10th Anniversary of proposed natal chart of Jesus, and a gift!

It's late here and I've been at the computer for nearly a couple of days ...so I'm just going to copy and paste what I just email Phoenix Venus for the rest of you members to have a gander and a chance to mull this same enigma over.. it's a dandy one, alright.

...copied and pasted as follows...>
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MAJOR MIND BLOWER GOING ON HERE.
I had been thinking a lot about the Hyleg and the formulae involved and it seemed to me that only the pre natal New Moon should be used in the process as the New Moon is the start of the new cycle and you are part of the cycle that is going on at the moment , the moment you are born.
I mean to say that what has been the accepted formulas and technique kept sounding more and more to me like typical "Trad" b.s.

So check out what I found... The post natal Full Moon of Yeshua, used in the same Hyleg formula i.e. Asc. + Natal Moon - post natal Full Moon = 17 Virgo 15' 34". My Hyleg, using the pre natal New Moon in the formula, Asc. + Natal Moon - pre natal New Moon = 17* Virgo 38" 03".
...and remember that the Part of Soul/Spirit for the USA natal is the 18th degree of Virgo , being as it is at 17* Virgo 18' 24
"
The post natal New Moon for Yeshu'a in Hyleg formula, Asc. + Natal Moon - post natal New Moon = 03* Pisces 08' 18". What I got using the "Trad" formula after I caught that error just some weeks ago finding out that it wasn't in the 7th of Cap,{Note: I had erred in my original computations for my Part of Hyleg and for a couple of years believed it to be in the 7th deg. of Capricorn...a mistake that I only caught just a few weeks ago} i.e. Asc.+ Natal Moon - pre natal {Full} Moon = 02* Pisces 36' 44". That's pretty doggone close...and I have been compensating for the changes astrodienst has made to the data.
What I get using the post natal New Moon in my Hyleg formula, i.e. Asc. + Natal Moon - post natal New Moon = 19* Leo 01' 41"... "Zuni Indians Perform A Ritual To The Sun"

{Note: for those of you unaware, Sun rites have been a major part of my life these last 13 1/2 years since I began doing them on a regular basis everyday, usually at dawn. I likely wouldn't be alive presently if not for my diligence in performing them in complete form every day. Trevor Ravenscroft wrote in his book "The Cup Of Destiny", that it is his belief that Parsival failed in his quest to obtain the Holy Grail because He became lax and began missing days entirely. The rites are best if performed at dawn, but they can be performed any hour of the day or even at night.}

I found that by using the time 30 seconds before the one I have been using for Yeshu'a's birth, that is using 5:22:30 P.M. instead of 5:23 P.M. You get the original position for the Sun and Moon, in other words, astrodienst sped it up 30 seconds. To get the exact same chart axis, [or as close as possible the original being 00* Libra 43' 17"] you have to cast a chart 23 seconds earlier, and you'll get 00* Libra 43' 20", as one cast for 24 seconds earlier produces 00* Libra 43' 07''.

So, now it won't be so hard to make composites, just use a chart for Yeshu'a cast 30 seconds earlier for accurate composite Sun and Moon and use a chart cast 23 seconds earlier for accurate composite chart axis and houses, but remember it'll be 2 to 3 seconds of a deg. too much. Pluto just has to be dealt with as an imposture and the difference between Pluto from my original chart, i.e. 00* Libra 58' 52"and what ever astrodienst is currently saying it is has to be divided by two and that figure must be subtracted from what ever figure comes out for the composite Pluto, and as it is currently a difference of 00* 01' 59" and isn't an even sum the plus or minus one second of a deg. is left to ones whim & fancy.

...and I find it of particular curious interest that there is a newly released movie about the Ouija Board, the very symbol for the 18th deg of Virgo !!

Now the trip is... to figure out just what this Hyleg thing is really all about, what it is really saying to you from your natal chart.

SO, WHAT i'M PROPOSING HERE IS THIS.
No matter where your natal Moon is at birth, you have to figure yourself being between two New Moons... Cycles begin with New Moons.
I have to find my book by Dane Rudhyar and Leyla Rael, "Astrological Aspects. A Process Oriented Approach" to give a proper dissertation, but I can't seem to locate it this evening, but I'll have something more posted here in the next 24 to 48 hours explaining why I believe the process of determining a Hyleg Part should be done in only one particular manner and not a choice between two as presently believed and held steadfast to by most astrologers.
Just as there is only one way, only by one formula, to determine the Part of Fortune. {Diurnal, kids.}

An, I've something else that is new to reveal, and discuss, too!
The Mirror Day.
I was born at the beginning of one. As the day only truly starts for your locale when the Sun is exactly conjunct the nadir, when the Moon exactly conjuncts the nadir, it is the beginning of "the Mirror Day".

{hint: For Jesus/Yeshua to produce the 18th* of Virgo as to the above issue,, one has to go forward to the Full Moon that was occurring the day after He was born. As I was born after the Full Moon, one has to go back to the New Moon before my birth to produce the 18th* degree of Virgo. There has been a great deal of such 'mirroring" between charts of people intimately involved with this current matter of bringing the truth to light, bringing the true natal chart of the Prince of Peace to the attention of the world. Phoenix Venus is one whom has seen it in as to her own natal chart. Miss X {from my book} had it quite strongly, my fellow yogi and good friend, Suryakant, has it too. A number of people do also, that all had some part in the process of producing the 2000 year old natal chart and bringing it to light.}

Stay tuned...

Images: Post Natal Full Moon chart for Jesus/Yeshu'a's birth and Yeshu'a's post natal New Moon chart.

...and post natal New Moon:

So here's the deal.

I know that about a year to a year and a half ago a forum member asked me if I thought that there was only one cycle of the Moon that is valid or was I of the opinion that there are two of affect in that the Full Moon is also the start of a cycle.
At the time, I said I felt that there are two but ever since, as due to the passage of time, and a good number of charts over that span of time, that all showed to me what I see as evidence that it is only the New Moon that has "the Say".
I'm not counting out that the Full Moon hasn't, and I may see it yet in the Sabian Symbols... the Symbols never lie and I have found them to be, as I've said many a time, the ultimate tool of rectification... and they do a real fine job of testing validity of technique as well.

But regardless of whether the New Moon is a "solo act" or not, the fact of the matter is that the New Moon cycle has repeatedly proven itself to be of valid influence through the entire cycle as given in a manner in accordance with the Sabian Symbol of the Zodiacal degree it happens to fall upon.
The laws of the physics and mechanics of the Zodiac are not unlike the workings of anything else in the Universe, the resultant derivative of any formula in equation form is that the result never strays strange from the factors it is derived from. All things are hatched, or birthed, from darkness into light.

Here's an except of a post of mine in the Country & Place sub forum, on the question of what the official birth chart of India is, as I explained my reasoning it was the reason they were in their doubts, as to the ones they were using, was that they were using the wrong time as the start of the day and by what was in the signed agreement between India and Great Britain, as it was to be given uncontested freedom on the start of the day and that the fact is that New Delhi time is a half hour fast, due to the capitol region splitting a time zone to give all of India one zone of time across the nation. The day begins when the Sun is at the nadir of your locale...and that's the agreement that India signed to whether they consciously knew that or not. It was to be as observed from Greenwich Observatory, when the zone established by the Observatory said it was 12:00:01 A.M., and not what India's, self declared. time zone said.

It's taken a bit from Dane Rudhyar and Leyla Rael's wonderful book, "Astrological Aspects. A Process Oriented Approach", where noted... and I totally recommend it, in fact I urge you all to read it.

...copied and pasted as follows...>

"The another important reason as to why it is even imperative that one does use this proper technique. The great 20th century astrologer, Dane Rudhyar, noted that all cycles of orbits by the Planets, Moon et al, that are used for calculating aspects are a series of a progression of aspects. From New Moon to Full Moon, for example is half of a complete cycle and in that first half cycle in which the Moon is moving away, apart from, the Sun it is in an "Involutionary Hemi-cycle",l called that by Rudhyar because as he wrote: "...because a spiritual potentiality or karmic necessity involves or incorporates itself into matter." The second half, or waning part of the Moons cycle is called the "Devolutionary Hemi-cycle." [and also wrote that there is a polar complement to Devolution and that it is Evolution. The change from Involution to Devolution is cyclic, continuous and natural...it occurs everywhere around us constantly, but the change from Devolution to Evolution requires a kind of mutation or 'quantum leap' from one level, the level of 'life', to another ~ the level of 'mind' or growth in consciousness.]"
At the beginning, the 'Conjunction' is symbolically pure subjectivity, it hasn't yet moved and hasn't yet taken the least iota of light to reflect back...and that is consciousness...in it's purest and simplest form. ..and from consciousness you have identity and being."

Check out own charts and see what the New Moon prior to your birth and after your births have to produce symbolically... do the Full Moon in between and then compare them to those of well known public or historic persons. Note as to whether if you either born before of after the Full Moon too, as to the ones you compare yours to and note whom those you have always felt some inexplicable draw to... especially the Full Moon comparisons as in addition as you can see by the "mirror like" pattern I got from comparing mine to the Yeshu'a chart...which, in all fairness, I shouldn't use as for to try to "sell you" all on this technique but for the fact that after ten years and considering all that I wrote in my book about similar type occurrences, of which there is a good number and might serve as an excuse on its' own merit, but definitely for all the other synchronistic like, "similar tenor", exact duplicate or exactly opposite...or pops out of a composite in a "three part harmony" kind of synastry which, just kind of repeatedly with nary a real miss, have shown up along the way of having to promote this chart as valid, without much let up, and constantly sitting with the chart in my face and seeing more and more because of it.,,and not just to me but those that were involved with this whole process of discovery ever since I first posted it online.Those of you that have followed my postings even semi faithfully know what I talking about and need no further prodding, I'm sure.

My good friend and fellow yogi, Suryakant, said it better than I was able to some eight, or nine, years ago, with his observation; "It's just like an onion, in that the more you peel it back, you find that it all smells the same and looks to be the same but layers are revealed and each layer in turn reveals more and more...the more you peel it, the more you discover just how deep it all truly is."

Ooh i hope the gift is cake. Yumm. Maybe some chocolate with strawberry icing. Or cheesecake, cant go wrong with that.

I think its quite likely that both the formulas represent something specific, possibly even the post-natal moon formulas do as well, especially given the interplay regarding the prenatal and postnatal formulas between you & Ysshuas charts.

I do agree with you though that the hyleg formula would retain a consistent formula, namely the one utilizing the new moon formula.

So where does that leave us with the formula utilizing the prenatal full moon? Well as you were saying the process is representative of the cycle of involution and devolution, with the potential of a quantum leap towards evolution, being at the start of the full moon, its quite possible that whereas hyleg represents the root, the formula utilizing the full moon would represent the ingredients that are required to propel the process of growth...

Lets look at the usa formulas for some perspective...

New Moon hyleg @ 13 sagittarius:

" A WIDOW'S PAST BROUGHT TO LIGHT.

KEYNOTE: The karma of past actions as it affects opportunities presented by a new cycle.

What the "widow's past" is remains obscure but the point is that even as a past cycle is closed — a phase of married life ends — the karma of whatever deeds or misdeeds this cycle witnessed will almost inevitably intrude into the new life period. Also, once a cycle of activity is concluded, much that was unclear or unconsciously motivated in the events it witnessed can now more easily come to the clear consciousness of the mind. It is possible to joyously herald the dawn from high above the actual stresses of existence (the preceding symbol), but the new day may be found loaded and darkened by the unfinished business of many a yesterday.

This is the third stage of the fifty-first five-fold sequence. Mankind is "the widow," because our soon-to-be-concluded Piscean Age has buried most of the ideals it once revered and proclaimed. Yet the New Age will have to deal with many oppressive ghosts. This is a symbol of RETRIBUTION."

Wow... Very fitting.

Usas full moon hyleg @ 29 taurus:

Taken from Dane Rudhyar's "An Astrological Mandala":

" TWO COBBLERS WORKING AT A TABLE.

KEYNOTE: The two-fold character of man's mature understanding.

In symbolism the feet are the symbol of understanding. Understanding differs from mere knowledge because it implies at least some degree of identification in depth with what is being understood. Moreover it is impossible fully to understand anything except when its opposite is taken into consideration. The mental process of understanding — and therefore of appreciation — implies confrontation between two points of view. Thus the mind gains a sense of perspective. The way to dispel a shadow is to have the object illumined (on its own two-dimensional level) by two sources of light. True understanding dissipates any intellectual shadow. The "two cobblers" symbolize two contrasting ways of approaching the understanding of an experience — especially a new experience — and they provide concrete forms which may clothe and protect the understanding.

This is the fourth stage of this twelfth five-fold sequence. It reveals symbolically the way in which a mature individual mind works in an attempt to gain PERSPECTIVE; a true perspective becomes the foundation upon which to build a new approach to life. "

The dynamic between the two symbols is quite remarkable.

Ps isnt it pretty funny... Here you are talking about mirror days and mirroring charts... And the symbol that popped up for the USA is about dispelling shadows with light... And the two-fold quality of understanding... !!!!!

...and what about the postnatal cycle... The last cycle before birth vrs. the first cycle after birth... A sort of mirror in itself... Hmmmm....?

Phoenix Venus said:

Ooh i hope the gift is cake. Yumm. Maybe some chocolate with strawberry icing. Or cheesecake, cant go wrong with that.

I think its quite likely that both the formulas represent something specific, possibly even the post-natal moon formulas do as well, especially given the interplay regarding the prenatal and postnatal formulas between you & Ysshuas charts.

I do agree with you though that the hyleg formula would retain a consistent formula, namely the one utilizing the new moon formula.

So where does that leave us with the formula utilizing the prenatal full moon? Well as you were saying the process is representative of the cycle of involution and devolution, with the potential of a quantum leap towards evolution, being at the start of the full moon, its quite possible that whereas hyleg represents the root, the formula utilizing the full moon would represent the ingredients that are required to propel the process of growth...

Lets look at the usa formulas for some perspective...

New Moon hyleg @ 13 sagittarius:

" A WIDOW'S PAST BROUGHT TO LIGHT.

KEYNOTE: The karma of past actions as it affects opportunities presented by a new cycle.

What the "widow's past" is remains obscure but the point is that even as a past cycle is closed — a phase of married life ends — the karma of whatever deeds or misdeeds this cycle witnessed will almost inevitably intrude into the new life period. Also, once a cycle of activity is concluded, much that was unclear or unconsciously motivated in the events it witnessed can now more easily come to the clear consciousness of the mind. It is possible to joyously herald the dawn from high above the actual stresses of existence (the preceding symbol), but the new day may be found loaded and darkened by the unfinished business of many a yesterday.

This is the third stage of the fifty-first five-fold sequence. Mankind is "the widow," because our soon-to-be-concluded Piscean Age has buried most of the ideals it once revered and proclaimed. Yet the New Age will have to deal with many oppressive ghosts. This is a symbol of RETRIBUTION."

Wow... Very fitting.

Usas full moon hyleg @ 29 taurus:

Taken from Dane Rudhyar's "An Astrological Mandala":

" TWO COBBLERS WORKING AT A TABLE.

KEYNOTE: The two-fold character of man's mature understanding.

In symbolism the feet are the symbol of understanding. Understanding differs from mere knowledge because it implies at least some degree of identification in depth with what is being understood. Moreover it is impossible fully to understand anything except when its opposite is taken into consideration. The mental process of understanding — and therefore of appreciation — implies confrontation between two points of view. Thus the mind gains a sense of perspective. The way to dispel a shadow is to have the object illumined (on its own two-dimensional level) by two sources of light. True understanding dissipates any intellectual shadow. The "two cobblers" symbolize two contrasting ways of approaching the understanding of an experience — especially a new experience — and they provide concrete forms which may clothe and protect the understanding.

This is the fourth stage of this twelfth five-fold sequence. It reveals symbolically the way in which a mature individual mind works in an attempt to gain PERSPECTIVE; a true perspective becomes the foundation upon which to build a new approach to life. "

The dynamic between the two symbols is quite remarkable.

Ps isnt it pretty funny... Here you are talking about mirror days and mirroring charts... And the symbol that popped up for the USA is about dispelling shadows with light... And the two-fold quality of understanding... !!!!!

...and what about the postnatal cycle... The last cycle before birth vrs. the first cycle after birth... A sort of mirror in itself... Hmmmm....?

Click to expand...

{ARrrrrrrgh, I had spent an hour writing a reply to this.... then....
...and it's gone.... just like that. I am having trouble with my right hand still which said trouble causes me to not have complete control of two fingers, the ring finger and pinky, and they sometimes inadvertently over a unintended key or sometimes the ring finger will twitch and strike an unwanted key and cause such a disaster...and you'd think that I would have learned by now to use the "wordpad" app and then copy and paste instead of typing directly to the aw forum reply app...just as I am even now still doing... {what the **** is wrong with me...? and why haven't I learned the lesson here...? ...your guess is as good as mine...}
...switching to wordpad here and will do it right from this point on...

I wasn't aware of your reply until just over an hour ago, {which, in retrospect, is now nearly four hours ago as I complete this post} I checked in to leave an observation to an older thread I had contributed some posts to and while scrolling through my subscribed threads looking for that thread I saw that you had replied here P.V.

...and YES! You came to the same conclusion some days ago that I only got around to myself between last night and this morning.

I am trying to finish a, now overdue, first post to a new thread I have in mind for the third and final conjunction of Pluto to the M.C. of the natal chart of the U.S.A. you and I both ascribe to {the "Zero Hour" natal chart, r.e. 12:00:01 a.m. July 4, 1776 Philadelphia, Penn.} that has already occurred on November 16th.I would've had it posted some weeks ago but I came to a realization that stems from the very subject we've approached here in this thread, in that I had a nagging thought that the event of the Pluto conj. should be analysed not just only singularly but in context as to, or as including, that of the New Moon to New Moon cycle it occurred in.

But getting back to that "conclusion" I finally got a spark of insight that the Full Moon provides some key to the "quantum leap" from a second half of the cycle, the waning Moon half of the Moons' cycle, being that of a "devolutionary" state and which I take as to understand it being the dissolving of what was incorporated into matter, to a spiritually evolutionary, the "quantum leap", state for the waning cycle and that implies that one doesn't let dissolve what was produced in the waxing half of the cycle, dissolving what was produced and returning to the same point of being...but rather one preserves it and utilizes it to be the basis from which the post New Moon then adds to with the following "devolutionary" making it a continuous process of building on the past and going another step further than letting what was created dissolve and returning to "square one", so to speak.

To put it in the best analogy I can think of, or visualize at this moment...and I realize it isn't a very good one, is that it is like building a bridge across a gorge, and then at the halfway point, turn back and dismantle it and return back from where you started... and then to begin another incomplete process never making the events a continuous process of evolutionary progress... which is what Rudhyar and Rael's book is truly about. That is understanding that astrological aspects are part of a continuous process and one should interpret a charts' aspects as such and encourage the native of the chart in to understand that they were born at a point in the process and must incorporate that understanding and utilize the continuity of it throughout their life, working in harmony with the process and not think of themselves as being only that as they were born as a static expression of the Cosmos the moment they were born. as the full title of the two authors book suggests, "Astrological Aspects. A Process Oriented Approach", as the correct understand of Astrology is that it is a process, and when implemented and utilized with that understanding it becomes a knowledge of, and a tool for, a continuous process that is oriented towards spiritual growth.

Now, even though the post natal Full Moon hyleg formula result derived from the Yeshu'a chart was so close to being the exact same degree as was given by the result produced from my pre natal Full Moon Hyleg formula and just misses exactly jibing with that which I had anticipated was going to be as to the result "mirroring" that result which was produced from the formula for Yeshu'a's post natal Full Moon as to my pre natal New Moon as to their both being in the exact same degree of the 18th of Virgo {which leaves a suspicion it may just have been by the oddest of circumstances?} the Sabian Symbol produced for my pre natal Full Moon in the third degree of Pisces is so nearly the same in general precept as the Sabian Symbol produced by the Part of Destiny {M.C. + Sun - Moon] for the Yeshua'a natal chart in the 14th degree of Capricorn as to again be perceived as like some kind of mirroring effect...

...Here, check it out and see what you think....{?}

"PISCES 3°: PETRIFIED TREE TRUNKS LIE BROKEN ON DESERT SAND.

KEYNOTE: The power to preserve records of their achievements which is inherent in fully matured cultures.

When a vast group of men succeed in building a culture with strong institutions which express themselves in significant symbols and works of art or literature, such an effort of many generations is rarely lost altogether. In one form or another, records of this culture endure or are mysteriously preserved, simply because they reveal the place and function of this particular culture in the long process of unfoldment of the potentialities inherent in archetypal MAN. It is such a concept that has been mythified and popularized in the religious idea of the resurrection of the dead on the Last Day. The symbol of petrified wood in the Arizona desert, however, tells us that the actual preservation of the records is never perfect or total. Only fragments remain, significant enough to reveal the essential archetypal form.
This third symbol of the sixty-seventh five-fold sequence brings the promise of social immortality — i.e. the preservation of the enduring (because archetypally meaningful) factors in whatever man attempts within his culture. A symbol of INDESTRUCTABILITY."

...and compare to...>>>

"CAPRICORN 14: AN ANCIENT BAS-RELIEF CARVED IN GRANITE REMAINS A WITNESS TO A LONG-FORGOTTEN CULTURE.

KEYNOTE: The will to unearth, in our culture as well as in any culture, what has permanent value, and to let go of nonessentials.

At a time when in nearly every land men are questioning and challenging the validity of traditional beliefs and customary attitudes, it becomes necessary to separate permanent values and great principles or symbols from the many individual habits and the socio-political developments which more often than not have perverted or even negated the original ideals of the culture. We must strive to free these ideals from the wild growth of personal and class selfishness, from the greed and ambition so prevalent in human nature, and learn to appreciate the excellence of what is the immortal seed-foundation, as well as the spiritual harvest, of any culture — and by extension of every sustained and complete work produced by a man's indomitable effort to achieve creative perfection.

In this fourth stage symbol we are shown the procedure which enables us to gain a deep and thorough appreciation of socio-cultural processes in their most enduring forms. What is needed is a penetrating and courageous insight founded upon a valid HISTORICAL PERSPECTIVE. This applies to the past of an individual's life as well as to the history of a nation or a group."

This is enough proof to me that here is a most worthy and needed study to be done, in my humble opinion, as to what is going on with all of the factors involved here and I'm certain when it is given the effort and eventually completely understood that it will rectify what now seems to be only but a partial formula for producing that which is currently identified as the Part of Hyleg and as to it being "THE" root, or foundation, from which all other Astrological Parts derived from ones natal chart must bow to as for cause, or of the sustenance, for their own existence. As it certainly seems to be indicated here that there is more to that "foundation" than is currently believed and that a most ancient knowledge of process of technique was partially lost over the eons since mankind was last in a period, and era, known to and identified by the Hindus, the Jains, the Buddhists and other sects that draw from Vedic knowledge as that of the "Satya Yuga", the "Golden Age", that period of some 8,000 plus years when all of humankind is at the pinnacle of their innate spiritual and intellectual potential which I have seen numerous sources indicate came to it's last conclusion around 12,500 B.C. [or B.C.E. for those that prefer]

I've got a bit too much on my plate at present and my priorities at this time are with the planetary transits affected the natal chart of the U.S.A. being that we are in the middle of a period of some of the most potentially transformative planetary influences I have seen to date and of such strong influence they could well rip this nation asunder as provide the needed reconstructive rectification it seems to be in desperate need of. I've been trying to get that thread up about the Pluto ~ USA M.C. conjunction for what seems like over a month now... but can't seem to finish it.
{I'm locking the doors, drawing the curtains, putting the headphones on and will put the nose to the grindstone as soon as I post this, though.... }


But, I am so dying to do this process for all the charts of those people that are so near and dear to me and whom I am so familiar with personally and astrologically over the years... and I might just take that time in the near future, maybe even make a large pot of coffee later on tonight, and get to one or a couple of them as I spoke to my fellow yogi and good buddy, Suryakant, about this last night and He showed some very genuine high interest in what results I might find as to his chart and to those of a couple of mutual friends of ours.
I'll keep you informed of any results as I get them and I will post as soon as I can get to that.


But dang Phoenix V. you've once again demonstrated that you've got that "Mad Skill" at understanding and utilizing the Sabian Symbols...
I am impressed with how quickly you drew to a conclusion about the Full Moon Hyeg formula being associated with Rudhyar's "quantum leap" which took me many days to come to.
"Mad Skills" indeed... you keep at it and I have no doubt that you're destined for recognized greatness in the field.

Aaargh ptv I just spent like 2 hours on a post and its GONE.... WWWHHHYYYYYY.... Sometimes technology is a major paaaiiinnnn..

Its so late now and I'm a bit looped out...

I'll repost tomorrow... our chat plus a few days of contemplating on the USA parts have lead me to some conclusions about the hyleg parts... I think some of your ideas on it are right on that money...

The USA parts arevery telling... if you want to take a look at the symbols before I make a postthe post natal new moon hyleg is at 15 Scorpio and the postnatal full moon is 1 Taurus....

so yeah i totally agree with what you were saying regarding the succession of new moons building upon the previous cycles. I read what you wrote on the other post on the USA pluto-mc thread and i think we are on the same page....

I spent a few days contemplating on the USA hyleg parts and came to some interesting conclusions. The parts are very remarkable as i think they show a clear example of the evolutionary factor that we have been discussing regarding the quantam leap of the full moon.

I also think that the hyleg parts show a connection to the AC/DC axis which gives me the idea that the aforementioned quantam leap requires one to become the embodiment of their DC.

I already posted the pre-natal symbols but let's give a recap to give them some perspective with the post-natals.

The pre-natal new moon, A Widow's past brought to light, is representative of that first spark of an initiative towards the nation. In a more literal sense it represents the early settlers moving to America who are driven to find a new life, away from the oppression of their countries, come to find out that they still have to work out the karma of their past actions amist building a new nation.

The pre-natal full moon, in a literal sense, seems to be representative of the American political party system. Mutual understanding and developing a perspective. Note the last line of the passage from Rudhyar: "a true perspective becomes the foundation upon which to build a new approach to life. "

So these two symbols seem to progress from that original spark to what grows out of that spark....

Both of these symbols, imho, can be related back to the AC of the USA chart, THE GATE TO THE GARDEN OF ALL FULFILLED DESIRES. Past actions brought to light through the promise of a new experience; mutual understanding crafting a new political system....

Now, the post-natal symbols, by contrast, are representative of the evolutionary growth of the people of the nation. Here the symbols seem to be moving towards the DC of the chart. They seem to represent what potentially comes out of the first two symbols.

The post-natal new moon @ 15 scorpio:

IBID:

"CHILDREN PLAYING AROUND FIVE MOUNDS OF SAND.

KEYNOTE: Early steps in the development of a mind seeking to be attuned to the higher level of human evolution.

This is a particularly cryptic symbol. It may be deciphered if one realizes that Man's essential destiny is to develop as a five-fold being, a "Pentagram" or five-pointed star. Number 5 symbolizes mind in its most creative and penetrating aspect, while number 4 refers to the life processes operating at present within the earth's biosphere. Our Western civilization has realized only the lower level of this vibration 5; i.e. mind contaminated by compulsive instincts and emotional involvement. Some individuals, however, are born with a special potential for development of the higher, creative mind, and in social circumstances favoring this development. In most cases, they are still "playing around" with their unusual capacity. They are in the kindergarten stage of this higher mind development.

In this final stage of the forty-fifth sequence of five symbols the transcendent possibilities of mental evolution, which require interpersonal communion in consciousness, are evoked. The free spirit of true scientific inquiry is only a foreshadowing of such a type of mind, which demands dedication to mankind as a whole. What is seen here is FUTURE-ORIENTED GROWTH."

So the pre-natal full moon symbol mentioned the perspective of the mind and here we have a symbol which represents the development of the mind towards a higher level of evolution.

The post-natal full moon hyleg @ 1 taurus:

" A CLEAR MOUNTAIN STREAM.

KEYNOTE: The pure, uncontaminated and spontaneous manifestation of one's own nature.

Here we see life substance in its original dynamic form and as it emerged from its spiritual source. This is true whatever the nature of the source may be. In a sense the mountain stream is conditioned by the nature of the soil and by all the forces which in the past have formed the mountain's rock strata: that is to say, by past history. Yet out of this past a new, pure (i.e. unadulterated) release of potentiality has emerged. It is ready to perform whatever work its dharma is to accomplish.

This is the first stage of the seventh five-fold sequence of phases. Matter is still imbued with great potential energy, energy being matter at its source. It is flowing irresistibly toward its own destiny. It is simply ITS OWN NATURE."

Spontaneous manifestation of ones own nature.... life substance... as it emerged from its spiritual source.... flowing towards its own destiny.

These two symbols seem to resonate with the DC of USA's chart, "the concern of simple souls for the welfare and happiness of less- evolved beings who thirst for life renewal.

so I would say that the full moons represent both what grows out of the root and the potential seed that drops and turns into it's own root.... ie the new moons. the post natals seem to be like you said what is built out of the pre natals...

So it seems here that the symbols represent the people of the nation as they grow towards an evolutionary state.... our "past brought to light" given "mental perspective" towards "future-oriented growth" to reach "the spontaneous manifestation of one's own nature."

Looking at my own personal parts derived from these formulas, it seems to align closely to this theme that we have discovered.

*** Edit: I made an error regarding my prenatal new moon hyleg. The correct position of my new moon hyleg is 13 cancer. I deleted the info pertaining to the errenuous part and posted the correct part at the bottom of the post. Reffer to the blue text.***

I would say that the pre-natal new moon is more representative as my "root" and the pre-natal full moon is more representative of the "quantam leap" of that root, which in turn was the spark that drove the post-natal moon hylegs to come into being... which weren't necessarily at the root of my being but were possibly needed in order to fulfill some karmic duty or destiny in life.... even in order to fulfill that which the pre-natal new moon hyleg part is here for...

pre-natal full moon hyleg @ 30 sag:

"THE POPE, BLESSING THE FAITHFUL.

KEYNOTE: The need to pay homage to traditional values upon which the Invisible Community of the spirit is built.

The concrete integration of myriads of human individuals within a great religious institution with a long tradition reflects, as well as having produced century after century, an invisible spiritual Community. The "flag bearer" has now become the "Pope," who assumes the role of God's representative on earth. It is a role, but culture is based on embodying great Images and deeply moving symbols in physical reality. The symbol asks of the individual: "Are you willing to live a transpersonal life as a symbol?" This is the final and supreme statement of that section of the cycle of the year represented by Sagittarius.

This concludes Scene Eighteen. A collectivity of human beings is seen having "transferred" their sense of spiritual value to a man who has become an incarnation of their common ideal. Keywords: PERSONALIZED WORSHIP. It can be a blessing or in some cases, a curse."


I would say that the second symbol was something which came into being along my path... it sort of sprang out of the new moon hyleg...

and that "faith" led to the post-natal hyleg parts coming into being...

my post-natal new moon @ 14 gemini and post-natal full moon @ 30 scorpio.

oddly enough ptv, my post-natal full moon hyleg is the same degree as our composite part of destiny!!!

and in turn... our part of destiny being conjunct the post-natal full moon that has to deal with hidden meanings..... the post-natal moons seem to be needed in order to fulfill the "purpose" of the pre-natal new moon...

So i'm seeing a definite progression which leads me to the question... if one is born between the new and full moon should they look up both post natal full moons that follow? I would think so... as it seems to represent some evolutionary growth to be fulfilled regarding that original spark of the pre-natal new moon....

pre-natal new moon hyleg @ 13 cancer:

"A HAND WITH A PROMINENT THUMB IS HELD OUT FOR STUDY.

KEYNOTE: The power of the will in shaping character.

Here again we see how a personal characteristic reveals what is behind it psychologically and spiritually. The thumb in palmistry signifies the will; a very rigid thumb shows an unbending will; a more flexible one, a more pliable individual. In the original formulation of the symbol the "hand" was said to be "slightly flexed" which may be taken to suggest a more flexible character. Nevertheless, the basic meaning is that individuality can only express itself through a strong character. Whenever this symbol confronts a person or a situation it is shown that a strong will is required to face the issue at stake.

This is the third stage in the twenty-first five-fold sequence, and the Keyword is CHARACTER."

... I spent some time contemplating this part and came to the conclusion that the other hyleg parts are about building upon this prenatal new moon hyleg.... The premises of "will" and "character" are what i believe to be the characteristics with which i came into this lifetime with these lessons and experiences, in order to develop.... And as something to rely on in terms of growth.

So it seems to be, in my case, that the new moon hyleg is a platform from which to learn and evolve.

Phoenix Venus said:

Aaargh ptv I just spent like 2 hours on a post and its GONE.... WWWHHHYYYYYY.... Sometimes technology is a major paaaiiinnnn..

Click to expand...

...HA!
I'm glad that it's not just me

Phoenix Venus said:

Looking at my own personal parts derived from these formulas, it seems to align closely to this theme that we have discovered.

I would say that the pre-natal new moon is more representative as my "root" and the pre-natal full moon is more representative of the "quantam leap" of that root, which in turn was the spark that drove the post-natal moon hylegs to come into being... which weren't necessarily at the root of my being but were possibly needed in order to fulfill some karmic duty or destiny in life.... even in order to fulfill that which the pre-natal new moon hyleg part is here for...

pre-natal new moon hyleg @ 12 cancer:

"A CHINESE WOMAN NURSING A BABY WHOSE AURA REVEALS HIM TO BE THE REINCARNATION OF A GREAT TEACHER.

KEYNOTE: The revelation of latent worth in an experience once it is seen in its deeper meaning.

In contrast to the “clown” symbol, which shows us man’s capacity to criticize and laugh at his superficial mannerisms and automatic habits or gestures, we now have a symbol which demands that we look beyond common appearances and try to discover the “occult” (i.e. hidden) character of every person and every experience. This symbol has been unduly glamorized: there is no particular reference here to an avatar or messiah, except in the sense that every man is potentially the avatar or manifestation of a Soul that has a definite and relatively unique function in the vast field of activity we call the Earth. To discover this occult potential of being, one requires a deeper or higher “vision,” a holistic perception — which is usually, but not always justifiably, called clairvoyance. The caricaturist also has to develop a special kind of “seeing” to enable him to extract the salient features of an outer personality or of a face. He picks out the most characteristic parts of a whole; the true clairvoyant perceives the essential meaning (or “message” and function) of the whole.

The contrast between the first and second symbols of this twenty-first five-fold sequence is indeed very significant. There may be no particular meaning in the fact that the nursing woman in this symbol is Chinese. Perhaps the psychic who visualized the scene may have mistaken a Tibetan for a Chinese woman, and unconsciously thought of the rather familiar process through which a new Dalai Lama, or other great Lamas, are searched for among newborn babies. The Keyword is REVELATION."

pre-natal full moon hyleg @ 30 sag:

"THE POPE, BLESSING THE FAITHFUL.

KEYNOTE: The need to pay homage to traditional values upon which the Invisible Community of the spirit is built.

The concrete integration of myriads of human individuals within a great religious institution with a long tradition reflects, as well as having produced century after century, an invisible spiritual Community. The "flag bearer" has now become the "Pope," who assumes the role of God's representative on earth. It is a role, but culture is based on embodying great Images and deeply moving symbols in physical reality. The symbol asks of the individual: "Are you willing to live a transpersonal life as a symbol?" This is the final and supreme statement of that section of the cycle of the year represented by Sagittarius.

This concludes Scene Eighteen. A collectivity of human beings is seen having "transferred" their sense of spiritual value to a man who has become an incarnation of their common ideal. Keywords: PERSONALIZED WORSHIP. It can be a blessing or in some cases, a curse."


I would say that whereas the first symbol seems to be deeply imbedded in my spirit, (it mentions the need to discover the hidden meaning in every experience) the second symbol was something which came into being along my path... it sort of sprang out of the new moon hyleg... looking for the hidden meaning in existence is what gave me a sense of "Faith" and "personal worship"...

and that "faith" led to the post-natal hyleg parts coming into being...

my post-natal new moon @ 14 gemini and post-natal full moon @ 30 scorpio.

oddly enough ptv, my post-natal full moon hyleg is the same degree as our composite part of destiny!!!

and in turn... our part of destiny being conjunct the post-natal full moon that has to deal with hidden meanings..... the post-natal moons seem to be needed in order to fulfill the "purpose" of the pre-natal new moon... after all mine does deal with "hidden meanings" which relates to what i am doing right here, right now... uncovering the hidden meanings in experiences through astrology.... hmmmmmm. all so epic.

So i'm seeing a definite progression which leads me to the question... if one is born between the new and full moon should they look up both post natal full moons that follow? I would think so... as it seems to represent some evolutionary growth to be fulfilled regarding that original spark of the pre-natal new moon....

Click to expand...

Wow, your pre natal New Moon Hyleg being the same degree as the I.C. for the U.S.A.'s natal chart is AWESOME...!


...but your post natal New Moon kinda freaks me out a little bit...

I am still a bit in awe of the fact that before we met up that you showed up in one of my lucid dreams ... maybe you induced it?


...and now you are really freakin me out... the same as our composite Part of Destiny, huh...and such a crazed, mad crazed Sabian too....


....stunts

piercethevale said:

Wow, your pre natal New Moon Hyleg being the same degree as the I.C. for the U.S.A.'s natal chart is AWESOME...!


...but your post natal New Moon kinda freaks me out a little bit...

I am still a bit in awe of the fact that before we met up that you showed up in one of my lucid dreams ... maybe you induced it?


...and now you are really freakin me out... the same as our composite Part of Destiny, huh...and such a crazed, mad crazed Sabian too....


....stunts

Click to expand...

Yeah and my part of destiny/ part of omens is conj USAs prenatal new moon hyleg "a widows past brought to light" !!!!

The post natal ones freaked me out so much I couldn't even post them

And I might remind you of this story... a few years back I got big into lucid dreaming and during that time I wrote down my dreams and had a few precognitive ones... and in one rather remarkable one there were some people standing outside a school and I knew i had to pick someone to start a conversation with. I decided to walk up to this one man and chat with him and he showed me a piece of paper that had an astrological formula on it... and in that moment I knew the key to astrology had been unlocked....

Yeah see my prenatal new moon having a nod to my approach to astrology mixed with that post natal full moon being our comp part of destiny only leads me to the conclusion that the potential quantam leap of the prenatal full moon resulting in the growth of the postnatal moons ultimately leads to what fulfills the purpose of the prenatal new moon hyleg....

And this is the part where I get google-eyed and say....

Its all waaay too much haha

Regarding the fourth hyleg part of the postnatal full moon, I think it does quite a bit to paint the full picture regarding the process of evolution and what grows out of the quantam leap of the initial full moon. IMO, even those born between the new and full moon would do well to look up the second full moon hyleg, resulting in one prenatal part and three postnatal parts...

Let's use Yeshua as an example seeing how he was born between a new and full moon.

Edit: I made an error regarding Yeshuas second postnatal full moon hyleg part. The correct position is 19.16 leo. Ive deleted all info relating to the erroneous part and added a new interpretation regarding the correct part. See blue text at the bottom of the post.

His prenatal new moon @ 2 Aries:

(Ibid)

" A COMEDIAN REVEALS HUMAN NATURE.

KEYNOTE: The capacity to look objectively at oneself and at others.

While the first phase of the process of emergence is essentially in terms of subjective impulse and the desire to act, the second phase represents the attempt to evolve an objective awareness of existence. Through a sense of contrast, consciousness is gradually being built. It is what Teilhard de Chardin calls "reflective consciousness": the ability to see oneself reflected as in a mirror, and eventually to laugh at the inadequacy of the form one sees; thus "humor," the triumph of objective consciousness over subjective feeling or moods, or involvement in self.

This symbol characterizes the second stage in the first five-fold sequence of phases: the stage of OBJECTIVATION OF CONSCIOUSNESS. This second phase complements and polarizes the first, which stresses the subjective desire to become individually conscious."

His postnatal full moon @ 18 Virgo:

" A OUIJA BOARD.

KEYNOTE: The ability to contact deeper recesses of the unconscious psyche and sensitiveness to psychic intimations and omens.

The ouija board is to be considered here a modern device similar to many ancient instruments used for divination and prophecy. Certain states of threshold consciousness are stimulated by such a use, and what the experience produces may vary greatly in quality and in origin. The release of unconscious material has lost the explosive force pictorialized in the preceding symbol, yet at this stage there is still no conscious and willful control over what reaches the ego-consciousness.

This is the third stage of the thirty-fourth sequence of symbolic phases in the life process. It is at best a stage of transition which stresses a passive openness to the unknown. The glamour of it may subtly pervert the mind of the aspirant; but in some cases, this can be the first manifestation of INNER GUIDANCE. The difficulty is to correctly evaluate what or who does the guiding."

His postnatal new moon @ 4 Pisces:

" HEAVY CAR TRAFFIC ON A NARROW ISTHMUS LINKING TWO SEASHORE RESORTS.

KEYNOTE: The mobility and intensity of interchange which make possible and characterize complex social processes.

Here we see the Concept of commerce and social interaction in a new form. What is stressed is the need to establish unceasing dynamic relationships between all aspects and functions of the social life. The more complex the relationships, the more dynamic and restless the society. In this symbol the "isthmus" refers to a geographic situation found near San Diego, California, where these Sabian symbols were produced —also in Florida and elsewhere. A narrow strip of land separates the sea from a lagoon and on this strip, houses are built and roads are constantly filled with moving cars. The proximity of the sea stresses the collective nature of social experiences and of what may appear to be "individual" achievements.

This fourth stage symbol-evokes many aspects of what at several levels can be called TRAFFIC. The technique for achieving social results is always based on an interchange of ideas and interplay of activities. Often, however, confusion ensues and traffic jams are ever-present possibilities."

The second postnatal full moon @ 20 leo:

ZUNI INDIANS PERFORM A RITUAL TO THE SUN.

KEYNOTE: A return to the glorification of natural energies.

While the first symbol of this five-fold sequence pictured the magnificence of the returning sun after a storm, in this last symbol we see, by implication, man returning to nature and glorifying the sun after the long crisis of "civilized" living in artificial cities. For many years now, the American Pueblo Indian has been for the weary city dweller and the dried-up intellectual a symbol of this "return to nature." After having ruthlessly destroyed him, we come to him as an exemplar of peaceful and harmonious group living.

This fifth symbol of the twenty-eighth sequence brings us the image of ZUNI INDIANS PERFORM A RITUAL TO THE SUN.

KEYNOTE: A return to the glorification of natural energies.

While the first symbol of this five-fold sequence pictured the magnificence of the returning sun after a storm, in this last symbol we see, by implication, man returning to nature and glorifying the sun after the long crisis of "civilized" living in artificial cities. For many years now, the American Pueblo Indian has been for the weary city dweller and the dried-up intellectual a symbol of this "return to nature." After having ruthlessly destroyed him, we come to him as an exemplar of peaceful and harmonious group living.

This fifth symbol of the twenty-eighth sequence brings us the image of a reversal of our socialized activity and opens for us the way to the deepest release of our long-denied root energies. Natural man links himself consciously to the source of all life on earth. And this means IDENTIFICATION THROUGH WORSHIP — and the sanctification of the creative power."

Note the phrases "examplar of peaceful and harmonious group living" and " a reversal of our socialized activity... opens for us the way to the deepest release of our long-denied root energies".... This last phrase really says a lot regarding the progression of our hyleg parts..... "Releasing the root energies within"... WOW!

Note the contrast between the first set of symbols and the second set, whereas the former represent inner wisdom and the latter represent group interchange... especially given the quote from the prenatal new moon " the ability to see oneself reflected as in a mirror".... where society becomes the mirror with which we project our individual consciousness onto... so this set of symbols has to do with projecting a "whole" being (an objective awareness of consciousness mixed with the ability to tap into subconscious recesses to guide oneself) onto society.... Leading to a sanctification of creative power

Didn't get a chance to read your Post above, today...been too much on my plate today...
hopefully I will get back to this thread before the weekend is over...I've but one weary eye open at the moment....

... but don't let that hinder you...
run with it as far as you want or are able.

I gotta get me som....Zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz's

Woah.... check out Obama's prenatal new moon hyleg..... !!!!

Cap 2 (ibid)

" THREE ROSE WINDOWS IN A GOTHIC CHURCH, ONE DAMAGED BY WAR.

KEYNOTE: The necessary realization by any individual making a violent use of collective power that it will lead to the inevitable destruction of some of the values ensuring group-integration.

It seems obvious that the interpretation of this symbol should refer to the disruptive consequences of war. The "chief" who claimed power from his tribe in order to lead or save it must reckon with the consequences of a too-impulsive use of this power in terms of violence. The integration he seeks to maintain or enhance may be partially destroyed if in his ambition he yearns to be the victorious war leader glorified by his people. A "rose window" is not absolutely essential to a cathedral, yet it symbolizes that through which the "light of the Spirit" enters into the edifice. Man's soul is said to be three-fold. Which part of man's inner trinity of principles tends to be destroyed by the use of violence? Evidently the principle of love and compassion.

This second stage symbol is in contrast to the preceding one because it opposes the power to destroy to the power to build. The "capital" of group-energies is partially squandered in armaments and death. WASTE is the opposite of group-integration."

...wow.

Phoenix Venus said:

Woah.... check out Obama's prenatal new moon hyleg..... !!!!

Cap 2 (ibid)

" THREE ROSE WINDOWS IN A GOTHIC CHURCH, ONE DAMAGED BY WAR.

KEYNOTE: The necessary realization by any individual making a violent use of collective power that it will lead to the inevitable destruction of some of the values ensuring group-integration.

It seems obvious that the interpretation of this symbol should refer to the disruptive consequences of war. The "chief" who claimed power from his tribe in order to lead or save it must reckon with the consequences of a too-impulsive use of this power in terms of violence. The integration he seeks to maintain or enhance may be partially destroyed if in his ambition he yearns to be the victorious war leader glorified by his people. A "rose window" is not absolutely essential to a cathedral, yet it symbolizes that through which the "light of the Spirit" enters into the edifice. Man's soul is said to be three-fold. Which part of man's inner trinity of principles tends to be destroyed by the use of violence? Evidently the principle of love and compassion.

This second stage symbol is in contrast to the preceding one because it opposes the power to destroy to the power to build. The "capital" of group-energies is partially squandered in armaments and death. WASTE is the opposite of group-integration."

...wow.

Click to expand...

DANM!

...and, you know, that symbol has been coming up a lot in progressed charts for myself these last ten years, composite charts and progressed composite charts etc..
It is also the degree that Obama's Part of Sudden Advance aka Hermetic Lot of Nemesis is in.

...and I only just now got to read that post a few back of yours in which you wrote:

" would say that the pre-natal new moon is more representative as my "root" and the pre-natal full moon is more representative of the "quantam leap" of that root, which in turn was the spark that drove the post-natal moon hylegs to come into being... which weren't necessarily at the root of my being but were possibly needed in order to fulfill some karmic duty or destiny in life.... even in order to fulfill that which the pre-natal new moon hyleg part is here for..."

...and although you were ahead of me in determining this, I didn't know what your determination was and you can see by the various posts I made that I'm saying pretty much the same thing... at least they seem at this moment... too tired to mull that over right now, but I think we're humming the same tune, sister....


...mad, mad, mad , mad skills, P.V. ... you got 'em....

Hey piercethevale... An idea struck!

I was contemplating whether a composite hyleg was something worth pursuing... Whether it was possible and of any relevance... For example a composite hyleg with Yeshua would represent the root of ones commitment to a relationship with Him, to a commitment towards an evolvrd spiritual way of being....

So the question arrived... How the heck do you arrive at a comp hyleg...? As a comp is based on midpoints and not dates, there would be no actual moon cycle surrounding the comp moon...

Well after usin my brain box a bit... I realized.... You might cast a comp of both new moon charts to use as the trigger, and use the comp asc and moon for the other two parts in the formula...

So it would look a bit like this...

Comp asc + comp moon - comp of both new moon charts moon

So i tried it out... I took Yeshuas prenatal new moon chart & my prenatal new moon chart and made a composite...

.... and a sign! The position of the moon for this comp chart was at 28.56 sag!!.This is within a degree conjunction of my prenatal full moon hyleg!!

So the comp hyleg using the formula turned out to be 23 taurus....

" A JEWELRY SHOP FILLED WITH VALUABLE GEMS.

KEYNOTE: The social confirmation of natural excellence.

Two elements should be distinguished in this symbolic picture: the gems that result from natural processes, often induced by extreme volcanic heat and pressure, and the finished products of refined craftsmen. Both the gems themselves and the artistry are highly prized and bring prestige to the owner of the jewels. The symbol applies to any product in which culturally acquired skill has embellished or transformed the end results of a lengthy and demanding natural process.

This is the third stage of the eleventh five-fold sequence of phases. At this stage we are concerned with the social process which brings about a CERTIFICATION OF PERSONAL WORTH."

this formula might be worthwhile to look in to!

And the same formula using the comp full moon and post natals too!

Phoenix Venus said:

Hey piercethevale... An idea struck!

I was contemplating whether a composite hyleg was something worth pursuing... Whether it was possible and of any relevance... For example a composite hyleg with Yeshua would represent the root of ones commitment to a relationship with Him, to a commitment towards an evolvrd spiritual way of being....

So the question arrived... How the heck do you arrive at a comp hyleg...? As a comp is based on midpoints and not dates, there would be no actual moon cycle surrounding the comp moon...

Well after usin my brain box a bit... I realized.... You might cast a comp of both new moon charts to use as the trigger, and use the comp asc and moon for the other two parts in the formula...

So it would look a bit like this...

Comp asc + comp moon - comp of both new moon charts moon

So i tried it out... I took Yeshuas prenatal new moon chart & my prenatal new moon chart and made a composite...

.... and a sign! The position of the moon for this comp chart was at 29.43 sag!!.This is the exact degree of my prenatal full moon hyleg!!

So the comp hyleg using the formula turned out to be 21.39 taurus....

Here is the symbol... It does make quite a bit of sense when i think about my experiences... Especially considering the mention of "messages" and the prominence of the "omens & signs" part in my chart.(check this out... I have omens and signs conjunct my part of destiny. Usa has the reverse part, astrology, conjunct its part of destiny... My comp with USA omens and signs is at 25 cancer conj USAs natal mercury...)

The symbol for 22 taurus:

" WHITE DOVE FLYING OVER TROUBLED WATERS.

KEYNOTE: The spiritual inspiration that comes to the individual in the overcoming of crisis.

Here also we are confronted with a symbol of guidance, and the dove flying over troubled waters reminds one of the story of Noah and the Ark. Noah met his and mankind's crisis courageously and in complete obedience to God's promptings. The test completed, he received the dove's message. It is a message from the Holy Spirit announcing a new Dispensation. This symbolic scene can be applied to personal crises resulting from emotional upheavals or from the irruption of unconscious forces and impulses into the consciousness — if the crisis has been faced in the right spirit.

This second stage symbol is in contrast to the preceding one because here it is not the product of a culture, a "book," but instead the rhythm of cosmic, God-ordained cycles that reveals its conclusive beat through a living and concretely significant sign — a REWARD TO THE FAITHFUL."

This fits so well with my full moon hyleg which is also about rewards of the faithful... Almost as if that quantam leap of the natal full moon merges into the root of a spiritually dedicated lifestyle... Which is the foundation of the comp...

And check this out.... My comp with Yeshua part of omens and signs is 26 libra... "an eagle and a large white dove merge into each other"... Which is Yeshuas part of basis ie "spiritual.aspirations"

....its all melding together in a way that is making me think....

this formula might be worthwhile to look in to!

And the same formula using the comp full moon and post natals too!

Click to expand...

I guess you have forgotten that I told you how to derive a composite Part of Hyleg last year sometime when I derived the composite Hyleg for us by making composites of all the charts involved in the process.

Those charts involved being:
A. A composite of the natal charts of the two people in question.
B, A composite chart of the two prenatal charts that were used by those two people to find the position of either the Full or New Moon, which ever of the two is relevant as to being the more recent of the two phases of the Moon prior to their own birth, from which to derive their own natal Part of Hyleg from... and then using those two composites for the data from which to derive the composite Part of Hyleg.

As to your statement: "For example a composite hyleg with Yeshua would represent the root of ones commitment to a relationship with Him, to a commitment towards an evolvrd spiritual way of being...."

...you've either forgotten what a Part of Hyleg is said to be, gotten it a bit confused with the attributes of some other Part, or have let yourself try to strecth the meaning for some reason or another.

The Part of Hyleg, is that "Part" as to which all the other Parts in a natal chart must finally deposit too, as like the Planet that is the "Final Depositor" in a natal chart, if that natal chart has, or were to have, a planet that is a singular "Final Depositor".

As to what a Part of Hyleg in composite to Jesus/Yeshua would represent.
Well, that falls back on whatever you believe your relationahip to him, or with Him, is all about...
Wouldn't it?

For an example, if you were a Christian Minister, then it would be about your ministry concerning Him as is seen by everyone else as, or is perceived to have, an affect upon or, an be an effect of.

piercethevale said:

I guess you have forgotten that I told you how to derive a composite Part of Hyleg last year sometime when I derived the composite Hyleg for us by making composites of all the charts involved in the process.

Those charts involved being:
A. A composite of the natal charts of the two people in question.
B, A composite chart of the two prenatal charts that were used by those two people to find the position of either the Full or New Moon, which ever of the two is relevant as to being the more recent of the two phases of the Moon prior to their own birth, from which to derive their own natal Part of Hyleg from... and then using those two composites for the data from which to derive the composite Part of Hyleg.

As to your statement: "For example a composite hyleg with Yeshua would represent the root of ones commitment to a relationship with Him, to a commitment towards an evolvrd spiritual way of being...."

...you've either forgotten what a Part of Hyleg is said to be, gotten it a bit confused with the attributes of some other Part, or have let yourself try to strecth the meaning for some reason or another.

The Part of Hyleg, is that "Part" as to which all the other Parts in a natal chart must finally deposit too, as like the Planet that is the "Final Depositor" in a natal chart, if that natal chart has, or were to have, a planet that is a singular "Final Depositor".

Click to expand...

Yeah... I had forgotten about that.

Regarding the interpretation of the hyleg chart, i see it slightly differently, which ive given some exyeshuasample of in this thread using the usa's and Yeshuas parts...

I see it as the root part, what the other parts, and thus the person, grows from. The foundation of the being.

So as a composite with Yeshua represents our relationship with Him, and thus our spiritual union (if that is how one might perceive a relationship with Him) the hyleg would be the root of that relationship.

I agree that some might perceive a relationship with Him differently.

I made a major mistake in this thread.

I was using the wrong prenatal new moon chart for myself, and thus some of the calculations and info regarding personal matters is inaccurate.

I will edit the appropriate posts. Sorry for any inconvenience or confusion this may have caused.

Thanks ptv for pointing this out. Sorry for causing you the undeserved stress.