Anti-conservative talk

C

Choe

Well-known member
MSO said:
You "ROFL" because you're ignorant. I'll let it slide. Just like your comment about how traditionalists use geocentric... so do moderners :lol:

We use a geocentric philosophy because that's the philosophy behind astrology. It's our viewpoint. It's the reason we have to know the exact place of birth, because the viewpoint from there determines so much.

What about the outers? Well obviously they must transcend! And transform! They're spiritual advancement! And all the other words new age people like to use to make them sound special.

Personally, I can't wait 'til this new age phase dies out. Only a few more decades, MSO... be patient. I swear, you nutjobs see the word "transcend" and you begin shouting from the rooftops.

If you want to use a heliocentric model, be my guest. Please inform me of your findings. If someone can find a system that works better than the current one, I'm all for it. Unfortunately, I don't see you doing that. So your argument is now invalid.

The funny thing is, for every moderner argument for an outer planet in natal astrology, one can be made against it in traditional. OHHH I HAVE URANUS IN MY 5TH HOUSE I LIKE WOMEN WHO ARE REBELS! -Has Sagittarius for the 5th House. :joyful:
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You all take this too personal. It's not my attack or genocide on YOU people or the systems you use, I'm still explorer and trying to understand why there are so many types of astrologies, because the truth is always simple.

No need for u to offend-(the ignorant part),I rofl-ed b/c you stated that without explaining and that's arrogant, and you said MY assumption was arrogant.
 
Rebel Uranian

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
MSO said:
Personally, I can't wait 'til this new age phase dies out. Only a few more decades, MSO... be patient. I swear, you nutjobs see the word "transcend" and you begin shouting from the rooftops.
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Amen bro.

"Transcend" - from Latin "transcendere" - to climb over. I've written a bunch of horror/suspense/mystery stuff in various media with titles along the lines of "The Transcension." Take that, new agers who don't get a capitalized name.

MSO said:
If you want to use a heliocentric model, be my guest. Please inform me of your findings. If someone can find a system that works better than the current one, I'm all for it. Unfortunately, I don't see you doing that. So your argument is now invalid.
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Astrology is cast from the position of the event (in this case, a birth.) If the event is on the surface of the Sun, then cast the horoscope from the position on the surface of the Sun. If the event is on a space shuttle, then cast the horoscope form the position of the space shuttle.

MSO said:
The funny thing is, for every moderner argument for an outer planet in natal astrology, one can be made against it in traditional. OHHH I HAVE URANUS IN MY 5TH HOUSE I LIKE WOMEN WHO ARE REBELS! -Has Sagittarius for the 5th House. :joyful:
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Imma quote you every time someone says I don't use outers. I find the trad planets to have more depth. The modern planets have meanings, I'm just not sure what.

P.S. SaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquarius
 
MSO

MSO

Well-known member
Choe said:
You all take this too personal. It's not my attack or genocide on YOU people or the systems you use, I'm still explorer and trying to understand why there are so many types of astrologies, because the truth is always simple.

No need for u to offend-(the ignorant part),I rofl-ed b/c you stated that without explaining and that's arrogant, and you said MY assumption was arrogant.
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You're full of paradoxes. You say the truth should be simple, yet adhere to an astrology that is more complex than anything else. You say you're an explorer yet you clearly have it in your mind that modern astrology is right and traditional needs to get out of your sight. That is the point of this thread, no?

Calling you ignorant is not offensive. You are, you don't know what you're talking about. Would you prefer I use a term you actually associate with meaning "uninformed?"

And I didn't feel the need to explain because it should be pretty much common knowledge. Unfortunately, and I do feel bad for you, you've been brain washed by people looking to make money off the new age garbage by putting out books about transcending spirituality. Tell you what, you prove to me that Neptune will help you reach heaven faster, and I'll become the most ardent modern astrologer you've ever seen.

Of course, traditional astrology is capable of being proven. Traditionalists make predictions in the 3rd dimension. We can test the results. You're going around telling everyone Uranus rules technology. Prove it.
 
S

sandstone

Banned
mso quote - and i am only isolating one of them

>>Did people have sex before Pluto was discovered? they did, they did! Everyone's life must have been exactly the same before Pluto, I mean, no one could have possibly transformed themselves!<<

the only thing different is astrologers found another way to explain it.. now there are more options... some like the extra options, some don't...kinda like will you have mayo with your blt? or whatever... as for the transforming part - it would have been given a different explanation too... the differences are in the astrologers approach, not the reality of what might of happened in the past... some astrologers want to make a connection to these activities thru using the more recently discovered planets... some still don't.. the choice is optional..

ps - those who seek proof of something from others, need to provide proof of what it is they think is the proof on their position too...
 
MSO

MSO

Well-known member
Rebel Uranian said:
Imma quote you every time someone says I don't use outers. I find the trad planets to have more depth. The modern planets have meanings, I'm just not sure what.

P.S. SaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquariusSaturnrulesAquarius
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Haha, you can ask 10 different moderners what Neptune represents and you'll get 10 different answers, some of which contradictory.

I too find the traditional planets to have more depth. The outers have a lustrous shine to them that elevates them, in the moderner's minds, to some kind of Kingly status. I find it all too irritating when people talk about the depth of Pluto, then turn around and define it's entire existence in a single paragraph.

RU, you're turning out alright. We just have to get you off that sidereal kick and you'll be A-OK in my books :joyful:
 
MSO

MSO

Well-known member
sandstone said:
mso quote - and i am only isolating one of them

>>Did people have sex before Pluto was discovered? they did, they did! Everyone's life must have been exactly the same before Pluto, I mean, no one could have possibly transformed themselves!<<

the only thing different is astrologers found another way to explain it.. now there are more options... some like the extra options, some don't...kinda like will you have mayo with your blt? or whatever... as for the transforming part - it would have been given a different explanation too... the differences are in the astrologers approach, not the reality of what might of happened in the past... some astrologers want to make a connection to these activities thru using the more recently discovered planets... some still don't.. the choice is optional..

ps - those who seek proof of something from others, need to provide proof of what it is they think is the proof on their position too...
Click to expand...

The funny thing is, people today look to the Kama Sutra for new sex positions. Pluto doing it's best.

Proof is all around you. Go ask a horary.
 
C

Choe

Well-known member
MSO said:
You're full of paradoxes. You say the truth should be simple, yet adhere to an astrology that is more complex than anything else. You say you're an explorer yet you clearly have it in your mind that modern astrology is right and traditional needs to get out of your sight. That is the point of this thread, no?

Of course, traditional astrology is capable of being proven. Traditionalists make predictions in the 3rd dimension. We can test the results. You're going around telling everyone Uranus rules technology. Prove it.
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And how do you prove that Mars rules technologies?

about the 1st paragraph,I didn't open this thread ,the mods made it by transferring off-topic posts.Second, when I said truth should be simple I meant: there shouldn't be so many contradicting and opposed views in it.
 
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Rebel Uranian

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
MSO said:
RU, you're turning out alright. We just have to get you off that sidereal kick and you'll be A-OK in my books :joyful:
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Well, Vedics and others use sidereal so there's nothing wrong with it. I don't care about your books. I have Neptune so I have movies. Did people have movies before Neptune? No...

Seriously, trad planets are way more interesting generally. That's only because I don't know what the modern planets do that the trad planets don't.

PLUTOOOOO! (Never mind the visuals.)
 
MSO

MSO

Well-known member
Rebel Uranian said:
Seriously, trad planets are way more interesting generally. That's only because I don't know what the modern planets do that the trad planets don't.
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This is why some moderners start saying they're elevated consciousness :lol:

Instead of finding out what they do, they just imagine them as super spiritual gods that do things you can't possibly understand.

They're truly majestic creatures.
 
Zonark

Zonark

Well-known member
Choe said:
This is the thing I loathe about traditionalists and conservatives:
They don't recognize Uranus(ruling the Internet and all the technologies) and Neptun(ruling films), Pluto(****,mafia,underground) but they live the modern ways.

The modern life are these planets. If you live like in medieval age- no watching TV, without electricity and so on, then I'll say you are NOT A HYPOCRITE and recognize you like a true traditionalist who practices what preaches.

One thing are people who use TA because it's classic and more practical technique for horary or so, another are people who deny the transcendental planets and promote conservative values when they live more or less a modern lifestyle.

RU, if you were Saturnian, you wouldn't be on the internet right now,because you wouldn't recognize it.Period.
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Hmm, Choe I am 'Saturnian' (my chart ruler is Saturn) and I am hardly ignorant of the internet. I think that you are mistaking rulership with dominion and what a planet can influence with what it cannot. Technology is a very broad thing. The simple act of using a rock to break something open is an extremely simplistic sort of technology. The act of using a tool, whether it be a physical, mental or spiritual construct to accomplish something is technology. Such a broad definition is surely not confined to the influence of a singular planet.

From your post, this is basically what you are implying; technology is synonymous with electricity, thus before the discovery of electricity and its utilization in tools, technology simply did not exist. There are many more logical fallacies in your post but first I want you to realize that one.
 
Rebel Uranian

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
Choe thinks being Saturnian means you can only use planets up to Saturn. That's fine with me, because the Internet is truly a Mercurial thing. A little Mars for the fact that electricity can come from burning things, Saturn for silicon when it's a metal and I don't know what for when it's not, oh yea, and also for memory, and Jupiter for the computer processing its code... As much as I have a prominent Uranus, I could get by perfectly fine without it.

The only time I'm not Saturnian is in most traditional astrology that's not sidereal. Really, just based on experience without even looking at my chart, I'd say that I'm Mercurial and Saturnian with a significant amount of Venus, but not as much as Mercury or Saturn. This is exactly what happens in sidereal, especially if you consider the Moon out of sect by being in the wrong hemisphere. As seen here, I'm a little too antagonist for Venus and the Moon, but not in the way of Mars. Mercury suits me better. It likes to argue a lot. I don't always argue and I'm surprisingly quiet, so that's where Saturn comes in.

~ Rebel Uranian
 
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Zonark

Zonark

Well-known member
Rebel Uranian said:
Choe thinks being Saturnian means you can only use planets up to Saturn. That's fine with me, because the Internet is truly a Mercurial thing. A little Mars for the fact that electricity comes from burning things, Saturn for silicon when it's a metal and I don't know what for when it's not, oh yea, and also for memory, and Jupiter for the computer processing its code... As much as I have a prominent Uranus, I could get by perfectly fine without it.

The only time I'm not Saturnian is in most traditional astrology that's not sidereal. Really, just based on experience without even looking at my chart, I'd say that I'm Mercurial and Saturnian with a significant amount of Venus, but not as much as Mercury or Saturn. This is exactly what happens in sidereal, especially if you consider the Moon out of sect by being in the wrong hemisphere.

~ Rebel Uranian
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Electricity can come from convection, friction and numerous other entropic forces that aren't combustion.

So yes, the internet is truly Mercurial :w00t:
 
Kaiousei no Senshi

Kaiousei no Senshi

Premium Member
This is the thing I loathe about traditionalists and conservatives:
They don't recognize Uranus(ruling the Internet and all the technologies) and Neptun(ruling films), Pluto(****,mafia,underground) but they live the modern ways.
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This is a mentality that I can't really understand very well. The idea that people who use traditional techniques should - for some reason - be stuck in the time period that those techniques were widely used. I'm not sure why there's a need for this sort of mutual exclusivity, but it borders on the silly. There's nothing that the modern planets rule that the traditional planets cannot take within their depth.

Technology and the Internet? Mercury.
Film? The Moon.

Just because things are new does not mean that there should be a new thing to rule or signify them. If you have the time, Sue Ward wrote an excellent paper on the origins of the significations of Uranus, Neptune, and Pluto. I highly recommend reading it. Quite eye opening, regardless of what side of the fence you are on.
 
T

twelthnight

Banned
I think the internet is Uranian rather than Mercurial because the social problems we encounter with the internet truly belong to the dark side of Uranus...that is, we become alienated from each other in our quest to connect.
 
Zonark

Zonark

Well-known member
twelthnight said:
I think the internet is Uranian rather than Mercurial because the social problems we encounter with the internet truly belong to the dark side of Uranus...that is, we become alienated from each other in our quest to connect.
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I think that's a rather cursory, circumstantial side effect of internet use rather than a driving characteristic considering many people interact in real life with people they talk to online.
 
Rebel Uranian

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~sueward/publications/UrNePl_samples.pdf

Well, I'm not a risk-taker (a psychology person said this) so obviously there's some part of me that doesn't like new things. But I'm also basically (emphasis on basically) a socialist, so... Socialism is ruled by the Moon (for common people,) right?

On Saturn:

"As the 'Grim Reaper' Saturn appears only to be concerned with bringing denial to our hopes and expectations, but as 'Father Time' we understand the purpose is to order the individual to be subservient to their society and their own spiritual destiny; to recognize that their life at any given time is only a small part of a much wider scheme; to safeguard the continuation of existence and ensure that subsequent generations will thrive and prosper. Saturn is often linked with history, traditions and the past, but it is every bit as concerned about the future. Everything that arises from its influence carries the aim of creating firmer foundations for future potential. Ancient depictions often show Saturn holding the Uroborus, the serpent who eats its own tail, a symbol of eternal regeneration which forges birth and death into the endless cycle of past, present and future. "

People don't understand how rules work. Have you ever studied music, or martial arts, or a number of things? You have to learn the old traditional stuff in order to be able to create new things. There are essentially rules on how to break rules. If you don't follow them, then you're simply following the rules no matter how much of a rebel you're pretending to be. Actors also have to rehearse their lines to be able to sound natural. If they don't rehearse, it'll sound like they rehearsed.

twelthnight said:
I think the internet is Uranian rather than Mercurial because the social problems we encounter with the internet truly belong to the dark side of Uranus...that is, we become alienated from each other in our quest to connect.
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Isolation was considered a Saturn thing, but somewhat given to all dry planets and signs. I consider Uranus hot and dry and the mirror image of Saturn rather than the "higher octave" of Mercury. I'm not sure exactly how important it is in interpretations considering I can get myself right without it. Apparently Mars trine Uranus would be a risk-taker but I'm not. I'm actually pretty boring minus a few things.
 
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T

twelthnight

Banned
Zonark said:
I think that's a rather cursory, circumstantial side effect of internet use rather than a driving characteristic considering many people interact in real life with people they talk to online.
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Recently there was quite an interesting article in The Guardian about the recent protests everywhere which were largely organized via the internet...although they have been more successful that anything we've seen in recent history, there is a troubling disconnect amongst each movement, according to the writer...
 
T

twelthnight

Banned
Rebel Uranian said:
http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~sueward/publications/UrNePl_samples.pdf

Well, I'm not a risk-taker (a psychology person said this) so obviously there's some part of me that doesn't like new things. But I'm also basically (emphasis on basically) a socialist, so... Socialism is ruled by the Moon (for common people,) right?

On Saturn:

"As the 'Grim Reaper' Saturn appears only to be concerned with bringing denial to our hopes and expectations, but as 'Father Time' we understand the purpose is to order the individual to be subservient to their society and their own spiritual destiny; to recognize that their life at any given time is only a small part of a much wider scheme; to safeguard the continuation of existence and ensure that subsequent generations will thrive and prosper. Saturn is often linked with history, traditions and the past, but it is every bit as concerned about the future. Everything that arises from its influence carries the aim of creating firmer foundations for future potential. Ancient depictions often show Saturn holding the Uroborus, the serpent who eats its own tail, a symbol of eternal regeneration which forges birth and death into the endless cycle of past, present and future. "

People don't understand how rules work. Have you ever studied music, or martial arts, or a number of things? You have to learn the old traditional stuff in order to be able to create new things. There are essentially rules on how to break rules. If you don't follow them, then you're simply following the rules no matter how much of a rebel you're pretending to be. Actors also have to rehearse their lines to be able to sound natural. If they don't rehearse, it'll sound like they rehearsed.



Isolation was considered a Saturn thing, but somewhat given to all dry planets and signs. I consider Uranus hot and dry and the mirror image of Saturn rather than the "higher octave" of Mercury. I'm not sure exactly how important it is in interpretations considering I can get myself right without it. Apparently Mars trine Uranus would be a risk-taker but I'm not. I'm actually pretty boring minus a few things.
Click to expand...

Give it time, you'll probably surprise yourself. I have mars trine uranus and I love to take risks.
 
Rebel Uranian

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
I said a psychology person said it. That makes them right. I'm also right about them being right because I never fall down ice skating and I look both ways before I cross the street and all that boring stuff.
 
Zonark

Zonark

Well-known member
twelthnight said:
Recently there was quite an interesting article in The Guardian about the recent protests everywhere which were largely organized via the internet...although they have been more successful that anything we've seen in recent history, there is a troubling disconnect amongst each movement, according to the writer...
Click to expand...

Have you been following the progress of Anonymous, or rather the idea behind Anonymous? The disconnect is not accidental.
 
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