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  #351  
Unread 07-15-2020, 04:44 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

I agree with AppLeo (in my own words), that the real key to a better world in general, is viewing each other as individuals with "inalienable rights", instead of anonymous members of cultural groupings.

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  #352  
Unread 07-15-2020, 07:23 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
Siriusly
Seriously.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
however
given other comments elsewhere
such as


clearly something else is
Wow, taking words I said a long time ago and presenting them out of context.

Your motives in a discussion are pure...
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  #353  
Unread 07-15-2020, 08:21 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
Seriously.



Wow, taking words I said a long time ago and presenting them out of context.

Your motives in a discussion are pure...
Hey Apps, was my last post true to what you've been saying?
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  #354  
Unread 07-15-2020, 08:48 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by david starling View Post
Hey Apps, was my last post true to what you've been saying?
Yeah pretty much
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  #355  
Unread 07-15-2020, 08:55 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

All,

We've done a lot of editing and deleting in this thread due to personal attacks. It is a hot topic, but it still must be debated WITH RESPECT. "You" statements (ie "it's disgusting that you say....") are attacks. Responses to attacks fuel more attacks.

If this thread can't stop being a magnet for attacks, it will be closed.

Warning,
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  #356  
Unread 07-15-2020, 11:59 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
In my opinion, no one really cares about racism or the death of George Floyd. Floyd was a depraved human being who was murdered by another depraved human being. These people are irrelevant. BLM has been around for a while, yet the movement suddenly takes precedence now? Why now? Why not before? Floyd's death was a convenient excuse to release pent up anger and resentment from the clear destruction of our economy and social cohesion.
Perhaps in your lexicon everyone is depraved. But in the American justice system-- at least, as it is supposed to work-- everyone is entitled to a fair trial. The death penalty is reserved for specific cases at the end of a long process. But you seem to advocate a trigger-happy vigilante type of justice that you would not want to live under.
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  #357  
Unread 07-16-2020, 02:18 AM
david starling david starling is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Perhaps in your lexicon everyone is depraved. But in the American justice system-- at least, as it is supposed to work-- everyone is entitled to a fair trial. The death penalty is reserved for specific cases at the end of a long process. But you seem to advocate a trigger-happy vigilante type of justice that you would not want to live under.
Vigilante lynchings and burnings applied to both black men and homosexual men.
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  #358  
Unread 07-16-2020, 02:44 AM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Perhaps in your lexicon everyone is depraved. But in the American justice system-- at least, as it is supposed to work-- everyone is entitled to a fair trial. The death penalty is reserved for specific cases at the end of a long process. But you seem to advocate a trigger-happy vigilante type of justice that you would not want to live under.
I don’t approve how the police handled a criminal like Floyd.
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  #359  
Unread 07-16-2020, 03:35 AM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

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He's a GREAT PATRIOT, didn't know that about him before he became president. Cannot wait for four more years.

The topic is BLM. Have you any comment about the 'peaceful videos'.

One can only conclude that you and David support the violence and the eradication of the monuments and statues of the Founding Fathers and the abolitionists. The president prevented them for destroying the Lincoln memorial which means so much to this country. Thank God for Trump during this madness.

https://youtu.be/sVkkHJpc5Q0
One cannot so conclude because it would be false. You might do us the courtesy of asking what we think prior to making such negative assumptions.

Obviously I don't support violence: I have repeatedly referred to the First Amendment's guarantee of the right to "peaceable assembly."

Nobody was destroying the Lincoln Memorial.

My personal feeling-- along with Senator Tammy Duckworth-- is that we need a national dialogue on how we memorialize our past.

Andrew Jackson was not only a slave holder, but he presided over bloodshed in the forced dispossession of Native Americans via the Indian Removal Act. Donald Trump admires him, though.

I see no need for statues of Confederate generals, personally, but I think there is a place for them in museums, where they can be better interpreted in the context of our nation's past. I don't think they belong in public squares.

An analogy would be Germany. Museums that I visited do interpret the Nazi past, but they don't put statues of Nazi leaders in public squares.
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Last edited by waybread; 07-16-2020 at 03:40 AM.
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  #360  
Unread 07-16-2020, 03:51 AM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Blackbery, have you seriously looked into New Zealand immigration requirements?

https://www.immigration.govt.nz/new-...resident-visas

Unless you're married to a New Zealander, highly skilled in an in-demand occupation, a wealthy investor, or a Pacific Islander, it might not be so easy.

Ethnic tensions are everywhere. Perhaps you've read up on the Maori. They have a social justice movement, as well.

Maybe come to where David or I live, in rocking chairs, wrapped in quilts......
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C.S. Lewis, Perelandra.

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  #361  
Unread 07-16-2020, 04:33 AM
david starling david starling is offline
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Blackbery, have you seriously looked into New Zealand immigration requirements?

https://www.immigration.govt.nz/new-...resident-visas

Unless you're married to a New Zealander, highly skilled in an in-demand occupation, a wealthy investor, or a Pacific Islander, it might not be so easy.

Ethnic tensions are everywhere. Perhaps you've read up on the Maori. They have a social justice movement, as well.

Maybe come to where David or I live, in rocking chairs, wrapped in quilts......
I'm still rockin' in the Free World!
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  #362  
Unread 07-16-2020, 06:15 AM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
One cannot so conclude because it would be false. You might do us the courtesy of asking what we think prior to making such negative assumptions.

Obviously I don't support violence: I have repeatedly referred to the First Amendment's guarantee of the right to "peaceable assembly."

Nobody was destroying the Lincoln Memorial.

My personal feeling-- along with Senator Tammy Duckworth-- is that we need a national dialogue on how we memorialize our past.

Andrew Jackson was not only a slave holder, but he presided over bloodshed in the forced dispossession of Native Americans via the Indian Removal Act. Donald Trump admires him, though.

I see no need for statues of Confederate generals, personally, but I think there is a place for them in museums, where they can be better interpreted in the context of our nation's past. I don't think they belong in public squares.

An analogy would be Germany. Museums that I visited do interpret the Nazi past, but they don't put statues of Nazi leaders in public squares.
Because your position is contradictory, and you either minimize or enlarge the issue to suit your posts.

First you claim that the instances of violence within the movement are few or isolated cases.

But then you admit the cities are burning and violence has erupted - and you blame Trump. Suddenly they are violent, if Trump can be made responsible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Donald Trump plays golf and watches Fox News while cities burn. The Black Lives Matter protests occurred under his watch. He has done nothing to bring Americans together.
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Last edited by Dirius; 07-16-2020 at 06:58 AM.
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  #363  
Unread 07-16-2020, 06:18 AM
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Trump's driving Americans apart. Plain and simple.
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  #364  
Unread 07-16-2020, 06:25 AM
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Using a simile, whereby the United States, under the Constitution, is a computer program, Trump is the malware intended to disrupt and destroy it.
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  #365  
Unread 07-16-2020, 06:30 AM
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Using that simile, this widespread violence and acrimony, along with the failure to adopt a national policy to help contain the Covid-19 epidemic, are evidence of the efficacy of the malware.
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  #366  
Unread 07-16-2020, 09:26 AM
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Malware-in-Chief Trump!
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  #367  
Unread 07-16-2020, 12:07 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

Seriously.
Wow, taking
Siriusly
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

....words I said a long time ago
and presenting them out of context.
Your motives in a discussion are pure...
you are entitled to your Siriusly so pure opinion
i.e.
the following words were said yesterday

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

Floyd was a depraved human being

.
on the contrary

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

who was murdered by another depraved human being.

These people are irrelevant.
Siriusly your opinion just yesterday
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  #368  
Unread 07-16-2020, 03:10 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

I agree. People can't dismiss the violence on one hand and then claim that the president is to blame for the carnage. As you and I have both explained, the Tenth Amendment of the Constitution prevents the president from over-riding the state's leaders. And in ALL of the cases where the BLM are out of control, they are Democratic leaders.

I don't think one billion dollars of damage is nothing!

That's the minimum damage amount they are accounting to the BLM 'peaceful protests' where building were burned to the ground, looting and smash and grab all over the country. In NY, many of the high-end stores are boarded up and empty. They are not going to open until they know they aren't going to be looted and windows smashed. Parts of the city look like a third world country, graffiti and people staying away.

And gun violence spiking higher and higher in urban areas of the country.
Only going to get worse with police 'defunding', no new cops being hired, hundreds leaving over the country in masses.

Once again, it's the poor and the minorities that are suffering the economic fallout and victims of the violence while the woke white liberals remain safe and secure in their suburbs and rural areas. All over the country gun sales have sky-rocketed and that's a sign that citizens can no longer rely on the police to help them out for they won't be there when they call emergency.


Gun and ammunition sales soar as defund-the-police movement grows




These type of households that support the 2nd Amendment are majority Republican. So the BLM is driving up support for Trump and Trump re-election 2020 looking more & more likely.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirius View Post
Because your position is contradictory, and you either minimize or enlarge the issue to suit your posts.

First you claim that the instances of violence within the movement are few or isolated cases.

But then you admit the cities are burning and violence has erupted - and you blame Trump. Suddenly they are violent, if Trump can be made responsible.
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  #369  
Unread 07-16-2020, 03:13 PM
blackbery blackbery is offline
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

They will welcome me and my family with open arms, no worries about that.




Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Blackbery, have you seriously looked into New Zealand immigration requirements?

https://www.immigration.govt.nz/new-...resident-visas

Unless you're married to a New Zealander, highly skilled in an in-demand occupation, a wealthy investor, or a Pacific Islander, it might not be so easy.

Ethnic tensions are everywhere. Perhaps you've read up on the Maori. They have a social justice movement, as well.

Maybe come to where David or I live, in rocking chairs, wrapped in quilts......
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  #370  
Unread 07-16-2020, 03:33 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Trump put a stop to it before they could destroy it. Up to ten years in prison was a big deterrent. But not before they destroyed Frederick Douglass Statue who is a famous abolitionist.

BLM just destroys what THEY don't like, no civil discourse, just terrorists and anarchists trying to eradicate American History. Which I know very well and dialogues HAVE been taking place & directions to go regarding Confederate monuments. But BLM not interested in ANY history being preserved including the Founding Fathers. They don't get to destroy statues of former presidents because that's what they want to do. We live in a democracy although they want to destroy that too.

They also destroyed symbols of the Christian faith and their churches. They are defacing anything they don't like with no regard or respect for people of faith.

Islamic mosques are not being targeted. Buddhist and Hindu temples are being left alone. It’s Christianity and the Bible that are under attack. Under the illusion of racial equality by the Black Lives Matter revolution,

BHAZ — Black House Autonomous Zone — has been spray painted on the columns of the historic St. John’s church outside the White House.

The Black Madonna and baby Jesus were vandalized by Black Lives Matter protesters.

At BYU the statue of Brigham Young himself was vandalized last week...which is awfully close to that for a lot of Mormons.

Seattle’s Statue of Washington Destroyed, Statue of Lenin Untouched


https://caldronpool.com/seattles-sta...nin-untouched/




Quote:
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Nobody was destroying the Lincoln Memorial.
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  #371  
Unread 07-16-2020, 03:42 PM
blackbery blackbery is offline
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

More violence in NY when the police joined with black and minority clergy in a peaceful march for unity in the city.

As the march started, a diverse group of faith leaders — Christian, Muslim, Jewish — and law enforcement, police unions, Black Veterans for For Social Justice, and citizens came together. They all gathered at Cadman Plaza to call for a stop to the violence in the city and to have deeper conversations about racial justice and police reforms.


They were attacked by BLM.

NYPD Chief Monahan Among Injured As Counter Protesters Disrupt Peaceful Unity March Over Brooklyn Bridge.



NYPD NEWS
@NYPDnews
· 23h
Three officers violently attacked by protesters crossing the Brooklyn Bridge. The officers sustained serious injuries.




Quote:
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s.
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  #372  
Unread 07-16-2020, 04:28 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Smile Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Wait....JUST WHO IS BENEFITING from this senseless violence???

Did someone just say IT'S PRESIDENT TRUMP???
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  #373  
Unread 07-16-2020, 09:07 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirius View Post
Because your position is contradictory, and you either minimize or enlarge the issue to suit your posts.

First you claim that the instances of violence within the movement are few or isolated cases.

But then you admit the cities are burning and violence has erupted - and you blame Trump. Suddenly they are violent, if Trump can be made responsible.
Actually Dirius, I think you misunderstand me. And American cities are not burning at present.

I am old enough to have lived through several cycles of riots in American cities, starting in the 1960s. The violence shouldn't have happened, obviously; but my point is that they tend to flare up and then quiet down. Further, although demonstrations may be intimidating to those who hold opposite political views, the overwhelming majority are peaceful.

Let's also recall Ghandi's call to passive resistance and the First Amendment's guarantee of the right to peaceful protests. Yes, the police may arrest demonstrators in such situations, but the demonstrators are not physically violent.

My dig against Trump was in response to an ad that his campaign ran against Joe Biden; as well as serious complaints that he made against Barack Obama.

You can see the campaign ad here: https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...americans-wont

Obviously the Trump campaign ad argues that Biden has something to do with burning cities. So they seem to think a president has some control over such events.

You can read about Trump's criticism of Barack Obama during the Ferguson riots here: https://www.newsweek.com/trump-blame...-riots-1507312

Apparently Trump himself does think a president has some control over such events.
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  #374  
Unread 07-16-2020, 09:28 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post
Actually Dirius, I think you misunderstand me. And American cities are not burning at present.
They were. And you yourself admitted to it. Hundreds of businesses ransacked and looted, destroyed or burned. Thats the work of more than just "a few people" - and in fact in some areas, every "protestors" seemed to be taking advantage of the situation.

For example, the people who established the CHAZ autonomous-zone were in the hundreds. They were not isolated cases of some random agitator pushing for violence. Truth is the majority of the protestors were violet. There were some groups in some cities were peaceful though, but this seems to have been the exception, not the rule.

You keep pushing the CNN narrative of "peaceful protestors". There is plenty of evidence they were not. About 9300 arrests in total so far, connected to the riots. [deleted personal attack - Moderator]
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Last edited by wilsontc; 07-18-2020 at 12:31 PM.
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  #375  
Unread 07-16-2020, 09:57 PM
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Re: Black Lives Matter, Marxist?

The BLM may have stopped burning buildings to the ground and causing one billion dollars worth of property damage in the country (which I guess is okay with the woke liberals!) but there are protests on de-funding the police going on in the urban cities. Yesterday, BLM attacked peaceful march in Brookly,
Portland another riot two days ago. Huge increase in gun violence due to BLM demand to de-fund the police.

Damage $400–500 million in the Twin Cities area. Other cities combined over $500 million. NOT what the country needs.

George Floyd protests could be most expensive civil disturbance in US history, experts say
Prior to 2020, the costliest civil disorder event in U.S. were the 1992 Los Angeles riots.


Hope the white, woke protesters ready to rebuild the communities they destroyed. Oh, no, wait. They've all run back to their safe, white neighbourhoods with their quilts to wrap them up at night and left the black and minority groups to deal with the expense and the fallout.

CNN does not report any of this. Still refers to the protests as 'peaceful' and moved on from the enormous cost, the lives lost and the damage to police departments.

https://youtu.be/-kt5ALeWv4U


Yesterday, the National Association of Police put their full support behind president Trump for re-election. They are not a far-right
group, they have supported Obama and Biden.

National Association of Police Organizations endorses Trump



“Our endorsement recognizes your steadfast and very public support for our men and women on the front lines, especially during this time of unfair and inaccurate opprobrium being directed at our members by so many,” wrote the group’s president, Michael McHale.


They did not endorse him in 2016. This election they know he's the only candidate that will stand up to protect their lives.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirius View Post
They were. And you yourself admitted to it. Hundres of businesses ransacked and looted, destroyed or burned. Thats the work of more than just "a few people" - and in fact in some areas, every "protestors" seemed to be taking advantage of the situation.

For example, the people who established the CHAZ autonomous-zone were in the hundreds. They were not isolated cases of some random agitator pushing for violence. Truth is the majority of the protestors were violet. There were some groups in some cities were peaceful though, but this seems to have been the exception, not the rule.

You are being dishonest, and you keep pushing the CNN narrative of "peaceful protestors". There is plenty of evidence they were not. About 9300 arrests in total so far, connected to the riots.

Last edited by blackbery; 07-16-2020 at 10:07 PM.
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