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  #7726  
Unread 10-18-2019, 10:19 PM
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

Also, it seems injured planets can behave very well with help from the right friends.

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  #7727  
Unread 10-18-2019, 10:43 PM
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I agree about Mars in Taurus.
What does Pluto do in Gemini that would exalt it there in 12/12?
It moves so slowly seems difficult to assess its behavior in Signs, the way itís possible with houses.
I trust the 12/12 pattern, and look for affirmation in the Greco-Roman religions. The Domicle-ruler of Gemini, Hermes/Mercury, was in service to Pluto. The pattern for Exaltation involves the transition of one Sign to the next, in Direct order. For this one, it's the changeover from Aquarius to Pisces. Pluto is Domicle-ruler of Fixed-Water; Aquarius is a Fixed-sign which transforms into a Water-sign, and the Modality of Scorpio makes Pluto the Regulating-ruler of Aquarius. Then, Gemini has the Element of Aquarius, and the Modality of Pisces, making its Domicle-ruler, Mercury, the Motivational-ruler of Aquarius. The Motivational-ruler is in-Service to the Regulating-ruler, and the Regulating-ruler is Exalted in the Sign which is the Domicle of the Motivational-ruler.
Two other examples using this pattern: Capricorn to Aquarius has Venus Exalted in Taurus, and Cancer to Leo, has Mars Exalted in Scorpio.

Mercury in-Service to Pluto, means that Mercury is a Benefactor when in Pluto's Domicile-sign, Scorpio. That's our current Transit for Merc, in the tropical zodiac.
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  #7728  
Unread 10-18-2019, 11:10 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Talkin'bout my Generation: In 12/12, Neptune is Exalted in Libra.
That's from the Gemini to Cancer transition.

[Side-note] The opposite of the tropical Age-sign, Capricorn, is having a rough time of it. Including having its name attached to a dreaded disease. I MUCH prefer the name "Mer" for Cardinal-Water, but convention dictates the afflicted label, in order to be understood. Either that, or go to the trouble of using the symbol for that one Sign.

Last edited by david starling; 10-19-2019 at 12:15 AM.
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  #7729  
Unread 10-19-2019, 03:55 AM
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I trust the 12/12 pattern, and look for affirmation in the Greco-Roman religions. The Domicle-ruler of Gemini, Hermes/Mercury, was in service to Pluto. The pattern for Exaltation involves the transition of one Sign to the next, in Direct order. For this one, it's the changeover from Aquarius to Pisces. Pluto is Domicle-ruler of Fixed-Water; Aquarius is a Fixed-sign which transforms into a Water-sign, and the Modality of Scorpio makes Pluto the Regulating-ruler of Aquarius. Then, Gemini has the Element of Aquarius, and the Modality of Pisces, making its Domicle-ruler, Mercury, the Motivational-ruler of Aquarius. The Motivational-ruler is in-Service to the Regulating-ruler, and the Regulating-ruler is Exalted in the Sign which is the Domicle of the Motivational-ruler.
Two other examples using this pattern: Capricorn to Aquarius has Venus Exalted in Taurus, and Cancer to Leo, has Mars Exalted in Scorpio.

Mercury in-Service to Pluto, means that Mercury is a Benefactor when in Pluto's Domicile-sign, Scorpio. That's our current Transit for Merc, in the tropical zodiac.
It sounds almost neo-traditional? You use outers, obviously, and the method is new. But itís strikingly not psychodynamic in the personality sense - the dynamism is largely derived from elements and modalities.
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  #7730  
Unread 10-19-2019, 04:56 AM
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It sounds almost neo-traditional? You use outers, obviously, and the method is new. But itís strikingly not psychodynamic in the personality sense - the dynamism is largely derived from elements and modalities.
The patterns are derived from the Elements and Modalities, which are used in both Traditionalistic and Modernistic astrology. Would Sense of Purpose, Sense of Directionality, Facilitating-ability and Catalytic-ability be considered "psychodynamic"? I'm also using the Ages as an integral part of the configuration, to explain the context within which the Chart plays out. Not certain what's meant by psychodynamic.
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  #7731  
Unread 10-19-2019, 04:59 AM
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Also, it seems injured planets can behave very well with help from the right friends.
More like "struggling" planets. They have to try harder, and need all the help they can get.
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  #7732  
Unread 10-19-2019, 05:07 AM
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I agree about Mars in Taurus.
What does Pluto do in Gemini that would exalt it there in 12/12?
It moves so slowly seems difficult to assess its behavior in Signs, the way it’s possible with houses.
Natal-charts are "snapshots" of astrological conditions when we're born and "come on line". So, the slow movement isn't really a factor in the personal sense. Pluto is just another player in the resolution and interdependence of forces, albeit an important one.
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  #7733  
Unread 10-19-2019, 05:25 AM
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I agree about Mars in Taurus.
What does Pluto do in Gemini that would exalt it there in 12/12?
It moves so slowly seems difficult to assess its behavior in Signs, the way itís possible with houses.
I take "Exalted" to mean honored and respected. It doesn't have to do anything to earn that, and has full freedom of expression, provided it's not too poorly Aspected by other placements. I have Saturn Exalted in my Natal-chart, and not badly Aspected, so I don't see it as a villain--just difficult to deal with in so many Charts, in the aggregate. I do need what I consider to be reliable structure in my astrology, rooted in Tradtionalism, which may be a result.
I also have my Moon Exalted in Aquarius, and Trine in Gem, so I have no problem with moving beyond Saturn's restrictions in ascertaining the nature of an Aquarian Age with Uranian and Plutonian rulership. In 12/12, the Aquarian Age is one of Facilitation. Also, in Gemini is Catalytic.

Last edited by david starling; 10-19-2019 at 06:02 AM.
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  #7734  
Unread 10-19-2019, 06:23 AM
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Pretty quiet. Mars transiting Libra?
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  #7735  
Unread 10-19-2019, 06:51 AM
david starling david starling is offline
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Fun fact: Contrary to what it sounds like in today's lexicon, the "Gay Nineties" (a label for the 1890s), were NOT a celebration of homosexuality!
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  #7736  
Unread 10-19-2019, 07:05 AM
david starling david starling is offline
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Here's a new one: A member with username TaurusTime has been UNBANNED!
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  #7737  
Unread 10-19-2019, 01:06 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Not sure either. Something about reconciling these capabilities with the sense alluded to above that they donít have to earn their status in a sign through action.
Yes, how they function separately is one thing, and how they fit into the group dynamic is another. More than one Sense of Purpose, for example, can get in each other's way. But if one Sense of Purpose placement is poorly Aspected, another can take precedence. Sort of like a constant, determined profession accompanied by a cherished hobby, practiced when time permits.
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  #7738  
Unread 10-19-2019, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
"Strength" is too vague a term. Jeremy does say that a stronger placement isn't necessarily a better one.
I've already determined that Mars in Taurus, for example, is an extremely noticeable influence. In Trad, it's in detriment by essential Dignity, since it's Domiciled in the opposite Sign, Scorpio. In 12/12, it's the opposite of Exalted, since Mars is Exalted in Scorpio.
I also notice that I made a mistake when I said Pluto should be stronger in its Domicile-sign than in a Sign which shares neither Modality nor Element with Fixed-Water; in this case, Sagittarius. Because, that's exactly the situation with all of the Exalted placements in 12/12: Pluto is Exalted in Gemini, different Element and Modality than its Domicile-sign, Scorpio. Which means it's what Trad calls, "in its Fall" in Sagittarius, just as Mars in Taurus is "in its Fall" (if I were to use that terminology) in 12/12.
Here's a thought--maybe an afflicted placement has to compensate with an increase in strength, to make its influence felt. Same thing might apply to affliction due to accidental debilities.
"Noticeable" influence might be a better description than "strong". Pluto in Scorpio is a match, and blends in nicely, whereas Pluto in Sagittarius is a mismatch, and stands out for that reason.
Similar to the kind of noises machinery make when they are malfunctioning.
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  #7739  
Unread 10-19-2019, 01:19 PM
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

How would you read 2 sense of purpose places connected by conjunction in a natal chart?
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  #7740  
Unread 10-19-2019, 01:20 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Similar to the kind of noises machinery make when they are malfunctioning.
"Inefficient" comes to mind, regarding your machinery metaphor.
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  #7741  
Unread 10-19-2019, 01:23 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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How would you read 2 sense of purpose places connected by conjunction in a natal chart?
A "Renaissance man", perhaps. Proficient in more than one field.

Edit: That would be an out-of-Sign conjunction.

Last edited by david starling; 10-19-2019 at 01:25 PM.
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  #7742  
Unread 10-19-2019, 01:33 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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12/12 is going to require a new revelation of some sort. I really appreciate yours, and Passiflora's input, which may spark what's needed.
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  #7743  
Unread 10-19-2019, 02:22 PM
SunConjunctUranus SunConjunctUranus is offline
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

ds, how did you able to attend UCLA's tech engineering? Did you get schoolarship or passing through competitive selections? It was very difficult for sure.
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  #7744  
Unread 10-19-2019, 02:25 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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ds, how did you able to attend UCLA's tech engineering? Did you get schoolarship or passing through competitive selections? It's very difficult for sure.
High SAT score, higher than average I.Q., and VERY low tuition cost compared to now.
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  #7745  
Unread 10-19-2019, 02:27 PM
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High SAT score, higher than average I.Q., and VERY low tuition cost compared to now.
Can you elaborate on that? About the process?
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  #7746  
Unread 10-19-2019, 03:04 PM
david starling david starling is offline
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Can you elaborate on that? About the process?
State resident is first, regarding tuition. For acceptance, SAT score and high school grade average, then I.Q. For a scholarship, you needed to be from a very low income family, and/or be really good at a sport. Not sure about foreign students. They may have been from wealthy families, because the tuition was much higher for non-State residents.

Last edited by david starling; 10-19-2019 at 03:15 PM.
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  #7747  
Unread 10-19-2019, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
Yes, how they function separately is one thing, and how they fit into the group dynamic is another. More than one Sense of Purpose, for example, can get in each other's way. But if one Sense of Purpose placement is poorly Aspected, another can take precedence. Sort of like a constant, determined profession accompanied by a cherished hobby, practiced when time permits.
You mentioned planets in detriment working harder to make their influence felt. It reminds me of the way dry farmed tomatoes are exceptionally flavorful.

Iím not sure how you heard and responded to what I was thinking and didnít say so precisely, but - wow.
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  #7748  
Unread 10-19-2019, 03:39 PM
SunConjunctUranus SunConjunctUranus is offline
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

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State resident is first, regarding tuition. For acceptance, SAT score and high school grade average, then I.Q. For a scholarship, you needed to be from a very low income family, and/or be really good at a sport. Not sure about foreign students. They may have been from wealthy families, because the tuition was much higher for non-State residents.
And then, you passed all of this JUST to pleased your father? Haha, I think your early adulthood was very colourful.
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  #7749  
Unread 10-19-2019, 04:32 PM
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Originally Posted by david starling View Post
A "Renaissance man", perhaps. Proficient in more than one field.

Edit: That would be an out-of-Sign conjunction.
I ask because you made a statement that two sense of purpose placements can work at cross purposes. Which I can see in the case of Pisces Moon vs. Sagittarius Mars (square) or Jupiter in Taurus vs. Sagittarius Mars (quincunx) but then when the issue of out of sign conjunctions and trines become a factor, things would get a little more nuanced if out-of-sign aspects are factored into the system. Then such a straightforward statement would not necessarily apply.
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  #7750  
Unread 10-19-2019, 11:23 PM
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Re: Random Thoughts, strictly Text

Why don't they do progressed synastry charts?
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