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  #26  
Unread 01-07-2015, 05:50 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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Originally Posted by R4VEN View Post
Everything about your `longing' for the right partner has been said, so I'll not add to that. What has already been mentioned is Juno. The placement - sign and house - of Juno will be what your soul requires, for whatever reason. I suspect the much of the idealising you have engaged in over time has been Neptune at work. Juno is what you will eventually choose at a soul level, because this is what you *need* in a committed partner - I'll link you to Bob Marks' page about Juno. Note the first sentence on the page - and it is true, even if you don't want it to be.

http://www.bobmarksastrologer.com/Juno21.3.html
Hello R4VEN, I feel I should investigate more about Juno.I checked the link...its very interesting because I have 2nd House, Juno in Virgo (0 degrees)...

A guy that really intrigues me (recently) has many personal planets in Virgo & Venus in Leo he is very meticulous about his work & creativity (he writes music &has a band) I admire him..That makes sense...
I am not attracted on someone based on their money not sure if I can be so superficial (2nd house Juno)...that would be lame
Thank you

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  #27  
Unread 01-19-2015, 12:12 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

Fascinating discussion, I must say. Tamara you brought up an interest point earlier in the thread about not settling for people who can't keep up with you intellectually. Not sure if I missed it but did you elaborate on this? Also you mentioned the idea that we get what we project, I'm not sure I've quite had that experience, unless of course I am completely misreading my chart lol.

As an aside, is Juno for both men and women in regards to soul partners?
Don't nodes have something to say or is that mostly for past lives/karmic relationships?
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  #28  
Unread 01-19-2015, 05:42 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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As an aside, is Juno for both men and women in regards to soul partners?
Don't nodes have something to say or is that mostly for past lives/karmic relationships?
Nodes show up in some karmic relationships, which may well also be partner-relationships.

Juno is in everyone's charts, and describes the partner we need for soul growth, even if it's not the partner we want.
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  #29  
Unread 01-19-2015, 02:33 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

So with Venus and Juno both in my 1st house my needs and wants are the same? Is that such a good thing for a relationship or troublesome? Nevermind, my ascendant is Libra, of course it's both. lol
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  #30  
Unread 01-19-2015, 10:09 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

Hi TamaraL, not sure if you're still around, but I came across this thread and wanted to comment.. Our charts have some similarities, Cancer Asc, 5th house Sag moon and vertex, strong Saturn plus Neptune conjunct Dsc (or 7th house ruler in your case).

With my Aqua venus in 8th I can definitely relate to the intellectualization of attraction, and needing to be able to engage in "mind sex" with someone if the connection is going to last. It's kind of angsty but the lyrics of this song basically sum it up lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLHvb9V8Yzs

Anyway I won't ramble on with my life story and views on relationships, but if you are still around I'd be happy to talk more since I've had similar experiences (although we might have ended up on opposite ends of the same spectrum in some ways).
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  #31  
Unread 01-21-2015, 07:20 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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Originally Posted by Etchasketch View Post
Fascinating discussion, I must say. Tamara you brought up an interest point earlier in the thread about not settling for people who can't keep up with you intellectually. Not sure if I missed it but did you elaborate on this? Also you mentioned the idea that we get what we project, I'm not sure I've quite had that experience, unless of course I am completely misreading my chart lol.

As an aside, is Juno for both men and women in regards to soul partners?
Don't nodes have something to say or is that mostly for past lives/karmic relationships?
hey Etchasketch, thank you for your comment, its cool to see that this thread is still going.For me intellect & relationships has been a big issue for 25 years & I am still searching the reasons behind my actions. I think I did elaborated in the beginning but I have changed a lot since...(I 've grown I mean) & it feels somehow expired.I think all my relationships are driven by intellect & the presence of the other person. If I don't feel at ease with how a person thinks about life & I can't relate & therefore make share a sexual connection, an honest connection with the other person.

I feel we get what we project, I can't prove it mathematically, physics?maybe... action-reaction. Its something I sense from observing me-others & experiences. But I see that when you project a woman with very strong opinions, men & women behave differently than when projecting a woman that changes her opinions every 5 minutes just to be likable. I don't want to risk projecting a fake image just to be liked...where does that lead me?
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  #32  
Unread 01-21-2015, 09:04 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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Originally Posted by kaali View Post
Hi TamaraL, not sure if you're still around, but I came across this thread and wanted to comment.. Our charts have some similarities, Cancer Asc, 5th house Sag moon and vertex, strong Saturn plus Neptune conjunct Dsc (or 7th house ruler in your case).

With my Aqua venus in 8th I can definitely relate to the intellectualization of attraction, and needing to be able to engage in "mind sex" with someone if the connection is going to last. It's kind of angsty but the lyrics of this song basically sum it up lol
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLHvb9V8Yzs

Anyway I won't ramble on with my life story and views on relationships, but if you are still around I'd be happy to talk more since I've had similar experiences (although we might have ended up on opposite ends of the same spectrum in some ways).
Good choice of music kaali!still here yes & thanks for commenting!I saw the similarities on the chart, interesting to discover people with similar experiences.(I am 2 y older ) Maybe its the sign of Aquarius in personal planets (your Venus-my Mercury) in combination with Moon in Sagittarius that creates a different approach to attraction & relationships.
..I don't feel its about being picky or turning down men for their intellect.
I don't want to scare anyone here
.In fact I can hang out with smart men as a friend & they seem to trust me more than women.

its about honesty= essential in all relationships not just love-sexual relationships. When there is no attraction between our minds, or "mind sex" oh yep..nicely put what sort of connection can be built? Otherwise its just pretending that I am into someone to please other reasons than myself...
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  #33  
Unread 01-21-2015, 10:13 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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hey Etchasketch, thank you for your comment, its cool to see that this thread is still going.For me intellect & relationships has been a big issue for 25 years & I am still searching the reasons behind my actions. I think I did elaborated in the beginning but I have changed a lot since...(I 've grown I mean) & it feels somehow expired.I think all my relationships are driven by intellect & the presence of the other person. If I don't feel at ease with how a person thinks about life & I can't relate & therefore make share a sexual connection, an honest connection with the other person.

I feel we get what we project, I can't prove it mathematically, physics?maybe... action-reaction. Its something I sense from observing me-others & experiences. But I see that when you project a woman with very strong opinions, men & women behave differently than when projecting a woman that changes her opinions every 5 minutes just to be likable. I don't want to risk projecting a fake image just to be liked...where does that lead me?
My understanding and experience of projection is that it is rooted in the unconscious. For example, no matter how aware I am of how I behave and are potentially received by another, there have been plenty of times where my presence elicits responses that are not in keeping with the interaction at hand. (I have Pluto tightly conjunct asc residing in a stellium in my first.) Challenging traditional gender roles appears to be both our problems. You clearly communicate in a matter that is unsettling to what I suspect is disagreeable to both traditional roles, hence you're attraction to men who are more inclined to the world of ideas which also challenges the way men are traditionally supposed to inhabit the world, physically. It's likely going to take many generations before more of a balance is struck in accepting that our behaviors exist on a continuum and are not so easily compartmentalized (even astrologically), despite the efforts of science to label and categorize everything in existence.

If I might put forth a possible conundrum to you... If you only are attracted sexually to men who are on the same page as you intellectually, doesn't that severely limit your potential partners? And out of that limited number of potential partners how many will be able to meet other needs that are important for the relationship to grow? It begins to feel more like a strategy designed for protection, which only serves to keep us where we are, instead of a way of life that is open, which challenges us to evolve. I hope I'm not just blowing hot air, you mentioned you've already changed from the time of your original post so I sincerely hope I haven't stepped on your toes with that line of questioning.
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  #34  
Unread 01-21-2015, 10:22 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

Just to mention your chart has an unusually high # of undecile and semi-undecile aspects, among which:

-a triangle among Merc-Mars-Nept;

-a triangle among Sun-Uran-Pluto; and

-Ven lies semi-undecile from the Sat/Nept.

If your astro software can't display these aspects, then you could draw by hand (and/or run an 11th and a 22nd harmonic chart to confirm the planets are conjunct).

While, afaik, the undecile is not well studied, you could start with the net's "need for adjustment" and "uranian-like" keyword suggestions and move forward with understanding these planetary relationships as being somewhat "edgy" in nature.

More if you're interested.
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  #35  
Unread 01-21-2015, 10:47 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

Krewster

Were you referring to my chart or the OP's? Sry if it isn't obvious to me, my exposure to astrology has not been very structured lol. I haven't paid much attention to less mentioned aspects and harmonic charts.
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  #36  
Unread 01-22-2015, 11:55 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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My understanding and experience of projection is that it is rooted in the unconscious. For example, no matter how aware I am of how I behave and are potentially received by another, there have been plenty of times where my presence elicits responses that are not in keeping with the interaction at hand. (I have Pluto tightly conjunct asc residing in a stellium in my first.) Challenging traditional gender roles appears to be both our problems. You clearly communicate in a matter that is unsettling to what I suspect is disagreeable to both traditional roles, hence you're attraction to men who are more inclined to the world of ideas which also challenges the way men are traditionally supposed to inhabit the world, physically. It's likely going to take many generations before more of a balance is struck in accepting that our behaviors exist on a continuum and are not so easily compartmentalized (even astrologically), despite the efforts of science to label and categorize everything in existence.

If I might put forth a possible conundrum to you... If you only are attracted sexually to men who are on the same page as you intellectually, doesn't that severely limit your potential partners? And out of that limited number of potential partners how many will be able to meet other needs that are important for the relationship to grow? It begins to feel more like a strategy designed for protection, which only serves to keep us where we are, instead of a way of life that is open, which challenges us to evolve. I hope I'm not just blowing hot air, you mentioned you've already changed from the time of your original post so I sincerely hope I haven't stepped on your toes with that line of questioning.
I agree with you are saying, about challenging gender roles.
Its not so dramatic though. (subjective of course)
Quite early in life, I was mainly admired for my my ideas & mind. Thats the message I took even from my own family. Imagination was my unique identity. So it left an imprint on my identity as a whole person.I understand that creates friction with how society sees/saw women, but I don't live in Sylvia Plath's timeframe (1932- 1963) In many ways the world changes slowly...but it also moves very fast.
I found love in my family exactly for how I was & I build my whole personality around the fact that my mind was very important (bad student by society norms, highly artistic,passionate) & that I would become a professional artist.

Its a perfect time to be a woman, an "UNusual" woman because I can actually fight about all my dreams.In the recent past I wouldn't be able to study, dress uniquely, meet men & hang out (as friends) , pursue what I need/want, have a career, & yes choosing men..I am not here to be with every guy in the room.blah blah sorry for the mini-manifesto...Look at the thread there are many cool women out there.....I don't know what the norm is anymore. Its interesting what you are saying about protection strategy.It could be true or somewhere in-between. If a person is alone for 2 years, it doesn't mean you are not evolving. Thats the other point of my thread you are not learning anything when you get in one superficial relationship after the other, most of my friends with the opposite strategy, have never been alone & are not learning anything...because their experiences are superficial.

Therefore I don't have many partners but I don't see than as a sign of weakness.Some individuals do...especially when they find you attractive & you don't. (partially its why I started the thread, wanted to ask how many people have been there?) So thats how I perceive my situation.

p.s I think Krewster is referring to your chart, now that I am looking at it...
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Last edited by TamaraL; 01-22-2015 at 12:11 PM.
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  #37  
Unread 01-22-2015, 06:00 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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If a person is alone for 2 years, it doesn't mean you are not evolving. Thats the other point of my thread you are not learning anything when you get in one superficial relationship after the other, most of my friends with the opposite strategy, have never been alone & are not learning anything...because their experiences are superficial.

Therefore I don't have many partners but I don't see than as a sign of weakness.Some individuals do...especially when they find you attractive & you don't. (partially its why I started the thread, wanted to ask how many people have been there?) So thats how I perceive my situation.

p.s I think Krewster is referring to your chart, now that I am looking at it...
I completely understand what you are saying. I haven't been in a relationship for many years and still evolved outside of one. Relationships should make us feel more alive, not sap our energy. I think I was unsuccessfully referring to growth within a relationship, which I see now was tangent to the focus of your post. Whoops
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  #38  
Unread 01-24-2015, 12:49 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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I completely understand what you are saying. I haven't been in a relationship for many years and still evolved outside of one. Relationships should make us feel more alive, not sap our energy. I think I was unsuccessfully referring to growth within a relationship, which I see now was tangent to the focus of your post. Whoops
Yes, but the truth lies somewhere in between.The ideal maybe not the truth.Ideally its great to experience your growth within a relationship. I 'd love that! How many people do that?Most of my friends don't do that.
Only people who developed something real, something that started from self-knowledge & having a cool & healthy relationship with your self, something I didn't have, when I was younger but developed over time. Still trying.A good sense of humor is necessary too!

Obviously all this is based on personal experience & from the perspective of a young woman, who frankly doesn't get the pressure to be with someone, (in a relationship, or sexually involved for a period of time) when I am not really attracted.& Most of the time its hard to find someone to experience all this.
I am normal too, I had allowed myself to believe I wasn't but choosing people is normal.

I 've met people from my circle saying the same comment about safety. Who knows, maybe the truth again lies somewhere in between.
But from my experience, its more complicated.
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  #39  
Unread 01-24-2015, 01:10 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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Yes, but the truth lies somewhere in between.
So very true.

There is no predetermined point of focus when it comes to relationships. They are an evolving entity.

When something "pure" occurs, it takes us away on a journey we've never known before. It reduces us to our basic self. It's simple yet complex. It's tangible yet unreal.

I'm still trying to figure out what it is in our charts that points to this path. I think the difficulty comes in the path being cluttered or misdirected. We may be born with certain 'energy'. But from our first breath comes one influence after another, that alters how we perceive ourselves. We become what we believe we should be, not the soul we are meant to be.

I think it's important to determine what it is we seek or draw to us, as opposed to what it is we truly need.

Relationships are beautiful and complex. But in truth, can be so simple.

I look at charts and try to determine what factors make us seek out certain people, or what attracts others to us. I have Venus in Aries. I instinctively seek someone with that Aries energy. But I've come to understand that is not what I truly need. I have yet to figure out what I should be looking at in the chart to determine that.

I've followed this thread for a while. Perhaps some of us over think the relationship/intelligence concept. I have Mars in Gemini in the 7th conjunct the descendant. I spend far too much time intellectualizing about relationships. But, I enjoy doing it. A curse or a blessing?
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  #40  
Unread 01-24-2015, 02:02 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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So very true.

There is no predetermined point of focus when it comes to relationships. They are an evolving entity.

When something "pure" occurs, it takes us away on a journey we've never known before. It reduces us to our basic self. It's simple yet complex. It's tangible yet unreal.

I'm still trying to figure out what it is in our charts that points to this path. I think the difficulty comes in the path being cluttered or misdirected. We may be born with certain 'energy'. But from our first breath comes one influence after another, that alters how we perceive ourselves. We become what we believe we should be, not the soul we are meant to be.

I think it's important to determine what it is we seek or draw to us, as opposed to what it is we truly need.

Relationships are beautiful and complex. But in truth, can be so simple.

I look at charts and try to determine what factors make us seek out certain people, or what attracts others to us. I have Venus in Aries. I instinctively seek someone with that Aries energy. But I've come to understand that is not what I truly need. I have yet to figure out what I should be looking at in the chart to determine that.

I've followed this thread for a while. Perhaps some of us over think the relationship/intelligence concept. I have Mars in Gemini in the 7th conjunct the descendant. I spend far too much time intellectualizing about relationships. But, I enjoy doing it. A curse or a blessing?
very poetic & true "In truth they could be so simple"...
I am trying to stop intellectualizing but its inevitable...time will tell...
its not a curse to know what lies in the basement of your actions.It has helped me understand even love myself.
9th Sun conjunct Venus 8th in Pisces I do have this inner need to find men that will teach me the secrets of the world.Even travel with them. I think the Venus in the 8th H is a very weird Venus & I can't relate with what I read online. Maybe her exaltation & Sun conjunction overrides the house position & somehow her behavior?
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Unread 01-24-2015, 02:16 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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very poetic & true "In truth they could be so simple"...
I am trying to stop intellectualizing but its inevitable...time will tell...
you SHOULD intellectualize if that's how you interact with the world. It's determining how to best use your own personal energy.

I've known many people who are very "into" sapiophiles. Intellect is a powerful thing. It has (or shouldn't have) nothing to do with gender or race or religion.

It simply is.
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Unread 01-24-2015, 03:00 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

I've been looking into midpoints lately. A bit of a story as to why.

But I see you have a Sun/Pluto midpoint and a Moon/Mercury midpoint both conjunct your Saturn, which is in Capricorn.

In a book by Michael Munkasey, he states that the Sun/Pluto midpoint is
"Your fundamental urge to exert control over all situations, your capacity or determination todefeat or ally with corrupt forces as they rise around you, and the mastery you show against self-corruption are prominent with this combination. Your commitment to concentrating yourself intothe essence of what you are as a person, the secret motivations you rally your inner strength around, and the obsession you have with increasing your self-confidence are also here"
The Moon/Mercury midpoint is
"These planets represent your ability to communicate your emotions effectively and in waysthat help others understand your feelings. These planets encourage you to become more aware of the separation between your intellectual or rational reasoning and intuitive or emotional sides.Feelings which originate deep within you, such as fear of the dark, phobias, etc., how calculationand logic vie against your habitual responses and impulses, and the emotions which you add toyour speech are also emphasized here"
These are on your Saturn in Capricorn. There's an expression of those aspects of yourself through Saturn, which can be seen as an older person. That's enhanced being in it's natural house of Capricorn, which lies on your descendant.
So there's nothing wrong with seeking an older person, a "mentor". It's simply an expression of who you are. It's tied in to your intellect, your emotions, and a power dynamic between your Sun and Pluto.
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Unread 01-24-2015, 03:09 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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you SHOULD intellectualize if that's how you interact with the world. It's determining how to best use your own personal energy.

I've known many people who are very "into" sapiophiles. Intellect is a powerful thing. It has (or shouldn't have) nothing to do with gender or race or religion.

It simply is.
I agree. Everyone has a preferred entrance into a relationship and intellect just happens to be Tamara's. I tend to have what's usually considered a female issue when it comes to relationships in that I lose my sense of self quite easily. I have a major stellium conjunct my asc with chiron rx in 7th and a taurus moon in 8th. With my asc in Libra I really mostly play off of others' intellects rather than put forth my own thoughts which can stray unconsciously during conversation. I'm not sure I'm a sapiophile - ty btw for introducing me to a new word - I need to feel secure emotionally first, a beautiful mind is just icing on the cake.
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Unread 01-24-2015, 03:18 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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I agree. Everyone has a preferred entrance into a relationship and intellect just happens to be Tamara's. I tend to have what's usually considered a female issue when it comes to relationships in that I lose my sense of self quite easily
I don't believe that's a female issue at all. I've been known to follow that path myself...losing oneself to another.

Being aware of that is a step to discovering yourself. It's not a bad thing in and of itself. One day you may find that intellectual being who will not let you 'lose yourself', but will enhance who you truly are.
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  #45  
Unread 01-24-2015, 11:59 PM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

Just catching up with this and double checked...its TamaraL's chart that bears the mentioned undecile aspects.
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Unread 01-25-2015, 12:07 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

Just catching up with this and double checked...its TamaraL's chart that bears the mentioned undecile aspects (had to recast without the benefit of location so the house orientation is messed up).
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  #47  
Unread 01-25-2015, 01:50 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

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Originally Posted by Sentient0ne View Post
you SHOULD intellectualize if that's how you interact with the world. It's determining how to best use your own personal energy.

I've known many people who are very "into" sapiophiles. Intellect is a powerful thing. It has (or shouldn't have) nothing to do with gender or race or religion.

It simply is.
That's right.Intellect is indeed powerful. Thats why I can't lie to myself.It simply is.Thank you for reminding me this.& I didn't know the sapiophile term, cool!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sentient0ne View Post
I've been looking into midpoints lately. A bit of a story as to why.

But I see you have a Sun/Pluto midpoint and a Moon/Mercury midpoint both conjunct your Saturn, which is in Capricorn.

In a book by Michael Munkasey, he states that the Sun/Pluto midpoint is
"Your fundamental urge to exert control over all situations, your capacity or determination to defeat or ally with corrupt forces as they rise around you, and the mastery you show against self-corruption are prominent with this combination. Your commitment to concentrating yourself into the essence of what you are as a person, the secret motivations you rally your inner strength around, and the obsession you have with increasing your self-confidence are also here"
The Moon/Mercury midpoint is
"These planets represent your ability to communicate your emotions effectively and in ways that help others understand your feelings. These planets encourage you to become more aware of the separation between your intellectual or rational reasoning and intuitive or emotional sides.Feelings which originate deep within you, such as fear of the dark, phobias, etc., how calculation and logic vie against your habitual responses and impulses, and the emotions which you add to your speech are also emphasized here"
These are on your Saturn in Capricorn. There's an expression of those aspects of yourself through Saturn, which can be seen as an older person. That's enhanced being in it's natural house of Capricorn, which lies on your descendant.
So there's nothing wrong with seeking an older person, a "mentor". It's simply an expression of who you are. It's tied in to your intellect, your emotions, and a power dynamic between your Sun and Pluto.
Both descriptions fit the reality of my situation.Both scary & fascinating to hear.So the Pluto-Sun dynamic is responsible...Although I frequently fail at increasing my self-confidence, I am determined to stay true to my inside.&I am able to distinguish between impulses & logic. I was always considered really older than my age in intellect & appearance... even the everyday problems/worries I face now are not considered my age.
I feel perfectly tuned to older people & love hanging out with my tutors ...Its a very strong theme in my life & every relationship I come across.
It really helps to have astrological insight on these sensitive areas of life, attraction and what drives you as a person.'Cause it confirms what I know and removes the unnecessary noises (result of peer pressure) blocking the way to confidence.
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Unread 01-25-2015, 01:55 AM
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Re: Intellect & Sexual Attraction

Quote:
Originally Posted by TamaraL View Post
That's right.Intellect is indeed powerful. Thats why I can't lie to myself.It simply is.Thank you for reminding me this.

Cause it confirms what I know and removes the unnecessary noises (result of peer pressure) blocking the way to confidence.
you are who you are. Never lie to yourself. In spite of the pressures. you know who you are. That's evident in your search, in seeking the affirmation.

There is a depth of soul within each of us. We seek a connection to affirm this depth, this piece of ourselves. It doesn't matter what the rest of the world thinks or says. This is our reality.

Keep that in mind, and you'll be more than fine.
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