Is Jupiter really that benefic??

@munch - of course the atheism thing is saturn and in itself that is the delusion. Its interesting that you should talk of faith with this jupiter/saturn - it makes sense. Perhaps we could take a further small leap and say that it is about religion.

@ bigblack Sure! It represents anything that you believe in to the point of having it be a fundamental part of who you are.

I have a question
Jupiter is exactly on my sun/moon midpoint.
It is at 0 degrees Libra.
Allowing that Jupiter should be the perfect expression of myself, then why am I so Saturnine in expression.
To be sure, Saturn is 67 degrees away from Jupiter, which may be a Quintile, but still I am a Sagittarian Sun.

queenfluff said:

this is really interesting. I have a lot of Neptune in my chart (1st house conjunct to asc and moon) and I swear the world feels like a dream to me. But they say Neptune has a loose grip on reality. Funny I feel I understand reality quite well - I just don't like alot of it esp. that material world that is more Saturn (which is mostly like the Western World) but Western Astrology still makes more sense to me (or maybe it is that my chart in Western astrology makes more sense to me). But I honestly would love it if it WAS "real" like Neptune instead of Saturn - that would explain alot for me! I like the dream world of Neptune alot more than the material world of Saturn. I read a quote once that said "This existence is a dream." - that is what it feels like to me - like the Matrix - there is something off but you are not sure what it is - it makes the world slightly dream like whether you want it to be that way or not. Or to often wonder if when you are awake that is actually the dream and when you are dreaming is actual reality? Maybe it is a thing that only Neptune types feel and those that don't have strong Neptune you won't see it?

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I think this is a vision of reality specific to Neptune types. You might get a lot out of reading Liz Greene's The Astrological Neptune and the Quest for Redemption, if you haven't already. It sounds like it would be right up your ally. I'm about halfway through it myself. I have a Neptune/Mars opposition, and find that I side with Mars and disown Neptune, so it's been a real eye opener for me to learn Neptune's perspective on the world. I can hear Mars in my brain, grinding his teeth every time I force him to read it with me.

bigblack said:

@ queenfluff "we are the puppets dream" - solaris.

It came to me last night - I think there has been a mental block on me. Its Jupiter/pluto contacts that are good for business - one example being microsoft. And those business that have the jupiter/pluto contact dont find it that difficult. As opposesed to those who seem to think that we have to struggle to make it. I'd rather have it like microsoft than struggle starting a business or starting a job with jupiter/saturn. BTW Jupter is sextiling pluto at the moment - as we all should know - so for the next month make your start in a new business or job.

Of those I have known who have jupiter/saturn contacts they are not doing that well in life.

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"Life is just a dream on the way to death" (another favorite of my Neptuney side) ~ from the movie The Crow, City of Angels

What if life was just a dream and the only way to wake up was our death? - hmm, maybe that would explain why lots of us are obsessed with wanting to know what happens after we die - because real life is waitng for us beyond. (this is very Scorpio thinking of me. )


Anyhow.....


When you say Jupiter/Saturn "contacts" - are you talking about natal aspects? Because I don't have any Natal aspects wit Jupiter and Saturn - in fact my Saturn has no major aspects to it - it is a loner and a rebel planet in my chart.

For me it will be a Jupiter/Saturn transit - so not permanent, just temporary - don't know if that is what you meant or not. Alhthough I am not really a "business" type ( like Capricorny) - Even though some of my aspects seem to say different and say I have a potential to be a great leader - maybe I do but I haven't figured out in what yet. I could see myself creating a small business because resourcefulness and creative ideas are some of my best quality (next to all the good Virgo stuff) - I just suck at business things like math, money, anything economic or financial bores me to tears. I not really that good at talking people into things that involves money. When I sell my used things, even if they are worth alot, I feel guilty charging people for them - like I am being selfish or something for wanting money for them. So that is why I would need a partner to handle the money ****.

@munch - I have been an atheist for 20 years - that sort of faith went out the window a long time ago for me because I believe it is psychological. But that doesn't mean you can't still have hope in things. Don't want to go into religion on here too much though. too heated of a topic.

I think I need to clarify

Of those I have known who have jupiter/saturn contacts they are not doing that well in life.

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When I say that they are not doing well I cannot say they are doing that bad either. they are just trundling along. Nothing significant - the same as most other people.

But these are both natal aspect people.

Admittedly I take this partly from magi but also from personal experience of jup/sat contacts by transit, but by transit it seems to have a more deleterious impact.

I think as far as the starting a business idea is that if your product is something people want it will sell itself. Or even if you have a gift that shines through to the end product that will show and sell itself as well. For me its ceramics and that is what I am about to start a business in. I do not know what a typical business type is - I think its all about self confidence, in particular in what you do.

I am going to reach here and say that like me you have not had much money in your life. This in itself has effected your thinking - effected your confidence as far as charging is concerned. I think those who are doing well charge what they do with no qualms - again its confidence gleaned from experience.

heres another neptune style quote for you queenfluff

Prospero:
Our revels now are ended. These our actors,
As I foretold you, were all spirits, and
Are melted into air, into thin air:
And like the baseless fabric of this vision,
The cloud-capp'd tow'rs, the gorgeous palaces,
The solemn temples, the great globe itself,
Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve,
And, like this insubstantial pageant faded,
Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff
As dreams are made on; and our little life
Is rounded with a sleep.

The Tempest Act 4, scene 1, 148–158​

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All the best.

bigblack said:

I think I need to clarify


I am going to reach here and say that like me you have not had much money in your life. This in itself has effected your thinking - effected your confidence as far as charging is concerned. I think those who are doing well charge what they do with no qualms - again its confidence gleaned from experience.

heres another neptune style quote for you queenfluff



All the best.

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Yes, you are right. Not much money. For only about 4 years of my life, did I make good money where I didn't worry about not having enough - yep, that is all I got was 4 lousy years and so far it doesn't look like it is ever going to go back to being that way. The rest of my life was struggle as far as money goes. I never have enough and everyday I think about "how can I get the money to pay for the things I need or want to do?" I skip out on alot of things I would like to do because I have no money. If they aren't free or really cheap they are out for me.

Even though I am very aware that money doesn't buy happiness and I hate the rich corporate idiots who make all their billions off of the exploitation of the planet and taking advantage of other people (if that is the only way to have money, than I want nothing to do with it - I have too many morals and principals) - I still envy those people who money comes so easily to them - they always seem to have want they need - I don't know how they do it. I really hate the fact that their are so many thing that are not availalbe to me just because money doesn't come too me. It makes my life seem very restrictive - which is hard for a person with so many interests and things they want to do. I honestly wish money to be abolished because it ruins so many things.

My only guess is that, for me, it is that Saturn in the 6th house in Taurus. A few people on here have said that that will cause money troubles and job problems - both will be hard to get for me. Well, they are right - In the past, I didn't have any troubles getting jobs even though they didn't pay alot. Since I am creative and resourceful, I always find away to get by somehow but it is still quite exhausting to worry about money so much. I miss those 4 glorious years where I didn't have to worry about it. I had plenty and a little extra to put away - first time in my life for that. That was between 2002 and 2006 - I wonder what transit was going on for me than that I had good luck like that.

I wonder what transit was going on for me than that I had good luck like that.

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Just curious but had you moved just before that period and then moved again after?

I have never had much money my life either and like you I have had a period of being able to save which has lasted for the past 5 years until the present day. Now I am about to take a chance and start my own business in studio ceramics - another occupation where you wont become rich. But I am hoping that it will provide a little job security - well we can dream!! Planing for this business startup has really made me evaluate myself and my position and motivations and my thought patterns.

I was reading an article on karma a few weeks ago. The article was stating that if you live in a poor place/area then you are contributing to the bad karma of that area. It affects our thinking - if indeed our thinking is not karma full stop.

I also have a scorpio asc but have the moon in virgo - not the sun.

bigblack said:

Just curious but had you moved just before that period and then moved again after?

I have never had much money my life either and like you I have had a period of being able to save which has lasted for the past 5 years until the present day. Now I am about to take a chance and start my own business in studio ceramics - another occupation where you wont become rich. But I am hoping that it will provide a little job security - well we can dream!! Planing for this business startup has really made me evaluate myself and my position and motivations and my thought patterns.

I was reading an article on karma a few weeks ago. The article was stating that if you live in a poor place/area then you are contributing to the bad karma of that area. It affects our thinking - if indeed our thinking is not karma full stop.

I also have a scorpio asc but have the moon in virgo - not the sun.

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Yes! I did but I have moved alot in my life (I think someone said is in my chart - i think is was my Chiron in Aries??). I moved in with a boyfriend a few months before I got the job (I actually moved with him again to a different place within that period of time) where I was making the big bucks and right after I got the job we broke up and I moved my stuff to the apartment across the hall! I was in that place for a short time and they were going to turn the buildings into condo and I moved yet again and than once more again before being laid off 4 years after I started the job! (geez, I moved alot than!) After I lost the job, I moved out of state and moved in with a new boyfriend. So yes, I would count two BIG moves (in with new boyfriends before and after my 4 years of good luck in job). Why do you ask?

Funny how my good luck with money ended right when yours started. The last five years (exactly has been five years since I left that job) have been opposite for me. I have never had luck with money but these past five years have been the lowest of the low - I never dreamed it would get this bad.

I was looking over past transits of Jupiter and Saturn and I noticed that during that period (my good one) that Jupiter and Saturn were both in my upper horizon. Jupiter was in Leo through Scorpio during that period (through my 9 to 1st houses). (actually found out they were going to lay people off in 2005 - but nothing was for certain - so it seems that once it hit below my ascendant is when things started to go down hill...hmmmm).

http://www.auxmaillesgodefroy.com/jupiter_timeline

http://www.auxmaillesgodefroy.com/Saturn_Timeline

Saturn was in Gemini through Leo which would be 7th through 9th houses.
I could see Saturn in Cancer is when I was working the most (I also went to school part time working on my masters which I never got to finish) and making good money (raises and bonuses!) in those years especially (8th house is mostly cancer - other peoples money!).

Queenfluff, I am thinking the same thing these days about religion and psychology. I think the Star Wars concept of 'The Force' might actually be the best explanation for all that we see. But, I'm also a huge geek as well. hehe.

@queenfluff

Saturn was in Gemini

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why do you ask

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Why do I ask - I have always had a hunch that its because of where I am living, and was curious, or just trying to clarify, that my theory stands up.

I moved into where I am still living when saturn had moved into gemini and into the eighth house. I always feel that having that "natal move chart" and still being here is helping me somewhat. I have more now than I ever have had materially. Strangely everything else is out of the window.

Of course there is also combined alignment charts - again magi i'm afraid - where the combination of charts - that is who we are signficantly mixing with - has a positive or negative effect upon ourselves. We can have a **** chart ourselves but if the right person comes along, and they become significant, it all goes well for us. And the period ends when the deal is over, so to speak. You often see this with bands where a member leaves and somehow its not the same. Or with tribute bands who do not become as successful as the original band as there is a different cac chart.

I also have moved a lot. I went to 22 schools, several childrens homes along the way as well.

@munch - no one is a bigger geek than me. Just to prove it I use linux.

bigblack said:

@queenfluff

Why do I ask - I have always had a hunch that its because of where I am living, and was curious, or just trying to clarify, that my theory stands up.

I moved into where I am still living when saturn had moved into gemini and into the eighth house. I always feel that having that "natal move chart" and still being here is helping me somewhat. I have more now than I ever have had materially. Strangely everything else is out of the window.

Of course there is also combined alignment charts - again magi i'm afraid - where the combination of charts - that is who we are signficantly mixing with - has a positive or negative effect upon ourselves. We can have a **** chart ourselves but if the right person comes along, and they become significant, it all goes well for us. And the period ends when the deal is over, so to speak. You often see this with bands where a member leaves and somehow its not the same. Or with tribute bands who do not become as successful as the original band as there is a different cac chart.

I also have moved a lot. I went to 22 schools, several childrens homes along the way as well.

@munch - no one is a bigger geek than me. Just to prove it I use linux.

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Hmm.. I don't think mine has anything to do with where I am living as I have moved so much - things don't necessary change when I move - I move because of change, yes. Like it becomes necessary for me to leave.

I have never had a "right person" come along. I will say though that I believe certain people I was involved with messed things up further for me because they used me. I think its the Neptune in me but people either don't see at all (i am invisible) or they see me as naive and try to take advantage of my generous. I would say my last relationship (the last boyfriend in the previous story) was the biggest mistake ever - worst thing I ever did was moved to that other state with him - from than on in - things went even more downhill - being with him was like constant bad luck for me - I couldn't get anything to get any better. I ususally do better with no one - when the person is gone than I do better.

I always hear stories about that "one right person" who changes your life and everything going great when they are around - well, not for me - or I have had one yet - or there isn't one in existance for me. I kind of believe the later. Rarely do the people help me - I ended up helping them too much and than I suffer in the consequences.

@queenfluff

4 years of good luck in job

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If you look at the history of apple computers, you will find that when steve jobs was expelled the fortune of apple computers began to look bleak. When he was brought back in apple computer fortune recovered.

Of course (now) I am suggesting that there was a good chart match between you and whatever company you were working for during the four year period.

I think its the Neptune in me but people either don't see at all (i am invisible) or they see me as naive and try to take advantage of my generous.

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I sympathise. I also have a scorpio asc with neptune conj, but with neptune in the twelve not the first like you. Seems familiar though. Incidentally, I have just been reading another thread where you state something like people think that they can take advantage of you but what they dont realise is that you remember and because of the sun/pluto conjunction there is a kick to you. Well I have a moon/pluto conjunction in virgo - with a very similar effect. I suppose this is a little of topic though.