Help in relationship with my daughter

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Hello there.

I need help in understanding my relationship with my youngest daughter. She is only 8 but I feel there is something in her chart that must have just kicked off. There is something in her personalitly that wasn't there before, or rather wasn't felt by myself before.

My problem is I don't know which sort of chart to post. Would it just be her basic birth chart, or should I post a synastry chart, or maybe composite, or progressed composite as whatever is happening is really starting afresh.

I have ideas of my own, that I would really like to discuss but I would like to post the right chart to start with. So any help to guide me on the right chart to post, in regards to my daughter's personality 'enhancement' would be much appreciated.
 

waybread

Well-known member
Hey, Momma!

Why not start with her natal chart plus transits?

If the problem seems specific to you, such that she is acting out against you, then your birth chart plus transits might be helpful, as well.

Also, if you can indicate what problems you experience with her, that is generally more helpful than requesting a "blind" chart reading.

Then if any members would like more info, they can request it.
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Hi Waybread, thanks for helping.

Please find my daughter's chart attached (with transits) along with my chart.

Basically she appears to have changed over the last three months. With sulks and strops. A selfish attitude probably along with streaks of jealousy.

There is not a day goes by without her stropping over something, and I'm not sure how she does but she seems to hit a button in me everytime and would usually end up shouting at each other.

I love her to bits, and she has always been an easy child, even through the terrible twos and threes. And I'm usually a very placid laid back sort of person so my reaction to her shocks me and I have to consiously count to ten now to try and deal with her. Think about what I say before I say it etc. I'm better at this now, as I realise what's happening, but I would like to know what in her and possibly my chart is causing this. Is it long lasting or a temporary patch we are going through? I have been through temper tantrums etc with eldest, and we cope quite admirably. So I don't understand why I become so worked up about this.

From what I know I would look at either her Pluto/Mars in Sagg in 5th house. I know that can cause a fiery nature. Or maybe the moon in Aries?

But if it's something to do with these planets why has it only recently started happening? I look at the transits but I don't understand much. Mercury is conjunct those planets in Sagg but it moves fast doesn't it? So it wouldn't always have been there. So a slower moving planet maybe? The problem started when she returned to school in Sept and I wonder if a friend could be having some influence on her normally placid nature. So I look at the 11th house, nothing going through that house from what i can see. Still trying to fathom this out for myself, and I'm floundering in the dark here a bit. Does Uranus rule the 11th and if so would that planet moving towards the MC have an effect?

Ooh just had another look, is transiting Uranus square the Mars/Pluto conj? I'm not sure how to work that out. Could that cause the problem.

Hope I've made a little sense there. Looking forward to some enlightenment.

Thank you. :)
 

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wilsontc

Staff member
think you hit on it, to lissy

Lissy,

You said:
Basically she appears to have changed over the last three months. With sulks and strops. A selfish attitude probably along with streaks of jealousy...she seems to hit a button in me everytime and would usually end up shouting at each other...is transiting Uranus square the Mars/Pluto conj?


That makes sense to me transiting (moving planets in the sky) Uranus (friends, also rebellion) square (energy needs to be combined with) birth Pluto (transformation, also power) conjunct (energy is combined with) Mars (being, also anger) focused in the self-expression house indicating a time of rebellious, powerful anger focused on "drama". This is a LONG transit so...get ready for the next "phase" in your daughter's development! :D

Powerfully,

Tim
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Re: think you hit on it, to lissy

Lissy,

You said:



That makes sense to me transiting (moving planets in the sky) Uranus (friends, also rebellion) square (energy needs to be combined with) birth Pluto (transformation, also power) conjunct (energy is combined with) Mars (being, also anger) focused in the self-expression house indicating a time of rebellious, powerful anger focused on "drama". This is a LONG transit so...get ready for the next "phase" in your daughter's development! :D

Powerfully,

Tim

Oh Tim, you have no idea how ridiculously pleased I am to have got that right. Thank you. Going to have fiddle with the chart to see how long that lasts, unless there is an easier way of finding out. :)

Rebellion is a great description of what we are going through, and the anger...she finds it hard to control, as erm...do I, I guess.

Right going to continue my investigations.
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Couldn't it be the effect of transit Mars on her Sun and Mercury, together with the other 3 more or less in Opposition? That must be giving her some energy...and maybe you oppose that energy for some reason? Did you want her to be an easy child all her life? Well, she is a Lioness, some day she must start practicing! :w00t: :biggrin:

Oh I see yes. Is that likely to be more short lived? I'll take that over slow Uranus. :tongue:

She's a Leo yes, but I prefer my cute pussy cat over my roaring Lioness.

I don't mind her sharpening her claws every now and again, but not constantly and not always on me.:pouty:
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
She is really loving yes, compassionate and empathatic. And yes I would say she was always quick to temper but equally quick to cool. But not so much lately. It seems to take her longer and longer to come back down. And irrational, erm yes. :lol:
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Yes you have a point there Haizea I may well have something in anger that I regretted later. But I do realise that little Leos need as many cuddles as they do discipline so I always try to follow up whatever I say with assurances that she is still loved.
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Oh I see! Lightbulb moment. Yes to know she is good at something, clever, I'm getting it. Never dawned on me. The Leo pride?

I'm all open to suggestions Haizea that's why I'm here. :wink: :happy:

Thanks for taking the time and for your help.
 

waybread

Well-known member
Momma, there are two major places to look for the mother [i. e., you] in a child's chart. One is the moon (especially in a night birth) and then there is some astrological disagreement about whether the IC or MC best represents the mother [of a female born at night], so we might just look at the axis as a whole.

Your daughter natally has moon square Venus and Jupiter. This is one of the easier squares to have, but it can suggest emotional (moon) excesses (Jupiter) or tension between her need for independence (moon in Aries) or her seeing you as too independent of her vs her own desires [Venus in Cancer]. Your daughter has Cancer rising, so the moon is her ruling planet, making her feelings and her mother extra important to her. Your daughter's moon also makes a semi-square to her Uranus. This will make her feelings a little explosive and subject to sudden shifts.

Transiting Saturn, the Dr. No of the zodiac, has been rolling back and forth over her IC/MC axis, and will continue to do so through July of 2010, when it begins to move off. Coupled with her natally stressful Saturn opposite that assertive Mars/Pluto combination in Sagittarius, she is sort of hard-wired to be engaged in power relations struggles of one sort or another, whether she wants them or not. It sounds as though you are appearing as Saturn in her life. Which is not bad, and you must sustain your firm but fair discipline if you want her to turn out all right, but just to be sensitive to the possibility that you may be showing up in her life as the kind of authority figures (parent/s, teachers) that you didn't like in your own childhood.

Well, obviously a little girl needs and loves her mother! The question is, can astrology help you out any? I think so.

With her Leo sun/Mercury, your child really does need to feel that she's your little princess. When she does what you ask her to do, any praise will be an effort very well spent. With her Cancer rising and 12th house Cancer placements, she is probably also very sensitive. As annoyed as you will understandably become with her, try very, very hard not to shame her or humiliate her. Cancer rising is apt just to go into her shell and not come out, except to snap her claws occasionally. You can probably put up with some childish pouting or sulking now, but you don't want to lose your influence with her when she approaches those pre-teen and teen years, when girls are subjected to far more serious temptations than a minor temper tantrum with Mum.

With her Leo sun in the 2nd house, you may wish to help your daughter learn about money management at an early age. Things like managing a small allowance and helping with the shopping. She may like to have a collection or two of pretty things. Jewelry suitable for a child, perhaps.

Your daughter has an interesting formation in her chart called a "kite", which has its tip or apex on Saturn in Gemini in the 11th house. This will be an energy for her to develop in her lifetime. She may discover what this is when she gets older, but it could be something like being a manager or supervisor (Saturn) in a career that involves a large-ish organization (11th house) and a lot of mental stimulation (Gemini).

On a practical level, you might consult with your daughter's teacher, to see if her acting-out is restricted to the home or whether it is showing up at school.

BTW, I have two adult children. That childhood "tissue tension" or growing pains kind of sorted itself out when they hit about age 17--just before they were old enough to leave the house. Now we're on excellent terms, but they both live far away, and I miss those early childhood years!
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Probably not we all need reassurance in the same way, and, yes, I don't think that a Leo (and in general all Fire and Air signs) what needs the most is to be told that she is loved...I might be wrong. Anyhow, even if I am wrong, that part seems to come naturally from you, so she will know you love her. :smile: But I think she might need to be proved for real the fairness/unfairness of a situation, the reason why some things have to be the way they have to be.

And Leo in particular are famous for needing reassurance about their person (personality/appearance).

Yes that is a very good point too.

Anyway we are having a good day today with a little less complaining and a little more praising.:happy:
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Which is not bad, and you must sustain your firm but fair discipline if you want her to turn out all right, but just to be sensitive to the possibility that you may be showing up in her life as the kind of authority figures (parent/s, teachers) that you didn't like in your own childhood.

Hi Waybread. First of all I have to highlight this phrase you posted because it really struck a chord with me. Something that i didn't realise until just now. My parents were very strict with me, and sometimes I felt really oppressed in my childhood. I have tried so hard not to be like that with my children, and to be firm but fair. But the more I think about it, the more I see a reflection of myself at that age. Yes Momma could put on the strops too, but along with the waterworks. I must have driven my own mother nuts.

I have really mostly felt my daughters Rising Sign along with the better points of her Sun. The Moon traits would surface now and again. She can be explosive but nothing I can't handle and she would be calm as quickly as she had angered.

I do feel very much like Saturn at the moment, putting a damp blanket over everything she wants. And she wants a lot and is totally impracticle with it too. For example we can't have a Great Dane in 2 bedroom flat with along with a cat, no matter how much she pleads and stamps her feet. And I am very consious of putting out that fire, that little spark that she has inside. I really don't want to do that, so it's finding that fine balance. Being a Libran you'd think I'd be good at that, but it's bloomin' hard.

She is very sensitive yes, you are right there. And I remember now, Cancer is well known for being crabby and sulky and sitting in their shell until they get their own way. But I see you picked up on the 'praise' that Haizea mentioned. The Leo side wanting to know they are good at something, to be the best. That is certainly something which we are lacking here and something I am already working on. I will give you an example for today. I have gotten the Christmas puzzles out because well we're nearly in December. I made a start and did 3 quarters of the edge before getting fed up. So my daughter came along and started doing some pieces. Now this Mom would probably have said 'thanks for that', 'that's a big help to Mummy'. But today I changed tack, and told her how clever she was, and they were the most difficult bits because Mummy couldn't do them. Anyway she finished the edge and is now starting on middle. But the best bit was how she dragged Daddy in from the shed to show him what she'd done. I suppose if Leo is going to be proud then everyone must know. :biggrin:


You mention money. Now she is very shrewd with her pocket money. Rarely spends it. But...she squirrels away all over the house. There'll be 10p in her knicker drawer, 50p in her sock drawer and £1 in her purse. Not to mention what's in her coat pocket.

Thank you for the Kite information. I've looked that up and it looks interesting. I think I can see it...a big triangle with a little triangle. I'll look into that some more and bear in mind what you said.

So thank you for the insight from an experienced mom. I'm sure i will look back with longing at these years when both my girls have fled the nest. Mind you my eldest who will soon be eleven wants to live with us forever. :D My youngest is going to buy a farm, never get married and have lots of animals. So much to look forward to. :biggrin: :biggrin:
 

Inside Out Orange

Well-known member
My 8-year-old daughter is about two weeks younger than yours. Scrapes in as a Leo. Very headstrong and difficult. I have another friend whose daughter is another month on i.e. Sep - similar story. I think her joking words were "defective batch the lot from 2001"!

I can imagine your daughter is a real handful with that grand trine in fire. A lot of self-centredness with that Aries Moon and Leo Sun. The Sagitarrian Mars will always be wanting to do its own thing and unwilling to be restricted.

You've got to be a strong parent, set good boundaries and realise that the energies there hold great potential but like wild horses they need taming, defining and direction.

Basically she appears to have changed over the last three months. With sulks and strops. A selfish attitude probably along with streaks of jealousy.

Mine has been quite horrible this year. Really disagreeable and hard to get along. Lots of attention-seeking and niggling to the point where you end up shouting at her and shutting her in her bedroom.

It's lasted from about Feb through October then suddenly she's become a lot easier to get along with. There have been a lot of other things going on in our lives but ...

You mention money. Now she is very shrewd with her pocket money. Rarely spends it. But...she squirrels away all over the house. There'll be 10p in her knicker drawer, 50p in her sock drawer and £1 in her purse. Not to mention what's in her coat pocket.

Mine's a bit of a hoarder too. She's got Scorpio rising so seems to get a lot of money given to her by grandparents etc. She also hoards sweets. A whole top drawer of the things collected at Christmas, Halloween, birthdays etc. That said, I'm not sure whether it's that atypical for 8-year-olds in general.
 
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lissyloulou

Well-known member
Hi Inside Out Orange.

Ha I love your friend's joke about the defective batch. :D

Yes she has a lot of fire in her chart and no Earth signs to balance that out. She's very headstrong in her little way.

I've just been looking at the different types of 'things' can't think of the word. Cardinal, Fixed, Mutable. I'm a Libran, my husband is a Cancerian, my eldest daughter a Capricorn. So that makes us all Cardinals. All wanting to be leaders in our own way. My little Leo probably wants to be a Leader too but being a Fixed sign, uses her stubborness to get her own way. You'd think with all that Cardinalness?? we'd all be at loggerheads but were not. :) But we are a good mix family, with Air, Water, Earth and Fire as our Sun Signs.

Blimey the more you read into this astrology the more you want to know.

I like your wild horse analogy, I feel we have to find the solution to dealing with her now, as when she hits the teens I can see her being hard to control.

Oh and we don't have any problem with sweets here. She has a massive sweet tooth and nothing sweet lasts five minutes in this house.:joyful:
 

Inside Out Orange

Well-known member
my eldest daughter a Capricorn.

That's another thing to consider. Capricorn children are usually very quiet and obedient with fewer displays of emotion.

I'd guess that your Leo daughter is nothing like that. Where your elder daughter was probably easy to get along with, and you figured that was a product of your good parenting; suddenly your Leo daughter is providing big challenges. You're probably feeling like perhaps you've done something wrong second time around?

The children of 2001 have that big Saturn-Pluto opposition. Being in Gemini/Sag brings a bit more intensity to those signs that you'd usually expect. Depending on the child's chart will also affect where in their life that intensity is expressed.
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
Cardinals are natural starters, organizers...so she is the only subordinate :biggrin: and Leo doesn't make for a good one.

Anyhow, it is impossible to change some dynamics in relations...and relations are always something difficult (well, you as a Libra know better than me :biggrin: ). She might be learning something important from that as well.

Your Sun then is the most similar to hers. Maybe she prefers to face you than to face the other two members of the family, when she just has to release that anger.

I guess Leos need all that confidence and self-esteem to be the generous and warm people that they can be. How could you give if you don't have?

As a student, one of the girls sharing my flat was a Leo, and at 20 years old she would place herself in front of the TV when the rest were watching it, so that we all listened to whatever silly thing she had to say. :biggrin: Maybe she had not had enough reassurance as a child?

Oh, how would my Sun be most similar to hers? I don't get that bit. Sometimes I feel the furthest from her. I have no Leo in my chart either so nothing that I could pull out and say okay my such and such planet in Leo understands a bit, because I don't. Well I didn't, but I'm trying to now. :)
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
That's another thing to consider. Capricorn children are usually very quiet and obedient with fewer displays of emotion.

I'd guess that your Leo daughter is nothing like that. Where your elder daughter was probably easy to get along with, and you figured that was a product of your good parenting; suddenly your Leo daughter is providing big challenges. You're probably feeling like perhaps you've done something wrong second time around?

The children of 2001 have that big Saturn-Pluto opposition. Being in Gemini/Sag brings a bit more intensity to those signs that you'd usually expect. Depending on the child's chart will also affect where in their life that intensity is expressed.

Yes you are right, my Capricorn daughter is very quiet and rules are rules and generally whatever we say as parents goes. She will sit and do her homework as soon as she comes in from school, and will generally try to please. Leo is so very different. Not better or worse, just a great big bundle of loveable energy and different. :happy:
 

lissyloulou

Well-known member
I meant your Leo girl's Sun and yours are the most compatible in your house. Father and sister are Water and Earth Sun.

Yours are Fire and Air (compatible elements). But, yes, if you have no important Fire in your chart, it might not be so easy to understand a Fire Sun, even if in theory Fire and Air are compatible. :unsure:

Oh I see, thanks Haizea.:)
 
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