Venus opposition Pluto in synastry

craft94

Well-known member
Was there a reason why you stopped talking to the person? Has the Venus person tried contacting you at all? I ask because it's said that the Venus person is usually the one who is obsessed.

I did do something very wrong last night and tonight, he texted me and told me never to contact him again. I feel guilty, but I did it out of paranoia. I didn't think it was that bad at the time. I thought it was a fair reaction to how he was treating me, but now I'd do anything to take it back.

I just feel like I should avoid relationships in general and never speak to men ever again because I'm way too sensitive and legitimately crazy (guys never tend to believe me when I tell them). I fear abandonment too much. Once I form any kind of connection with someone, I want it to last forever in some form. If not, I feel violated afterwards in a strange way.
 
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ChildOfVenus

Well-known member
Well I feel the same way about people I care about. Wanting it to last forever even if it's just friendship. I really do hate it when things go bad when I really use to care about the person. I mean is it unrealistic to feel that way?
I did do something very wrong last night and tonight, he texted me and told me never to contact him again. I feel guilty, but I did it out of paranoia. I didn't think it was that bad at the time. I thought it was a fair reaction to how he was treating me, but now I'd do anything to take it back.

I just feel like I should avoid relationships in general and never speak to men ever again because I'm way too sensitive and legitimately crazy (guys never tend to believe me when I tell them). I fear abandonment too much. Once I form any kind of connection with someone, I want it to last forever in some form. If not, I feel violated afterwards in a strange way.
 

craft94

Well-known member
Well I feel the same way about people I care about. Wanting it to last forever even if it's just friendship. I really do hate it when things go bad when I really use to care about the person. I mean is it unrealistic to feel that way?

I don't know. I hope not. I just know that the next time some guy tells me he's an "emotionless dick but not with you, you make me feel, you have magical abilities that no one else has," my first instinct will be to run away because it's a warning. It will only be a matter of time before they start behaving that way towards you, as well, even if they said that was impossible. In this case, before we even got the chance to meet each other!
 

craft94

Well-known member
I did do something very wrong last night and tonight, he texted me and told me never to contact him again. I feel guilty, but I did it out of paranoia. I didn't think it was that bad at the time. I thought it was a fair reaction to how he was treating me, but now I'd do anything to take it back.

I just feel like I should avoid relationships in general and never speak to men ever again because I'm way too sensitive and legitimately crazy (guys never tend to believe me when I tell them). I fear abandonment too much. Once I form any kind of connection with someone, I want it to last forever in some form. If not, I feel violated afterwards in a strange way.

Hmmm...thinking on it now though, and I feel less guilty. I still think what I did was shitty (I wouldn't have liked it done to me) but I think it's perfect for him that he knows about it, because it now rids himself of the blame. It justifies his disappearance, whereas before, he had no excuse. He'd never admit this though.

Even the fight we got into: he said he was distancing himself because I was still in love with my ex. Initially I thought, "well fair enough," but then I thought about it and realized: "What is he talking about? I'm not in love with my ex. I don't even care about him anymore, now that I've started talking to you. I'm hurt, sure, but these things take time to heal." We had known each other for less than a month yet he was saying he didn't want to flirt with me if I wasn't 100% invested, which I'm not, in his opinion, if I'm still effected by past relationships. So, first, it's my fault for not beingas invested as he is and then it's my fault for being too invested so which is it??? It's always my fault. Never yours.

A mutual friend even told me he lied to me about another girl he's dated.
 
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GeminiGrrl

Well-known member
Looks like some pretty intense stuff happening to people here, including a love triangle that is considered a likely outcome with this aspect.

You're not kidding. One of the things I absolutely LOATHE about having my natal Venus squarng my Pluto -- as well as squaring the natal Pluto of just about everyone my age! -- is the fact that I appear to attract more than my share of men who are either married or in a steady(?) relationship but looking for a little action on the side. At this point in my life, I don't consider it my place to judge these men for what they're doing because that's their decision to make -- but for the sake of my own well-being, I choose not to be a party to this and I make it clear to the man right from the beginning.
 

ChildOfVenus

Well-known member
Yes I understand I hate being Venus it's the worse I think the Venus person is the one who really suffers. Pluto could really care less that's what I think. Sometimes this feels fatal and like I'd do anything to be near that person.
Looks like some pretty intense stuff happening to people here, including a love triangle that is considered a likely outcome with this aspect.

ChildOfVenus - since you mentioned Pluto hating Venus, that can be an eventual outcome though it generally doesn't start this way. The way the aspect works especially with the opposition is that Pluto becomes aware of the power of their feelings (opposed by Venus) while Venus becomes aware of the power Pluto has on them, hence the obsessive feelings there. So both people feel it but while Venus is sort of mesmerized by Pluto, Pluto could end up becoming frightened of Venus because of the unique and overpowering influence he/she has on them. If you are dealing with someone who considers themselves strong and independent they could be in for a surprise and not like what they are feeling and ultimately blame it on Venus while it's their own planet making them feel this way. So there is likely to be intense projection and confusion involved.
 

jkxx74

Premium Member
You're not kidding. One of the things I absolutely LOATHE about having my natal Venus squarng my Pluto -- as well as squaring the natal Pluto of just about everyone my age! -- is the fact that I appear to attract more than my share of men who are either married or in a steady(?) relationship but looking for a little action on the side. At this point in my life, I don't consider it my place to judge these men for what they're doing because that's their decision to make -- but for the sake of my own well-being, I choose not to be a party to this and I make it clear to the man right from the beginning.
I can relate although with Venus square Uranus rather than Pluto there - you start wondering about the point of having that aspect in your natal chart in the first place. But if you pick someone slightly younger or older then there is no aspect so it could be pretty normal and even good. It still ***** because if you follow what everyone else is doing you end up getting ******* pretty royally.

Yes I understand I hate being Venus it's the worse I think the Venus person is the one who really suffers. Pluto could really care less that's what I think. Sometimes this feels fatal and like I'd do anything to be near that person.
The Pluto person can suffer too but much later when they realize what they've done to the other person and how much pain they caused them. Not everyone will, of course, and even if they do the damage is done to you so you don't really get anything out of them repenting a decade later after you've been devastated. Still there is the matter of choice and people always have the opportunity to avoid something that will go south. I just wonder what the lesson is supposed to be for us with the Venus square X aspects.
 

ChildOfVenus

Well-known member
I just wonder how the trine between Venus and Pluto works in composite when you have the opposition on synastry. I remember you did comment about this before. Some people say the Composite isn't really important but I think it is.
I can relate although with Venus square Uranus rather than Pluto there - you start wondering about the point of having that aspect in your natal chart in the first place. But if you pick someone slightly younger or older then there is no aspect so it could be pretty normal and even good. It still ***** because if you follow what everyone else is doing you end up getting ******* pretty royally.

The Pluto person can suffer too but much later when they realize what they've done to the other person and how much pain they caused them. Not everyone will, of course, and even if they do the damage is done to you so you don't really get anything out of them repenting a decade later after you've been devastated. Still there is the matter of choice and people always have the opportunity to avoid something that will go south. I just wonder what the lesson is supposed to be for us with the Venus square X aspects.
 

Vyri

Banned
Did you know that a synastry chart only references a composite chart with planets of let's say another or his within your natal wheel and vice versa that join in a single map expression as the apex angle..Let's say you have your Venus in his 12th house in Leo over his Mars, and the composite or synastry chart has the chart portray a trine betw your Venus and his Mars trine in lets say Libra and Gemini consecutively..what do you think the blend would suggest. Remember nothing is ever to be forecast without the natal charts bearing out the energies with first consideration.

12th house Venus/Mars in Leo will have consideration with mention of children of course, secret worries anxieties of the Mars individual possibly thinking his love interest Venus experiences some misgivings with conception issues or that the love interest is shy and a very creative retiring type, which he takes the lead to draw out and the romance is experienced on a very loving clandestine level.
Now the composite chart has Venus in the 10th house with an opposition of Mars in it from the 4th house. You would not only have to know the natal charts of the individuals as to how the temperaments would be demonstrated bc of their individual charts, i.e.; His Mars in Gemini in the 5th, and his Mars trine to his Venus from the 9th in Libra..as well as these two planets in individual sectors within her chart for a blend. In the composite charts the influence of the individuals planets within each other's charts sectors..the blend of the planets in aspect with each other..etc..but the composite chart now combines these influences by augmenting all these planets places into one chart of their combined hour/ minute =planets/house/signs/aspects. Robert Hand has a book out with the many combinations that describes and gives examples how to understand these blends..it is good reading as are with all his books.

The composite would then read something like this..the opposite Venus Mars effect would strengthen the Venus character to emerge in the relationship and even disagree or discuss argumentatively about the way children should be reared within the house hold. The 4th house would bring into scrutiny the Father attitudes against the much too much Motherly prospective's? 10th vs 4th consideration's. But it is the natural trines/ease or squares/obstacles etc. other aspects which would bear out the individual house experiences not in the composite chart first, but in the individual charts, then the planets from their host positions rulings arriving into other individuals houses to be considered of fated testimony.. The composite is a guide post to activities that are of mental integration efforts that each chart promises on a very personal experience. The opposition of Mars and Venus in the composite would be defused by the trine energies each experienced with each other's planets falling within specific house areas each owned. It is a very complicated process
which is not an easy task to transmute or interpret. It takes a knowledge of the individual and how they integrate energies from their own charts into everyday experiences. And then there are the transiting energies of each passing day or night movements.

It is enough to say that it takes a long while to chart just how these influences will draw the unions to actualize activities into events:sideways:

Take care that your potentials will be realized gainfully

All the best
Vyri
 

GeminiGrrl

Well-known member
I can relate although with Venus square Uranus rather than Pluto there - you start wondering about the point of having that aspect in your natal chart in the first place. But if you pick someone slightly younger or older then there is no aspect so it could be pretty normal and even good. It still ***** because if you follow what everyone else is doing you end up getting ******* pretty royally...

I just wonder what the lesson is supposed to be for us with the Venus square X aspects.

Well, as it happens, I have both Venus square Pluto and Venus square Uranus in my natal chart (which is a real pain in the ***)...but at least in my own case, I think I have some idea what the lesson is that I'm supposed to learn from this. The answer can be found in my fifth house, which is ruled by Aries. That sounds as if it might be a good thing since the fifth house is a Fire house...until you find out that this is where I have both my Saturn (which of course tends to inhibit the energy of whatever house it touches, in my case the house of romance and pleasure and creativity) and my North Node, although they are thankfully not conjunct.

Based on what I've read, the karmic path of North Node in Aries is a weakened sense of self -- the person with North Node in Aries needs to learn how to stand up for himself or herself by establishing appropriate boundaries and communicating his or her own needs appropriately instead of simply giving in to other people and hiding his or her feelings in order to please them and keep the peace (South Node in Libra). It seems very much as if my natal chart almost knows that following the path of my North Node would probably be even harder than it is already if it were too easy for me to be in a romantic relationship because the temptation to lose myself in the relationship might be too great. I also have Chiron in Aries, although in the fourth house rather than the fifth, which appears to re-emphasize the necessity of learning not to let other people influence me too much. To top it all off, I've done some past-life regression work which suggests that one of the reasons why I'm in this incarnation is because I'm supposed to learn what love really is -- and like it or not, human beings seem to learn better under somewhat adverse conditions than they do when everything is easy.
 
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Vyri

Banned
The Nodal Axis or the North Node in Aries is a positive signet, can you tell me the source that speaks of Aries N.Node as a placement where the temperament needs re-evaluation; i.e., the lesson is to learn to augment a more positive reliance on self rather than giving your power away to others?

The North Node is a place where as we approach the higher spheres or echelons of our journey, heading North to the God head so to speak, it references a release of our gifts (North Node Karmic/Dharma path) a sort of Walk to 'Emma-us' where we come to know ourselves or the Christ principle in our spirits. I have never heard it expressed as a denigration point where we are needful of integrating experiences that we are lacking in our persona's. The N.N. is a pl. of the Moon that is the nurturing element we impart, after the Moon has eclipsed itself and released the dross to express the gainsay of her position where the North Node is.:sideways:

All the best

Vyri
 

ChildOfVenus

Well-known member
So do you know how the trine between Venus and Pluto works in composite? When you have the opposition in synastry?
Did you know that a synastry chart only references a composite chart with planets of let's say another or his within your natal wheel and vice versa that join in a single map expression as the apex angle..Let's say you have your Venus in his 12th house in Leo over his Mars, and the composite or synastry chart has the chart portray a trine betw your Venus and his Mars trine in lets say Libra and Gemini consecutively..what do you think the blend would suggest. Remember nothing is ever to be forecast without the natal charts bearing out the energies with first consideration.

12th house Venus/Mars in Leo will have consideration with mention of children of course, secret worries anxieties of the Mars individual possibly thinking his love interest Venus experiences some misgivings with conception issues or that the love interest is shy and a very creative retiring type, which he takes the lead to draw out and the romance is experienced on a very loving clandestine level.
Now the composite chart has Venus in the 10th house with an opposition of Mars in it from the 4th house. You would not only have to know the natal charts of the individuals as to how the temperaments would be demonstrated bc of their individual charts, i.e.; His Mars in Gemini in the 5th, and his Mars trine to his Venus from the 9th in Libra..as well as these two planets in individual sectors within her chart for a blend. In the composite charts the influence of the individuals planets within each other's charts sectors..the blend of the planets in aspect with each other..etc..but the composite chart now combines these influences by augmenting all these planets places into one chart of their combined hour/ minute =planets/house/signs/aspects. Robert Hand has a book out with the many combinations that describes and gives examples how to understand these blends..it is good reading as are with all his books.

The composite would then read something like this..the opposite Venus Mars effect would strengthen the Venus character to emerge in the relationship and even disagree or discuss argumentatively about the way children should be reared within the house hold. The 4th house would bring into scrutiny the Father attitudes against the much too much Motherly prospective's? 10th vs 4th consideration's. But it is the natural trines/ease or squares/obstacles etc. other aspects which would bear out the individual house experiences not in the composite chart first, but in the individual charts, then the planets from their host positions rulings arriving into other individuals houses to be considered of fated testimony.. The composite is a guide post to activities that are of mental integration efforts that each chart promises on a very personal experience. The opposition of Mars and Venus in the composite would be defused by the trine energies each experienced with each other's planets falling within specific house areas each owned. It is a very complicated process
which is not an easy task to transmute or interpret. It takes a knowledge of the individual and how they integrate energies from their own charts into everyday experiences. And then there are the transiting energies of each passing day or night movements.

It is enough to say that it takes a long while to chart just how these influences will draw the unions to actualize activities into events:sideways:

Take care that your potentials will be realized gainfully

All the best
Vyri
 

Vyri

Banned
The potential of the composite is the synastry's beginnings. Blend the houses and signs they fall in within each other's charts, the opposition will speak of separation energies to these ends or of these meanings or activities of their house placements. Venus will not accept Pluto to integrate energies he represents, she separates herself and or her house activities from his presence where ever he rules. The square she should experience 'forming' to him presents obstacles in her nature she resists of him and his rule.

The places in the composite these planets have lordship of will integrate house sign forces for Pluto/Venus in more of a benign way in that the influence of Venus Pluto possible achievements activities will render success from whatever houses they make their influence felt from. The meanings of Pluto/Venus will experience a buffering effect of the harshness of the square or opposition by the trine. New experiences also within the houses they represent in the composite will also aid them in achieving new expressions of to their potential great good. Venus/Pluto effects of lets say a movie stars persona would give her great appeal to the masses and vice versa for a man. As Clark Gable was lauded by both sexes as a he man, he was said to appeal on a grand scale to all sects of animal attraction or human appeal or amativity?

Instead of the harshness or antipathy of their energies you would find yourself trying to negate by the opposition/square aspect of Pluto/Venus, you would be able to acclimate yourself with different approaches to diffuse the limiting effects of the potential malefic influences by the benign energy of the trine or sextile in the composite. The square and opposition are potentially strife causing energies that lets say being in a large crowd of people would call for extra added care that your purse would not be dislodged from your person..and as to physical affront, there would have to be other energies from Mars or Uranus Saturn with these placements from preferably hidden houses 12th or 8th or 6th and even the 5th or angles of a 7th 1st or 10th nature. The forth you would have to make sure you had adequate locks and protection on each door. It is a neighboring community attractiveness energy. Some opposition to these effects would be lessened by the trine to these planets within the composite, an aid if you will would present itself from the composite houses that the harsh effects would not be fruitful to accomplish initial Karmic/Dharma energy.

Hope this helps

All the best
Vyri
 
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jkxx74

Premium Member
GeminiGrrl,

having my Saturn opposite the NN in my own chart I can definitely attest to that being a bad placement - but the squares are oodles of trouble too. I know quite a few people with a 5H Saturn and it is as you say a placement that makes it harder for them to be spontaneous but also more understandable from my point of view with the heavy Cap influence - they don't seem restricted but just do things in a more predictable way which has its positives.

On the nodes, I was doing some reading today as a friend has hers in 8 Pisces, the same degree as the upcoming solar eclipse on the 26th. Your description of your placement sounds right to me, and I'd add knowing that you have the right to assert yourself when you genuinely feel you should, regardless of the other's expectations. It is true that we learn better under adverse conditions, that seems to be the way Saturn teaches us lessons and apparently also what is implied by square aspects - learn what we really want or need by observing the things we do not. It's just the part about how to actually get the things we do care about that stumps me.

Vyri's previous post was an interesting read as it states that a composite can show that energies actually work out quite differently long-term than what is implied by a synastry alone (I have observed this and agree with it) and that one should not take the synastry or even one's own aspects as definite predictors of what might unfold. And there's the matter of squares being about internal conflict, where a relationship (in case of Venus squares) can simply be the arena for that conflict to unfold where it's our internal pattern being played out even if we think it's happening because of the relationship.


Vyri,

thank you for the insightful post on synastry vs composite placements. That helped put some ideas into perspective.

Wouldn't this definition of the NN essentially state that going along the NN path is a lesson in learning we can actually do things which seem impossible for us, with the gift of that realization being that we end up doing a whole lot more since these endeavors would seem easy compared to the "impossible" feat we accomplished?


ChildOfVenus,

Venus trining Pluto in a composite would tend to bring out Pluto's transforming qualities to the relationship in a positive way - Pluto does in some ways represent survival so this aspect can help with making relating style changes that can help a relationship survive. Otherwise the usual bits about the relationship transforming both partners' ways of relating in the future still applies. On a more extroverted note it can also mean easily attracting necessary resources together just when these are needed the most.
 

GeminiGrrl

Well-known member
The Nodal Axis or the North Node in Aries is a positive signet, can you tell me the source that speaks of Aries N.Node as a placement where the temperament needs re-evaluation; i.e., the lesson is to learn to augment a more positive reliance on self rather than giving your power away to others?

The North Node is a place where as we approach the higher spheres or echelons of our journey, heading North to the God head so to speak, it references a release of our gifts (North Node Karmic/Dharma path) a sort of Walk to 'Emma-us' where we come to know ourselves or the Christ principle in our spirits. I have never heard it expressed as a denigration point where we are needful of integrating experiences that we are lacking in our persona's. The N.N. is a pl. of the Moon that is the nurturing element we impart, after the Moon has eclipsed itself and released the dross to express the gainsay of her position where the North Node is.:sideways:

All the best

Vyri

Nearly every source I've read both on the internet and elsewhere speaks of the Nodes as representing the karmic path which an individual is following in his or her current incarnation (assuming a belief in reincarnation, of course).

The South Node is believed to represent the challenges which the individual faced in previous incarnations and the lessons which he or she learned as a result of those experiences as well as the limitations which those experiences imposed upon him or her. The South Node represents the choices which are easy and which seem familiar (because we've actually experienced them before!) and therefore feel comfortable but from which we don't really learn anything new because we've already been there, done that, and learned those lessons. The South Node also often represents the direction in which other people (often our parents) think we should go and teach us to go but in which for one reason or another we find ourselves unable to go even though part of us might actually want to go there. (In my own case, I find it very interesting that my father is pursuing the exact opposite nodal path from me -- Aries South Node, Libra North Node -- and that my mother's South Node is in Aquarius which is another collective-oriented sign.)

The North Node, by contrast, represents the lessons which we have incarnated this time around in order to learn -- and as a result, it frequently represents situations that prompt us to feel uncomfortable because they're unfamiliar and because the greatest growth is often achieved through difficulty. In my case, my South Node is in Libra so it's been very easy in the past for me to be a "people pleaser" -- and I think this had quite a bit to do with my mother's influence, because it's usually a lot easier for us to operate from our South Node when we're young. My North Node is in Aries, so part of my job has been to break away from some of what I learned from my mother when I was growing up. She couldn't really teach me how to stand up for myself because that was not what she had been taught either -- she was still trying to get a handle on it herself while she was raising me.
 

Tutu

Member
My Pluto opposes this guys Venus in a very wide orb, 8 degrees. But there is also my mars in his 8th house and his moon in my 8th. He also has a venus conjunction mars, which makes him unbelievably sexy, so I don't know exactly what is working the trick, but I feel totally obssessed. There's this very strong pull, so strong that I can feel his energy around me before I know he is there. It's like I am being sucked into a field of energy. I want to be there because I am fascinated, but I am very scared of being unable to control myself. That's how I feel around him, like I'm just about to do some silly thing because I don't seem to be able to hold myself together. I even forget to breathe. Even though I'm the Pluto it feels like he has the upper hand.

I just wonder how the Venus person feels. I don't manipulate situations so that I can be around him more often, quite the contrary. But it feels like he does that a little bit, as if he is playing with me. I feel very exposed around him, as if he is seeing me naked, so I try as hard as possible not to let out signs that I am into him, but he is clearly very perceptive and is probably enjoying the effect he causes on me very much, which make me even more angry at myself for being the foolish one.

I would blame my Pluto in EXACT opposition to my Aries rising by attracting these kind of people to me.
 

Tutu

Member
My Pluto in Libra opposes this guys Venus in Aries in a very wide orb, 8 degrees. But there is also my mars in the his 8th house and his moon in my 8th. He also has a venus conjunction mars, which makes him unbelievably sexy, and is otherwise a very venusian type, soft and sweet, so I don't know exactly what is working the trick. But I feel totally obssessed. There's this very strong pull, so strong that I can feel his energy around me before I know he is there. It's like I am being sucked into a field of energy. I want to be there because I am fascinated, but I am very scared of being unable to control myself. That's how I feel around him, like I'm just about to do some silly thing because I don't seem to be able to hold myself together. I even forget to breathe. Even though I'm the Pluto it feels like he has the upper hand.

I just wonder how the Venus person feels. I don't manipulate situations so that I can be around him more often, quite the contrary. But it feels like he does that a little bit, as if he is playing with me. I feel very exposed around him, as if he is seeing me naked, so I try as hard as possible not to let out signs that I am into him, but he is clearly very perceptive and is probably enjoying the effect he causes on me very much, which make me even more angry at myself for being the foolish one.

I would blame my Pluto in EXACT opposition to my Aries rising by attracting these kind of people to me.
 

ChildOfVenus

Well-known member
My Pluto in Libra opposes this guys Venus in Aries in a very wide orb, 8 degrees. But there is also my mars in the his 8th house and his moon in my 8th. He also has a venus conjunction mars, which makes him unbelievably sexy, and is otherwise a very venusian type, soft and sweet, so I don't know exactly what is working the trick. But I feel totally obssessed. There's this very strong pull, so strong that I can feel his energy around me before I know he is there. It's like I am being sucked into a field of energy. I want to be there because I am fascinated, but I am very scared of being unable to control myself. That's how I feel around him, like I'm just about to do some silly thing because I don't seem to be able to hold myself together. I even forget to breathe. Even though I'm the Pluto it feels like he has the upper hand.

I just wonder how the Venus person feels. I don't manipulate situations so that I can be around him more often, quite the contrary. But it feels like he does that a little bit, as if he is playing with me. I feel very exposed around him, as if he is seeing me naked, so I try as hard as possible not to let out signs that I am into him, but he is clearly very perceptive and is probably enjoying the effect he causes on me very much, which make me even more angry at myself for being the foolish one.

I would blame my Pluto in EXACT opposition to my Aries rising by attracting these kind of people to me.

How does it feel having his Moon in your 8th house? My Moon is in someone's 8th house and he has Pluto in his 5th house in his own chart. Which squares my Moon. Every time I see him the energy between us is so intense. I can barely speak it's just the way he looks at me. We also have Venus opposition Pluto in composite.
 

Tutu

Member
I have this feeling that he knows me through and through. And that makes him able to push my buttons with the slightest comment. Today we had a professional meeting. Although I was satisfied with me being able to control myself more, it feels that he strikes back when I control myself and don't show signs of my infatuation. It's as if he is punishing me a little bit for not showing my true self. He is my superior, and I think this relates to the fact that, if this ever came to be a relationship, that would be the taboo aspect about it that relates to matter about the moon in the 8th.
 
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