Timing, Void of Course & Via Combusta Moon

astroner · Mar 1, 2013

This chart is one of the weirdest ones I have casted. My question was when I will be in a relationship?

I'm Saturn (peregrine?) & retro in Scorpio where moon is @ fall. Moon is in Libra is it VOC, and I know is in Via Combusta, but it's conjunct fixed star Spica. I have read that negates the VC. Not sure though. It's an interesting chart & Moon is flowing towards Saturn for a conjunction. Moon is in bad shape..what will be the outcome? Will anything happen at all?

Here's the chart..

unteruber · Mar 1, 2013

I also noticed yesterday that moon has gone void of course and is in via combusta, it might a better idea to ask the question after some time.

Kaiousei no Senshi · Mar 1, 2013

The problem with "when" questions is that they might not ever materialize, and that can often be what leads people to confusion. In layman's terms, there's a very real possibility that people will never have children, relationships, or whatever it is they're asking about. So when the chart comes back looking awkward to them, it's likely the chart is saying that there isn't a good chance of this happening.

This chart is probably telling us something along those lines. At the very least, the aversion between the significators is an obvious no for now, but what does it mean to you that the Moon is positioned within the Ninth house? And how about that application to Venus in her exaltation? Especially in relation to the houses she rules.

astroner · Mar 1, 2013

Hey, thanks for having a look

. Another horary expert in a different forum was able to pick up things accurately. I explained that I didn't want any flings and won't be feeling fully ready to be in a relationship until around June, or beyond. I just wanted to see if a good opportunity would present itself soon.

She did accuarely pick up that I have about 3 admirers, but that nothing solid will come of the matter (true and I have been 'rejecting' them). I wanted to see if Moon was actually one of them because I don't want to deliberately hurt anyone. I just need some time by myself (Saturn rx 9th house) for now to work on some of my inner issues. I have had chances, but I haven't been making the effort to get to know them. She mentioned Sun is in my face (degrees) & it's someone that I have seen & also into (I have an idea of who this might be) -

Moon receives me in exaltation, but I don't like Moon (accurate - I don't want to quickly be in a relationship right now, especially if they are 'fling' types)

Venus is combust..so that's not good at all. Plus, I dislike Moon right now as well, but seems Moon is really into me & is flowing towards me. I wonder what the conjunction will actually bring..

Not sure if Moon represents an actual person, or just the event(s) itself.

Kaiousei no Senshi said:
The problem with "when" questions is that they might not ever materialize, and that can often be what leads people to confusion. In layman's terms, there's a very real possibility that people will never have children, relationships, or whatever it is they're asking about. So when the chart comes back looking awkward to them, it's likely the chart is saying that there isn't a good chance of this happening.

This chart is probably telling us something along those lines. At the very least, the aversion between the significators is an obvious no for now, but what does it mean to you that the Moon is positioned within the Ninth house? And how about that application to Venus in her exaltation? Especially in relation to the houses she rules.

Kaiousei no Senshi · Mar 1, 2013

Moon receives me in exaltation, but I don't like Moon (accurate - I don't want to quickly be in a relationship right now, especially if they are 'fling' types)

This is actually not true. :/ The Moon doesn't receive Saturn, she is in his exaltation so he receives her, except he really doesn't because there is no aspect between the two planets.

Regardless, I was trying to get you to focus on the Moon's placement in the Ninth house and what that could imply in relation to the question and future activities that could bring about a relationship, because it doesn't seem like you'll get one as things currently stand, but the Moon and her application gives you a way out, or perhaps describes someone you will meet.

dr. farr · Mar 1, 2013

(Following is not in accordance with standard horary practice and uses whole sign house format)

One way to estimate (at least using the alternative horary approach I follow) is through the Part of Love:
-querent's Part of Love (ascendant+jupiter-venus) falls @ 22 Aries
-querent's significator (lord of the ascending sign) = Saturn
-when IN THE CHART (NOT in the ephemeris) Saturn comes round to conjunct the querent's Part of Love, a relationship might well be predicted
-in this chart, Saturn is retrograde so the count (by signs) would be from the place of Saturn (Scorpio) BACK (not forward, BACK) through the signs to the Part of Love;
-this would be 7 signs
-since significator Saturn is a slow planet and since it posits a fixed sign (Scorpio), we can suggest that each sign (ie each sign = 1 time unit) might refer to a 1 month period of time
-therefore, the indication (from this type of analysis) would estimate that querent might be in a (love type) relationship within about 7 months from the date of this question.

astroner · Mar 2, 2013

Moon in Libra. Saturn in Libra is exalted..I don't understand how it isn't true. Saturn in Scorpio is where Moon is @ fall, therefore I (Saturn) don't like whoever moon is, or what it represents. Moon in Libra (for me) means Moon likes Saturn, as Saturn exalts in Libra. There is no aspect, however Moon flows towards Saturn & they were a day away from being conjunct (when I asked the q)

Or are you suggesting it's the other way around? I like Moon, but Moon doesn't like me?

Oh, I guess the "receiving" part is where the confusion stems from. I thought when I said "receive" it meant Moon liked me (is where Saturn exalts), but since I'm in Scorpio, where Moon is @ fall, that I didn't like Moon, or something similar. Well, I'm not sure what 9th could mean to me other than morals/beliefs (commitment, marriage, etc) ..I won't travel until May/June & not currently studying..:]

Kaiousei no Senshi said:
This is actually not true. :/ The Moon doesn't receive Saturn, she is in his exaltation so he receives her, except he really doesn't because there is no aspect between the two planets.

Regardless, I was trying to get you to focus on the Moon's placement in the Ninth house and what that could imply in relation to the question and future activities that could bring about a relationship, because it doesn't seem like you'll get one as things currently stand, but the Moon and her application gives you a way out, or perhaps describes someone you will meet.

astroner · Mar 2, 2013

Thanks Dr Farr, lol. I will keep you updated. I have been told something similar, but we'll see

dr. farr said:
(Following is not in accordance with standard horary practice and uses whole sign house format)

One way to estimate (at least using the alternative horary approach I follow) is through the Part of Love:
-querent's Part of Love (ascendant+jupiter-venus) falls @ 22 Aries
-querent's significator (lord of the ascending sign) = Saturn
-when IN THE CHART (NOT in the ephemeris) Saturn comes round to conjunct the querent's Part of Love, a relationship might well be predicted
-in this chart, Saturn is retrograde so the count (by signs) would be from the place of Saturn (Scorpio) BACK (not forward, BACK) through the signs to the Part of Love;
-this would be 7 signs
-since significator Saturn is a slow planet and since it posits a fixed sign (Scorpio), we can suggest that each sign (ie each sign = 1 time unit) might refer to a 1 month period of time
-therefore, the indication (from this type of analysis) would estimate that querent might be in a (love type) relationship within about 7 months from the date of this question.

Kaiousei no Senshi · Mar 2, 2013

astroner said:
Moon in Libra. Saturn in Libra is exalted..I don't understand how it isn't true. Saturn in Scorpio is where Moon is @ fall, therefore I (Saturn) don't like whoever moon is, or what it represents. Moon in Libra (for me) means Moon likes Saturn, as Saturn exalts in Libra. There is no aspect, however Moon flows towards Saturn & they were a day away from being conjunct (when I asked the q)

Or are you suggesting it's the other way around? I like Moon, but Moon doesn't like me?

Yes, exactly. Since Saturn is in the Moon's fall, he injures her and so she rejects him. This could play out in any number of ways, perhaps you meet someone and your desire to have a longterm relationship turns them off as they aren't quite ready for it, or whatever.

The way you're looking at it is more inclined to the author John Frawley's method, which is backwards from classical reception.

Anyway, the bigger picture here is that you're unlikely to meet someone where you are now. Are you planning on moving in the near future? Have you given it any thought? The Moon's location in the Ninth and applying to the Ninth house lord could indicate that you meet someone after a move or maybe after they have moved into your area. Of course it could also mean you meet someone at church. The Ninth house is funny like that.

astroner · Mar 2, 2013

Really? From what I read here: http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5104

It was the other way around :S.

"Reception is like this: a good example, which is used in the article I linked, is a scene from the film 'Kingdom of Heaven', where an emissary from the Christian army goes to visit Saladin, leader of the Muslim army.

In this scene, Saladin (Mars) receives the emissary (Venus) as a guest in his tent, because Venus is in *his* sign. In this case, Venus is in Aries, the sign of her detriment. The emissary (Venus) is at a serious disadvantage in Saladin's (Mars) tent, because she is in his territory. Mars has the advantage. Venus in detriment has nothing to offer Mars because there is no mutual reception; so in this case, Mars has the power to decide whether to treat Venus as a guest, or throw her out of the tent. "

So, in my eyes, I have the advantage over Moon. Moon is in my house - visiting me, but I don't want Moon to visit me. I'm defending myself against Moon's advances (in Scorpio). I'm trying to push Moon away, but that's just my take

But I don't go to church =S & really never liked church (no offense to anyone). What else..moving? Nope. Maybe someone does move near me, in my building, or something..

I guess it could make sense how you're saying it. That Moon wants to have fun, but I don't.

Kaiousei no Senshi said:
Yes, exactly. Since Saturn is in the Moon's fall, he injures her and so she rejects him. This could play out in any number of ways, perhaps you meet someone and your desire to have a longterm relationship turns them off as they aren't quite ready for it, or whatever.

The way you're looking at it is more inclined to the author John Frawley's method, which is backwards from classical reception.

Anyway, the bigger picture here is that you're unlikely to meet someone where you are now. Are you planning on moving in the near future? Have you given it any thought? The Moon's location in the Ninth and applying to the Ninth house lord could indicate that you meet someone after a move or maybe after they have moved into your area. Of course it could also mean you meet someone at church. The Ninth house is funny like that.

Kaiousei no Senshi · Mar 2, 2013

"Reception is like this: a good example, which is used in the article I linked, is a scene from the film 'Kingdom of Heaven', where an emissary from the Christian army goes to visit Saladin, leader of the Muslim army.

In this scene, Saladin (Mars) receives the emissary (Venus) as a guest in his tent, because Venus is in *his* sign. In this case, Venus is in Aries, the sign of her detriment. The emissary (Venus) is at a serious disadvantage in Saladin's (Mars) tent, because she is in his territory. Mars has the advantage. Venus in detriment has nothing to offer Mars because there is no mutual reception; so in this case, Mars has the power to decide whether to treat Venus as a guest, or throw her out of the tent. "

Unfortunately, this quote does not exist within the article linked to in the post before and does give the opposite information for what reception implies. The actual quote spells it out more clearly, though is very lengthy.

I was reminded of reception when I saw a scene in the recent movie "Kingdom of Heaven," about the 3rd Crusade; and it sounded like some passages from Bonatti I have been translating. Here is the scene. Two crusader lords are captured by Saladin and brought into his tent. Saladin gives ice water to one (whom he intends to treat as a guest). The other takes water, too, which Saladin did not intend. Saladin has him killed.

So two enemies of Saladin are in his tent, but one is formally greeted, and the other not. Saladin suspends his warfare against the one he greets, but has no duty to protect the one he has not greeted.

In Bonatti's horary material on illness, he emphasizes again and again that the patient will not die if the Lord of the 1st (the sick person) is received by the Lord of the 8th (death); but he will die if it's the other way around. Why? I think the Saladin analogy helps (Saladin = Lord of 8th). When a planet is properly received, it is taken care of by the planet receiving it; normal hostilities cease, and the received planet is able to do what it normally does. Now, if the Lord of the 1st is received by that of the 8th, then the 8th will not kill him, and the Lord of the 1st gets to do what he wants to do: live. But if the Lord of the 1st receives that of the 8th, then the 8th gets to do what he wants: to kill.

If a planet receives another, it is always inclined to help the planet it receives. It's ability to do so will change depending on how well situated the receiving planet is, but the intent is still there.

Though, those reception meanings aren't really necessary here, because we don't have a reception with this chart anyway. What we have is a generosity because there is no aspect between Saturn and the Moon which is necessarily for reception. So really what we have is Saturn being generous towards relationships, but not having the ability to do anything about it. Unfortunately Saturn is in the Sign of the Moon's Fall, so there's something about Saturn that prospective relationships wouldn't like and aren't open to. Maybe the Tenth house placement is important, are you too busy with work? Do you work at a controversial place? I'm just fishing for ideas here.

astroner · Mar 2, 2013

That's so weird!! LOL, I have always been told the opposite.

For example, an horary I posted here a couple of months ago. I was Sun in Capricorn, the other person was Saturn in Scorpio.

They told me that I liked Saturn more than he did me because I was in Capricorn, so that was completely wrong????

I'm so confused now

Thanks for explaining it to me though!

& no..not too busy with work or anything like that either.
I just got out of a 7 year relationship and really I have been the one pushing others away who have tried to be in a relationship with me, not the other way around so that's why I'm soooo confused. I also don't feel ready for a relationship right now, I just wanted to see anyway if anything would come along..

I have to get something done around April/May before I'm open to any new relationships (serious ones)

Okay so sticking to this. Saturn has some inner issues to work on even though Saturn likes relationships (Moon in Libra), relationships don't like Saturn

. Pluto likes Saturn (something to do with the April/May thing) & there is mutual reception there..that makes sense.

I think 9th house applies since I will be traveling, but then returning though..not actually moving to that place. Just like a mini needed vacation..maybe after the vacation I'll be in a better place where Moon can feel more comfortable

Gotcha!

astroner · Mar 2, 2013

Saturn in Libra (Querent)
Sun in Capricorn (Quesited)

Saturn "receives" the Sun by domicile. Sun is the guest and Saturn is the host. Saturn is receptive to the Sun.
Saturn is in the sign of the Sun's fall. Sun is not receptive to Saturn, could be a case of Sun feeling that Saturn is not good for him/her somehow. Maybe Sun really just doesn't like Saturn. Could mean a few different things in context to the question.
Unless there's an aspect between the 2 planets then there isnt a true reception.

So, I finally get it! Haha..

In the horary I asked I was Sun in Capricorn, and he was Saturn in Scorpio. And I tried explaining that he was the one more into me than the other way around, but still people insisted that I was the one more into him (there was a sextile). A lot also used the wrong house, but the ones that did (or the one who did) told me the opposite. Okay, so it makes complete sense now! NOW I KNOW!!!!

Timing, Void of Course & Via Combusta Moon

astroner

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unteruber

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Kaiousei no Senshi

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Kaiousei no Senshi

dr. farr

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astroner

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astroner

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Kaiousei no Senshi

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Kaiousei no Senshi

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