DETRIMENT state of AQUARIUS SUN is WEAK and DEBILITATED

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
*

Malefics - also known as 'infortunes'
these are planets that naturally symbolise damage and loss.

Traditionally these are SATURN the 'Greater Malefic'
and
Mars, the 'Lesser Malefic'.


BOTH ARE EXTREME IN NATURE:

SATURN being COLD and DRY

and Mars exceeding in heat.
WHEN the natural malefics are positively placed in the chart
well dignified, strong in position and involved in good aspects
their influence may be beneficial rather than afflicting :smile:
https://www.skyscript.co.uk/gl/malefics.html

MALEFIC is derived from LATIN

Maleficus, malefica
ADJECTIVE
Definitions:
harmful, noxious, injurious
of black magic
wicked, criminal, nefarious, evil
Age: In use throughout the ages
Frequency: For Dictionary, in top 10,000 words
Source: “Oxford Latin Dictionary”, 1982 (OLD)


maleficus, malefici
NOUN
declension: 2nd declension
gender: masculine
Definitions:
criminal, wrongdoer
magician, enchanter, sorcerer (L+S)
Age: In use throughout the ages
Frequency: For Dictionary, in top 10,000 words
Source: “Oxford Latin Dictionary”, 1982 (OLD)


maleficium, malefici(i)
NOUN
declension: 2nd declension
gender: neuter
Definitions:
crime/misdeed/offense
fraud/deception (L+S)
injury/hurt/wrong
pest
sorcery

Age: In use throughout the ages
Frequency: For Dictionary, in top 10,000 words
Source: “Oxford Latin Dictionary”, 1982 (OLD)


malefice
ADVERB
Definitions:
maliciously (Ecc)
mischievously (L+S)
viciously
wickedly

Age: In use throughout the ages
Frequency: Having only single citation in Oxford Latin Dictionary or Lewis + Short
Source: “Oxford Latin Dictionary”, 1982 (OLD)


malefica, maleficae
NOUN
declension: 1st declension
gender: feminine
Definitions:
sorceress
witch
Age: In use throughout the ages
Frequency: Having only single citation in Oxford Latin Dictionary or Lewis + Short
Source: “Oxford Latin Dictionary”, 1982 (OLD)


maleficio, maleficere
VERB
conjugation: 3rd conjugation
voice: intransitive
Definitions:
practice sorcery/black magic
Age: In use throughout the ages
Frequency: Having only single citation in Oxford Latin Dictionary or Lewis + Short
Source: “Oxford Latin Dictionary”, 1982 (OLD)


maleficentia, maleficentiae
NOUN
declension: 1st declension
gender: feminine
Definitions:
evil/evil-doing (L+S)
ill conduct
injury, harm
viciousness
wickedness

Age: In use throughout the ages
Frequency: Appears only in Pliny’s “Natural History”
Source: “Oxford Latin Dictionary”, 1982 (OLD)
 

waybread

Well-known member
I think that what the sun in Aquarius indicates, unless other chart factors strongly influence it, is that the ego is is just not so strongly prominent.

As a sun-Aquarian, I am very taken with the work of Lao Tsu, The Tao Te Ching, which teaches that true power does not come from personal assertiveness. Its paradox is control over one's situation coming through inaction.

But really, if we think about it, Leo (domicile) and Aries (exaltation) are the only two signs in the zodiac where the core personality is apt to be very dominant. The sun falls in Libra. There is one traditional view that says, for a woman with a night birth, the moon is a stronger indicator of her personality than is the sun. Anyone's sun can be dimmed in the 12th or 8th house.

Then so far as Saturn goes, it also depends upon how he's placed. A domiciled Saturn "in its own chariot" is seen as more beneficial. A well aspected Saturn can give one a lot of fortitude.

Most nativities have a mix of dignities and debilities. Somehow the sun-Aquarians who made a huge difference on our planet (like Charles Darwin, Abraham Lincoln, Mozart, Galileo, Susan B. Anthony) weren't much slowed down by their sun signs.
 

waybread

Well-known member
One other thing to recognize that in a lot of traditional astrology, the sun is not the primary "me" point in the horoscope. That honor belongs to the ascendant; and with a rising star or planet being given special prominence in directing the native's life.

Traditionally the sun symbolized one's father or monarch: in other words a more self-actualizing person with authority over the individual. (We still see this in mundane astrology where the sun symbolizes the head of state.) In a married woman's chart, at least with a day birth, the sun symbolized her husband. (Back in the days when women lacked much autonomy.)

The sun also does not indicate one's prominence or lack thereof. That belongs to the midheaven. Which, in part, explains why the sun sign of Aquarius has its share of prominent people.

Neptune, 910-- Oftentimes a sun-Aquarian seems to lack a kind of inner drive to manifest one's personality in a forthcoming way. It may seem like "there's no 'there' there." This possibly has to do with the detriment impact. On the other hand, a sun Aquarian with a strong first house, moon, or stellium in another sign can manifest those traits strongly.
 

waybread

Well-known member
And again, a domiciled malefic seems to lose its negativity. Mozart, for example, had a sun-Mercury-Saturn conjunction in Aquarius. These made no other major aspects, unless we count a wide trine to his Sagittarian moon.
https://www.astro.com/astro-databank/Mozart (Rodden AA) He also had Venus in Aquarius.

Abraham Lincoln and Charles Darwin were born on the same day, both with a Sagittarian Saturn square Mercury (falling) in Pisces. With their moons in Capricorn (detriment) Lincoln suffered from depression. and Darwin, from digestive problems. The moon rules one's moods as well as the stomach.

These problems did not prevent Lincoln and Darwin from making major impacts in world history, but an undignified Saturn did negatively impact them personally, in their health.
 

waybread

Well-known member
Thanks, neptune910.

I like to work with the elements and qualities of signs. Aquarius is the fixed air sign, so ideas are very important to us.

Maybe when the solar Me-Point is diminished, other aspects of the sign can predominate. This would probably be most noticeable with other Aquarian planets.
 

david starling

Well-known member
Thanks, neptune910.

I like to work with the elements and qualities of signs. Aquarius is the fixed air sign, so ideas are very important to us.

Maybe when the solar Me-Point is diminished, other aspects of the sign can predominate. This would probably be most noticeable with other Aquarian planets.

I read that Vedics consider the Sun to be Malefic, in which case wouldn't a weakened Sun be a good thing?
 

infest

Well-known member
Aquarius and Libra suns have weaker bodies. More likely to be underweight or overweight in my experience, and struggle with maintaining their health. Low on energy, irritable. 1 aquairus overcompensated and he turned out a psychopath. High but stuck violent energy.
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
Aquarius and Libra suns have weaker bodies. More likely to be underweight or overweight in my experience,
and struggle with maintaining their health. Low on energy, irritable. 1 aquairus overcompensated
and he turned out a psychopath. High but stuck violent energy.

Modernistic discussion is not traditional board

i.e.
Members who wish to explore a combination of traditional and modern ideas
should feel free to start a new thread in an appropriate forum for further discussion :)


I read that Vedics consider the Sun to be Malefic, in which case wouldn't a weakened Sun be a good thing?

our VEDIC board is at https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/index.php?forums/vedic-astrology.87/

.
 
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waybread

Well-known member
Infest's post was totally appropriate for a discussion of traditional astrology. Theoretically, Libra (fall) and Aquarian (detriment) suns should have lower vitality.

But we don't want to get stuck on some kind of ancient version of pop sun-sign astrology. Someone with an Aqua or Libra sun signs could have many other dignified planets, conjunctions with beneficial fixed stars, nice aspects., &c.

Traditionally the chart ruler would be the almuten, lord of the geniture, or rising star, which probably wouldn't be the sun.

I wouldn't change my Aquarian sun-sign if I could.

David, in Babylonian astrology (and it's hard to get more traditional than that,) the sun was seen as both beneficial and harmful. This is probably because summer daytime temperatures in Iraq get well above 40 Celsius ( > 100 Fahrenheit. ) The July average daytime high is 44 Celsius (over 110 F.)

Unsurprisingly Jupiter was seen as a much more beneficial planet (and king of the gods,) because he was a rain god. Water in a hot desert or Mediterranean climate is key to survival.
 

waybread

Well-known member
JA, don't you think you made your point-- repeatedly?

Keep in mind that a sterile dictionary definition based on etymology is not the same as how traditional horoscope interpretation actually works. Horoscope interpretation requires panoramic thinking and the ability to integrate numerous variables; not an obsessive focus on any one.

As you know, a planet in detriment can have many mitigating factors.

A planet in exaltation or domicile can have severe problems, such as a conjunction with one of the difficult stars like Algol, called the "demon star," currently in Taurus. That would take away from whatever benefits an exalted moon or domiciled Venus would otherwise bestow.

Does something specifically bother you emotionally about the sign Aquarius or particular sun Aquarians? Or are you more influenced by today's sun-sign astrology?

David, you probably know this, but the constellation of Aquarius, the water bearer, was named after the winter rainy season in the Near East and Mediterranean regions. The "rain" from the vase of the constellation is the Aquarid meteor shower.

To the Babylonians, Aquarius was named "the Great One," perhaps because of the all-important significance of water in their desert climate. (See Gavin White, Babylonian Star-Lore.) The water-bearer represented one of the primal, primary gods Ea, who symbolized water.
 
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