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  #1  
Unread 09-04-2006, 02:57 PM
Francesca Francesca is offline
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Will I hear from X this week?

Using my new Frawley text, I attempted to answer this question: "Will I hear from X this week?" (Hear implies telephone, letter or e mail). My significator is Saturn and Venus (romantic interest), his is Sun, communication is Mars, ruler of his 3rd house.

There is fairly good, though ambivalent, reception between significators but no aspect (opportunity for action). Back to the book. Frawley says look for an aspect between Moon and communication, Mars. There is an approaching trine between Moon and Mars, 8 degrees or so away. But there are other ways of doing this, so I'm looking for your 2 cents.

Also, do moon and Mars "behold" each other? I am having trouble getting my hosting service to import the chart, so the question was asked at 23:03 universal time, or 7:03 pm EST(DST) in Lockport, NY Sept. 3.Thanks


Here's the chart after all.





Last edited by Francesca; 09-04-2006 at 05:24 PM.
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  #2  
Unread 09-04-2006, 11:55 PM
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Re: Will I hear from X this week?

Fran,

Here are a couple of tips;

First of all, don't confuse yourself with using natural significators along with house rulers as significators. Pick one of those methodologies and stick to it, then use the other for fine tuning the answer. Personally, I use the regular house significators and look at the natural significators only when I need to.

Second, you said Mars rules his 3rd house. I take it you have chosen the 7th house to rule him. Why? Granted that the 7th house rules the default "other person", but that is only when no other house will describe the quesited person. You should consider the relationship between you and X. If it is romantic, use the 5th house. If he's a colleague or a subordinate, use the 6th, etc. If he's a client, use the 7th (yes, it'll be ok then). If he plays many different roles, use the house the describes the role your are querying about. Suppose you're querying about your boss. Normally, you'd use the 10th to rule him. However, if you're hoping for romance with him, you should consider the 5th for that possibility while keeping in mind that the 10th rules his current "official" relationship with you.

Some astrologers say that you should use 7th if you have named the quesited in your horary. I strongly disagree with that, but feel free to try it and see if it works for you.

Now, who is X to you? In what context are you hoping for communication with him?
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Unread 09-05-2006, 02:08 AM
Francesca Francesca is offline
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Re: Will I hear from X this week?

He's a guy I think I'd like to have a relationship with. But what do you mean Natural vs. House Sigificators?

Last edited by Francesca; 09-05-2006 at 03:32 AM.
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Unread 09-05-2006, 06:02 AM
astromony astromony is offline
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Re: Will I hear from X this week?

I am confused as to how you found venus as his significator in this horary? To me venus rules 2H(taurus) and 8H(libra) in this chart. I have only studied this subject minimally but have read some of Deborah Holdings techniques in the skyscript website and she uses William Lilly's work on horary/electional astrology.
I have a different read on whether you will hear from X or not. You, the querent are represented by saturn. Query is placed in 7th house because he is other, as in another person. H7 ruled by leo ruled by the sun. Sun is separating from satrun which would lean toward a no in the judgement. Sun is moving toward opposition with uranus, his 1/7H. His significator sits in his first house, your 7th. Also mars(warrior) moving out of square pluto(power) in your 10th house and his fourth. This yense aspect is at an end. And the moon, indicating timing of your next meeting is moving away from recent meeting or trine with sun(him) and mercury and will next aspect mars by trine and this will happen pretty quickly as the moon is in a cardinal sign.
Thanks for the challenge. I am excited to begin using horary and learning how, but see what you make of it anyway.
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Unread 09-05-2006, 02:00 PM
Francesca Francesca is offline
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Thumbs up Re: Will I hear from X this week?

Hi, A. Thanks for your comments. I didn't use Venus for him, I used sun. Frawley says use Lord 1 and venus for female querent in a romantic question.
I used sun for him as you say, with no co-significator. I couldn't pick one, as he is an older man and Saturn was already Lord 1. Receptions between Sun and Venus/Saturn are ambivalent, but there, nonetheless.

I think Sorehearted will use only Lord 1 and Lord 2, no co-significators.

Nonetheless, I think your conclusion is right. Mercury conjunct the sun shows him already with someone,and "exalting" her and I don't think he will call. I am a little disappointed in this because I thought I was applying Frawley's outline pretty well, but intuitively feel very strongly he will not call. I hope further experience will find Frawley correct, but we'll see.

I am also new and excited about horary. Thanks, again.
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Unread 09-06-2006, 10:59 PM
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Re: Will I hear from X this week?

A natural significator is that planet that rules a specific issue regardless of which house it rules in the chart. For example, Venus is a natural ruler of love and women; the Sun is a natural ruler of men and authority; Mars is a natural ruler of young men and agression and anger; etc.

What I have noticed that you do in an horary is that you use the house ruler (based on the sign on the cusp) and the natural ruler for one issue or person. Like in this horary, you used the ruler of the first and Venus. With all due respect to Frawley, this method can be very confusing, especially for beginners. What I like to do is focus on house rulers first, and after I reach an answer I look for fine tuning from the natural rulers of the matter. Some astrologers do the complete opposite; they look at natural rulers first then the house rulers. Either way, there's tuning then fine tuning. Both at the same time will only be easy to judge for someone very experienced.... like Frawley

Here's a potential problem that may arise when you use natural rulers. How do you know that you are using a proper ruler. You may assign the guy to the Sun because the Sun naturally rules men, but someone else may assign the guy to Saturn because they perceive the guy as old and potentially malicious. Also, you may think you are naturally ruled by Venus (being the woman here), but there may be another woman you don't know about. This is when we use the Moon. Now, who's Venus and who's the Moon? Confusing, huh?

Natural rulers are fantastic to use, but they need a lot of practice and a very objective point of view. My personal advice is to learn using house rulers first. I don't know for sure whether this is the best way to learn, but it worked for and, thus, I recommend it.

Now, I would use the 1st house for you, the 5th house for the quesited and the the turned 3rd from the 5th (radix 7th) for communication from his side. Do you think you can try to work with those?

Final note: Why is the Mercury/Sun conjunction showing you "another person"??? Which houses do each of those planets rule? Are they turned 5th or 7th houses from one another? Also, this conjunction is separating; keep that in mind. Last thing, even if all that shows someone else, what does that have to do with your horary which, might I remind you, is about potential communication not a potential love affair?

Don't get lost in the chart, Fran. Not every single planet must be taken into consideration.
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Last edited by Summery Joy; 09-06-2006 at 11:04 PM.
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  #7  
Unread 09-07-2006, 12:17 AM
astromony astromony is offline
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Re: Will I hear from X this week?

Thanks Sorehearted for the explanation. If you know any sites/books that you recommend for further study on the subject, i would greatly appreciate it.
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Unread 09-07-2006, 12:38 AM
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Re: Will I hear from X this week?

Yay, Sorehearted, so useful! I am reading closely
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Unread 09-07-2006, 12:41 AM
Francesca Francesca is offline
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Smile Re: Will I hear from X this week?

Yes, I agree it can be very confusing.

Saturn is L 1,Mercury L 5, and Sun, L 7. There is no aspect of any strength between the querent or quesited,nor is there any reception. The situation is one of indifference. There will be no communication. There, that was simple. Is it right?
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Unread 09-07-2006, 12:49 AM
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Re: Will I hear from X this week?

Sorehearted, a have a question which further touches on the use of natural significators and house rulers. I posed a horary question asking 'what is the best relationship for us?'. The person I asked about is a friend, and ex, and a potential love interest all in one. I wonder if in this scenario, it would make sense to consider his natural significator (mars). How else could I decide? Is it worth while looking at rulers of the 5th, 7th and 11th to see which one enjoys the most positive relationship with my significator? Or have I just posed a bunky question, that I need to think about further and rephrase?
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