Completely opening up. I hate myself. Demons. Emotional torture. How do I heal?
- Thread starter GeminiSun
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Osamenor
Staff member
How have you made the progress you've already made? I wouldn't think you could've done that without some serious healing, maybe accessing your subconscious.
Jupiter is both your north node ruler, and currently transiting your north node, and trine/sextile (loosely) your nodal axis. When it's sitting on your north node, its message regarding your karmic journey is especially strong. And, when a planet transits your north node, its message is greatly amplified in your life, because the north node makes whatever it touches bigger. So does Jupiter. So, if Jupiter is on your north node, they make each other very big.
I've looked at your south node story before, and it looks exactly like the struggle you're describing: being both gay and deeply religious, in a religion that doesn't accept homosexuality. We create our own demons, and/or have them created for us by the society around us. That conflict has created your demons.
I think that whatever I say, you might not believe it, because your sense that you must choose either God or your authentic self, and that it's a strict either/or choice, seems so deeply ingrained... but God didn't make the church. God didn't make the rules about sexuality, either. People did that.
The Christian story is a story about going against the religious establishment. Jesus was a rebel against his society's equivalent of church. So were the early Christians... until they went and established themselves as a state religion. Today's heresy becomes tomorrow's dogma.
Even the anti-gay dogma in Christianity is based on just one Bible verse, which is not about homosexuality, but about equality. "A man shall not lie with a man as with a woman." That's just a prohibition on one specific act--anal sex between men--and the prohibition was for cultural reasons that don't exist in our society.
In Biblical society, and many surrounding cultures, if a man was on the receiving end of penetrative sex, instead of being the penetrator, that made him less-than. Lower class, debased: women were lower class anyway, but if a man "acted as a woman" in sex, that made him lower class. Jewish law was written with an expectation that all men in their society would be equal, there would be no such class distinctions. So, anal sex between men was offensive (a more accurate translation of the word translated as "abomination") simply because it created a social class division. That doesn't happen in North America today. Who has what kind of sex with who doesn't change their social status.
Outside of that, the Bible doesn't mention homosexuality at all. There may be an occasional disparaging comment about "homosexuals," but that's a translation from a Greek word that would more accurately mean "pervert." Just a general sense of ickiness, not anything specific about sexual orientation or even particular sexual acts.
Sexual orientation as we understand it is a fairly modern concept, only around the last century or so. Before then, it wasn't about who you were, just what you did. In that light, the church can't very well have any long standing prohibition on it, because no such concept has existed long enough for it to be a long standing prohibition.
This is getting off the topic of astrology... but my whole argument here is Jupiterian. Jupiter is, more broadly, about collective beliefs. On your north node, it calls you to examine and question collective beliefs. Gemini is all about asking questions... if you're following your sun sign nature, that would be natural to you.
Thank you for your post!! But you are right, my beliefs are soooo ingrained in me, however, with the transits you've explained, it's like I'm finally "open" to a new type of spirituality, you know? I always felt too ashamed to pray to God for help. I always felt like I wasn't worthy enough because of who I am and the path I chose. But recently, I've been praying to God anyway, asking for help to guide me in the right direction during such a crucial time in my life with so many important decisions to make, and I prayed just to be protected because my life has been full of anxiety and heartache and I don't think I can handle anymore of it.
I'm coming to terms with the fact that this "system of beliefs" I've built for myself or accepted into my life has been nothing but a very self-destructive energy for me. And I feel so much better now that I am OPEN to releasing it... It's a process but I have such high hopes.
waybread
Well-known member
Gemini Sun, I commend you for the hard-won progress you've made so far.
With Saturn in your 4th house of your early childhood conditioning squaring your first house Scorpio moon-Pluto, I can see why you are so terribly hard on yourself.
Then Mars in a man's chart rules his sexuality and sense of masculinity. With Mars conjunct your MC in Leo, it's understandable that you feel there is something very public about your sexuality; and in a way that is very hurtful (Chiron conjunct Mars.)
Young children often find sexuality to be difficult and confusing-- if not awful. For example, a heterosexual girl who has been raped and told it was her fault, and has to live with shame, guilt, and probably PTSD. You're not alone with your type of fears and feelings, although each person is unique.
I don't like to give religious advice for fear of being inappropriate-- unless someone brings up their religion first. So just my 2c on the subject: please take anything you can use and leave the rest.
1. If you believe in the judgmental Christian (or Catholic God) even though you find much of what is taught about Him to be troubling, see if you can let in for a moment a glimpse of other things in Christian teaching: God's total love for you, and the availability of a state of grace.
Sometimes as we go through life, we learn that the events that troubled us so much when we were younger actually serve us in some way as mature adults. The promise of Chiron is that if we stay open to the things that hurt and shame us at one time, we will gain in wisdom and compassion for other people experiencing the same problems. Perhaps you could be a blessing to gay youth (or LGBTQ people) struggling to find a healthy identity, for example.
Are you familiar with one of the current Democratic candidates for U. S. president, Pete Buttigieg (pronounced boot-eh-judge)? He is openly gay, married to a man, and a devout Episcopalian (Anglican.) Many American Protestant churches embrace their gay members.
Here is an article about him in the New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/10/us/politics/pete-buttigieg-sexuality-religion.html
You don't need to take such a strong and public stand as a gay man, but see if there might be small ways in which you could further LGBTQ rights.
2. I have a different understanding of God, as more like a life force, creative principle, or divine consciousness. This life force constantly surrounds us and lives within us. (Compare the Asian concepts of prana, mana, and chi or qi.) See what happens when you let go of your troubling thoughts so that you can experience being in touch with this all-pervasive divine presence.
The Bible is full of competing verses: one would almost say contradictions. You might focus on the empowering verses, like James 4:8, and Matthew 5:3.
You gave yourself an ultimatum at the end of your OP. I say you don't have to choose. You can do both.
With Saturn in your 4th house of your early childhood conditioning squaring your first house Scorpio moon-Pluto, I can see why you are so terribly hard on yourself.
Then Mars in a man's chart rules his sexuality and sense of masculinity. With Mars conjunct your MC in Leo, it's understandable that you feel there is something very public about your sexuality; and in a way that is very hurtful (Chiron conjunct Mars.)
Young children often find sexuality to be difficult and confusing-- if not awful. For example, a heterosexual girl who has been raped and told it was her fault, and has to live with shame, guilt, and probably PTSD. You're not alone with your type of fears and feelings, although each person is unique.
I don't like to give religious advice for fear of being inappropriate-- unless someone brings up their religion first. So just my 2c on the subject: please take anything you can use and leave the rest.
1. If you believe in the judgmental Christian (or Catholic God) even though you find much of what is taught about Him to be troubling, see if you can let in for a moment a glimpse of other things in Christian teaching: God's total love for you, and the availability of a state of grace.
Sometimes as we go through life, we learn that the events that troubled us so much when we were younger actually serve us in some way as mature adults. The promise of Chiron is that if we stay open to the things that hurt and shame us at one time, we will gain in wisdom and compassion for other people experiencing the same problems. Perhaps you could be a blessing to gay youth (or LGBTQ people) struggling to find a healthy identity, for example.
Are you familiar with one of the current Democratic candidates for U. S. president, Pete Buttigieg (pronounced boot-eh-judge)? He is openly gay, married to a man, and a devout Episcopalian (Anglican.) Many American Protestant churches embrace their gay members.
Here is an article about him in the New York Times: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/04/10/us/politics/pete-buttigieg-sexuality-religion.html
You don't need to take such a strong and public stand as a gay man, but see if there might be small ways in which you could further LGBTQ rights.
2. I have a different understanding of God, as more like a life force, creative principle, or divine consciousness. This life force constantly surrounds us and lives within us. (Compare the Asian concepts of prana, mana, and chi or qi.) See what happens when you let go of your troubling thoughts so that you can experience being in touch with this all-pervasive divine presence.
The Bible is full of competing verses: one would almost say contradictions. You might focus on the empowering verses, like James 4:8, and Matthew 5:3.
You gave yourself an ultimatum at the end of your OP. I say you don't have to choose. You can do both.
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I've been thinking about that too. I feel like such a failure and a hypocrite for thinking like that but in my soul it "feels right." Like praying to god even though apart of me doesn't feel worthy, still feels nice. To have some kind of "connection" with a higher-power who you believe wants the best for YOU I think can be comforting for some people. I just hate the fact that I am "making up my own God" but this is what makes me happy and feel free. Having these religious restrictions tied to me has been nothing but a complete disaster. I have to flyyyyyyyyyyy. I have to release myself from this if I ever want to be happy and fully healed!
waybread
Well-known member
GeminiSun, I take your point, but the Catholic church has a strong authoritatian streak that does not encourage questioning. Many Catholics are fine with this, and even view obedience as a cornerstone of their faith. Some other Christian denominations place more emphasis on that "still small voice" within us. In my beliefs, God is the basic creative principle of the cosmos. As His unique creation, you are a part of what God is.your
Ecclesiastes 9:7: "Go then, eat your bread in happiness and drink your wine with a cheerful heart; for God has already approved what you do."
I believe that you can have your religious faith as well as your authenticity as a human being. Possibly not within the church as it is today, but there will be a community of faith for you that welcomes gay members-- if this is what you want. (Jupiter in the 11th house.)
Your moon rules your 9th house of religion and theology, and it is closely squared by Saturn in your 4th house of early childhood conditioning. You may always feel some of the quandary you described at the end of your OP. So if it's going to hang around independently of your choices, you might just follow your heart.
Ecclesiastes 9:7: "Go then, eat your bread in happiness and drink your wine with a cheerful heart; for God has already approved what you do."
I believe that you can have your religious faith as well as your authenticity as a human being. Possibly not within the church as it is today, but there will be a community of faith for you that welcomes gay members-- if this is what you want. (Jupiter in the 11th house.)
Your moon rules your 9th house of religion and theology, and it is closely squared by Saturn in your 4th house of early childhood conditioning. You may always feel some of the quandary you described at the end of your OP. So if it's going to hang around independently of your choices, you might just follow your heart.
I am working really hard to set myself free and still find a balance and be happy within my own spirituality. The last two days have been very rough for me. I am really coming to terms with a lot of stuff. Emotions I've held in for so long seem to just be pouring out of me and I cannot stop crying! I can feel some kind of healing coming because I feel so much intensity and pain right now, and from experience, this is usually when I learn or deal with something really hard. Whatever happens, I cannot live the way I currently do. It is not serving my soul, my life, the people I love, the energy I exude - I am completely out of balance. This is a very tough time but I am not running from this topic anymore. Or just "accepting" what a horrible, sinful person I am. I cannot live with that in the back of my mind, effecting my choices, decisions, my mental health - everything. I will fight hard.
Thank you for the advice. I've also been doing a lot of mirror work (Louise Hay's teachings). It seems to be working for me little by little.
I have no choice and it's what I want. I am done living with this "thing." It is not serving me. I know it will be very hard. I really resonate with the 8th House and if anyone has any placements there, they know it is such a deep, intense, almost obsession-like energy where it is sooooooooooo hard to let go. But the blessing with it is it promises TRANSFORMATION. The things you NEVER thought you would be able to let go of or overcome, eventually you will be able to. I know and feel that in my heart. I just have to throw myself into this and allow destiny to take it's course in my soul! I have to MOVE AWAY from that South Node 8th House energy and move towards the grounded 2nd House energy which is more focused on what we are able to see, the world, what is infront of us and not all this spiritual stuff that haunts me.
Demons inhabit the human mind; they are products of the mind. I believe, based on personal experience, that they are common to all people; we all share certain "species" of demons. Most of the time, for most of us, they don't emerge into consciousness.
Almost all of us live in a world of delusion, partly created by our social milieu, partly by individual choice (in order to ward off pain and low self image), which allows us to deny or ignore reality. Sadly, the path to self-integration leads through reality. Without living in "the real world", all claims to "spiritual seeking" are meaningless, hollow; the material and the spiritual are but dual manifestations of the same cosmic energy. And both must be honored; one does not exist, or grow within us, without full and active inclusion of the other.
Almost all of us live in a world of delusion, partly created by our social milieu, partly by individual choice (in order to ward off pain and low self image), which allows us to deny or ignore reality. Sadly, the path to self-integration leads through reality. Without living in "the real world", all claims to "spiritual seeking" are meaningless, hollow; the material and the spiritual are but dual manifestations of the same cosmic energy. And both must be honored; one does not exist, or grow within us, without full and active inclusion of the other.
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God loves you. You were born gay for a reason. You’re not the labels that your family put on gay people.
Have you looked into reincarnation? You might find some answers there. I think for your situation it could help you build your self esteem and learn to love yourself for who you are. It’s hard to overcome childhood trauma such as you experienced but you deserve to be living your best life. It’s okay to be gay!
Good luck with everything. If you need to vent, feel free to message me.
Osamenor
Staff member
"This spiritual stuff" is part of your north node, too, though in a different way. Eighth house is up for you in two ways: as your sun sign, which makes eighth house growth especially important for you, and as your south node sign. As the south node sign, it's gifts you were born with, or maybe your ancestral past, or maybe your past life, as in reincarnation (if reincarnation makes sense to you), past. Maybe all of those.
If we're looking at the south node as a karmic past story, then we look for the negative meanings of its placement. Eighth house in that context can mean some very horrible things, like death, violence, war, etc. We could also be looking at taboos. Hidden sexuality comes to mind. You said no one in your family has ever been openly gay... I think you have closeted gay relatives. Not only is it a safe bet just considering how much of the general population is gay, but the eighth house deals with familial secrets that are rather buried. Skeletons in the closet that you would really have to hunt for to find them. But, since this is the eighth house we're dealing with, not the twelfth (twelfth house deals with the ancestral secrets that have already gone to the grave with those who knew them), it's also a safe bet that you have living relatives--or maybe very recently dead ones, but who you knew in life--who know about this.
That's one way to read your south node as ancestral past. I'm also looking at a familial interpretation because of your south node ruler being in Cancer, which is the sign of your family, homeland, people, home culture.
But then, while your north node is in the second house, which does indeed have to do with coming into the world and finding peace, it's also in the very spiritual and philosophical Sagittarius. With a Jupiter-ruled north node, there's no way your north node journey isn't a spiritual one. In your node story, I see a reworking of spirituality, not a throwing it away.
I realized this last night. lol. I cannot let go of spirituality, I just have to re-define what it means to me and how I can use it as a blessing and not something completely self-destructive and horrible. I'm going to use my spirituality to EMPOWER myself, NOT tear myself down any longer.
Thank you so much for the kind words and encouragement!!!God loves you. You were born gay for a reason. You’re not the labels that your family put on gay people.
Have you looked into reincarnation? You might find some answers there. I think for your situation it could help you build your self esteem and learn to love yourself for who you are. It’s hard to overcome childhood trauma such as you experienced but you deserve to be living your best life. It’s okay to be gay!
waybread
Well-known member
GeminiSun, are you in Hungary? If you're now in an English-speaking country other than in Africa, you might take a look at the Anglicans (Episcopalians in the US, Church of England.) Of the Protestant denominations, they're pretty "high church" (and thus a bit more like Catholicism) They have embraced gay parishioners, some of whom are prominent within the church and in other areas. There is a schism with some of their African churches, which are more traditional, but otherwise I think you'd find a welcome.
See, for example: https://www.integrityusa.org/
(No, I am not a member myself, just trying to be helpful here.)
It looks like there is an Anglican church in Budapest: https://www.anglicanbudapest.org/
See, for example: https://www.integrityusa.org/
(No, I am not a member myself, just trying to be helpful here.)
It looks like there is an Anglican church in Budapest: https://www.anglicanbudapest.org/
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Nope! Moved to Canada with my family at the age of 4.
As for churches, I think my new found spirituality doesn't want anything to do with any kind of church or like something that like this huge group follows and believes word for word. I am going to define my own spirituality. Like even realizing this has given me so much fricking confidence. I obviously believe in God and will always believe in God, just not the God many of us have identified with for so many generations!
I had a huge revelation and could not stop crying
This whole time God has tried to make me realize that I have a beautiful spirit and I am beautiful just the way I am
And I ignored it... For so long
And now I've made peace with it
And I can't even begin to tell you guys how happy I am
This whole time God has tried to make me realize that I have a beautiful spirit and I am beautiful just the way I am
And I ignored it... For so long
And now I've made peace with it
And I can't even begin to tell you guys how happy I am
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