Elevated and pitted degrees

Rebel Uranian

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
Pitted Saturn in both sidereal systems on Astrodienst, no other pitted planets and no elevated planets. Plus all my important planets are in Capricorn. I don't think I have any critical degrees at all. That essentially pits all my planets, with the rest being in Saggitarius including ruler of my Moon in Gemini and Jupiter being in Capricorn, because Saturn reception Jupiter is the final depositor if you don't use Pluto as ruler of Scorpio. What happens when the whole chart is pitted?
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Rebel Uranian said:
Pitted Saturn in both sidereal systems on Astrodienst, no other pitted planets and no elevated planets. Plus all my important planets are in Capricorn. I don't think I have any critical degrees at all. That essentially pits all my planets, with the rest being in Saggitarius including ruler of my Moon in Gemini and Jupiter being in Capricorn, because Saturn reception Jupiter is the final depositor if you don't use Pluto as ruler of Scorpio. What happens when the whole chart is pitted?
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Not exactly... it means the condition of the dispositor of your Capricorn planets is such that as dr. farr has said, its influences are limited, inhibited, and tend toward NEUTRALITY, being neither particularly "good" NOR particularly "bad" in its effects - dr. farr has written good advice concerning pitted degrees on this thread http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40285 :smile:
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
Yes, definitely it only refers to the particular planet which is pitted or elevated), NOT to all the planets which might be disposited by that planet; eg, simply because Saturn is pitted, it does NOT mean that any planet in Capricorn or Aquarius are also pitted just because Saturn is! A pitted dispositor simply indicates that it will not act much (either way) AS a dispositor, relative to whatever planet or planets it may be dispositing, ie, its dispositorship will be largely ineffective.
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
No, they are modified by their decan lord/planetary face (if the lord of the entire sign is pitted); if the decan lord (or planetary face) is pitted, they are modified by their duodenary lord; if the duodenary lord is pitted then the monomoiria (sign monomoiria lord) has sway; if the sign monomoiria lord is pitted, then the planetary degree ruler (planetary monomoiria) has sway; if all planetary lords at all these divisional levels are pitted, then there is no modifiying dispositorship upon the planet.
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
Simply check the positions of planets and other chart points, against the list of pitted and elevated degrees I have provided in my first posting to this thread**. Being in a pitted degree tends to neutralize the influences of the planet, reduces both the positive and the negative indications toward "balance"; being in an elevated degree boosts the planet, overcomes most of any debilities/detriments it might have, and favors the positive, constructive influences of the planet, and greatly reduces any negative, disruptive influence that might be connected with the planet.


**the pitted and elevated planets in your posted natal chart are:

PITTED: Saturn; Pluto

ELEVATED: Mercury; Neptune

(none of the asteroids or other special points on the chart are in pits nor are they elevated)
 
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Rebel Uranian

Rebel Uranian

Well-known member
A couple of days ago or something I was looking for the pits and elevations in my dodek chart and I realized that the actual placement of my Neptune is pitted :devil: Transits are going to be a shock so no one should be jealous, in fact you should be very glad yours isn't...
 
Aaronmcc11

Aaronmcc11

Well-known member
Assuming that these degrees do actually "Elevate" or "Neutralize" a planet.. I really am curious to know how someone would behave with every planet in a pitted degree. Just some kind of a blob-person with no behavior? Or would they be Perfect? It seems like a silly thing to be curious about but I truly wonder.
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
The dodekatemorion would then become most prominent, but if all the dodekatemorion of the planets were also all in pitted degrees, well, I do not know the answer to that question; possibly another ancient concept (Bright degree activations) modifies the blocked influence of the pitted planets, allowing such blocked planet to "shine forth from its pit", to a certain extent, and thereby have some inf;uences in the chart.
 
tsmall

tsmall

Premium Member
dr. farr, I have been wondering...

If a planet is in a pitted degree, would it ever be possible for the aspects it makes to other planets in the natal chart to still be valid, and felt in the native's life, but for the planet to still have no ability to create events, and for transits of and to that planet to also cause no events? Meaning the influence is there and felt internally only?

Further, are the dodekatemorion at all similar to antiscia?
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
The extant literature doesn't really go thoroughly into such questions; I will not say that I believe the pits represent total blocks to influences, total neutralization, but I will say that being in a pitted degree greatly reduces any positive or negative influences of that planet, and therefore also would reduce the effects of aspects to or from that planet; but totally blocked? Maybe, but probably not totally so; the Bright, dark or mixed quality of the degree will have a modifying influence as well.
Relative to transits, again I can't claim that transits of or to pitted planets simply do nothing at all; rather, whatever the transit indicates is greatly modified as to effects, one way or the other (positive effects or negative effects)

No, the dodeks are rather like ramifications, whereas antiscia are like mirrors or reflections (particularly of the underlying forces "behind" the planet or Lot involved)
 
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twelthnight

Banned
Interesting. My chart ruler, mercury is pitted, but my asc degree is elevated. Also my venus is elevated as well as being generally well placed and aspected otherwise...may explain a lot of things, perhaps...
 
byjove

byjove

Account Closed
Why did someone leave that giant, zombie-ish picture there? Nonsense!

Re elevated and pitted, I've just come across a website of a Norwegian astrologer who seems very adept, indeed, and if I understand him correctly, he's saying that these degrees have something like an orb; and that any planet within two degrees of this, is considered in that exaltation degree - and under the domicile of the planet exalted there! So, if this is what he's saying, for example:

example 1
consider Mars at 18 degrees Aries, it is within 2 degrees, but this is the Sun's exaltation, does that mean as I think he intends, Mars in under the domcile of the Sun then, because it's the Sun's exaltation? Who domciles whom here?!

example 2
consider Saturn at 18 degrees Aries, does this then place Saturn under the domcile of the Sun? Saturn is at fall here, but imagine the Sun is dignified in Leo, is Saturn then (redeemed) by being under the Sun's domicile, in this being dignifed?
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
Mr. Bevan is discussing the degrees associated with a planet's exaltation or Fall, he is not talking about "celestial topography" type pits and peaks (pitted degrees and elevated degrees) The pits and peaks apply to each and every planet, regardless of the planet; the degrees of exaltation and Fall are specific to a specific planet IN a specific sign.

Relative to your example questions:
To my understanding of the matter, if planet A is within orb of the exaltation or Fall degree of planet B, this means nothing relative to planet A: planet A would continue to be under the dispositorship of the planetary lord of the sign planet A is posited in.
Only planet B, if in orb of ITS exaltation or Fall degree, would be affected by this exaltation or Fall degree.
However, I re-iterate that this is only my understanding of the matter; I am unfamiliar with any literature which might give a different explanation.
 
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JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
Mr. Bevan is discussing the degrees associated with a planet's exaltation or Fall, he is not talking about "celestial topography" type pits and peaks (pitted degrees and elevated degrees) The pits and peaks apply to each and every planet, regardless of the planet; the degrees of exaltation and Fall are specific to a specific planet IN a specific sign.

Relative to your example questions:
To my understanding of the matter, if planet A is within orb of the exaltation or Fall degree of planet B, this means nothing relative to planet A: planet A would continue to be under the dispositorship of the planetary lord of the sign planet A is posited in.
Only planet B, if in orb of ITS exaltation or Fall degree, would be affected by this exaltation or Fall degree.
However, I re-iterate that this is only my understanding of the matter; I am unfamiliar with any literature which might give a different explanation.
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This is interesting dr. farr because, if planet A were for instance, Jupiter located at 21ºLibra and planet B were for example, Saturn located at 14[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]º[/FONT] Libra would Planet A (Jupiter) not benefit from being placed in Saturn's Exaltation? Particularly if Jupiter were for instance combust by a Libra Sun?
 
Moog

Moog

Well-known member
byjove said:
Why did someone leave that giant, zombie-ish picture there? Nonsense!
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Haha, yeah, what's that about.

I want to say thanks to Dr. Farr for posting this, it's all interesting to me.

Looks like I have an elevated Mercury and Moon. *ponders*
 
byjove

byjove

Account Closed
JUPITERASC said:
This is interesting dr. farr because, if planet A were for instance, Jupiter located at 21ºLibra and planet B were for example, Saturn located at 14[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]º[/FONT] Libra would Planet A (Jupiter) not benefit from being placed in Saturn's Exaltation? Particularly if Jupiter were for instance combust by a Libra Sun?
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Yeah I'm a little confused too because, for example, some astrologers consider dignity is not a part of two planets in aspect e.g.

Venus in Gemini sextile Mercury in Leo, that Mercury does not benefit here. Others seem to disagree so I don't know. I wonder does that carry on to your example? Who would be best to check this with, Al-Biruni?
 
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dr. farr

Well-known member
-being in an exaltation degree would be an essential dignity for the planet whose degree of exaltation is involved, but not for some other planet being in that exaltation degree
-being in an ELEVATED degree (which is DIFFERENT THAN BEING IN AN EXALTATION DEGREE) applies to any and all planets, and is an ACCIDENTAL (not an essential) dignity (according to Traditionalist astrology)
-the pitted degrees and elevated degrees represent a different concept than the specific EXALTATION degree allocated to each specific planet; pits and elevations are generic for ALL planets; EXALTATION degrees (or degree areas) are relevant ONLY for the specific planet it is allocated to ("belongs to")
 
byjove

byjove

Account Closed
dr. farr said:
-Pitted Degrees, also known as "pits", "depressions", "holes", "deep degrees" and "degrees of diminishing fortune"; regardless of strength or weakness, dignity or detriment or debility, affliction, benefic or malefic, planets in them are neutralized (either completely or nearly so): they almost "don't count", influence wise, in the given chart
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Muted/don't count, does that help diminish the potential trouble caused by a planet? (e.g. badly aspect and in a pitted degree, and in fall/detriment)
 
JUPITERASC

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
dr. farr said:
Relative to your example questions:
To my understanding of the matter, if planet A is within orb of the exaltation or Fall degree of planet B, this means nothing relative to planet A: planet A would continue to be under the dispositorship of the planetary lord of the sign planet A is posited in.
Only planet B, if in orb of ITS exaltation or Fall degree, would be affected by this exaltation or Fall degree.
However, I re-iterate that this is only my understanding of the matter; I am unfamiliar with any literature which might give a different explanation.
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JUPITERASC said:
This is interesting dr. farr because, if planet A were for instance, Jupiter located at 21ºLibra and planet B were for example, Saturn located at 14[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]º[/FONT] Libra would Planet A (Jupiter) not benefit from being placed in Saturn's Exaltation? Particularly if Jupiter were for instance combust by a Libra Sun?
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dr. farr said:
-being in an exaltation degree would be an essential dignity for the planet whose degree of exaltation is involved, but not for some other planet being in that exaltation degree
-being in an ELEVATED degree (which is DIFFERENT THAN BEING IN AN EXALTATION DEGREE) applies to any and all planets, and is an ACCIDENTAL (not an essential) dignity (according to Traditionalist astrology)
-the pitted degrees and elevated degrees represent a different concept than the specific EXALTATION degree allocated to each specific planet; pits and elevations are generic for ALL planets; EXALTATION degrees (or degree areas) are relevant ONLY for the specific planet it is allocated to ("belongs to")
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Understood dr. farr:
what I find interesting on reading your comment is that in the particular instance of Jupiter located at 21ºLibra and Saturn located at 14[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]º[/FONT] Libra, Jupiter in Libra is received in this particular case in Saturn's Exaltation by an Exalted Saturn because Saturn located at 14[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]º[/FONT] Libra is in Exaltation: furthermore, Saturn located at 14[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]º[/FONT] Libra is in the terms of Jupiter and therefore received by Jupiter.

So, the point I make is that Jupiter located at 21ºLibra and Saturn located at 14[FONT=Times New Roman, serif]º[/FONT] Libra are not only in conjunction but also in Mutual Reception by term and Exaltation and this condition benefits Jupiter particularly because Saturn's degree of Exaltation is 21ºLibra :smile:


 
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