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Traditional Astrology For discussions on Traditional Astrology only. (Note: Typically, traditional astrology is defined as using techniques developed prior to 1700 by astrologers from the Hellenistic, Persian, Hebrew, and Renaissance eras. In general, it relies on Ptolemaic aspects (sextile, trine, square, opposition and conjunction) though there may be some exceptions, and always excludes modern planets (Neptune, Uranus and Pluto,) as well as any asteroids. The focus is less on what would be considered modern psychological chart interpretation and more on prediction. Members who wish to explore a combination of traditional and modern ideas should feel free to start a new thread in an appropriate forum for further discussion.)


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  #26  
Unread 07-11-2011, 09:51 AM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by ethertwist View Post
I have a few novice questions if you'd be so kind as to oblige?

When a planet is said to be Occidental, does that mean it's below the horizon (Houses 1-6) or does it just refer to it moving away from the Sun or in the opposite half of the chart where the Sun is located? Is my understanding of this completely incorrect?

Does a close opposition from Uranus to the Part/Lot of Fortune count or since Uranus is not considered a factor in Traditional astrology is that aspect deemed negligible?

What about Jupiter at a pitted degree? Is that a strong indicator against potential wealth or is it just one factor that could be mitigated by something more promising?

I apologize if my questions or trite or obvious. I'm trying to get a handle on Traditional astrology and I'm finding it a bit dense.
Although I do not study/use/or fully understand Traditional astrology, I do however want members to learn, so in that light will offer some 'learning links'

occidental
“Oriental means to rise before the Sun, occidental means to rise after the Sun. The qualities, significations and humoral qualities of the planets can change considerably according to whether they are oriental or occidental. For example, most planets gain in height and hair when oriental.”
http://www.skyscript.co.uk/gl/oriental.html

http://www.astrologyweekly.com/dictionary/occidental-or-oriental.php
http://www.your-astrology.com/oriental-vs-occidental-horoscopes.html
http://www.superglossary.com/Definition/Astrology/Occidental.html


Last edited by astrologer50; 07-11-2011 at 10:15 AM.
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  #27  
Unread 07-11-2011, 02:50 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

@atrologer50 I can agree with neptun too. also about appearance. Neptun is the higher octave of venus [deleted attacking comment - Moderator]

Last edited by wilsontc; 07-11-2011 at 07:16 PM.
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Unread 08-13-2011, 09:30 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by SniperBomber328 View Post
Sorry I am a little confused here, do we count the Sect Triplicity ruler of our chart, or of the sign that Fortuna falls in?
The Dispositor of the Lot of Fortune. You could also call it the Ruler Lot of Fortune. It will be the Planet that rules the Sign in which the Lot of Fortune is place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328 View Post
And what if the Lot of Wealth falls in Sagittarius in the 2nd House, do we count Jupiter soley as the Almuten for that lot?
Probably, but not necessarily. Sun and Jupiter are the Day and Night Sect Triplicity Rulers respectively. There is no Exaltation Ruler for Sagittarius.

It's possible for Jupiter to be the Sign Ruler, Sun to be Fire Sect Ruler and the Lot to be in the Term of Venus. In that case, which of those three aspects the Lot within 2° applying/separating?

If none aspect the Lot, then which if the three is strongest?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328 View Post
My Fortune falls in Pisces at 24 Degrees, and I want to know if my calculations for the Almuten is correct; Pisces at 24 degrees

Ruler: Jupiter
Exaltation: Venus
Triplicity Ruler: Mars
Term Ruler: Mars

So is my Almuten Mars?
Correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328 View Post
Mars falls in the 1st House, is Occidental (Rises after the Sun), Domicile (In Scorpio), Free from Combustion, in its own Triplicity, direct in motion and conjunct my Mercury.
Then it sounds like Mars is very strong.

If Mars is Occidental and conjunct Mercury, then Mercury is Occidental in a Feminine Sign where it should be. Mercury sounds very strong as well, especially being received by Mars. That is something positive.

How that would apply to your life is that you would get a lot of lucky breaks, much more so than the average Joe.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328 View Post
My Mars and Jupiter recieve no aspect towards eachother (or by face, term, etc.), and Jupiter is Cadent but conjuct my Fixed Star Spica, rises before the Sun (Oriental), and Conjunct my Asc, and falls in its own Face. Which I think Jupiter is the Almuten of my Lot of Wealth.
Um, you might be confusing that with the Lot of Fortune. The Lot of Wealth is the Ascendant + 2nd House Cups Degree + Ruler 2nd House.

If Pisces is rising, you most likely have Aries as the 2nd House Cusp. Your Almuten of Wealth would be the Planet that has dominion over the Lot of Wealth, the Ruler of the Lot of Wealth, Jupiter, the 2nd House Cusp and the 2nd House Ruler.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MsK View Post
My Part/Lot of Fortune is at .5 Leo

I can not tell if my Almuten is the Sun or Jupiter.
Neither can I without seeing the chart.

5° Leo is the Term of Jupiter. If your chart is a Night Chart, then Jupiter is both the Term Ruler and Fire Sect Triplicity Ruler and has more power than the Sun.

Also, just so everyone understands, Ptolemy used the Lot of Fortune to determine wealth, but everyone else uses the Lot of Substance, which I call the Lot of Wealth since that is what it signifies.

I'll post two charts here you can look at for more help.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
1. When looking at the Profections and Solar Returns, what do you want see?

What makes an astrologer say "this is the year"?
What is the nature of the testimonies?
Did the past astrologers use the same system?
Ah, it was you. Okay, I answered those questions on another thread in the Predictive Section about William Lily's Death Indicators (or something akin to that).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
2. Judging the natives chart, how would we know if the native wont marry?
You'll see indicators. Note that to the Ancients, marriage and cohabitation were one in the same. Rich people had weddings. Poor people usually licked each other and then went back to herding sheep or whatever it was they were doing.

Feral Saturn, Feral Venus, certain Combust significators, Almuten of Marriage inconjunct to both Sun and Moon, and a few others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
Concerning the natives partner. Could we describe her character? Looking at the natives chart?
In very general terms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
3. Primary Directions. What is this? Is this a modern thing or was this practiced by the ancients?
I answer that on the other thread, but briefly, it's a method of turning the Earth and watching the Planets form aspect to each other and to Chart Points (like the Ascendant, Midheaven and Lot of Fortune).

I have a theory that where the Directions are off by a day or two and the birth time is otherwise correct, the discrepancy is caused by perturbations in the Earth's orbit and also be 8.4 earthquakes that jar Earth.

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Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
1. When Ptolemy says Quadrant he means houses, yes?
I think Quarters might be a better term to use. What he means is the 12th, 11th and 10th Houses, and the 4th, 5th and 6th Houses are Masculine Quarters, while the 1st, 2nd and 3rd Houses and the 7th, 8th and 9th Houses are Feminine Quarters.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
So the Almuten would be looked at and behave differently in one of them?
Not behave differently, rather be slightly weakened. Ideally, Sun, Jupiter and Saturn should be in Masculine Signs and Houses in Masculine Quarters and Oriental of the Sun. Mercury and Venus should be Occidental and in the Feminine Quarters (and Moon should be in a Feminine Quarter too).

I often mention a Planet's "condition" and what I'm looking at is whether a Planet is Fortunate or Unfortunate, and how strong it is.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
How do we tell the difference between losing and gaining when looking at the chart?
Aspects mostly, but also Primary Directions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
If the progressed planet can only trine, square, sextile, conjunct, or is in opposition to the Lot of Wealth. Is it correct to presume trines and sextiles means gain and squares and oppositions are the loss of wealth?
That would be more or less true.

That goes back a lot to "condition." A Fortunate Planet that is powerful in the chart will give you a lot of gains, while a Fortunate Planet that is weak only so-so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
Could we tell how the native loses his wealth?
Yes, the aspects in the Natal Chart will tell the story, the Primary Directions will tell when.

The SniperBomber has a powerful Mars that also appears to be Fortunate. Let's assume Mars is the Almuten of Wealth. Look at your Primary Directions for the Ascendant. You see Ascendant trine Lot of Fortune. Calculate the age when that trine takes place.

Now determine the Profected Ascendant for that year (I show that on the other thread). Assume Aries or Scorpio is the Profected Ascendant. That makes Mars the Year Ruler.

Now cast the Solar Return Chart for that year and look at Mars. If Mars is in good condition, then it's probably a substantial gain. If Mars is in bad condition, then probably a minor loss.

Then look at the Primary Directions for that year to see when exactly that will happen.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
1. Converse direction. Another predictive technique, yes? Does this go by another name?
This gets confusing. You can direct Points and Planets in the order of Signs (Gemini, Cancer, Leo, Virgo etc) or against the order of Signs (Capricorn, Sagittarius, Scorpio, Libra etc). There is some confusion as to which is actually "converse."

Some say the Ascendant's motion (against the order of Signs) is direct and so any directions in the order of Signs is converse) while others say the Ascendant's motion (against the order of Signs) is converse.

Perhaps I should point out that the Ascendant naturally moves clock-wise in the Natal Chart. It is rising (toward the Midheaven -- the Midheaven moves toward the Descendant, the Descendant toward the Nadir).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
Do we measure the difference in degrees and convert them into time?
Basically yes, but directions of the Midehaven are in Right Ascension, while those of the Ascendant are in Oblique Ascension (and those of the Descendant in Oblique Descension). The Planets are mixed so we use their Hourly Distance and Temporal Speed (as they cross the skies -- not their orbital speed).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
2. Sale property of your home. What makes you say this? If Saturn trines the Lot of Fortune, would the nature of how its gained be different?
Saturn rules Real Estate, land and agriculture, among things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
Traditionalist held astrology to higher standards then, yes? More class too.
Yes, it's based on actual mathematical theories, instead of guesswork.

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Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
This sounds like modern astrology. Could you clarify for this me? I presumed judgement can yield a yes or no verdict and not maybe.
It's not always Black & White.

The Topic of Children is a good example. Sometimes you get mixed testimonies, and there's no way to provide a definitive answer, except by looking at Profections, Solar Returns and Primary Directions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
Or is this like a gate, a separation between those than can learn to earn, keep what they make, and those that no matter what, will never accumulate wealth to the point of class change.
That would be a good way of describing it.

You can look at these two charts for more examples.




Lindsay Crosby was the son of famous crooner Bing Crosby (White Christmas and all those songs plus dozens of films with Bob Hope and others).

You see the Venus, the Ruler Lot of Wealth Combust and Unfortunate, and Mercury also Unfortunate being Perrine and Retrograde squares the Lot. Saturn the Almuten of Wealth is inconjunct the Lot.

He never really had it like the old man did. His music and film career never panned out, and so he never made the money his father did. That doesn't mean he was poor, because he wasn't. It just means he didn't do as well as his parents did.



In this chart, you see Venus the Almuten of Wealth in sextile to the Lot of Wealth, but Mercury makes no aspect and is weak being Stationary, plus you see the Sun squares the Lot of Wealth, while both Moon and Jupiter oppose the Lot of Wealth. Jupiter rules the 2nd House and being in Pisces squares the 2nd House, which I guess is better than not being in aspect to the 2nd House at all.

Professor Gumby has never had a net worth greater than $50,000 US Dollars, except for maybe 2-3 years in his life when he worked for [the now defunct] Arthur Andersen LLP, and when he was a private investigator.

Even now, he owns an apartment and a house and has a chunk of cash (mostly in Euros) but the value of all that does not exceed $50,000. His life-time average annual income only barely exceeds $13,000.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
1. Concerning the Lot of Debt. How sure are you of this? When using the Lots, do we look at bad aspects as warnings of bad happenings if the native proceeds to action?
The Lot of Debt is about your indebtedness, and the debts others owe to you. It may or may not impact your wealth. Usually if it will, you will see the Ruler Lot of Debt in square or opposition to the Ruler Lot of Wealth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
2. Azieme degree . What is this?Where did this idea originate? This is similar to pitted degrees, yes?
Yes. In reference to the history of Astrology, the Sumerians began keeping records of events of all manner: when a king ascended or died, when a war started, floods and other weather events, births, marriages and deaths, and of course infirmities and deformities observed at birth and over several thousand years identified certain Zodiac Degrees as essentially Benefic or Malefic.

Azieme Degrees in particular identify a birth defect or congenital deformity or illness.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
Now I want to know about social class. I recall you spoke upon Conception Charts or the Natal Epoch. To my understanding this determines of the Native will be born a King, Champion Athlete, Common man, and so fourth.

Could you enlighten me on this? Who's idea this comes from, the ancients thoughts on this. I'm very interested. Perhaps you can turn me to an astrologer that wrote upon this.
It's quite ancient. It pre-dates Aristotle. Ptolemy gives it a treatment as confusing as it might be. They used the Conception Chart to determine events that effect the child in the womb. From that chart, they also determined rank and station, whether a birth would be single, or multiple, whether male of female, and birth defects.

I don't believe some of the later astrologers understood the use of the Conception Chart and so they sought alternative methods (which is why there is such a variation in the concept of "bodyguards").

The underlying principle is the same in any chart of any type, that a Planet is a Planet until aspected upon. I guess that's sort of like Newton's Laws where an object at rest remains at rest until acted upon.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
One last thing, chart rectification. How does this work? Could you show me?
Now that I have figured out the Animodar sure.

I'll use Professor Gumby's chart to keep it simple. That chart is a Preventional Chart. How do we know? Because the Moon is applying to the conjunction of the Sun having completed its opposition to the Sun. So we need to cast a Lunation Chart for the Full Moon prior to birth (we would cast a Lunation Chart for the New Moon if the chart would be Conjunctional).



We use the Light Above Horizon for Full Moon Lunation Charts (and that would include a Lunar Eclipse for this purpose). That is the Sun at 28° Taurus 07'.

Which Planet has the greatest Dignity in the Sun? Venus does. Venus is the Sign Ruler and Venus is the Earth Sect Triplicity Ruler.

Now, switch back to the Natal Chart and look at Venus. To which is Venus closer in Degrees, the Ascendant or the Midheaven? Obviously the Midheaven at 1° Virgo 31'.

Yes, there are 30° in Virgo, but at Latitude 39°N07' how many degrees actually cross over the Midheaven as the Ascendant crosses the Horizon?

Look at the Right Ascensions of the Midheaven. We want the full 30° of Virgo so we subtract the Right Ascension at 0° Libra from the Right Ascension at 0° Virgo.

180°00' = 0° Libra at 39°N07'
152°05' = 0° Virgo at 39°N07'
-------
xxxxxxx

179°60'
152°05'
-------
027°55'

Now, the Midheaven is at 01°Virgo31' so how much Right Ascension is that?

153°32' = 1°31' Virgo at 39°N07'
152°05' = 0°00' Virgo at 39°N07'
-------
001°27'

We need the Hourly Distance of Venus.

Venus is at 4° Cancer 39'. Her Right Ascension is 95°04 and her Oblique Ascension is 74°30.

The Ascensional Difference is the Right Ascension minus the Oblique Ascension:

AD[Venus] = 95°04' - 74°30'

AD[Venus] = 20°34'

Venus is out-of-Bounds in this chart with a Declination of 24°N54' so we add the Ascensional Difference to 90° giving us 110°34' for the Semi-Diurnal Arc (we would subtract if the Declination was Negative and we would reverse that for those living in the Southern Hemisphere).

The Temporal Hours will be the Semi-Diurnal Arc divided by 6:

TH[Venus] = 110°34 / 6 = 18°25'

Then to find the Hourly Distance, we divide the Meridian Distance by 18°25'

How far away is Venus from the Midheaven by Right Ascension? We just subtract the RA of Venus from the Right Ascension of the Midheaven (RAMC).

Meridian Distance = 153°32' - 95°04'

Meridian Distance = 58°28'

Now we divide the Meridian Distance by the Temporal Hours to get the Hourly Distance

HD[Venus] = 58°28' / 18°25'

HD[Venus]= 3°10'

The Hourly Distance tells you the number of Houses away from the Meridian (either the MC or the IC) that a Planet is and that is what the whole number represents, and the fractional part is how far away from the Cusp of the House that Venus is.

Each House is essentially 2 Diurnal Hours. Think of the chart as a clock where the Ascendant is 6:00 AM so then 3 Houses or 6 Hours (3 * 2 = 6) later it is 12:00 PM and that is the Midheaven and the 6 Hours later is the Descendant at 6:00 PM and then 6 Hours later is the Nadir/IC at 12:00 AM and then we've come full circle back to the Ascendant at 6:00 AM in a 24-Hour period.

We just have to set up a simple proportion or a ratio:

27°55' : 2 = 1°27' : X

From our high school math, we know to cross-multiply and divide, and so we have:

2 * 1°27' / 27°55' = X

It's easier to use decimal notation:

2 * 1.45 / 27.91666 = X

2.9 / 27.91666 = X

0.03582 = X

So, um, what exactly is "0.03582" in Degrees?

It is less than 1°. That is what the big fat "0" means.

Let's multiply by 60 to convert to minutes:

60 * 0.03582 = 2.1492

That gives us 0°2.1492' of arc.

Multiply the 0.1492 * 60 = 8"

So there is a difference of 0°02'08"

Can we round that off? Sure, let's call it 0°02'

Now, there are 24 Hours in one day and 360° in the Zodiac Circle.

How many Degrees are in 1 Hour?

Simple, 360 / 24 = 15° and you might notice the longitudinal meridians around Earth are 0° 15° 30° etc and most of the Time Zones are based on those.

If there are 15° in 1 Hour, how many Degrees are in 1 Minute?

Simple, 15° in 60 Minutes or 1° every 4 Minutes.

And that is 30' every 2 Minutes or 15' every Minute/60 Seconds or 1' every 4 seconds.

So my birth time is off by about 8 or 9 seconds or so.

Now, if I was the Anal Retentive Astrologer, I would rip everything up, chuck it out the window and start with a whole new chart and post 30 "Read My Chart" threads about the new birth time.

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Originally Posted by Sugar View Post
Thanks for the help. I'll pay you back one day
Pay it forward.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Crosby Wealth.jpg (52.2 KB, 286 views)
File Type: jpg Gumby Wealth.jpg (51.4 KB, 243 views)
File Type: jpg Gumby Full Moon.jpg (37.5 KB, 675 views)
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  #29  
Unread 08-31-2011, 12:04 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

I think 2nd house is also about speech.....I dont know but a general predictive thought : people who are not good in communication are not good in wealth.
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Unread 08-31-2011, 12:35 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

Quote:
Originally Posted by bardevolved;311448[B
]I think 2nd house is also about speech[/B].....I dont know but a general predictive thought : people who are not good in communication are not good in wealth.
communication is seen by evaluating mercury, what houses mercury rules (gemini, virgo) and 3rd house being basicc education and naturally ruled by gemini.

I have never heard of 2nd house being about speech? could you cite some sources?
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Unread 08-31-2011, 01:00 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

I've heard about the second house being associated with the throat, if that's what someone is referring to?
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Unread 08-31-2011, 02:53 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by byjove View Post
I've heard about the second house being associated with the throat, if that's what someone is referring to?
This is health conditions for the signs.

the weakest point for taureans, I can vouch for that having tonsils out at 16 after years of misery. Mercury in taurus can be good singers. I don't associate with throat and earning money with communnications, unless mercury is posited 2nd
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Unread 08-31-2011, 07:08 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

I ll tell u my story................

First of all vedic astrology tells that 2nd house is the house of speech , and any affliction to 2nd house causes speech impediment.

In my case....2nd house lord mars is in 6th house ...but i noticed mercury the natural ruler of comunication is in 29 degree of libra and in the 8th house. 29 degree is a critical degree. Sometimes i feel like talking too much...and most of the times i dont feel like talking....basically i am silent type.....but if your in a job that needs you to talk too much how difficult it is when someone who does not want to talk.................oh there were lot more emotional turmoil happened in my life,.....but i should not talk about them as these are out of context

When a person becomes too good from heart he becomes a poet, and even a drunkard....astrology ? why i was so intrested in astrology....its due to the kid of family influence
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Unread 08-31-2011, 07:18 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by bardevolved View Post
I ll tell u my story................

First of all vedic astrology tells that 2nd house is the house of speech , and any affliction to 2nd house causes speech impediment.

In my case....2nd house lord mars is in 6th house ...but i noticed mercury the natural ruler of comunication is in 29 degree of libra and in the 8th house. 29 degree is a critical degree. Sometimes i feel like talking too much...and most of the times i dont feel like talking....basically i am silent type.....but if your in a job that needs you to talk too much how difficult it is when someone who does not want to talk.................oh there were lot more emotional turmoil happened in my life,.....but i should not talk about them as these are out of context

When a person becomes too good from heart he becomes a poet, and even a drunkard....astrology ? why i was so intrested in astrology....its due to the kid of family influence
perhaps if you mentioned you were referring to vedic instead of 99% of us here using modern western astrology, then there would be no confusion
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Unread 09-01-2011, 08:37 AM
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Wink Re: A natives wealth

Originally Posted by SniperBomber328
Sorry I am a little confused here, do we count the Sect Triplicity ruler of our chart, or of the sign that Fortuna falls in?
The Dispositor of the Lot of Fortune. You could also call it the Ruler Lot of Fortune. It will be the Planet that rules the Sign in which the Lot of Fortune is place.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328
And what if the Lot of Wealth falls in Sagittarius in the 2nd House, do we count Jupiter soley as the Almuten for that lot?

Probably, but not necessarily. Sun and Jupiter are the Day and Night Sect Triplicity Rulers respectively. There is no Exaltation Ruler for Sagittarius.

It's possible for Jupiter to be the Sign Ruler, Sun to be Fire Sect Ruler and the Lot to be in the Term of Venus. In that case, which of those three aspects the Lot within 2° applying/separating?

If none aspect the Lot, then which if the three is strongest?


Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328
My Fortune falls in Pisces at 24 Degrees, and I want to know if my calculations for the Almuten is correct; Pisces at 24 degrees

Ruler: Jupiter
Exaltation: Venus
Triplicity Ruler: Mars
Term Ruler: Mars

So is my Almuten Mars?

Correct.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328
Mars falls in the 1st House, is Occidental (Rises after the Sun), Domicile (In Scorpio), Free from Combustion, in its own Triplicity, direct in motion and conjunct my Mercury.

Then it sounds like Mars is very strong.

If Mars is Occidental and conjunct Mercury, then Mercury is Occidental in a Feminine Sign where it should be. Mercury sounds very strong as well, especially being received by Mars. That is something positive.

How that would apply to your life is that you would get a lot of lucky breaks, much more so than the average Joe.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SniperBomber328
My Mars and Jupiter recieve no aspect towards eachother (or by face, term, etc.), and Jupiter is Cadent but conjuct my Fixed Star Spica, rises before the Sun (Oriental), and Conjunct my Asc, and falls in its own Face. Which I think Jupiter is the Almuten of my Lot of Wealth.

Um, you might be confusing that with the Lot of Fortune. The Lot of Wealth is the Ascendant + 2nd House Cups Degree + Ruler 2nd House.

If Pisces is rising, you most likely have Aries as the 2nd House Cusp. Your Almuten of Wealth would be the Planet that has dominion over the Lot of Wealth, the Ruler of the Lot of Wealth, Jupiter, the 2nd House Cusp and the 2nd House Ruler.


-x-x-x-x-

A little messy above, but all that was written by Bob, whom I like to thank very much for giving my chart a deep analysis. Didn't notice earlier so I apologize, and thank you bob once again for replying to so many posts. ( I sould like some sort of semeritan, however you spell that).

Also Bob if your reading this, what I meant was that my Part of Wealth lands at 7 Degrees Sagittarius in the 2nd House. I'm Scorpio Rising, and my Venus sextiles this lot. Also my Mars Trines my PoF and Mercury partile Trines my PoF.
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Last edited by SniperBomber328; 09-01-2011 at 08:41 AM.
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  #36  
Unread 10-31-2018, 09:26 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy View Post


It's my understanding

that
traditional astrology centers on physical matters
and modern with non
ie. the mind.
That's erroneous - traditional astrology is concerned with mind as well

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy View Post

Having said that, I would like an understanding in traditionalist ways.

How do we delineate wealth in a horoscope?
Is it possible to find where the wealth will be made?
How about the timing or loss?

Where could I find this information?
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Unread 11-03-2018, 06:39 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
That's erroneous - traditional astrology is concerned with mind as well

Do you have some examples with explanation for the statement?
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Unread 11-04-2018, 08:27 AM
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Re: A natives wealth

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy View Post
It's my understanding that traditional astrology centers on physical matters and modern with non ie. the mind. Having said that, I would like an understanding in traditionalist ways.

How do we delineate wealth in a horoscope?
Is it possible to find where the wealth will be made?
How about the timing or loss?

Where could I find this information?
There are different ways and approaches in different system of astrology .Social network has Millions of information,if not thousands, on this .But most of them were afflicted like planets except few hundreds.In case if you follow those,to have ideas,and stick with it,then you will follow a way to find an answer like this :
: (2134>3267%rh31*1028)/12346#78 = 2

However,the foundation way of seeing mass wealth is based on traditional and very old texts and jamakol systems are.

Yes.Jupiter and Venus plays a role as karak,through sun.But it depends on individual horoscope.check DK ( Dana karak ) in your chart.immaterial of which planet is that,it is the key.If you have confusion on this ,then find out this key in another way.

a) Decide whether your lagna or rashi which is strongest ?
b) then 10 house planets from the above is the key planets.In case if you dont see any planets occupying it,then go to find out ,in navamsa,where this rashi 10th lord is sitting ? That Navamsa lord is the key .

However,the below ,will help ,fundamentally ,to open the door with the above key.

1.your Lagna lord should be strong
2.If Lagna lord connected with 5th and Ninth house by any means.( and not to be associated with 12th house or Lord )
3.Check 4th house lord.see where he is in the chart in birth.check who is 10th lord from this place.Finally check whether he has any association with Lagna or lagna lord.

The above is simple ,mostly applies with 70 % accuracy based on my research.( But remember there are several other ways to look deeply ).And to find the sources of wealth,check the same planet and house of the above point no 3.if this is ,

1.House - by self ,hard work
2.House - Collective with family
3.House - Brothers,local friends,influences,brokerages
4.House - Mother ,maternal ,through properties link
5.House- Due to previous good deeds,gambling,shares etc
6.House - through your enemies,debts (borrowing loans and converting as assets and run away )
7.House - Through Business associations,wife and relations
8.House - Lottery,unexpected gains,etc
9.House -through research,politics associations,father,teaching
10.House =through profession,etc.,
11-House- Friends,community,brothers
12-House- through overseas associations,imports,exports,

In case of need,I can send a tutorial with real case studies( not Old charts as usual as Justification after the incidents ) if needed,

God Bless all,
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  #39  
Unread 11-04-2018, 02:18 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by Senecar View Post


Do you have some examples with explanation for the statement?
If you have some examples with explanation that contradict the statement
do post examples and/or links to them
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Unread 11-04-2018, 08:33 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
If you have some examples with explanation that contradict the statement
do post examples and/or links to them
First of all, what is mind? How do you define mind? What do you mean when you say " traditional astrology is concerned with mind?"
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Unread 11-05-2018, 12:16 AM
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Re: A natives wealth

No you
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  #42  
Unread 11-05-2018, 03:09 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by Senecar View Post

First of all, what is mind?
How do you define mind?
What do you mean when you say " traditional astrology is concerned with mind?"
Indeed
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  #43  
Unread 11-07-2018, 09:27 AM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
Indeed
Because, in the past history, mind was usually equated with soul, which has its own entity, and flies into heaven for afterlife world.

Recently, most people don't believe in that concept of mind, unless deeply religious. But mind is more seen as function of biological entity = brain, and has motivation, desires, different emotions and reasonings i.e. ability to think in logical ways etc.

There are many diiferent schools of philosophy looking at mind from different angles, so it is not that all simple to say, well this is mind.
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Unread 11-07-2018, 12:13 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

It feels like chemistry class. Degreees, houses, transitions etc etc seemed too alien. I think it would take years for me to understand charts, especially wealth in the chart ( I truly want to learn though to play lottery )) )

Good input by everyone though. Thank you all for the discusssion.
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  #45  
Unread 11-07-2018, 02:22 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by Ada View Post

It feels like chemistry class.
Degreees, houses, transitions etc etc seemed too alien.
I think it would take years for me to understand charts, especially
wealth in the chart ( I truly want to learn though to play lottery )) )
Good input by everyone though. Thank you all for the discusssion.
a willingness to study is important
BENJAMIN DYKES translation simplifies these concepts
webpage at https://www.bendykes.com/
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  #46  
Unread 11-07-2018, 04:55 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
a willingness to study is important
BENJAMIN DYKES translation simplifies these concepts
webpage at https://www.bendykes.com/
His books are not for people whose bank accounts are empty
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  #47  
Unread 11-07-2018, 05:04 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by Ada View Post

His books are not for people whose bank accounts are empty
BENJAMIN DYKES has spent years
translating traditional texts previously unavailable in English
so the prices are reasonable
if you cannot afford ANY of the books then

Introduction to Traditional Astrology lecture costs $4.99

covers eight major differences in technique, attitude, and approach

which distinguish traditional astrology from modern types. (Length 38:20, 18MB).
https://www.bendykes.com/product/int...nal-astrology/
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=82p-D...eature=related Hippocrates Let food be your medicine: let medicine be your food. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvz9uSK3zXo Rosencrantz & Guildenstern are Dead Tom Stoppard http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KchhSIVwMdY Every exit is an entrance to somewhere else. VETTIUS VALENS FREE http://www.csus.edu/indiv/r/rileymt/...s%20entire.pdf
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  #48  
Unread 11-07-2018, 05:35 PM
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Re: A natives wealth

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Originally Posted by Ada View Post

His books are not for people whose bank accounts are empty
meanwhile there is a generously FREE alternative from Charlie Obert
at http://theastrologypodcast.com/2018/...YNlDgSz2m19brA
In episode 156 of THE ASTROLOGY PODCAST astrologer Charles Obert joins the show
to talk about the concept of essential dignities and debilities
and how they are used to determine the condition of a planet in an astrological chart.
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  #49  
Unread 11-07-2018, 09:29 PM
Ada Ada is offline
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Re: A natives wealth

Quote:
Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
BENJAMIN DYKES has spent years
translating traditional texts previously unavailable in English
so the prices are reasonable
if you cannot afford ANY of the books then

Introduction to Traditional Astrology lecture costs $4.99

covers eight major differences in technique, attitude, and approach

which distinguish traditional astrology from modern types. (Length 38:20, 18MB).
https://www.bendykes.com/product/int...nal-astrology/

Well i cannot invest the money in that right now is the right word I think, tight budget and have to be careful. Thank you for the alternative website, as always you are full of information. I should just read Bob or follow and I think I would be fine ( joking).

Thank you again.
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  #50  
Unread 12-17-2018, 06:44 PM
SunConjunctUranus SunConjunctUranus is offline
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Re: A natives wealth

Hello guys, just came across this site: https://af.cpptea.com/astrofox.php?d...o%20(Indonesia)

I had sun in detriment position and mercury rx combust. , but lot of wealth (29°capricorn) is near my sun 0°Aquarius. So what is that mean guys?

Additional: my jupiter cap is in fall and sextile venus, I should be careful with female.

Last edited by SunConjunctUranus; 12-17-2018 at 06:49 PM.
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