You still don't want to address the real issue, which is that the planets influence and mirror most terrestrial events, which is the definition of astrology (
https://www.dictionary.com/browse/astrology).
So Ptolemy talks about seeds in Tetrabiblos 1.2 as a metaphor for a human life and horoscope at birth.
But then he goes on to talk about the limits to his seed metaphor, due to the differences in the place of birth in countries, child-rearing and "customs" of different places.
Yes, but he ascribes the influence of race to astrological factors, for example the Ethiopians are burned by the Sun, the Scythians are nourished by the Moon, this in 2.2. He even ascribes ethnicities and particular countries to astrological governors, for example the nations of Italiy, Apulia, Gaul and Sicily are masterful, benevolent, and co‑operative because of Leo, this in 2.3. In the previous chapter, he rightly points out that:
And now in each of these general regions certain special conditions of character and customs naturally ensue... so also would one discover special traits in each arising from the natural familiarity of their particular climes with the stars in the signs of the zodiac. -
http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Ptolemy/Tetrabiblos/2A*.html#2
So two thousand years before sociobiology, Posidonius and Ptolemy pointed out that cultures and customs are based on heredity and (geographical) environment (which they rightly pointed out to formed from astronomy). I think that the current concept of ''culture'' as a top down approach did not arise up until the Enlightenment (which is neither DIT, nor sociobiology). It is a logical fallacy, which these ancient philosophers did not fell into.
Indeed,
I am not biological determinist in the sense that I ignore environment, which is geographical culture.
Although Ptolemy works out an astrology for different regions in book II, in sec. I.2 his argument is that we cannot predict everything about a human life from a simple horoscope reading. We have to look at both the horoscope and the native's non-horoscopic circumstances. We cannot "demand everything of the art" of astrology, because there are "instances wherein it could not provide the full answer."
Waybread, this is precisely what I argue throughout this thread. You could take some effort to read the posts though.
He notes that astrologers often make mistakes, because the topic is so vast.
Yes.
"...we should not object to astrologers using as a basis for calculation nationality, country, and rearing, or any other already existing accidental qualities."
(Robbins transl, -- 17-19.
So Ptolemy himself says that the seed metaphor only goes so far.
I never claimed it did. It is the synthesis of biological determinism with the effect of the environment, from which we conjecture human affairs. And I say, that the first processes are dependent on physics, that is by physical reductionism.
In I.3 he makes a similar argument about predictive astrology for nativities. An individual's fate and life can be greatly affected by large-scale disasters. Just as a doctor can mitigate the worst effects of a disease or even cure it, an individual can mitigate pending individual misfortunes.
Which is something that was accepted by everyone in classical astrology, that people that perish in disasters do not have all their prorogators destroyed, but simply fall under the influence of universal event and influence. And I gave similar arguments for the latter problem, at least in relation to ''electional astrology'', see my previous correspondence with Dirius.
Of course, if I wrote like this, you'd say I didn't accept the validity of astrology.
I don't know what you are talking about what you are talking about, since I have already restated these arguments in..., oh wait you deleted the thread. Nevertheless, I have developed further some of these theories, concepts and methods here:
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=125418
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=125435
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=125479
https://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum/showthread.php?t=125501