Will I have a relationship with him (tricky chart)

Hi all.

A friend asked me to cast a horary chart for the following question:
- Will I have a relationship with this guy?

Background: they work at the same company and met a few months ago. The guy is in a relationship but according to my friend seems to be open and "too friendly" towards her. She wants to know if they will ever have a relationship and, if so, if it will last.

She is Moon and Venus. He is Saturn and Sun.

Venus receives Sun (in LIbra) in the 5th, very appropriate for someone in love. However the best reception I can find from the guy is Saturn receiving Moon by term, which I find pretty weak.

There are no applying aspects between Sun, Venus, Saturn and Moon.

However that Jupiter in the 1st, very essentially and accidentally dignified, seems to strenghten my querent and give a lot of luck. Will this be enough for a positive outcome?

Also, the last aspect of the Moon will be a trine with Mars. What does this Mars signify? It is co-almuten of the 7th as has the same strength of Saturn. But I tend not to use Almutens, unless really need to, when a significator is already in use. Apart from that, Mars co-rules the 5th (sex) and rules the 11th (friends). How would you interpret this? Who is this Mars?

Last question: Would you take Jupiter as an extra significator of my querent, because it is in the 1st House? Frawley is adamant that a planet can only be a significator of a house when it is within 2 degrees of the cusp, otherwise it only changes it but doesn't rule it.

Sorry for so many questions!! Really trying to get a positive outcome from this question as my friend is sure he is the man of her life.

Thank you in advance

no applying aspects between Sun, Venus, mars and Moon.so i would say no

Thank you Giacinto for you answer. Good to have some support in my veredict.
Any more thoughts?

StarSeed said:

Hi all.

A friend asked me to cast a horary chart for the following question:
- Will I have a relationship with this guy?

Background: they work at the same company and met a few months ago. The guy is in a relationship but according to my friend seems to be open and "too friendly" towards her. She wants to know if they will ever have a relationship and, if so, if it will last.

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I'm going to make a quick statement about this. as horary astrologers we need to be appropriately guiding our querents into right questions. here's what this paragraph says to me: girl sees guy, guy is taken, girl jumps to "will we ever be together?" our querent is putting carts before horses, and we need to take better stands before we take on flippant charts. interestingly the chart is telling us the same thing, and I'll highlight that as we look further.

StarSeed said:

She is Moon and Venus. He is Saturn and Sun.

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do not use secondary significators in relationship charts. there is no need for extraneous details here -- either they get together or they don't, shown by the strength and placement of main significators. so we will look at only Saturn and Moon.

StarSeed said:

Venus receives Sun (in LIbra) in the 5th, very appropriate for someone in love. However the best reception I can find from the guy is Saturn receiving Moon by term, which I find pretty weak.

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it is a weak reception, so weak it's nonexistent without reception with another minor dignity (face or triplicity).

StarSeed said:

There are no applying aspects between Sun, Venus, Saturn and Moon.

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Moon is ill-placed -- only in dignity by face, in the unfortunate sixth. not a great start.

StarSeed said:

However that Jupiter in the 1st, very essentially and accidentally dignified, seems to strenghten my querent and give a lot of luck. Will this be enough for a positive outcome?

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no, more likely an additional descriptor to further inform the astrologer on what the querent looks like, what manner their disposition is, their uprightness, etc. interestingly Lilly shares that planets in their exaltation are exceedingly haughty, asking for more than they are due. so this Jupiter further highlights the strong presumption of relationship potential on the part of our querent. and please don't take this to be an insult on someone's character in any way -- we asked the universe for a map to solve of the situation, and so the universe shows the cold truth. if I could just tell you how many times I've been described by an exalted planet.. but I look at it and know immediately, "okay. I'm pushing it and am feeling too good about myself to realize it."

as an aside.. this likely suggests that your querent has some sixth and/or tenth house issues (given Jupiter's rulership over these houses), for good or ill. if this chart had been asking if she was sick, for instance, I would say resoundingly yes. and it may be anyway -- noticing emplacement between L1 and L6 rulers (Moon in 6th, Jupiter in 1st). something to think about.

StarSeed said:

Also, the last aspect of the Moon will be a trine with Mars. What does this Mars signify? It is co-almuten of the 7th as has the same strength of Saturn. But I tend not to use Almutens, unless really need to, when a significator is already in use. Apart from that, Mars co-rules the 5th (sex) and rules the 11th (friends). How would you interpret this? Who is this Mars?

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Mars has no dominion over the fifth. Scorpio is intercepted. Libra is on the cusp, so Venus has rulership over the affairs of this house. Aries does rule the 11th though, so if anything there may be a contact with a friend, or perhaps this is hinting that at best this would end in friendship, but I don't see a reason to get too sidetracked on this.

StarSeed said:

Last question: Would you take Jupiter as an extra significator of my querent, because it is in the 1st House? Frawley is adamant that a planet can only be a significator of a house when it is within 2 degrees of the cusp, otherwise it only changes it but doesn't rule it.

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my friend, you've tried to assign 3 planets to our querent -- Moon, Venus, now Jupiter. that's 3 of the 7 planets we use in horary. I don't know how you find clarity with that many players vying for the spotlight. stick to Moon and let Jupiter further describe the person, without being a significator for that person. (full disclaimer: this would be different in other kinds of charts. in missing item charts, a peregrine planet in the seventh or a malefic on an angle could describe the thief.)

StarSeed said:

Sorry for so many questions!! Really trying to get a positive outcome from this question as my friend is sure he is the man of her life.

Thank you in advance

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I'm glad you asked the questions. but there's just so little to write about in this chart because there's so little prompting the question. I'd humbly advise you as astrologer to be more selective about the questions you entertain, but also suggest that our querent divert their focus elsewhere.

wca,

Thank you so much for your help with this chart! I really appreciate you took the time to look at it in detail and answered to my questions.

I agree with your description about the querent - I think she is pushing a situation and fantasising about a relationship that seems very unlikely to develop into anything more than a friendship.

I indeed delivered a negative answer to her question. When she received my report, she said that she had consulted a number of mediums/psychics about the same issue and they all said the guy was the man of her life.
However horary astrology has proven to be very, very reliable in the past and I prefer to believe in what I read in my chart.

as an aside.. this likely suggests that your querent has some sixth and/or tenth house issues

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She is currently in the process of changing jobs, and I think this is weighing on her.

do not use secondary significators in relationship charts. there is no need for extraneous details here -- either they get together or they don't, shown by the strength and placement of main significators.

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Lilly seems to suggest we use secondary significators for marriage horary charts but I agree it makes the analysis much more confusing and I would gladly stop using them!!