need relationship advice... how should I approach this?

aquarius7000 said:

Hi again,

You are not imagining things, from the chart and going by all you have narrated till now tells me she might actually be rejecting you. Imagine having another man. How horrible is that.

I think the sooner you get out of this unhealthy relationship, the happier you are going to be. I don't see long-term potential here. Your Sun squared by her Saturn (rejection by the Saturn person), Moon square Moon (clash of feelings), Mars-Pluto opposition (violent temper outbursts), Venus square Venus (clash of values and different likes and dislikes), Sun-Uranus opposition (feeling of uncertainty and instability going out from the Uranus person). Given all that, I am afraid it is better you find yourself another person. I think you are wasting your time. Your chart the potential of a good solid marriage,, but a bit later.

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We agreed to having a surrogate. She said she might carry one or two. But children isn't the issue, I told her that she needs to think about her daughter and think about yourself. She needs to find a man that will take care of them both. I told her that it's the Saggs job to help take care of her daughter since she is autistic and needs attention of two adults not just one. She usually gets angry and says that she's not trying to marry him, that she probably won't even get married. That does leave me most confused-


We agreed to having a surrogate. She said she might carry one or two. But children isn't the issue, I told her that she needs to think about her daughter and think about yourself. She needs to find a man that will take care of them both. I told her that it's the Saggs job to help take care of her daughter since she is autistic and needs attention of two adults not just one. She usually gets angry and says that she's not trying to marry him, that she probably won't even get married. That does leave me most confused-

- The abuse in my home came from poverty and alcoholism and thankfully I'm neither for nor do I even drink. In fact one of our biggest issues was I didn't want her to drink and she loves her glass of wine every night (I hate alcohol due to my drunk father) -


- The abuse in my home came from poverty and alcoholism and thankfully I'm neither for nor do I even drink. In fact one of our biggest issues was I didn't want her to drink and she loves her glass of wine every night (I hate alcohol due to my drunk father) -

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waybread said:

But with your south node of the moon conjunct your Mars, anger may always be your fall-back position.

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katydid said:

Dear AriesinLove,

You and I have talked a lot by PM. I like you very much and I feel you are a very sincere young man.

I have a lot of love and respect for Aries energy types. My husband of 35 years is an aries, and our son is an aries and my daughter in law, etc. So I know Aries types very well and have profound love for their passion, enthusiasm and motivation.

I have no doubts that you will, one day, succeed in building a lovely family life and you will have what you are now striving for.

But I do not believe it will be with this Leo woman that you are now wanting so badly. I think your desires are misplaced at this point.

I think the synastry between you two has more problems than solutions. But you can use the energy between you two to help motivate you to finish your degree, nail down that good job, continue counseling and therapy to get your temper sorted out etc.

There will be plenty of lovely, sweet, exciting women who want the same white picket fence and baby car seats as you do.

First true loves are painful to give up on. I know that you have your heart set on this woman. But she has her own baggage and it is not going to just work itself out, in my opinion. She has a lot of things preventing her from buying into your dream fantasy of settling down together. And you cannot overcome them, in my opinion.

Focus on your self right now and move on, towards your own successful future.

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waybread said:

Aries, I'm just about done with your thread, and as you know, I sent you some synastry via PM.

To the others, in my experience there isn't a lot of truly wonderful synastry out there even for happily married couples. But I would look for harmonious aspects or conjunctions between paired moons and suns, as well as "reverse" Mars-Venus aspects. Then the inter-aspects between any of these as well as the ascendants are helpful. For example, your Venus trines her moon. Jupiter can give a real "feel good" aspect. Your Jupiter broadly conjuncts her moon. Her Jupiter conjuncts your sun.

I'm not a fan of stressful aspects.

Having said all this, you can have the best synastry in the world, and still not have the relationship ever work out.

Sometimes with relationship problems it's good to look at the individual charts apart from the synastry, so that we can see what each person brings to the table. People can have lovely synastry and yet still have internal stressors that damage their potential as a partner.

We all have our personal and astrological shortcomings, so I don't say this to single you out for criticism. But with your south node of the moon conjunct your Mars, anger may always be your fall-back position. Good for you that you are trying to correct it.

Aries, with all due respect, you need to challenge yourself in ways that have little to do with another person, such as an extreme sport. The evolutionary goal of Mars-ruled Aries is to push yourself to the limit in a solo kind of way. You seem to be trying to dominate Leo Lady, but really the person to prevail over is you, and whatever fears hold you back. With your heavy Aries horoscope, you're the kind of guy who should be become a fighter pilot, take up fencing as a hobby, or sail solo around the world.

Instead, it seems that so much of your natural Aries nature and assertiveness is getting misdirected on a relationship that seems highly unlikely to succeed-- for reasons that you have clearly laid out.

Actually, Ariesinlove, your and my synastry is pretty good, so if we ever met, we'd probably get along. But Holy Toledo. If some man were to tell me that I needed to find a man to take care of me and my child, I would have taken serious offense, and wonder if his head was back in 1955. And this coming from a 20-year old!

Yes, there are so many women out there who long for a take-charge kind of guy (possibly as a substitute Daddy) to take care of her. There have been a couple of these women on our threads lately. But any woman who is reasonably independent, let along if she has an education or a career, would probably bristle at the notion that she's supposed to revert back to 60 years or so ago, when the ideal husband was "the good provider" for the stay-at-home mom.

Is there some reason why you cannot help out with the autistic daughter as a friend, not as a step-dad?

You agreed to have a surrogate-- yet she hasn't committed to settling down with you, and doesn't like the way you pressure her to get married. Does not compute. Plus, have you any idea what is involved with a surrogate mother???

Frankly, if you told me not to have a glass of wine with dinner, I'd tell you to buzz off. I mean, just because your Dad was an alcoholic doesn't mean that mature adults cannot drink responsibly.

But wait-- you found out that Leo Lady had a DUI, and then lied to you about it.

Anyway, I'm done.

There is a Spanish proverb that goes, "God says, 'Do what you will. And pay the price.'"

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Osamenor said:

Maybe you're not poor, and maybe you don't drink, but you are still carrying the relationship patterns of your family, which could lead to some very dysfunctional relationships. I see a few things in your natal chart that point to that. Do you want to know what they are? Or do you really not want to hear anything astrological that isn't about the "wonderful" synastry between you and this woman and how to "get her back"?

Your own description of yourself also tells me that you're still stuck in those patterns. You have a temper, you've hit her, you've done several things that sure sound like trying to control.

Waybread knows synastry better than I do, so maybe she, or others, will have more to say on this, but... your synastry with Ms. Leo looks like a mixed bag to me. It sounds like you're basing your idea of the synastry being very compatible on your sun signs. You may have heard that Aries and Leo are a highly compatible combination. That's true if you're talking about the signs themselves. That's not necessarily true if you're talking about people with those sun signs. For synastry to suggest compatibility, there have to be multiple factors in the synastry that point to compatibility. Sun sign is only one piece of the picture, and not enough to make or break the synastry all by itself.

You and she have a trine between your suns. That's what astrologers call a harmonious aspect. When two planets (sun and moon are planets for the purpose of astrology) are 120 degrees apart, give or take up to 4-10 degrees (how much can be given or taken for it to still be a trine is disputed among astrologers, but between your sun and hers, the trine is pretty exact), whatever fulfills the purpose of one of them also fulfills the purpose of the other.

That can play out between planets in your own chart, if they form a trine. Here's an example from mine: I have a trine in my chart between the sun (Leo) and Jupiter (Aries). I also have the moon in Sagittarius forming trines with both of them--when three trines are connected like that, it's called a grand trine, and it's even stronger. Sun represents what your core personality needs most; moon is about your deepest desires and emotional needs; Jupiter is about where in your life you most want to expand, your approach to learning, and what kinds of things tend to go well for you, coming to you easily.

In fact, your girlfriend has part of that aspect, the same sun/Jupiter trine. She's exactly two days younger than me, so she and I have the same sign placements for everything except the moon. Your sun is conjunct her Jupiter, which probably serves to magnify you, in some sense, from her point of view. But back on topic....

Every sign has its own desires, needs, and purpose. For Leo, the purpose is ego growth to the fullest extent possible. For Aries, it's will, being challenged, meeting challenges. For Sagittarius, it's exploring, having experiences, and self expansion. Those are the fire signs of the zodiac, and they all have self expansion as a key message.

If those three signs are teaming up through trines, an adventure or learning experience that results in self growth will serve all of their purposes nicely. Take Sagittarius out of the equation, and maybe there will be a little less of the "ho-hum, let's just wander and see what happens" approach, but Aries and Leo together are happy to meet a challenge that leaves a sense of pride once it's accomplished. A person with that trine in their chart will probably be deeply fulfilled by that kind of challenge. Two people with that trine between their suns may enjoy such a challenge together.

Between two people, a trine between your natal suns means you both want more or less the same thing for your core personal growth. In that sense, you're compatible. But there's the rest of your synastry to consider. You also have a square between your Venuses. Venus informs your approach to relationships, how you communicate interest and affection, how relate to others in general. Planets in square "want" very different things.

Given the square and where it is, I'm not surprised you have difficulties communicating. You both have Venus in Mercury-ruled signs (Mercury is all about communication, and it rules both Gemini and Virgo), but they're signs with a very different message. Gemini is an air sign: its indicators include talk, taking in and sharing information, impulsivity. Virgo is an earth sign: practical, detail oriented, needs to plan ahead rather than act on impulse. Mercury, as the ruler of both signs, acts differently on each: Gemini is talk, Virgo is do. Talking and doing both communicate, but in different ways.

It's likely that the two of you have very different approaches to love and very different ways of communicating love. That doesn't necessarily mean you can't communicate love, but it requires work, and recognition that you have different styles. Unlike the trine, which lets everything flow effortlessly, the square is a challenge. If you're not both conscious of it and deliberately working with it, it can and will trip you.

Neither your sun combination nor your Venus combination can make or break the relationship by itself, and even if you did have a thoroughly compatible synastry chart, it wouldn't necessarily mean the two of you have a wonderful relationship, or that you're "meant to be." What kind of relationship you have depends on how you respond to your chart factors. That part is up to you, and her.

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Osamenor said:

Maybe you're not poor, and maybe you don't drink, but you are still carrying the relationship patterns of your family, which could lead to some very dysfunctional relationships. I see a few things in your natal chart that point to that. Do you want to know what they are? Or do you really not want to hear anything astrological that isn't about the "wonderful" synastry between you and this woman and how to "get her back"?

Your own description of yourself also tells me that you're still stuck in those patterns. You have a temper, you've hit her, you've done several things that sure sound like trying to control.

Waybread knows synastry better than I do, so maybe she, or others, will have more to say on this, but... your synastry with Ms. Leo looks like a mixed bag to me. It sounds like you're basing your idea of the synastry being very compatible on your sun signs. You may have heard that Aries and Leo are a highly compatible combination. That's true if you're talking about the signs themselves. That's not necessarily true if you're talking about people with those sun signs. For synastry to suggest compatibility, there have to be multiple factors in the synastry that point to compatibility. Sun sign is only one piece of the picture, and not enough to make or break the synastry all by itself.

You and she have a trine between your suns. That's what astrologers call a harmonious aspect. When two planets (sun and moon are planets for the purpose of astrology) are 120 degrees apart, give or take up to 4-10 degrees (how much can be given or taken for it to still be a trine is disputed among astrologers, but between your sun and hers, the trine is pretty exact), whatever fulfills the purpose of one of them also fulfills the purpose of the other.

That can play out between planets in your own chart, if they form a trine. Here's an example from mine: I have a trine in my chart between the sun (Leo) and Jupiter (Aries). I also have the moon in Sagittarius forming trines with both of them--when three trines are connected like that, it's called a grand trine, and it's even stronger. Sun represents what your core personality needs most; moon is about your deepest desires and emotional needs; Jupiter is about where in your life you most want to expand, your approach to learning, and what kinds of things tend to go well for you, coming to you easily.

In fact, your girlfriend has part of that aspect, the same sun/Jupiter trine. She's exactly two days younger than me, so she and I have the same sign placements for everything except the moon. Your sun is conjunct her Jupiter, which probably serves to magnify you, in some sense, from her point of view. But back on topic....

Every sign has its own desires, needs, and purpose. For Leo, the purpose is ego growth to the fullest extent possible. For Aries, it's will, being challenged, meeting challenges. For Sagittarius, it's exploring, having experiences, and self expansion. Those are the fire signs of the zodiac, and they all have self expansion as a key message.

If those three signs are teaming up through trines, an adventure or learning experience that results in self growth will serve all of their purposes nicely. Take Sagittarius out of the equation, and maybe there will be a little less of the "ho-hum, let's just wander and see what happens" approach, but Aries and Leo together are happy to meet a challenge that leaves a sense of pride once it's accomplished. A person with that trine in their chart will probably be deeply fulfilled by that kind of challenge. Two people with that trine between their suns may enjoy such a challenge together.

Between two people, a trine between your natal suns means you both want more or less the same thing for your core personal growth. In that sense, you're compatible. But there's the rest of your synastry to consider. You also have a square between your Venuses. Venus informs your approach to relationships, how you communicate interest and affection, how relate to others in general. Planets in square "want" very different things.

Given the square and where it is, I'm not surprised you have difficulties communicating. You both have Venus in Mercury-ruled signs (Mercury is all about communication, and it rules both Gemini and Virgo), but they're signs with a very different message. Gemini is an air sign: its indicators include talk, taking in and sharing information, impulsivity. Virgo is an earth sign: practical, detail oriented, needs to plan ahead rather than act on impulse. Mercury, as the ruler of both signs, acts differently on each: Gemini is talk, Virgo is do. Talking and doing both communicate, but in different ways.

It's likely that the two of you have very different approaches to love and very different ways of communicating love. That doesn't necessarily mean you can't communicate love, but it requires work, and recognition that you have different styles. Unlike the trine, which lets everything flow effortlessly, the square is a challenge. If you're not both conscious of it and deliberately working with it, it can and will trip you.

Neither your sun combination nor your Venus combination can make or break the relationship by itself, and even if you did have a thoroughly compatible synastry chart, it wouldn't necessarily mean the two of you have a wonderful relationship, or that you're "meant to be." What kind of relationship you have depends on how you respond to your chart factors. That part is up to you, and her.

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Osamenor said:

Quoting this post because it highlights all the synastry aspects I didn't pick up on. Aquarius7000 knows synastry much better than I do, too.

To this interpretation, though, I would add a caveat: all those squares and oppositions make for a challenging relationship, although it could be one with strong chemistry, too. Challenging isn't always the same thing as doomed, but for a challenging relationship not to become a doomed relationship, both partners have to be approaching it with great maturity and willing to take it as a learning experience. Based on your description of how this relationship is playing out, that's not what's happening.

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