You know what I mean.Bickering? Turf war?
On the contrary this is a lively discussion thread on apparent 'confusion about pluto'
You know what I mean.Bickering? Turf war?
On the contrary this is a lively discussion thread on apparent 'confusion about pluto'
the 'one-size-fits-all-schools' of generalised cookbook astrologyI don't like typical Pluto interpretations in modern astrology either.
by all means do the comparison if you are familiar with traditional delineationThat's why I was interested in a comparison between Pluto, Mars and Saturn
by both modernists and traditionalists to work out specific differences.
I'm going to create a separate thread on that later.
So, your input will be welcome.
Clearly, that 'drawing on that sheet of paper'A sheet of paper with a drawing on it is not what I'd call inner guidance, really.
Intuition is not dependent on a knowledge of modern astrologyWhat I mean with inner guidance is intuition
If 'no tools are required'
which is guidance right here right now, no tools required.
CertainlyYes, both camps use astrology for predictive purposes.
Whether discussion is experienced as 'bickering' or not
You know what I mean.
. . . Konrad posted an anonymised chart which was then re-calculated by a member using their own software and then posted on the forum with an inclusion of both the year and the date of birth of the third party. The year and the date of birth of the third party had previously been obscured and anonymised by Konrad.
The member was asked politely to alter the re-posted chart, but refused, the chart remained posted showing date and time of birth.
Eventually, moderator wilsontc acted and the offending chart has now been anonymised in accord with forum rules.
Here is a link to that chart http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...&postcount=169 which is now named 'James Bond' and has neither date of birth nor time of birth
That's misinformationGet your facts straight before you continue to spread misinformation.
There was no communication between the moderator and myself.
I acted on my own.
Seems you just can't miss an opportunity to cast someone in a bad light when you think you can get away with it.
Quite the informed poster you are.
The words there was 'communication between the moderator and yourself' cannot be found anywhere
Hi Monk ~ on stings ~ 'Oh Death where is thy sting? Oh grave thy victory?'
Clearly you missed the multiple posts that have now been deleted from this thread by moderator wilsontc
- they were deleted around 01:00AM. When posts are deleted threads do appear 'sloppy' with little coherence.
But late last night/early hours trolls posted a number of lewd comments on this thread,
those posters have now been banned by wilsontc and their comments deleted from this thread.
There were several pages of dialogue between posters on the topic of forum rules
regarding protection of private information when third party charts are posted.
because Konrad posted an anonymised chart which was then re-calculated by a member using their own software
and then posted on the forum with an inclusion of both the year and the date of birth of the third party.
The year and the date of birth of the third party had previously been obscured and anonymised by Konrad.
The member was asked politely to alter the re-posted chart, but refused, the chart remained posted showing date and time of birth.
Eventually, moderator wilsontc acted and the offending chart has now been anonymised in accord with forum rules.
Here is a link to that chart http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showpost.php?p=598714&postcount=169
which is now named 'James Bond' and has neither date of birth nor time of birth
and so Konrads request to you to anonymize the chart has been deletedWell yes, we agree on the influence of Saturn, but for different reasons.
[deleted comment since poster has anonymize chart - Moderator]
No one is interested in stealing your identityAttached are my natal chart and a list of aspects found in it. Please don't steal my identity, clean out my bank account, cause me sleepless nights, or harm me in any other meaningful way with the information provided and I promise not to do any of that to any of you.
2/3's of my natal aspects are less than 5°. 5 are less than 3°, 2 less than 2°, and 4 less than 1°.
The 17 aspects consist of
1 conjunction - 1 opposition
5 trines - 5 squares
2 sextiles - 3 inconjuncts
My hair is now grey/silver.
Bob
ExactlyYes, but that is sort of part of the problem.
Personality is, while unique, a mixture of very common things every people can share. Everyone will be afraid of something, or have problems, and usually about similar stuff. At some point we all experience disatisfaction with our jobs, our relationships, our family, etc.
For example, I've never met someone that didn't blame his or her parents about something,
regardless of how insignificant the issue could be.
Thus I believe that, at some point, we could find an explanation to everything, regarding anything.
We could use only the asteroids such as chiron, and relate him in some way towards any type of doubts we could have.
What shows up in astrology, is the predictive power of it. Even using modern techniques, most of the information provided by outer planets when using predictions, is of little help.
I know for example, most people will atribute pluto transits to certain stuff,
but there is usually a much more reliable explanation to such things by traditional standards.
Also, I've noticed that it's usually people who feel disempowered and not in charge of their lives that gravitate to predictive astrology. Which is logical. If people want to get back their power and back in charge of their lives, however, then I suggest to stay away from predictive astrology.
In Research, i will not debate, but Oddity mentioned tight on angles, and at the time i did give Prince as a tight Pluto M.C., no one seems to have connected?
http://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Prince
He does sing songs about under age or taboo sex, perhaps Pluto traits?
I'm too polite to go there!
Waybread,
if you're not going to post the chart details, can you post the chart in Lahiri with Porphyry houses? I will look when I get the opportunity.
Waybread, please reveal the info regarding the chart you posted
Useless comments without astrological discussion.
Here it is, Konrad. While I trust your confidentiality absolutely, we learned from yesterday's little episode with "tcwilson" (aka leviathan) that there are trolls about; and identity theft is a huge problem internationally.
Here it is, Konrad. While I trust your confidentiality absolutely, we learned from yesterday's little episode with "tcwilson" (aka leviathan) that there are trolls about; and identity theft is a huge problem internationally.
It seems we have a different definition of inner guidance. The way I use the term, inner guidance means guidance coming from within and not guiding what is within (which I guess is how you meant it). In that sense, astrology is not guidance that is coming from within, but it can be used as guidance for what is within.the 'one-size-fits-all-schools' of generalised cookbook astrology
are indeed best avoided
by all means do the comparison if you are familiar with traditional delineation
Konrad earlier commented that
'The established planets are the seven visible ones
- it is one aspect of practice that both camps use
- if you want to add more bodies to the rulership system and in general practice
the onus of proof is actually on the person proposing the modification...'
Clearly, that 'drawing on that sheet of paper'
would require interpretation in order to discern the meaning
Intuition is not dependent on a knowledge of modern astrology
or even of a knowledge of traditional astrology either
in order to find inner guidance
If 'no tools are required'
then the matter is beyond the province of both modern and traditional astrology
and seems better suited to the Spiritual Realm board of this forum
Certainly
How so? It was about your model of astrology. You've made some bold statements which I find very questionable. So I commented accordingly.Useless comments without astrological discussion.
How so? It was about your model of astrology. You've made some bold statements which I find very questionable. So I commented accordingly.
I'd say before anyone can say anything definite about which celestial bodies should be used and which bodies shouldn't, we should actually know why astrology works. So, I'm curious, do you actually know why astrology works? If not, you're just speculating.
Also, does conscious thought play any role in your model? If not, you leave out an important part of reality.
Well, I take your reply as a "No, I don't really know why astrology works, I'm just speculating like everybody else here"... is that okay with you?My bold statement regarding psichological astrology, was regarding its uses. I said it was redundant. It is.
Telling someone how his personality works, so he can make adjustments, can be done so with or without astrology. You can go to an actual therapist. Hell, you can actually stand in the mirror and reflect about the flaws in yourself without ever looking at your chart. Astrology doesn't really play a big part in anything, rather than at most a confirmation of what you may already know about yourself.
Predictive astrology takes a handle on things that are otherwise unknown. Horary for example, on missing items. Amazing how it works. A very usefull tool.
I never said psichological astrology is useless, or that it didn't work. I believe it is clearly something that can be extracted from a birth chart. I just said it is redundant, which means that its uses aren't that many, because at most it can tell you things you already know, or that people already know from you. To me it is not a practical use of a person's time or money.
I'm not trying to be hurtfull here. To give you an example, a VCR is still usefull, plays videos. Today it is redundant, because we don't really need VCR's anymore. Of course you can watch an old movie tape in it.
But that comment, rather than a statement, was a personal view, regarding the chart reading in question.
it seems to me that my comment bothered you, so you decided to say something similar regarding predictive astrology. To me its fine if you want to believe predictive astrology is for "powerless people", I really don't care about your opinion regarding it.
Thus my quote to your comment: Useless comment without astrological implication
Would be nice if an admin could strip both these 2 comments of mine, and yours, because they don't really add to the conversation.
Temporarily, maybe. I'd be careful with such absolute statements.Exactly
pluto has nothing different to add to delineation using the seven visible planets
Well, I take your reply as a "No, I don't really know why astrology works, I'm just speculating like everybody else here"... is that okay with you?
I actually did comment. I see the influence of Pluto but I disagree with a lot of what the modern interpretations say about what that influence actually is. That's why I said the notion to see Pluto as just a mixture of Mars and Saturn is interesting but not actually valid. I can see, however, how folks can come to that conclusion after reading the usual modern cook books. So in that sense, I can understand the traditionalists and appreciate your (plural 'you') comments. Current definitions of Pluto in astrology are not very satisfying. Point taken. To then say that Pluto is irrelevant and doesn't have anything to add because it doesn't fit into the tried and tested models is a rather bold statement, especially since no one here knows with absolute certainty why astrology actually works (myself included), we all just know how it works, and Pluto (and the other outer planets) force us to rethink our model and approach. With the emergence of the electric universe model, the old cosmological models seem to be outdated now, and with it the old astrological models. So, there's a lot of research and development to do.You see your basicly trying to troll the post, haven't seen you make an actual comment on either theory or practice.