that if something paid for isn't fit for purpose, you are by law entitled to a refund. However, getting it out of the seller is another matter.
But we have independant bodies that can be contacted if the initial complaint and request for refund is refused.
I will post the chart that I asked after I emailed them:
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Unread 03-25-2015, 01:35 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

There is nothing in their 2nd or first house, and their first house is ruled by a malefic. Jupiter rules their 2nd and my first house, Venus rules my 2nd house.

Moon has just passed the south node, but Moon is intercepted, so is Sun. Sun deposits Jupiter, Sun in exhaltation. Not sure what Sun represents, 6th house. As Jupiter is in the 6th, I don't know if that is me seeking advice.

Moon trines Jupiter, then conjuncts Mars (8th ruler) then it has to change signs before it conjuncts Venus. Moon is also waxing. Venus approaches Jupiter by square, Jupiter is in Venus terms. But, Venus is in my 2nd house cusp.

Its not a definate yes.
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Unread 03-25-2015, 02:04 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vyri View Post
Didn't see a chart Horary Master so I asked a question of my own about the situation, even tho I have no personal contact with the individual it would be interesting to evaluate a chart on the basis of yes or no by another. Am only a novice and thank you for your reply. It is done unto you as you believe.
Thanks for the regards
Vyri
Thanks for creating a chart, I am never sure how you read charts asking about 'others'. Would you assign me to the 7th house (other) and the college to the turned 9th?
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  #20  
Unread 03-25-2015, 11:04 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Originally Posted by Neptune Rising View Post
Hi, I'm stuck which house this rules. I am not sure if its the 8th house of other people's money, or if I'm asking about a refund from an education institution, it would be the 10th house (their 2nd)?
Thanks
Dear here are my thought and my opinion.
I will get the 7th (open enemies-eye to eye-otherrs money) and 8th their money.
Your pocket = 2th h = Venus.
The positive is that Mars (their money) is in on your own first. But this can show that it is something that is burn you... also the same for your significator in your 6th H =anxiety
Now iam looking at the reception. Mercury here quite bad in the 12th house tells us that their moves are not so clean toward you. Here Mercury "loves" jupiter and also Venus=your money (mercury in exalt of venus). This shows us that it will not easily give back your money.
Also I do not like the matual reception between Venus (money and your pocket) and Mars (their own money) share mutual reception through Detriment = it does not show promising things. Also i do not see aspect between them. Rather difficult getting it - if ultimately get.
the Acs in picses and mercury also there shows not clear thinks. maybe you get a little back and not all ????
However, the Moon shows that you will hear soon from them ... hope the news will be good

Last edited by Sunrise; 03-25-2015 at 11:08 AM.
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  #21  
Unread 03-25-2015, 07:12 PM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

I don't think you're getting the refund. They might agree to give you the refund, but you won't actually get your money back. You're Jupiter. They're Jupiter also (higher educational authority figures, house 10 and 9). Their Sun (their communications and actions, their 9th and 10th), is in trine with you, and your are receiving it as ruler. This means that their communications and actions will be favorable for you. They are also Mercury (your enemies) and the sun is Mercury's 12th (your enemy's loss). Your money is Venus. It's in square to you--you're blocked from getting it. The Moon is badly afflicted in your ascendant: your escapism caused trouble for you. You are unfortunate.
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Unread 03-25-2015, 07:19 PM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

where is the actual horary vs email event?
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  #23  
Unread 03-25-2015, 08:24 PM
Neptune Rising Neptune Rising is offline
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where is the actual horary vs email event?
Tik, you got it right, this is the event for sending email. I posted a horary a little while ago. When I'm back home in a few hours, I'll link it here. It's in the money section, I think.
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Unread 03-26-2015, 04:49 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

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Originally Posted by Neptune Rising View Post
Tik, you got it right, this is the event for sending email. I posted a horary a little while ago. When I'm back home in a few hours, I'll link it here. It's in the money section, I think.
Neptun to finally understand the chart is one that shows the time that you sent the email to them (an event chart) asking for your money and not horary chart ??
if so the answers are invalid
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  #25  
Unread 03-26-2015, 05:45 AM
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Re: Which house rules refunds?

Hi Neptune Rising,

The college's refunds policy will state the refund end date which has passed, I assume. If you are simply dissatisfied the law does not support you. However, if the college failed to provide the service you paid for you can hold them in breach of contract which overrides their refunds policy because it is your statutory right. I assume they will reject your complaint, which is to be expected when money is involved. You are best advised to identify what was necessary but was not provided, pair it with legislation (Supply of Goods and Services Act, 1982, As amended).Hold them liable for breach of contract, since you are entitled to have the work done with reasonable care and skill. Describe each point showing what was agreed and how the target was not met. Give them an end date: 14 days to return the sum or provide you with a "Completion of Procedures" letter. Mail your document recorded. The "Completion of Procedures" letter is necessary to take your case to the Office of the Independent Adjudicator for Higher Education, who can deal with the matter out of court. I hope you have some proof against their word. Good luck with!
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