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  #1  
Unread 07-31-2012, 01:22 AM
boom boom is offline
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Denial of Marriage

Someone tell me something positive to come out of this. I'm new at this and trying my best to figure it all out. I've tried to decipher my chart using different methods and am deeply saddened by what I find.

Denial of Marriage:

Vedic Astrology:
- Venus and ruler of 7th house severely debilitated -> Mercury, Venus and Mars all combust in 6th house
- Venus placed in Leo and aspected by both Sun and Moon
- Jupiter - singleton, stationary and retrograde

Delineating Marriage (Medieval Method): http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=49297
- Venus is impeded (combust, joined with malefics [Sun/Mars]); triplicity lords are impeded (Jupiter: Stationary; retrograde; Sun: 6th house; Mars: combust 6th house)
- Venus and the lords are occidental and are between the AC and IC (Jupiter), between DC and MC (Saturn) and in the 2nd quarter of the Moon (Sun)

Delineation of Marriage (Hellenistic Method): http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=49434
-lords of triplicity of Venus in a bad sign (Jupiter - stationary, retrograde; Saturn-unaspected, retrograde, 10th house - sorrows; Sun - sixth house)

Other stuff:
Part of Fortune squared by Leo stellium; ruler (Venus) is severely debilitated
Lilith (Cancer) in 5th (bad parent/can't have kids)
Pluto (Scorpio) in 7th (abusive relationships/power struggle)
Juno (Pisces) in 12th (first marriage could do me in)
I have no exalted planets!!

Me and my self-pitying tendencies need some comfort right now
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Last edited by boom; 11-13-2012 at 12:19 AM.
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  #2  
Unread 07-31-2012, 08:49 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

In my views, these are the reasons
venus is strongly combust,
7th ruler mercury is combust too,
south node in 7th.



Quote:
Originally Posted by boom View Post
Someone tell me something positive to come out of this. I'm new at this and trying my best to figure it all out. I've tried to decipher my chart using different methods and am deeply saddened by what I find.

Denial of Marriage:
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  #3  
Unread 07-31-2012, 09:15 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

I do modern astrology, and I don't see any problem. With Virgo on the cusp of your 7th house, I would look to the position of Mercury. OK, so it's in the 6th house but it is extremely well-aspected. You might look to meet Mr. Right at your job or a health/fitness centre. Mars and the sun are two planetary Mr. Right indicators, and they are also really well aspected. Lucky you!

The main feature of your chart seems to be a kite formation, pointing to your moon-Chiron in the third house of thought and communication. Also of siblings. Your big challenge in life would seem to be learning how to deal with hurt feelings.

I have sun conjunct Mars as well, and have been married most of my adult life. Twice.
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Last edited by waybread; 07-31-2012 at 09:18 PM.
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Unread 08-01-2012, 01:07 AM
boom boom is offline
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by beginner View Post
In my views, these are the reasons
venus is strongly combust,
7th ruler mercury is combust too,
south node in 7th.
the idea of never having a lifelong companion breaks my heart Leos live for love.

Outside of squaring my Neptune (even that may be a bit wide), my North node doesn't have any actual aspect to any of my personal planets. I read that you'd have to look at the placement of the rulers of the nodes. If my North node is ruled by Mars and my South node is ruled by Venus, and Venus and Mars are both strongly debilitated in my chart (6th house, combust, conjunct), then what happens?
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  #5  
Unread 08-01-2012, 02:32 AM
Alice McDermott Alice McDermott is offline
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Re: Denial of Marriage

One of the reasons I discarded the various forms of 'traditional' astrology was that the rules just didn't apply to my clients. These people regularly had lives that the more ancient forms of astrology said wasn't possible. I live in the southern hemisphere so perhaps this is why as many of the strictures were based on dignities, debilities etc., which, as they are derived from the Northern hemisphere seasons, aren't appropriate in the Southern hemisphere.

However, I still have a number of clients born in the Northern Hemisphere and don't find these so called rules apply to their lives either!

In modern astrology you will certainly have a partner and as the significators are in the 6th house it is likely to be someone in public service. With Mars involved it could be the police or armed services; with Mercury and Venus involved it could be involving selling, beauty or beauty products, writing or art; with Leo and the Sun involved this person(s) could be prominent or attain prominence.

A likely time will be in 2015, when Secondary Progressed Venus moves to conjoin your Descendant. This is a classic combination for partnership and marriage.

You have your Vertex in the 7th house as well, so this would be a strong significator for marriage and partnership; any time a planet triggers this placement by progression, directions or major transits the relationship energy will be activated in your life. In 2013-2014 Solar Arc Vertex moves to sextile the ruler of your Descendant so this could also be a time when you meet someone important to you.

Right now you have Secondary Progressed Descendant conjunct natal and SP Pluto. This will bring plutonian people into your life and give plutonian experiences in relationships - these are rarely easy!

As an example of how inaccurate these old rules can be, I have the ruler of my Descendant exalted and in an excellent house, you would think this would give a pleasant marriage at the very least. I was married for 13 years and hated every minute of it! When I got divorced I decided I would never marry again and never have.

Neptune square your nodal axis can give some problems, so just be careful when transits activate this configuration.

Rather than just believing these ancient rules, created for a different time and vastly different culture(s) perhaps check them out for yourself - maybe check out the charts of famous people and people you know well. You should find that really these rules just aren't working, for example, look at all the famous people, politicians etc., who have planets in the 12th house! Their lives are rarely hidden away, quite the opposite, they are in the full glare of the public. In addition I have never found planets combust debilitated in any way in real life, for example, look at the chart of Noel Tyl (31st December 1936, 3.57 pm, West Chester, PA), it would be difficult to find a more famous astrologer and he has been famous in other areas as well, yet he has the ruler of his MC, Jupiter, in Capricorn combust the Sun in the 7th house. His Jupiter works very, very well for him and has taken him to every continent on Earth both physically and through his prolific published works.

Alice
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  #6  
Unread 08-01-2012, 02:38 AM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alice McDermott View Post
As an example of how inaccurate these old rules can be, I have the ruler of my Descendant exalted and in an excellent house, you would think this would give a pleasant marriage at the very least. I was married for 13 years and hated every minute of it! When I got divorced I decided I would never marry again and never have.
Hey Alice, would you mind sharing your chart?
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  #7  
Unread 08-01-2012, 03:05 AM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by boom View Post
Someone tell me something positive to come out of this. I'm new at this and trying my best to figure it all out. I've tried to decipher my chart using different methods and am deeply saddened by what I find.

Denial of Marriage:

Vedic Astrology:
- Venus and ruler of 7th house severely debilitated -> Mercury, Venus and Mars all combust in 6th house
- Venus placed in Leo and aspected by both Sun and Moon
- Jupiter - singleton, stationary and retrograde

Delineating Marriage (Medieval Method): http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=49297
- Venus is impeded (combust, joined with malefics [Sun/Mars]); triplicity lords are impeded (Jupiter: Stationary; retrograde; Sun: 6th house; Mars: combust 6th house)
- Venus and the lords are occidental and are between the AC and IC (Jupiter), between DC and MC (Saturn) and in the 2nd quarter of the Moon (Sun)

Delineation of Marriage (Hellenistic Method): http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=49434
-lords of triplicity of Venus in a bad sign (Jupiter - stationary, retrograde; Saturn-unaspected; Sun - sixth house)

Marriage Indicators in Horary: http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=36623
- I'm a woman with Sun with Mars/Venus AND Venus with Mars
- my Sun is not applying to Saturn

Other stuff:
Part of Fortune squared by Leo stellium; ruler (Venus) is severely debilitated
Lilith (Cancer) in 5th (bad parent/can't have kids)
Pluto (Scorpio) in 7th (abusive relationships/power struggle)
Juno (Pisces) in 12th (first marriage could do me in)

Me and my self-pitying tendencies need some comfort right now
It's not much but Transiting Saturn moving through your 7th will sextile your Mercury, Sun, Venus stellium and trine your Moon. Moon and Mercury rule your 5th and 7th houses. Not sure if T Jupiter gets to these planets at the same time, but you might meet someone as this is the final transit of T Saturn to these natal planets which is usually the strongest.

I feel your pain and I am quite a bit older than you are. My ruler of the 7th is in the 8th and square Uranus, it's also sextile Mercury and trine my ASC. Its depositor Jupiter in the 12th is opposing Uranus and Pluto, but also part of a natal Kite. The triplicity ruler Mars in the 6th is retrograde and unaspected and Saturn(ruler of my Sun and 7th House almuten ruler) is conjunct Mercury but square Neptune!! This certainly has described my relationships, fast starts and abrupt endings, deception and few relationships with years in-between each one. In my case, I am have never married. I's very depressing to me especially now that it's too late to have children. The ancient delienation seem to point to the reason why I never married but then again so does modern astrology.

Last edited by Vista; 08-01-2012 at 03:13 AM.
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  #8  
Unread 08-01-2012, 04:12 AM
dr. farr dr. farr is offline
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Re: Denial of Marriage

I accept elements of both Traditional and Modernist astrology (and reject other elements of both)

For me, as an eclectic, and using whole sign houses:

-7th house is under Virgo
-its lord (Mercury) as well as benefic Venus and malefic Mars, are all absorbed by the Sun ("combust') which to me means that the SUN is significator for all of the planets it has absorbed
-therefore your defacto lord of the 7th house is the SUN (note: this view of the Sun and combustion is alchemical in nature and follows the teachings of hermeticists such as Paracelsus)
-relative to marriage specifically, I have found specific Lots of much more delineative value than generic house allocations; in this case the Woman's Lot of Marriage is the indicative element in this chart giving most information regarding marriage
-your WLOM (ascendant+saturn-venus) falls @ 22 Cancer, in the 5th whole sign house (indicating a romantic marriage-5th house), its dispositor and significator being the Moon
-Moon is in its house of joy (3rd whole sign house) and flows toward the WLOM, both quite + testimonies
-since the Sun is defacto lord of the 7th house and holds Venus within it (see above), the sextile of the Moon to the Sun (Moon as significator of the WLOM, Sun as defacto significator via absorption of the 7th house and Venus) is very + testimony for marriage.
-also note that Vesta (symbolic of hearth and home, and of the internal flame) is in the same sign as the WLOM (Cancer) and both have the same significator (the Moon)
...indications of difficulties with marriage??
Not in my book-rather quite the opposite!

(Note: Vesta is in the 5th whole sign house of fertile Cancer; Lilith is NOT in the 5th house, rather it is in the 6th house by whole sign; indications for having children are quite favorable in this chart)

Last edited by dr. farr; 08-01-2012 at 04:17 AM.
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  #9  
Unread 08-01-2012, 09:34 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Great reading, Alice! Just curious: how can you say for sure that boom will get married, vs. merely having a favourable time for that to happen?

boom, I wouldn't say that Leos "live for love". Leos live for other people's praise and admiration; as well as their own ability to express themselves with excellence in some way.

You have such a good-looking chart, with all of those trines and sextiles. Lucky you.
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  #10  
Unread 08-01-2012, 11:55 PM
Alice McDermott Alice McDermott is offline
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Hi Waybread

Marriage involves two people so whether or not Boom gets married when Secondary Progressed Venus conjoins her natal Descendant depends a great deal on the chart of her partner and their combined charts.

However, this, or SP Venus conjunct planets in the 7th house or ruler of the 7th house, is a classic configuration that turns up again and again when people meet those with whom they form partnerships and/or get married.

Alice
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  #11  
Unread 10-09-2012, 03:06 AM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alice McDermott View Post
One of the reasons I discarded the various forms of 'traditional' astrology was that the rules just didn't apply to my clients. These people regularly had lives that the more ancient forms of astrology said wasn't possible. I live in the southern hemisphere so perhaps this is why as many of the strictures were based on dignities, debilities etc., which, as they are derived from the Northern hemisphere seasons, aren't appropriate in the Southern hemisphere.

However, I still have a number of clients born in the Northern Hemisphere and don't find these so called rules apply to their lives either!

In modern astrology you will certainly have a partner and as the significators are in the 6th house it is likely to be someone in public service. With Mars involved it could be the police or armed services; with Mercury and Venus involved it could be involving selling, beauty or beauty products, writing or art; with Leo and the Sun involved this person(s) could be prominent or attain prominence.

A likely time will be in 2015, when Secondary Progressed Venus moves to conjoin your Descendant. This is a classic combination for partnership and marriage.

You have your Vertex in the 7th house as well, so this would be a strong significator for marriage and partnership; any time a planet triggers this placement by progression, directions or major transits the relationship energy will be activated in your life. In 2013-2014 Solar Arc Vertex moves to sextile the ruler of your Descendant so this could also be a time when you meet someone important to you.

Right now you have Secondary Progressed Descendant conjunct natal and SP Pluto. This will bring plutonian people into your life and give plutonian experiences in relationships - these are rarely easy!

As an example of how inaccurate these old rules can be, I have the ruler of my Descendant exalted and in an excellent house, you would think this would give a pleasant marriage at the very least. I was married for 13 years and hated every minute of it! When I got divorced I decided I would never marry again and never have.

Neptune square your nodal axis can give some problems, so just be careful when transits activate this configuration.

Rather than just believing these ancient rules, created for a different time and vastly different culture(s) perhaps check them out for yourself - maybe check out the charts of famous people and people you know well. You should find that really these rules just aren't working, for example, look at all the famous people, politicians etc., who have planets in the 12th house! Their lives are rarely hidden away, quite the opposite, they are in the full glare of the public. In addition I have never found planets combust debilitated in any way in real life, for example, look at the chart of Noel Tyl (31st December 1936, 3.57 pm, West Chester, PA), it would be difficult to find a more famous astrologer and he has been famous in other areas as well, yet he has the ruler of his MC, Jupiter, in Capricorn combust the Sun in the 7th house. His Jupiter works very, very well for him and has taken him to every continent on Earth both physically and through his prolific published works.

Alice
Thanks Alice for taking the time to respond to this thread. I'm just getting over another crush who's currently with another girl. I tend to have a lot of difficulty with intense crushes, does that have anything to do with " Secondary Progressed Descendant conjunct natal and SP Pluto." Or am I completely missing the boat? Sometimes, I feel like I'm constantly getting involved with guys that are clearly NOT available.

Where would you suspect I meet men? Most of my social circle revolves around work (6th house venus?) and it's constantly the same people.

Once again, thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by dr. farr View Post
I accept elements of both Traditional and Modernist astrology (and reject other elements of both)

For me, as an eclectic, and using whole sign houses:

-7th house is under Virgo
-its lord (Mercury) as well as benefic Venus and malefic Mars, are all absorbed by the Sun ("combust') which to me means that the SUN is significator for all of the planets it has absorbed
-therefore your defacto lord of the 7th house is the SUN (note: this view of the Sun and combustion is alchemical in nature and follows the teachings of hermeticists such as Paracelsus)
-relative to marriage specifically, I have found specific Lots of much more delineative value than generic house allocations; in this case the Woman's Lot of Marriage is the indicative element in this chart giving most information regarding marriage
-your WLOM (ascendant+saturn-venus) falls @ 22 Cancer, in the 5th whole sign house (indicating a romantic marriage-5th house), its dispositor and significator being the Moon
-Moon is in its house of joy (3rd whole sign house) and flows toward the WLOM, both quite + testimonies
-since the Sun is defacto lord of the 7th house and holds Venus within it (see above), the sextile of the Moon to the Sun (Moon as significator of the WLOM, Sun as defacto significator via absorption of the 7th house and Venus) is very + testimony for marriage.
-also note that Vesta (symbolic of hearth and home, and of the internal flame) is in the same sign as the WLOM (Cancer) and both have the same significator (the Moon)
...indications of difficulties with marriage??
Not in my book-rather quite the opposite!

(Note: Vesta is in the 5th whole sign house of fertile Cancer; Lilith is NOT in the 5th house, rather it is in the 6th house by whole sign; indications for having children are quite favorable in this chart)
Thank you Dr. Farr for your positive interpretation. I just had a couple of questions:

1. You mention that you mix both traditional and modern elements of astrology. How do you typically interpret individuals with 6th house stelliums? Everything I read about the 6th house is pretty bad. In modern astrology, its about health and service. In traditional astrology, it mean I'm a slave and will remain of low status.

2. What is the difference between the Sun absorbing Mercury/Venus/Mars and the planets being combust?

3. Are Parts usually interpreted first by the ruler or the aspects made to a specific Part? For example, I make no aspects to my Part of Marriage, but I my entire stellium is square the Part of Fortune (in Taurus) and opposite the Part of Divorce (Aquarius).

4. By Whole sign system, is my moon in the third or the fourth house? I'm very new to astrology, so please bear with me.

I'm very grateful you took the time to respond to my thread Sometimes, it's nice to see a positive reading; everything I read and try to apply to my chart is always so negative. Everything is always about how all my planets are debilitated and I'll receive no fortune/love/etc. It makes me quite sad since a lot of things in my life didn't go as planned (but that's life I suppose).

Last edited by boom; 10-09-2012 at 03:14 AM.
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Unread 10-09-2012, 03:46 AM
gen6k gen6k is offline
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Re: Denial of Marriage

youre over interpreting it. you'll be fine.

these "problems" are perhaps true, but not the correct scenario to imagine them in.

most people have some kind of problems with marriage. i have the 7ths ruler opposite Mars. my will seems to go against theirs. as well as opposite chiron, theres a lot of healing themes and something to fix. since the oppositions to the ruler are in the 12th house i seem to pick "broken" partners. the last person i tried to partner with was so broken that they didnt even know they were broken...

now i just want to have fun (gemini venus) cause i cant always carry the load, and not as capable anymore.

just try to see what you could run in to, and avoid or deal with those situations correctly before its too late.

http://sacred-astrology.blogspot.com...kumbh-and.html

you have rahu in pisces according to vedic.

Last edited by gen6k; 10-09-2012 at 08:47 AM.
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  #13  
Unread 10-09-2012, 03:31 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by boom View Post
4. By Whole sign system, is my moon in the third or the fourth house?
boom your whole sign chart is attached - your Moon is in 4th whole sign house

also attached is your alcabitius houses chart which is the one for medieval delineation purposes - note that your natal Moon is in 4th for alcabitius house system - for optimum results it is important to delineate with the appropriate house system
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File Type: jpg BOOM NATAL ALCABITIUS HOUSES STYLE.jpg (79.5 KB, 12 views)
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Unread 10-14-2012, 08:16 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

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Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
boom your whole sign chart is attached - your Moon is in 4th whole sign house

also attached is your alcabitius houses chart which is the one for medieval delineation purposes - note that your natal Moon is in 4th for alcabitius house system - for optimum results it is important to delineate with the appropriate house system
Thanks! Out of curiosity, would my Mercury and Venus be interpreted in the 5th or 6th house? These planets are so close to the 6th house cusp in the alcabitius house system chart.
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Unread 10-14-2012, 08:52 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
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Thanks! Out of curiosity, would my Mercury and Venus be interpreted in the 5th or 6th house? These planets are so close to the 6th house cusp in the alcabitius house system chart.
Whole signs is useful as it clearly identifies whole signs as whole houses - clearly showing that Sun, Mars, Venus and Mercury are all Leo so are all in 6th whole sign house. Makes sense

Dynamical division is used to gauge planetary strength. Sun Venus and Mercury being in 5th Alcabitius house shows these three planets being in a succedent house are likely to produce more events than Mars in 6th Cadent house. Planets producing most events are located in 1st, 4th, 7th and 10th angular houses
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Unread 10-14-2012, 09:03 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by JUPITERASC View Post
Whole signs is useful as it clearly identifies whole signs as whole houses - clearly showing that Sun, Mars, Venus and Mercury are all Leo so are all in 6th whole sign house. Makes sense

Dynamical division is used to gauge planetary strength. Sun Venus and Mercury being in 5th Alcabitius house shows these three planets being in a succedent house are likely to produce more events than Mars in 6th Cadent house. Planets producing most events are located in 1st, 4th, 7th and 10th angular houses
Do the placements of Sun, Venus in Mercury in 5th change the reading for Delineating Marriage (Medieval Method)? All my personal planets (excluding Moon) are all still combust Plus, these planets are so close to the 6th house cusp. Do they still express themselves fully in the 5th?

I read up on planetary placements in the 5th house and while I feel like I fit some of the descriptions, I can't help but wonder if it stems from the fact I have a lot of Leo placements or the 5th house (I'm quite childish, I love going to the theatre/concerts, self-expression is key).
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Unread 10-14-2012, 09:09 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

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Originally Posted by boom View Post
Do the placements of Sun, Venus in Mercury in 5th change the reading for Delineating Marriage (Medieval Method)? All my personal planets (excluding Moon) are all still combust Plus, these planets are so close to the 6th house cusp. Do they still express themselves fully in the 5th?

I read up on planetary placements in the 5th house and while I feel like I fit some of the descriptions, I can't help but wonder if it stems from the fact I have a lot of Leo placements or the 5th house (I'm quite childish, I love going to the theatre/concerts, self-expression is key).
That's why I posted the Alcabitius houses for you boom, because the Medieval Method is delineated using Alcabitius houses - the examples on the thread are using Alcabitius houses And as there are so many layers of meaning/interpretation with this method, so its a good idea to check out basic natal chart delineation using Alcabitius houses as well for more insight. Take time to process the info http://www.astrologyweekly.com/forum...ad.php?t=48463
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Unread 10-14-2012, 09:56 PM
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Culpeper Culpeper is offline
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Re: Denial of Marriage

I do not see what all the panic is about over this horoscope chart. It is really very good. However, you are confusing yourself by mixing rules from horary and natal as well as different time periods. I will just use Hellenistic since you mention that.

Hellenistic uses whole sign houses which are visible as the signs around the outside of the chart. It does not use aspect orbs. First find the strength of the planets determined primarily by their house position. In this chart Moon in the 4th, Sun and Mars in the 7th and Saturn in the 10th are the strongest planets as these are angular houses. Jupiter is also reasonably strong in the 2nd house.

The planets are active in the houses they rule rather than their location. The Moon rules the 5th house and Jupiter rules the first. These houses are represented by fruitful signs with strong rulers so this indicates that the native will have children.

The 7th house of marriage is Virgo ruled by Mercury. Mercury is in the 6th cadent house. Cadent planets are weak and slow to act if ever. However, Mercury has aspects and conjunction with Venus-- really favorable. The aspects are a grand trine kite. Also there is a mutual reception with the Sun. Mercury will certainly do something good for you in due course.

Triplicity rulers were very important in Hellenistic. Since this is a night chart the triplicity ruler of Virgo and the 7th house is the Moon. The Moon as previously shown is strong and this is a very favorable indication of marriage. So matters are better than you think.
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Unread 10-27-2012, 06:58 AM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

I keep trying to find out more about "combustion" and it seems as though everything points to never being fortunate in relationships because my 7th house ruler and venus are combust. I've had 4 massive crushes go bust in the past year (all of whom have girlfriends). I've tried to become more proactive in my approach to guys, but a lot of the time there's something in the way. It's frustrating and irritating.

Last edited by boom; 11-12-2012 at 11:50 PM.
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Unread 10-27-2012, 05:11 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Have you followed any of the above advice? Or just reverted to your "poor me" trope?

You sound like the girl "who's in love with love." And that's fine. But "four crushes in the past year"? That must be some kind of world record. Is anything about these men really suitable for you, or are you just feeling starved for affection?

As a Leo, you need to remember that you are royalty. Walk with pride, and look and act your best. Otherwise, the lioness just sulks in her den, licking her (oftentimes imagined) wounds-- possibly generated by your moon conjunct chiron. Express self confidence, even when you don't feel it. Fake it till you make it.

With your stellium in the 6th house, focus on health-fitness and/or service to other people for now.
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Last edited by waybread; 10-27-2012 at 05:13 PM.
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  #21  
Unread 11-12-2012, 11:52 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by Culpeper View Post
I do not see what all the panic is about over this horoscope chart. It is really very good. However, you are confusing yourself by mixing rules from horary and natal as well as different time periods. I will just use Hellenistic since you mention that.

Hellenistic uses whole sign houses which are visible as the signs around the outside of the chart. It does not use aspect orbs. First find the strength of the planets determined primarily by their house position. In this chart Moon in the 4th, Sun and Mars in the 7th and Saturn in the 10th are the strongest planets as these are angular houses. Jupiter is also reasonably strong in the 2nd house.

The planets are active in the houses they rule rather than their location. The Moon rules the 5th house and Jupiter rules the first. These houses are represented by fruitful signs with strong rulers so this indicates that the native will have children.

The 7th house of marriage is Virgo ruled by Mercury. Mercury is in the 6th cadent house. Cadent planets are weak and slow to act if ever. However, Mercury has aspects and conjunction with Venus-- really favorable. The aspects are a grand trine kite. Also there is a mutual reception with the Sun. Mercury will certainly do something good for you in due course.

Triplicity rulers were very important in Hellenistic. Since this is a night chart the triplicity ruler of Virgo and the 7th house is the Moon. The Moon as previously shown is strong and this is a very favorable indication of marriage. So matters are better than you think.
Thanks for the reading! I just wanted to ask, why are my Mercury and Sun in mutual reception? All are in Leo...does that change the reading a whole lot?
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Unread 11-13-2012, 12:43 AM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by boom View Post
Thanks for the reading! I just wanted to ask, why are my Mercury and Sun in mutual reception? All are in Leo...does that change the reading a whole lot?
As you say boom, I agree Sun in Leo with Mercury also in Leo are NOT in mutual reception
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Unread 11-13-2012, 01:14 AM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

1987... too young to suspect a denial of marriage... I will worry when I turn 40 and I haven't been married.

You will marry an:
Intelligent (sun and mars in virgo)
Extroverted guy (mercury in leo)
That you will meet at your workplace, gym, or at your daily routine (whatever it is). "this three planets in your 6th, so DEFINITELY you will meet him at 6th house situations and places"
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Unread 12-17-2012, 09:45 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by boom View Post
the idea of never having a lifelong companion breaks my heart Leos live for love.

Outside of squaring my Neptune (even that may be a bit wide), my North node doesn't have any actual aspect to any of my personal planets. I read that you'd have to look at the placement of the rulers of the nodes. If my North node is ruled by Mars and my South node is ruled by Venus, and Venus and Mars are both strongly debilitated in my chart (6th house, combust, conjunct), then what happens?
Hey boom cheer up - a technique step by step shown by BobZemco who no longer posts on this forum may interest you

08-16-2010, 06:59 AM
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Re: Age of marriage shown in the Natal Chart
Quote:
Originally Posted by Astrolove
I have tried doing the natal chart with added progression however I am just as lost.

Maybe you're LOST (like the tele show) and not lost.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrimsonTaurus
ok so I'm totally confused!

Taurus is actually White & Yellow (Citrine). Libra would be dark crimson.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Astrolove
I would like to know if anyone can help me figure out the year or the age of marriage in my case Please.

I'll show you some neat tricks.

000 - 029 Ari
030 - 059 Tau
060 - 089 Gem
090 - 119 Can
120 - 149 Leo
150 - 179 Vir
180 - 209 Lib
210 - 239 Sco
240 - 269 Sag
270 - 299 Cap
300 - 329Aqu
330 - 359 Pis

Those are the Right Ascensions aka "RA" so if I said RA Venus 9439' then you'd know that Venus is really in at 4 Can 39' and what is the value of that? Well, sometimes astro-math is easier if you use RA instead of Signs/Degrees.

This whole thread is about a woman named Rose Murray who wrote a book about when you'll marry or something like that way back in 1996.

She is using an astrological technique that is 3,000 years old, but she doesn't explain it very well so I'll clear up some of the confusion.

Her method is based on primary direction or what we call progressions. Everything you need or want to know about your future is right there. I'll show you how to do that using this chart here:



In this chart, we see Venus at 4 Can 39' which would means that the opposite point would be 4 Cap 39' so that if we direct the Ascendant to 4 Cap 39' then the directed Ascendant would be in opposition to natal Venus.

Let's convert the Ascendant and the point opposite Venus to Right Ascension:

4 Cap 39' equals 270 + 4 Cap 39' --> 27439'
20 Sco 43' equals 210 + 20 Sco 43' --> 23043'

Now let's subtract the difference between the two RA points:

27439'
23043'

Convert 39' for subtraction:

27399'
23043'

Equals 4356'

Now, we aren't really keen on minutes of arc so we'll get rid of them and we're left with:

43 and using a Naibod Table (which is not the same thing as a Naibod Arc) we find that 43 equals 43 years and 230 days.

So, in the 43rd year of the life of Professor Gumby, in the 7th Month (230 days divided by 30 days), which was July 2005, something happened, specfically to wit, Prof Gumby and his wife filed for divorce which was finalized 60 days later in September.

That is Directed Ascendant opposition natal Venus which happens to rule Professor Gumby's 9th House and this happened to be his 2nd Marriage and his wife was a foreigner and that folks, is what the 9th House means.

How about that? Now don't feel bad for Professor Gumby because I happen to know he was over the bleeding Moon about the whole thing.

But I think you guys wanted to know about marriage. Okay.

Let's direct Jupiter to the 5th House and sextile the natal Sun. In order for Jupiter to form a sextile with natal Sun at 5 Gem 13' Jupiter will have to be directed to 5 Ari 13' so let's convert those to Right Ascensions:

Sextile 5 Ari 13' equals 0 + 513' --> 513'
Jupiter 10 Pis 38' equals 330 + 1038' --> 34038'

Lets subtract Right Ascensions:

513'
34038'



Houston, we have a problem.

How do we resolve this problem? Well we just add 360 and then subtract:

36513'
34038'

Convert 13' for subtraction:

36473'
34038'

Equals 2435' and since we hate those minutes, let's get rid of them and we're left with:

24

From the Naibod Table (which again has absolutely nothing to do with the Naibod Arc) we find that:

24 equals 24 years 128 days.

In the 24th year of the life of Professor Gumby in the Month of April he set up house with the new Mrs. Professor Gumby in the quaint German village of Schnenberg-Kbelberg (a river runs through it).

If you want to find the time of Professor Gumby's 2nd Marriage, I'll give you a hint: Jupiter makes a certain aspect with Mercury.

Now, I can't reproduce the Naibod Table here, but you can certainly get in the ball-park just by using the degree-for-a-year thing.

A word of caution:

And a word of warning:

If you're into the "squares are scary" thing, then you're going to miss the boat.

If you look at the chart, you can plainly see that directed Venus will form a square with natal Mars. That was a good thing that happened to Professor Gumby and he didn't have to lay in a ditch with stinky putrid water for 2 hours getting shot at to have this good thing.

Directed Uranus square your natal Part of Fortune could be the day you win the lottery. So just think about that because directed Sun square Venus or directed Venus square Sun could be the love of your life.
Attached Images Prof Gumby.jpg (39.3 KB, 108 views)
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Four Modern Astrologers said Serial Killer John Wayne Gacy: "…can be very good with kids..." "...just your presence would be beneficial to other people..." "...a fairly well-rounded personality...you can offer a good role model..." "You have an instinctive awareness and your uninhibited response to life can refresh and gladden whomever you encounter."

Traditional Astrology Says: "...shows a strange mind and very wicked."

Gacy received 12 Death and 21 Life sentences for the murder of 33 boys.
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Unread 12-17-2012, 09:48 PM
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Re: Denial of Marriage

And BobZemco added an important piece of information as follows


08-16-2010, 11:54 PM
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Re: Age of marriage shown in the Natal Chart
I forgot to mention something really important that Murray didn't explain very well in her book and a lot of others have butchered along the way. Anytime people try to reduce Astrology to the lowest common denominator you get a big FAIL.

People should consider the possibility that Venus (or Mars) is NOT the Marriage Indicator in their chart and that Venus may not even be a Marriage Indicator. How can you know what the Marriage Indicators are?

The Marriage Indicators are:

the progressed Ascendant
the natal, progressed and transiting 5th House Ruler
any planets in the natal 5th House
any planets progressed or transiting the natal 5th House
the natal, progressed and transiting 7th House Ruler
any planets in the natal 7th House
any planets progressed or transiting the natal 7th House

For a second marriage all the above plus:
the natal, progressed and transiting 9th House Ruler
any planets in the natal 9th House
any planets progressed or transiting the natal 9th House

For a third marriage same/same plus:
the natal, progressed and transiting 11th House Ruler
any planets in the natal 11th House
any planets progressed or transiting the natal 11th House

For those whose philosophy is "do it until you get it right," same/same plus:
the natal, progressed and transiting House Ruler for the appropriate marriage (ie the 5th marriage is the 3rd House)
any planets in the appropriate natal House
any planets progressed or transiting the appropriate natal House

Other Marriage Indicators would be:

The Chart Ruler (the Ascendant Ruler)
The Final Dispositor (the boss of the Ascendant Ruler -- not all charts will have a Final Dispositor)
The Almuten of the Chart

In Professor Gumby's chart, Jupiter is the Almuten of the Chart and you see progressed Jupiter moving into the 5th House and making sextiles with two Planets in the 7th House.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrimsonTaurus
I'm still confused

Well, it is an advanced topic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrimsonTaurus
And I do know Libra is actually Crimson, but my best friend that passed away called me Crimson and my horoscope is Taurus, so that's how I came up with my user name.

That's cool. I think there's a thread where everyone (or some people) post the story behind their user name.
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Four Modern Astrologers said Serial Killer John Wayne Gacy: "…can be very good with kids..." "...just your presence would be beneficial to other people..." "...a fairly well-rounded personality...you can offer a good role model..." "You have an instinctive awareness and your uninhibited response to life can refresh and gladden whomever you encounter."

Traditional Astrology Says: "...shows a strange mind and very wicked."

Gacy received 12 Death and 21 Life sentences for the murder of 33 boys.
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08-17-2010, 12:07 AM
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