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  #51  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:15 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

I'm sorry of being harsh; I didn't mean to say for druggies to drop dead.

I've just known a lot of people that did drugs that took, used, and abused people because they never wanted to fix their drug problem and they most likely never will.

If you're hooked on opiates or heroin then you'll just destroy everyone around you.

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  #52  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
Thanks for highlighting that remarkable comment
I notice there was no mention of any rationale by that person
for their somewhat extreme perspective
Well I'm glad someone else rather than me is shocked.

Unfortunately I've received warnings for reacting too heatedly in the past, which is a shame because that type of thinking should be stopped in its tracks and a more compassionate, forgiving view instilled. But nope.

And it confuses me because anyone who needs help is thankful when they receive it, so why not show the same compassion to others who need help? But it's far too common in this world to see the opposite and it sickens me.

May life humble those people.
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  #53  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:20 PM
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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
I'm sorry of being harsh; I didn't mean to say for druggies to drop dead.

I've just known a lot of people that did drugs that took, used, and abused people because they never wanted to fix their drug problem and they most likely never will.

If you're hooked on opiates or heroin then you'll just destroy everyone around you.
Sometimes it's ok to admit you don't know what you're talking about.
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  #54  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:23 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

And don't get me wrong,
there's nothing wrong with medication drugs to help reduce the pain
but are you actually suffering from a medical decision??
Do you really need drugs to relieve your pain??
Stop being a baby and just take the pain.
Everyone is so quick to take pain killers and other drugs to avoid the harsh realities of the world.
Oh you have back pain?? Just take 10 pills you'll be good to go.

No. You'll just get hooked on those pills, so just leave them alone


.
Exactly
and then there's Psychiatry
Psychiatry: The Marketing of Madness:
Are We All Insane?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uFkivsEy3CI
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  #55  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:27 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

I'm really sorry about what I said.

I just don't have an opinion on drugs anymore. Just forget everything I said.

Drugs have never impacted me or my family in a negative way, so I'm ignorant on the subject.
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  #56  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:28 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluebell87 View Post

Well I'm glad someone else rather than me is shocked.

Unfortunately I've received warnings for reacting too heatedly in the past,
which is a shame because that type of thinking should be stopped in its tracks
and a more compassionate, forgiving view instilled. But nope.

And it confuses me
because anyone who needs help is thankful when they receive it,
so why not show the same compassion to others who need help?
But it's far too common in this world to see the opposite and it sickens me.

May life humble those people.

Life humbles us all in time

I too have been castigated and had numerous posts deleted for "being too heated"
to be fair though perhaps more of my posts could be deleted
there are so many
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  #57  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:34 PM
Bluebell87 Bluebell87 is offline
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Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
I'm really sorry about what I said.

I just don't have an opinion on drugs anymore. Just forget everything I said.

Drugs have never impacted me or my family in a negative way, so I'm ignorant on the subject.
I know drugs cause a lot of problems and hurt. Sometimes the drug addicts aren't the only or 'real' victims. But there doesn't need to be a final answer, sometimes allowing yourself to be confused leads to greater understanding like realising that maybe they are taking drugs because they can't be normal, regular people. It's ok to be on the outside if society. Just because you are not operating at full capacity, just because you are broken...it does not mean you are not fixable or loveable....don't use your leadership qualities to condemn people.
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  #58  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:36 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

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Originally Posted by Bluebell87 View Post
I know drugs cause a lot of problems and hurt. Sometimes the drug addicts aren't the only or 'real' victims. But there doesn't need to be a final answer, sometimes allowing yourself to be confused leads to greater understanding like realising that maybe they are taking drugs because they can't be normal, regular people. It's ok to be on the outside if society. Just because you are not operating at full capacity, just because you are broken...it does not mean you are not fixable or loveable....don't use your leadership qualities to condemn people.
I don't have leadership qualities and I don't know anything. Just please forget everything I said.

I didn't realize what I was saying was stupid.
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  #59  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:41 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

I'm really sorry about what I said.

I just don't have an opinion on drugs anymore.
Just forget everything I said.

Drugs have never impacted me or my family in a negative way, so I'm ignorant on the subject.

You are nevertheless entitled to hold an opinion
even if you have no experience on the topic
that does not mean stating your perspective is disallowed
after all it happens constantly regarding astrological matters
meanwhile back at the ranch....
I am happy to learn that neither you nor your family have been impacted negatively by drugs
and long may that situation continue for you and your family

An excellent current example of the impact of "sunstance abuse" on a family
is President Elect Donald Trump who DOES NOT TAKE DRUGS and does not drink alcohol
because TRUMP learned a difficult lesson
http://www.inquisitr.com/3329397/donald-trumps-dead-brother-freddy-trump-was-an-alcoholic-hated-the-donald/

when
despite wealthy family
and
privileged background
Trumps elder brother died tragically of alcohol abuse
Donald Trump 'never drank alcohol' due to brother Freddy's deathhttp://news.sky.com/story/donald-trump-never-drank-alcohol-due-to-brother-freddys-death-10662157
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/03/us...ring.html?_r=0


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  #60  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:46 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post

I don't have leadership qualities and I don't know anything.
Just please forget everything I said.

I didn't realize what I was saying was stupid.

Many of my comments are stupid but that does not prevent me from posting them
That's how I learn
by discussion
do not fear being stupid and.or being thought of as stupid


What you said is not necessarily "stupid"
instead perhaps it is based on lack of personal experience
which often leads to ignorance on a topic
if I may say so
without being considered "heated"
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  #61  
Unread 12-12-2016, 04:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AppLeo View Post
I don't have leadership qualities and I don't know anything. Just please forget everything I said.

I didn't realize what I was saying was stupid.
Hey, you don't need to go the other way and have NO opinion :/ just not wanting people dead innit
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  #62  
Unread 12-12-2016, 05:35 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

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Originally Posted by Neptunian Rainbow View Post

However, it is a really potent drug for some people. I myself am totally against using drugs since I want to dive deep within myself and process my emotions and I want to challenge and overcome my fears instead of escaping from life.

Tbh I would not even be able to use drugs if I would want to. I have Mars and Venus square Neptune and Neptune conjunct my ascendant. I have tried weed once in my life since I wanted to understand why people use it. I became VERY psychotic, the other people who used the same substance felt relaxed and nothing more. Within a few hours I returned back to normal but I did feel paranoid for a few months afterwards. That kind of paranoia is something that I have never experienced before.

The thing is that if some people want to be irresponsible, loose control and live in a fog, other people will have to take care of them and deal with the mess they cause for themselves and others.
I know a pisces sun, who has neptune in the 4th square sun, merc and venus. Had the same thing happen when he was in his late teens. He smoked pot and went psychotic and blacked out, has no memory of what happened. The people he was with never wanted anything to do with him anymore because of how scary he was. He never touched drugs after that experience.

I have neptune in the 6th, opposite venus, inconjunct sun, trine merc. I've never touched a drug, and really don't understand why anyone would want to lose control over their faculties or person, isn't life difficult enough? Seriously.

I think anyone that has neptune in hard aspect to the luminaries, should avoid drugs and alcohol altogether, the potential for addiction and death caused by drugs is too high.

Anyone that has Mercury as ruler of their sun or ascendant and it's in aspect to Saturn, should avoid smoking at all costs. Also if Saturn is in the 3rd, smoking will likely kill you. Lungs are too susceptible.


Lastly, while drugs and getting drunk may seem "cool" in your teens and early 20s. Once you hit your 30s and beyond, if you are still participating in such activities the only thing you will be considered is a Loser, by almost everyone. Severe depression will also set in when everyone you know will seem to have stable careers, homes and families of their own. By that point you now have a serious battle with addiction on your hands with slim chances of breaking.

sounds dandy.
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  #63  
Unread 12-12-2016, 09:19 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Legalizing addictive substances does.... exactly what for our children? What message does it send them? That their elders' desire to get high-- as an antidote to boredom (apparently, David)-- is far more important than the child's right to a safe and supportive home? Are we a society that hates its children?

Legalization has its arguments in its favour, and I think I'm aware of most of them, but what it doesn't address is the need to curtail drug addiction in the first place; and who besides the addict gets truly hurt. For starters, little kids in foster care, and parents of dead teenagers.

Lest anyone want a different kind of history lesson, a number of addictive drugs were perfectly legal in the US in the 19th century. A common one was morphine to numb the pain of childbirth. I highly recommend that history fans see the film A Long Day's Journey Into Night based on the Eugene O'Neill play. The playright's own mother became addicted to morphine as a result of her being given morphine during and after his birth.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-uVwAPVfDnI

Does anyone know how many kazillions of your hard-earned tax dollars go to rehab for people who cannot afford a private clinic-- and then lapse time and again once they are back in the situation where they got addicted in the first place? Or the cost of special needs babies born as addicts because their pregnant mothers couldn't get clean?

http://www.cnn.com/2012/12/14/health...cky-overdoses/

http://www.kentucky.com/news/special...e44456310.html

(I also know the alcohol argument, but two wrongs don't make a right.)

At the least, we need a "Good Samaritan law" so that drug users will call 911 when someone overdoses. But this is different than full fledged legalization.

If legalization were entirely the solution, the oxycontin epidemic would never have happened. Families are being destroyed over a prescription drug that is entirely legal (although it is on the street, as well.) When addicts can't get anymore they turn to heroin-- previously addicted.
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  #64  
Unread 12-12-2016, 09:32 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

It gets worse. A lot of addicts-- who started out with perfectly legal pain killers prescribed by their family doctor-- will turn to just about anything to either get another prescription from another doctor-- or find them on the street.

These people "forget" to eat and they can become seriously malnourished. Some of them turn to theft or prostitution-- which at this point that an underaged girl is an addict, is hardly a "victimless crime." Poor mothers would trade their food stamps for pills. Where heroin is $10 a bag, it's a much cheaper high than the perfectly legal OxyContin.

I just hope young people don't think about making drugs seem cool or sophisticated.

No, it's not about The Man, either. He'd make plenty off money off your addictions, if he could; just as he's done with OxyContin, alcohol and tobacco.

Just google "meth effects' images-- you'll see a series of before and after photos. Then you can learn what this stuff does to people's skin and teeth.

They call getting high getting "wrecked" for a reason.

References available upon request.
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  #65  
Unread 12-12-2016, 10:17 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by waybread View Post

It gets worse.

A lot of addicts

-- who started out with perfectly legal pain killers

prescribed by their family doctor--


will turn to just about anything
to either get another prescription from another doctor
-- or find them on the street.


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  #66  
Unread 12-12-2016, 10:40 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

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Originally Posted by waybread View Post
It gets worse. A lot of addicts-- who started out with perfectly legal pain killers prescribed by their family doctor-- will turn to just about anything to either get another prescription from another doctor-- or find them on the street.

These people "forget" to eat and they can become seriously malnourished. Some of them turn to theft or prostitution-- which at this point that an underaged girl is an addict, is hardly a "victimless crime." Poor mothers would trade their food stamps for pills. Where heroin is $10 a bag, it's a much cheaper high than the perfectly legal OxyContin.

I just hope young people don't think about making drugs seem cool or sophisticated.

No, it's not about The Man, either. He'd make plenty off money off your addictions, if he could; just as he's done with OxyContin, alcohol and tobacco.

Just google "meth effects' images-- you'll see a series of before and after photos. Then you can learn what this stuff does to people's skin and teeth.

They call getting high getting "wrecked" for a reason.

References available upon request.
The vast, vast majority of people who use painkillers never become addicted to them. That's fact.

But because of the current propaganda war, chronic pain patients are being hung out to dry. No drugs for many - they might become 'addicts' regardless of their history.

The government's function is NOT to protect citizens from themselves. How is our new prohibitionist society helping? Do you know that prohibition when it's been tried in the past didn't help, and lots of people died or became very ill from things like street alcohol? That that was how organised crime got a foothold in America?

Why do you think it's a good idea to do more of the same thing that didn't work, made things worse, and had all sorts of bad unintended consequences?
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  #67  
Unread 12-12-2016, 10:52 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

*

Just because pills are prescribed by a doctor
and administered by a pharmacy
that doesn’t mean they are safe for everyone

As prescription numbers continue to rise
the chance for prescription drug abuse rises as well.

Learn about the most addictive prescription drugs
including Adderall, Xanax, Codeine, amphetamines, and more.
begin learning about specific drugs that are commonly misused.

THE MOST ADDICTIVE PRESCRIPTION DRUGS ON THE MARKET

http://www.healthline.com/health/add...rugs#Overview1
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  #68  
Unread 12-12-2016, 10:58 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Personally I despise drugs, and take a harsh stance against them.

I do not follow the argument that they should be legalised to curv the drug traffick. Drug traffick should be crushed and destroyed.

To me the problem with drugs is that they affect your behaviour, and thus are not a "personal" problem. A person that is high can't interact with others in a normal way, thus having someone being high affects everyone around him.
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  #69  
Unread 12-12-2016, 11:04 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dirius View Post
Personally I despise drugs, and take a harsh stance against them.

I do not follow the argument that they should be legalised to curv the drug traffick. Drug traffick should be crushed and destroyed.

To me the problem with drugs is that they affect your behaviour, and thus are not a "personal" problem. A person that is high can't interact with others in a normal way, thus having someone being high affects everyone around him.
The problem with that, Dirius, is that we've been trying to do that for fifty years. It hasn't worked. It's made the whole mess worse.
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Unread 12-12-2016, 11:12 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

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The problem with that, Dirius, is that we've been trying to do that for fifty years. It hasn't worked. It's made the whole mess worse.
Well it depends on the country.

My country has "been doing that", but it really hasn't.

I don't think it has made it worse. The war on drugs did not expand their use. The counter-culture of the late 60's did that, which set the roots for the heavy abuse of hard drugs in the 70's and so on.

What made the drug problem worse is people defending them. Arists, politicians, etc. The moment we allowed society to tell our kids that using drugs was "ok" is the moment it spiraled out of control.

My parents told me since I was a kid that:"drugs are bad, don't use them, you will end up a homeless junky with no future, etc". ---- and I don't use drugs, not even recreational.

I do, however, see some merits in legalising certain drugs, although I personally would love to see them burned. But not every society is ready for that. My country isn't ready for that.
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  #71  
Unread 12-12-2016, 11:19 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Key there, Dirius. Your parents told you. And that's how it should be. Parents should raise their kids. We shouldn't be looking to governments to protect us from ourselves in lieu of that. When we do that, we're saying that civil liberties, control over one's own person, is bad, and must be taken away from us. This is so profoundly wrong, except perhaps to those who have an implicit trust in the virtue of government, who believe that it is wiser and better than we are. But it's not. Government has no business in most private spheres.

I live in one of the overdose capitals of the world. The law doesn't seem to be helping much. Harm reduction, however, works.
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  #72  
Unread 12-12-2016, 11:25 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

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Originally Posted by Oddity View Post
The vast, vast majority of people who use painkillers never become addicted to them. That's fact.

But because of the current propaganda war, chronic pain patients are being hung out to dry. No drugs for many - they might become 'addicts' regardless of their history.

The government's function is NOT to protect citizens from themselves. How is our new prohibitionist society helping? Do you know that prohibition when it's been tried in the past didn't help, and lots of people died or became very ill from things like street alcohol? That that was how organised crime got a foothold in America?

Why do you think it's a good idea to do more of the same thing that didn't work, made things worse, and had all sorts of bad unintended consequences?
Oddity, please do not trot out the old trope about Prohibition in the 1920s. History does not repeat itself.

You have not addressed my points about children.

The government very much protects citizens from themselves-- and from others. Were this not the case, we could abolish speed limits on highways, most crimes, and just forget about police protection.

If someone without independent wealth chooses an unsafe course of action and needs major medical care as a result, guess who pays for them? You and I do. If s/he has little kids getting harmed or winding up in foster care, we support them, as well.

Chronic pain patients are given drugs of various sorts. For some, psychologists working with pain management techniques are effective.

But don't lecture me: with moderate arthritis and bad feet, I live with chronic pain. I refuse to take prescription pain killers for it.

Organized crime in the US pre-dated Prohibition. (Tammany Hall?)

Don't get me started on white collar crime in this country. You don't need the Mafia to explain how ordinary people get cheated, threatened, and bilked.
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Unread 12-12-2016, 11:29 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

That's great for you, Waybread. I hope that if your arthritis gets worse, or if something else happens, that Canada's chill effect has eased up a bit, so that if you need pain killers, you can get them.

You prefer that your taxes don't go to other people's medical care. I guess you like them going to more police, more armies, more prisons. Which is okay, I won't change your mind on this.

If the state wanted to 'protect' us from drugs, might they regulate things like production, instead, to make sure that a drug is what it's sold as? Or should we keep continuing the spiral of drug wars, death, and harm?

Prohibition is not the answer. Unless, of course, it's all working well as is. Not seeing that where I live.
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Unread 12-12-2016, 11:36 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oddity View Post
Key there, Dirius. Your parents told you. And that's how it should be. Parents should raise their kids. We shouldn't be looking to governments to protect us from ourselves in lieu of that. When we do that, we're saying that civil liberties, control over one's own person, is bad, and must be taken away from us. This is so profoundly wrong, except perhaps to those who have an implicit trust in the virtue of government, who believe that it is wiser and better than we are. But it's not. Government has no business in most private spheres.

I live in one of the overdose capitals of the world. The law doesn't seem to be helping much. Harm reduction, however, works.
I have a different view, because that would create more recovering junkies, which isn't a good thing. Being a recovery addict is hard, I know a couple of individuals, and its terrible.

Yes I agree that legislation can help people, its just that to me we have to prevent it, rather than cure it.

What I care is that innocent people don't die from an overdosed driver running over by-standers.

I can't condone the libertarian approach on drugs because people under the influence are not in control of their own thoughts, body or behaviour, and thus can't be treated as "responsible" individuals while its effects lasts. I mean, we do stop drunk drivers, because they endanger others. So we kind of ignore personal liberties when one can't function under the banner of reason.

I know I'm a bit hard on the subject, and I don't say my point is the better one. Perhaps legalising is best, and its going to happen anyway.

EDIT: I know I'm kind of a weird individual that sometimes seems to bend to the left, and then on the right . My friends alwys tell me I'm a political contradiction lol.
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Unread 12-12-2016, 11:37 PM
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Re: Drugs - your opinion?



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