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Natal Astrology A place to discuss yours and others' birth charts (after you post your own birth chart interpretation). Includes psychological and relocation astrology, houses, aspects, and planetary dignity and debility.


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  #1  
Unread 02-14-2019, 02:00 AM
DonnieMost DonnieMost is offline
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Double Whammy (Saturn & Pluto transits)

My experience with Saturn & Pluto what not fun at all this past 5 years. Ive had a Saturn Return in my second house, with Pluto transit over my natal sun. Picture a 26 yr old guy bouncing back and forth between gig and gig. Im 32 now, And Ive learned a lot tho, thankful for the time given to me to learn on my behavior. But it was a ride, not my finest hour but a ride nonetheless.

Has anyone else experienced this?

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Unread 02-26-2019, 03:03 AM
Amnesia Amnesia is offline
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Re: Double Whammy (Saturn & Pluto transits)

Pluto conjunct my natal Sun in 2006 was life transforming. It was like I was put on a rack for a few years and I started to feel the transit when Pluto was exactly 10 degrees away from my Sun. At the time I wasn't an astrologer and I didn't know what was happening to me, but as the conjunction became exact in 2006 I had something resembling a breakdown! At the same time however a new life/direction was emerging and I am in a much happier place now.

It was a classic death/rebirth theme and it wasn't until a few years later that I realised what had happened and that was my 'penny drop' moment when learning astrology.

Last edited by Amnesia; 02-26-2019 at 03:05 AM.
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  #3  
Unread 02-26-2019, 10:57 AM
DonnieMost DonnieMost is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Amnesia View Post
Pluto conjunct my natal Sun in 2006 was life transforming. It was like I was put on a rack for a few years and I started to feel the transit when Pluto was exactly 10 degrees away from my Sun. At the time I wasn't an astrologer and I didn't know what was happening to me, but as the conjunction became exact in 2006 I had something resembling a breakdown! At the same time however a new life/direction was emerging and I am in a much happier place now.

It was a classic death/rebirth theme and it wasn't until a few years later that I realised what had happened and that was my 'penny drop' moment when learning astrology.
Glad you survived that. Did you have Saturn return to your natal position at that time as well. Or was the pluto transit the hallmark of that time?
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  #4  
Unread 02-26-2019, 11:04 AM
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JUPITERASC JUPITERASC is offline
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Re: Double Whammy (Saturn & Pluto transits)

Quote:
Originally Posted by DonnieMost View Post

My experience with Saturn & Pluto what not fun at all this past 5 years. I’ve had a Saturn Return in my second house, with Pluto transit over my natal sun. Picture a 26 yr old guy bouncing back and forth between gig and gig. Im 32 now, And I’ve learned a lot tho, thankful for the time given to me to learn on my behavior. But it was a ride, not my finest hour but a ride nonetheless.
Has anyone else experienced this?
If seeking predictive accuracy
keep in mind that not all transits are relevant/activated
and so
Factor in PROFECTION for unrivalled detail
BobZemcos detailed response on this topic
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/foru...758#post484758
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobZemco View Post

Re: Profections and revolutions
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall
It's enough to make your head spin.

The key is organization. I would like to help people with that, but being disorganized myself, that's probably not a good idea. I used to go from House-to-House, but that got to be tedious, so I started focusing only on activated Planets, and that works a lot better (for me).

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall
I already know that Saturn is active in his chart because this is a sixth house profection year for my husband and while Saturn is not the Year Lord (Mercury gets that honor) Saturn is important because natally he is in the 6th.

Okay.

The ruler of the Sign in which the Profectional Ascendant falls is activated and becomes the Year Ruler.
Any Planets in that Sign are also activated, because they are disposited (ruled) by the Year Ruler.
I know most profect in 30 increments, and that's fine, but
I profect by Oblique Ascension using Diurnal Hours.
For example, if the Ascendant is 15 Sagittarius 45' then using 30 it will fall at 15 Capricorn 45' b
ut profecting by Oblique Ascension using Diurnal Hours, it falls at 7 Capricorn 56'.
Continuing, 4 Aquarius 01' then 6 Pisces 35' all the way until you get to 15 Gemini 45' (7th House).

As you can see, there isn't a whole lot of difference, but
occasionally you'll find charts where the Profected Ascendant will fall exactly on a Natal Planet or a Lot...
and that's really intense, just as a Solar Return Planet falling exactly on the Profected Ascendant.
Anyway, one other thing to clarify is that it is the Sign that is activated, not the House.
The Profected Ascendant has activated Capricorn, which means the House holding the Sign of Capricorn in your Solar Return is activated, and as you can see, it is Capricorn that sits on your 2nd House/Sign.
Any Planets falling in the Sign will play a key role.
I can't remember who, but someone says that Planets transiting the Sign of the Profected Ascendant are important, but I cannot trace its precursor. No else says it (Zael and ibn Ezra certainly don't), and in practice, I haven't seen a thing out of it, but if people want to explore that, go right ahead.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall
Here is what stands out to me.

In the radix chart Saturn is the ruler of the ASC, as well as the Almuten of the 2nd house. I believe, though I'm probably incorrect, that when a planet is "activated" it activates the houses it rules as well as the house it is in. So 1st, 2nd, and 6th, with the 10th house as well since Saturn is the exaltation ruler of Libra.


Yes, I would consider the Exalted Sign for the Year Ruler.
Note that in the SR Chart, Saturn in Scorpio is in aversion to Libra, but he can see Capricorn and Aquarius.
If a Planet is not in its own Sign, then is important to be connected by sextile, square, trine or opposition. That allows the Sign Ruler to manage the affairs in that House, even though he isn't physically there. It's like you can leave home, but still be connected: you can call or e-mail, and a family member there, or another you put in charge (the house-sitter, baby-sitter, dog-sitter) can take your instructions and carry them out.

If you have no connection to your home, then you really aren't in control.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall
The back story is on the other thread, but already we can see a theme emerging. 1st, 2nd, and 10th are easily understood, but the 6th sort of leads you to want to think illness.

I'm not sure that's it. Over time, Signs and Houses kind of got to be used interchangeably, even though they aren't necessarily the same thing. For Solar Returns, it's actually the Sign that comes to the Ascendant, not the House.

So, the Profected Asendant activates that Sign in your Natal Chart, plus your Solar Return Chart, and then the Sign that comes to your Solar Return Ascendant becomes activated in your both your Natal and Profectional Charts. And of course the Ascendant Sign in your Natal Chart is always activated in the Solar Return Chart.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall
So insert first question. Each house means several different things and al-Qabisi says that we are to look at the triplicity rulers to determine how they will fare. The 6th house represents the native's illness, slaves, and beasts. The 1st triplicity ruler tells about illness, the second about slaves and domestics, and the third what will come to the native because of those. Is there a way to "fine tune" the significations of the houses to determine which of these will be affected? I guess the question is, does the signifying triplicity ruler need to be activated as well?

Uh, if I understand the question correctly, you're asking: "Now that I've identified the Rulers and Signs involved for the year, what the hell do I do now?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsmall
So the question becomes, since we know the worst Masha'Alla has written about happened, how do we judge if it will be reversed?

Before you do that, you have figure out exactly what's going on.
You probably already evaluated the condition of the Planets in the SR Chart, or at least the key players, and compared them to your Natal Chart.

A few pointers.

Mercury is not On-Station.

Not yet, anyway, and that is a big key in delineating the chart.

Mercury just crossed her own North Node so she's increasing in light and that's a +. She is within 12 of the Head and that's a +, so is being in her own Face, and being in the Bound of Jupiter and being received by Jupiter and being in a Bright Degree and being looked at by Venus and in aversion to Saturn. But Mercury is Slow and that's not good, and being Occidental Mercury is Female -- but in a Masculine Sign, House and Degree, and being Nocturnal (since she is Occidental) she is Above Earth....and so Out-of-Sect and in her own Detriment.
I should point out that some say the Head is in Fall in Sagittarius (and Tail in Fall in Gemini) but I'm not really sure about that and tend to ignore, since there's conflicting views on it.
Overall, Mercury is like a 2.5 on a Scale of 1 to 5.
At first glance, it appears that Mercury is applying to the sextile of Venus, but that isn't happening. Mercury did sextile Venus while Mercury was in Scorpio and Venus in Virgo, and due to Mercury's slowing, they stayed in the exact minute for nearly a week before Venus separated from Mercury.
Very, very important....it is Venus who separated from Mercury and Mercury is not applying to Venus.
Mercury cannot apply to Moon, because Moon is the faster of the two, so no aspect there. The next aspect is an opposition with Jupiter. Here's a case where a Planet goes Retrograde, then Direct, and still manages to perfect this opposition (with Mutual Reception) in Human Signs (Gemini plus the first 10 of Sagittarius).
I just can't help but notice the 10th Sign is Virgo -- Mercury -- ruling your fame and public standing, and the 9th House totally engulfs the 10th Sign.
And then the opposition is to Retrograde Jupiter. I was just commenting on another thread that is not an aspect, that is a collision and the signification of a Planet colliding with a Retrograde Planet is that you are being driven/forced/compelled to do something that you'd rather not do. That also fits well once again with the Out-of-Sect Mercury who is not Malefic (doing something it would not normally do otherwise)...and we saw the same thing in the Horary Chart.
Mercury never perfects the conjunction with Mars, because Mars changes Signs....but that is actually a good thing given that Mars rules Scorpio and Saturn is Retrograde there (meaning Saturn is weak even though he Joys in the 12th).
Anyway, with respect to health, Venus rules Taurus and Venus is in Libra in a Bright Degree, in a Degree of Increasing Fortune, sextile the Ascending Sign, trine the Ascendant Ruler and in aversion to Saturn.
No problems there (unless there's something freaky in the Natal Chart).
I mention that because sometimes it is easier to rule out what is not to be, and whatever is not ruled out is what it is.

I'll comment some more later, but right now I have to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently and die gallantly (because, you know, "specialization is for insects"...that's what Heinlein says).
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  #5  
Unread 02-27-2019, 12:32 AM
Amnesia Amnesia is offline
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Re: Double Whammy (Saturn & Pluto transits)

Only Pluto at that time. My first Saturn return didn't happen until years later and when that happened I suddenly became more aware of time and the direction of my professional life with some anxiety.

To get hit by both at the same time though must have been quite a rough ride as you say!

I also have Moon in the 8th House in Scorpio (along with Saturn) though so the Pluto transit in 2006 resonated with me on a very emotional level too.

Last edited by Amnesia; 02-27-2019 at 12:34 AM.
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