analyzing dispositors

IleneK

Premium Member
How about this: Perhaps you also put up your natal, since many of us can follow your dispositors visually in the chart and may find it much easier than the diagram that you posted.

And then get the ball rolling:
indicate where you want to start, or what might be on your mind?
Let's do this as a team...
 
How about this: Perhaps you also put up your natal, since many of us can follow your dispositors visually in the chart and may find it much easier than the diagram that you posted.

And then get the ball rolling:
indicate where you want to start, or what might be on your mind?
Let's do this as a team...

I'm sorry, I hope to be more cooperative now.
So I was reading about dispositor trees but didn't find any other website which creates one, other than the diagram that I posted.

I was reading about how thru a dispositor tree, the energy flow behind a chart, the dynamic how the planets interact with each other, which planet is dominating and thereby seeing what kind of transits will affect the life of the chart owner more or less.

Personally, I notice in my life how my healing process, my wish to progress in my authentic self-development, meets many obstacles in the areas of finances, education, work environment and relationships...
even in therapy, I haven't found one yet who's supportive but rather discouraging by emphasizing more on my weak spots instead of strengths. but now I have requested on specifically trauma specialist and feel optimistic that I will find a more suitable one.
I also notice how my struggle with emotional blockages, trapped energy from trauma, is holding me back from fully expressing myself in daily life.
People always tell me I have a lot of potential to achieve more, but these
emotional inhibitions/feeling overwhelmed easily, is always in the way of any kind of success.

I remember around 2016 I had moments of spiritual awakening and I felt lighter and things seemed to move on in a synchronized way. but then I experienced a breakup which threw me off track and reopened wounds again.

Maybe the energy dynamic of my planets could give me some insight on where exactly the energy is blocked and where to focus more, so the energy can flow easier and when I can start thriving in life.

I appreciate anyone who can give me more insight.
astro_2at_progressincompassion_he.66145.219176.png
 
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JUPITERASC

Well-known member
*


tracking dispositors of each planet leads to Leo sun
which has ANGULAR STRENGTH
due to being conjunct ascendant
as well as DOMICILE DIGNITY as sun rules Leo :smile:


also interesting is your time of birth
because
sun two degrees above ascendant
so birth occured literally eight minutes after sunrise
and
Traditionally, one differentiates between a day chart
which has sun above horizon
and
a night chart which has sun below horizon
literally
if birth in fact occured earlier than stated
then
chart would have been a night chart

could someone help me analyze and interpret my dispositors and how it influences my whole chart.

thankful for any help!


https://www.astro.com/tmpd/cpy0file...b2sig_progressincompassion_hp.64615.58528.png


I'm sorry, I hope to be more cooperative now.
So I was reading about dispositor trees but didn't find any other website which creates one, other than the diagram that I posted.

I was reading about how thru a dispositor tree, the energy flow behind a chart, the dynamic how the planets interact with each other, which planet is dominating and thereby seeing what kind of transits will affect the life of the chart owner more or less.

Personally, I notice in my life how my healing process, my wish to progress in my authentic self-development, meets many obstacles in the areas of finances, education, work environment and relationships...
even in therapy, I haven't found one yet who's supportive but rather discouraging by emphasizing more on my weak spots instead of strengths. but now I have requested on specifically trauma specialist and feel optimistic that I will find a more suitable one.
I also notice how my struggle with emotional blockages, trapped energy from trauma, is holding me back from fully expressing myself in daily life.
People always tell me I have a lot of potential to achieve more, but these
emotional inhibitions/feeling overwhelmed easily, is always in the way of any kind of success.

I remember around 2016 I had moments of spiritual awakening and I felt lighter and things seemed to move on in a synchronized way. but then I experienced a breakup which threw me off track and reopened wounds again.

Maybe the energy dynamic of my planets could give me some insight on where exactly the energy is blocked and where to focus more, so the energy can flow easier and when I can start thriving in life.

I appreciate anyone who can give me more insight.
 
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*


tracking dispositors of each planet leads to Leo sun
which has ANGULAR STRENGTH
due to being conjunct ascendant
as well as DOMICILE DIGNITY as sun rules Leo :smile:


also interesting is your time of birth
because
sun two degrees above ascendant
so birth occured literally eight minutes after sunrise
and
Traditionally, one differentiates between a day chart
which has sun above horizon
and
a night chart which has sun below horizon
literally
if birth in fact occured earlier than stated
then
chart would have been a night chart

,,,,,,,,,,,

when I do honest self-reflection, I feel like there's a lot which blocks my sun/my personality to shine in a leo manner. maybe it has to do with my sun being in the 12th house which is ruled by moon. (cancer in 12th house)
I do feel more like a cancer inside. and the fact that I lack some leo qualities because of my sensitivity/shyness can be frustrating at times.
I also have the natal aspect: sun opposite moon, sun opposite uranus, sun trine saturn, sun trine pluto
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
when I do honest self-reflection, I feel like there's a lot which blocks my sun/my personality to shine in a leo manner.
maybe it has to do with my sun being in the 12th house which is ruled by moon. (cancer in 12th house)
I do feel more like a cancer inside. and the fact that I lack some leo qualities because of my sensitivity/shyness can be frustrating at times.
I also have the natal aspect: sun opposite moon, sun opposite uranus, sun trine saturn, sun trine pluto
there is much mess and confusion in the area of the so-called "...houses..."
There are at least twenty or thirty different house systems
or means of dividing the so-called "...birthchart..."
into twelve segments of life activity.
In astrology, houses, mansions, or domains
represent general areas of life activity
and are the grounding areas or arenas of expression for planets.
Originally, the words "...houses..." and "...signs..." were interchangeable.
A planet in the SIGN of Aries was also a planet in the HOUSE of Aries
so that in effect
there were no real houses as we know them today

DEPENDENT ON THE HOUSE SYSTEM CHOSEN
house location of a planet may changefor example
Whole Sign House system
ascendant sign becomes the whole first house
and the other houses follow.
ASCENDANT POINT ITSELF can then fall anywhere in the first house
and
MIDHEAVEN POINT anywhere in the upper half of the chart.


Placidus is simply the default :smile:





ASTROSEEK offers WHOLE SIGN HOUSES calculation at
https://horoscopes.astro-seek.com/traditional-astrology


The Whole Sign House system was used by the ancient Greeks
and the Hindus who still use it today.
It is the oldest and simplest house system in existence
and immediately eliminates the awful mess astrologers have made on the issue over the last 1300 years or so
Artificial divisions now known as houses
were attempts by early Greeks and Hindus to measure strength "...points..." in the horoscope
which during 7th and 8th centuries AD were construed

or confused
as means of dividing the birth chart.
The ascendant and midheaven degrees and their opposites, for example,
were definite power points or areas of intense focus
but not necessarily the beginnings of a house or quadrant


.

 

sinhtheslumberingdragon

Well-known member
there is much mess and confusion in the area of the so-called "...houses..."
There are at least twenty or thirty different house systems
or means of dividing the so-called "...birthchart..."
into twelve segments of life activity.
In astrology, houses, mansions, or domains
represent general areas of life activity
and are the grounding areas or arenas of expression for planets.
Originally, the words "...houses..." and "...signs..." were interchangeable.
A planet in the SIGN of Aries was also a planet in the HOUSE of Aries
so that in effect
there were no real houses as we know them today

DEPENDENT ON THE HOUSE SYSTEM CHOSEN
house location of a planet may changefor example
Whole Sign House system
ascendant sign becomes the whole first house
and the other houses follow.
ASCENDANT POINT ITSELF can then fall anywhere in the first house
and
MIDHEAVEN POINT anywhere in the upper half of the chart.


Placidus is simply the default :smile:





ASTROSEEK offers WHOLE SIGN HOUSES calculation at
https://horoscopes.astro-seek.com/traditional-astrology


The Whole Sign House system was used by the ancient Greeks
and the Hindus who still use it today.
It is the oldest and simplest house system in existence
and immediately eliminates the awful mess astrologers have made on the issue over the last 1300 years or so
Artificial divisions now known as houses
were attempts by early Greeks and Hindus to measure strength "...points..." in the horoscope
which during 7th and 8th centuries AD were construed

or confused
as means of dividing the birth chart.
The ascendant and midheaven degrees and their opposites, for example,
were definite power points or areas of intense focus
but not necessarily the beginnings of a house or quadrant


.



JUPITERASC,


Traditionally the 9th house is seen as a cadent house. If the midhaven should fall in the whole sign 9th house, would that house "gain strength" because the midhaven is there, rather than the 10th house?
 

waybread

Well-known member
Your sun is very strong in the sign of its domicile. If you use modern planets, Uranus in Aquarius is also domiciled.

Some of your planets' rulers lead to the sun, but not all of them. Saturn in Aries>>Mars in Cancer>>moon in Aquarius>>Uranus in Aquarius. But if you use Saturn as the traditional ruler of Aquarius, you end up back in a 3-way loop. This would also involve Jupiter ruled by Saturn, putting you back in the loop.

A Leo sun in the 12th house probably will not be as "out there" as the sun in another house, because the 12th rules things that are hidden from view. You may be a very private person who prefers to work behind the scenes, rather than being "on stage" in front of admirers.

Uranus opposite your sun can make it hard to develop a firm sense of self because Uranus rules sudden change. Just when you think you know who you really are, Uranus says, "No! Not that!" Your moon conjunct Uranus and Neptune can make your emotions feel very volatile and stressed.

However, you appear to have a "kite" formation in your horoscope, pointing to your moon-Uranus. So working on your emotional health (6th house) seems like a good opportunity for you to grow and expand.

I've been in counseling myself a few times, and my experience was that it is hard to find a therapist who is helpful, but if you find one, you can make real progress. So I hope you don't give up on therapy because you have a lot to handle.

Your north node (of personal growth) conjuncts Chiron. Chiron shows us "where it hurts," but also where, by staying open to Chiron's wounds, we can gain in wisdom and compassion. This looks like a real growth trajectory for you.

Best wishes for your journey, W.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
JUPITERASC,
Traditionally the 9th house is seen as a cadent house.

If the midheaven should fall in the whole sign 9th house, would that house "...gain strength..."
because the midheaven is there, rather than the 10th house?
not necessarily - condition of planetary ruler of 9th important factor :smile:
keep in mind PLANETARY JOYS as an example



joys-large.jpg





580d722395be69bc6389361f560569ce342f167c_hq.jpg
 

sinhtheslumberingdragon

Well-known member
not necessarily - condition of planetary ruler of 9th important factor :smile:
keep in mind PLANETARY JOYS as an example



joys-large.jpg





580d722395be69bc6389361f560569ce342f167c_hq.jpg


Well,



If the MC/IC and AC/DC axis are power points, then they should be powerpoints for the planets even if the house is traditionally cadent



This problem does go away when using non-WSH, however.


Are planetary joys important? I always thought of them as being a relatively minor form of accidental strength
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Well,
If the MC/IC and AC/DC axis are power points, then
they should be powerpoints for the planets
even if the house is traditionally cadent
This problem does go away when using non-WSH, however.
There's no problem - keep in mind that
irrespective of location of MC
10th remains ANGULAR HOUSE :smile:

significations of 10th house are unchanged even if MC not located there

Are planetary joys important?
I always thought of them as being a relatively minor form of accidental strength
focus on the TOTALITY of testimonies of the natal


.
 

sinhtheslumberingdragon

Well-known member
There's no problem - keep in mind that
irrespective of location of MC
10th remains ANGULAR HOUSE :smile:

significations of 10th house are unchanged even if MC not located there


focus on the TOTALITY of testimonies of the natal


.


Indeed. I was not arguing for a changing of the meaning of the houses, but rather that there is just some extra "strength" to the planets by virtue of the axis being there :smile:





How do you feel about some charts having extremely well dignified planets (like Jeffery Dahmer, notorious serial killer) yet the natives being horrendous people? Vs people with heavily "detriment" charts being honorable people (such as Ted Turner)
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Indeed. I was not arguing for a changing of the meaning of the houses,
but rather
that there is just some extra "...strength..." to the planets
by virtue of the axis being there :smile:
every natal chart varies
the TOTALITY of the TESTIMONIES
of every natal chart require individual assessment
generalisation is fun
but unreliable

How do you feel about some charts having extremely well dignified planets
(like Jeffery Dahmer, notorious serial killer)
yet the natives being horrendous people?
Vs people with heavily "...detriment..." charts
being honorable people (such as Ted Turner)
another example :smile:
....To assess astrology accuracy
a member of Kansas City Committee for Skeptical Inquiry (KCCSI)

approached astrologers
posing as man interested in working with young people
and gave each astrologer the birth data of John Wayne Gacy
instead of his own

- plus a computerized natal chart
from a company internationally recognized for accuracy
(Neil F.Michelsen)
- and asked for their advice.

The astrologers unanimously

encouraged him to pursue youth work
and none saw any problem with this.
Gacy was selected because his chart
should portray a clear picture of a sadistic sexually motivated killer..."

Gacy known as the "...Killer Clown..."
due to his charitable services at fundraising events, parades
and children's parties where he would dress as "...Pogo the Clown..."
a character he devised himself...”


Quote:
Originally Posted by BobZemco

Four Modern Astrologers said Serial Killer John Wayne Gacy:

"…can be very good with kids..."

"...just your presence would be beneficial to other people..."

"...a fairly well-rounded personality...you can offer a good role model..."

"You have an instinctive awareness
and your uninhibited response to life
can refresh and gladden whomever you encounter."

HOWEVER

TRADITIONAL ASTROLOGY SAYS: "...shows a strange mind and very wicked."

Gacy received 12 Death and 21 Life sentences
for the murder of 33 boys


.
 

sinhtheslumberingdragon

Well-known member
every natal chart varies
the TOTALITY of the TESTIMONIES
of every natal chart require individual assessment
generalisation is fun
but unreliable


another example :smile:
....To assess astrology accuracy
a member of Kansas City Committee for Skeptical Inquiry (KCCSI)

approached astrologers
posing as man interested in working with young people
and gave each astrologer the birth data of John Wayne Gacy
instead of his own

- plus a computerized natal chart
from a company internationally recognized for accuracy
(Neil F.Michelsen)
- and asked for their advice.

The astrologers unanimously

encouraged him to pursue youth work
and none saw any problem with this.
Gacy was selected because his chart
should portray a clear picture of a sadistic sexually motivated killer..."

Gacy known as the "...Killer Clown..."
due to his charitable services at fundraising events, parades
and children's parties where he would dress as "...Pogo the Clown..."
a character he devised himself...”


Quote:
Originally Posted by BobZemco

Four Modern Astrologers said Serial Killer John Wayne Gacy:

"…can be very good with kids..."

"...just your presence would be beneficial to other people..."

"...a fairly well-rounded personality...you can offer a good role model..."

"You have an instinctive awareness
and your uninhibited response to life
can refresh and gladden whomever you encounter."

HOWEVER

TRADITIONAL ASTROLOGY SAYS: "...shows a strange mind and very wicked."

Gacy received 12 Death and 21 Life sentences
for the murder of 33 boys


.




JUPITERASC,


Do you have an article or link for Gacy experiment?
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
what does it mean that my "...almuten figuris..." is saturn?
Almuten Figuris is an old doctrine

where one planet according to certain calculations applied,

receives the honors to be the Ruler or Lord of the Chart :smile:


The word Almutes is an Arabian word which means '...Winner...'.
Because, the planet is the Winner of all the '...life giving...' places. Or the places which are most sensible and important in the natal figure.


The method which we'll use here I call Ezra/Zoller method.
Arabian Astrologer Ibn Ezra (1089 — 1164) was the first (as far as we at this moment are aware) to explicitely wrote about calculating the Almutem Figuris.

In his writings Zoller trace the beginnings of this Almutem Figuris and he found it in the writings of Iambichus (c. 245–c. 325) who was Syrian neo-platonic philosopher who wrote also about Astrology in his writings.
Iambicus in his work "Theurgy or on the mysteries of Egypt" speaks about the thing how one can change his fate. He speaks that he can do that through Theurgy and through personal relationship with the Lord of the Geniture of which he (Iambichus) only says that can be known through Astrology, but he didn't explained the method.
Zoller, tracing back the Ibn Ezra's ancestry, through the Sabaeans and his teachers (Mashallah and other) all the way to the first centuries where this doctrine was thought. Because of that line Zoller thinks that the Lord of the Geniture of which Iambichus speaks in his writings is in fact the Almutem Figuris of the Ibn Ezra.

Iambichus speaks (through the name of Porphyry) about the Peculiar Daimon, that is some kind of an Guardian Angel and it is conected to the personal soul but its not the same
Here's what Iambichus says in his Theurgy:
This [daimon] therefore is present as an exemplar before the souls descend into the realm of generated existence. As soon as the soul chooses him for leader the [daimon] immediately comes into charge of completing of its vital endowments and when it descends into the body it unites with the body and becomes the guardian of it common living principle. He likewise directs the the private life of the soul and
whatever the conclusions we may arrive at by inference and reasoning he himself imparts to us the principles."


Zoller about the Almutem Figuris says that it is equally as powerful as all the other planets taken together."

Benjamin Dykes (great student of Zoller) says about Almutem Figuris:
"Almutem Figuris, a powerful planet in the natal figure whose spirit or angel acts as the native's special link to the Divine. The Almutem Figuris is a spiritual astrological delineation, similar to but not the same as Lilly's the "Lord of the Geniture." But like Lilly (and Plato), the Almutem Figuris was taken to affect the native's thoughts, beliefs and character. Spiritual enlightenment can demand that we open our eyes to this particular planet and use it to access the Divine. Significantly, this is a function that many modern astrologers now attribute to the sun sign." (In his article on Happiness).

The method of calculation

1. Find the Essential Dignities (the 5 dignities, apply 3 points to all 3 triplicity rulers), in the Degree of the:
- Sun
- Moon
- Ascendant
- Part of Fortune
- Syzygy (the prenatal lunation, the one that came last, i.e. after which the birth follows - New or Full Moon).

2. Add 7 points for the Day ruler and 6 points to the Hour ruler.

3. Add accidental dignities scores.

For the planet in 1st house you add 12 points.
10th house = 11 points
7th house = 10
4th house = 9
11th = 8
5th = 7
2nd = 6
9th = 5
8th = 4
3rd = 3
12th = 2
6th = 1

The planet which has most points in the aforesaid places is the Almutem Figuris of the chart!

Don't forget to apply the 5 degrees ruler for the planet near the cusp of the houses. For example, if Saturn is at 15 Scorpio in 4th, but the 5th house cusp is at 19 Scorpio, you will calculate that Saturn already in the 5th, and you will give him 7 points instead of 9 as he would took if he was in 4th house. This can make big difference.

The free traditional astrology software - Morinus (google it), calcualte the Almutem Figuris. You can find this option by typing F3. But I should warn you that in that calculation is included some adding of points according to the planets phases. Zoller did not mention any kind of phases calculation so at this moment I'm not aware why the author of the software did included that.

But the best way and more enjoyable is to calculate it with your own hand. You will be familiar with the chart more deeply if you do this calculations with your own hand as the older astrologers did.
And if you must use the Morinus software than subtract the phases scores and you will get the Almutem Figuris right. All else is the same calculation as the Ezra/Zoller method.

Zoller gives short discriptions for every planet being Almutem Figuris:

Sun:
"If the Almuten figuris is the Sun, the native will want to lead, express his creative power and be recognized."

Moon:
"If the Moon, s/he will want to care for, be cared for, eat and make love, dream"

Mercury:
"If it is Mercury, s/he will be diligent in the sciences, business and communications"

Venus:
"Id it is Venus s/he will be a lover of beauty, of music, of men and women etc."

Mars:
"If it is Mars, s/he will fight in order to dominate"

Jupiter:
"If it is Jupiter, s/he will philosophize and teach"

Saturn:
"If it is Saturn he will retire from society, investigate hidden things and suffer adversity.""
 
Almuten Figuris is an old doctrine

where one planet according to certain calculations applied,

receives the honors to be the Ruler or Lord of the Chart :smile:


"If it is Saturn he will retire from society, investigate hidden things and suffer adversity.""

retiring from society and suffering adversity sounds bad... I do see a lot of saturn related themes in my life though, like obstacles coming in my way where I feel like I have to give my all to overcome them.
 
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