Saturn: A catalyst for change or a bringer of stagnation?

Bunraku

Bunraku

Well-known member
waybread said:
Beautiful graphics, Thirdteenth!

To paraphrase Stephen Forrest, no planet is in the sky just to hurt us.

Traditionally it was just seen as self-evident that bad things happened to people, and Saturn became the primary astrological box in which those bad things got placed.

The shift to seeing Saturn as something other than the Greater Malefic was spurred by Liz Greene's book in the 1970's: Saturn: a New Look at an Old Devil.

Saturn does want something from us: maturity, self-discipline, and stoicism. He tends to reward his apt pupils later in life.
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Waybread,

Maybe if you were from the boomer generation, the last generation who can enjoy retirement.

These days, old age doesn’t look very optimistic or rewarding. People are working until they drop dead or physically cannot anymore. More and more people are living paycheck to paycheck.

Such is Saturn’s slavery.

We need a book that wasn’t written 50 years ago when Americans were on drugs and partied constantly at music festivals. :lol:
 
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lostinstars

Well-known member
I wrote the above reply #20 as I got some free time after a guy made me wait as he was late for the meeting (Saturn makes you wait) and the guy is super pissed for whatever reason and told I did a really horrible job at a presentation just looking at one slide among the 90 odd slides I worked on and if he could he would fire me on the spot (cruelty without a reason to which modern astrologers say Saturn is trying to teach some lessons). The same guy praised my work and was happy just yesterday(Hello modern astrologers, what lesson I've not learnt that needs to be learnt?).

Such is the punishment Saturn gives sitting over a billion km away for talking about how cruel and unfair this planet is, I have noticed this time and again, you talk negative (which is only the real nature and functioning of Saturn) about Saturn, something awful happens. This is the reason astrologers around the world talk great about Saturn, some must know what happens if you talk bad about this planet.

Contrary to countless people who say Saturn delays but gives gifts and rewards, Saturn doesn't delay instead gives swift results much faster than anyone wants to believe.
 
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Bunraku

Bunraku

Well-known member
It’s a planet not a sentient being. Saturn doesn’t want you to do anything. It probably doesn’t care because it’s literally a ball of gas and other random elements strewn about.
 
Bunraku

Bunraku

Well-known member
The whole “lessons needing to be learned” is just victim blaming.
What lesson can be learned by a woman getting raped, mugged, or a child being molested or kidnapped. Absolute B.S.

Modern astrology falls apart if you think about it for more than 1 second.
 
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lostinstars

Well-known member
Bunraku said:
It’s a planet not a sentient being. Saturn doesn’t want you to do anything. It probably doesn’t care because it’s literally a ball of gas and other random elements strewn about.
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Whether you believe in Traditional or Modern, you can't say a planet is not a sentient being. All the planets are sentient beings, real and they like to play with humans.
 
Thirdteenth

Thirdteenth

Well-known member
Sentient means to be capable of feelings or to be able to be conscious. A planet capable of consciousness? :surprised: That would be placing these planets on a pedestal beyond what I would have assumed it could have been reached. Absolutely amazing! Astonishing! I love it. This will be included into the list of astrological theories that I come across on AW to look up during study time :love:
 
Thirdteenth

Thirdteenth

Well-known member
If a planet is just a planet and it is just made up of elements that helps retain the planet’s anatomy then why go forth to try to place these real-life associations on a planet that exist to just exist in our universe to be merely just a planet floating around the sun in the first place? :lol: What would that make astrology as a whole? A theory in itself? So many questions. Such a thought-provoking thread :joyful:
 
Bunraku

Bunraku

Well-known member
I mean why does a planet need to be sentient and alive, or think like a human being, in order to astrology to work? Does it make it easier to assign blame when someone in the sky is causing these events?

I don’t believe there’s a big old daddy looking down from above dictating everything. That comes from western christian type thinking. Then people went ahead and mixed it up with eastern beliefs and they come up with this strange concoction of ideas.

My biggest irk is that they translated brahama as “God,” which makes people even more confused. People from the west just ran with it and made a monotheism out of it that never existed in the first place.
 
Dirius

Dirius

Well-known member
Thirdteenth said:
If a planet is just a planet and it is just made up of elements that helps retain the planet’s anatomy then why go forth to try to place these real-life associations on a planet that exist to just exist in our universe to be merely just a planet floating around the sun in the first place? :lol: What would that make astrology as a whole? A theory in itself? So many questions. Such a thought-provoking thread :joyful:
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The real-life associations are to the deities these planet's represent.

In antiquity, the planets (errant-stars) were not considered gods, nor to be alive. That is why their were usually referd as "...the star of (planet)Venus".

Dialect and coloquialism eventually morphed the way we refer to them (from "star of Venus" to just "Venus").
 
Dirius

Dirius

Well-known member
Bunraku said:
I mean why does a planet need to be sentient and alive, or think like a human being, in order to astrology to work? Does it make it easier to assign blame when someone in the sky is causing these events?

I don’t believe there’s a big old daddy looking down from above dictating everything. That comes from western christian type thinking. Then people went ahead and mixed it up with eastern beliefs and they come up with this strange concoction of ideas.

My biggest irk is that they translated brahama as “God,” which makes people even more confused. People from the west just ran with it and made a monotheism out of it that never existed in the first place.
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To be fair most pantheistic cultures have a "king of the Gods" type of deity, like Zeus, Odin, etc. who had absolute power over the entire pantheon, along with a creator or absolute first deity such as Gaia.

In a way christianity does the same with God and the archangels.
 
Thirdteenth

Thirdteenth

Well-known member
Bunraku said:
I mean why does a planet need to be sentient and alive, or think like a human being, in order to astrology to work? Does it make it easier to assign blame when someone in the sky is causing these events?
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First question: That is just a theory (Thank you @Lostinstar for sharing it :joyful:) A theory I find to be intriguing and it can have weight to it if it were to just be looked into rather than thrown aside as mere none sense just because it is a theory that is not apart of your own belief (whatever that might be). I like be open to these ideas (even when I find it to be disagreeable). You never know what can come from it or what small pieces of valuable information can be gained. However, People can agree to disagree.

Second question: I applaud at those choice of words 👏 Excellent!



I don’t believe there’s a big old daddy looking down from above dictating everything. That comes from western christian type thinking. Then people went ahead and mixed it up with eastern beliefs and they come up with this strange concoction of ideas.

My biggest irk is that they translated brahama as “God,” which makes people even more confused. People from the west just ran with it and made a monotheism out of it that never existed in the first place.
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Thank you for sharing your views. Very telling indeed. You are free to choose to believe in whatever you deem to be the truth. I love hearing different opinions :)
 
wan

wan

Well-known member
Dirius said:
To be fair most pantheistic cultures have a "king of the Gods" type of deity, like Zeus, Odin, etc. who had absolute power over the entire pantheon, along with a creator or absolute first deity such as Gaia.

In a way christianity does the same with God and the archangels.
Click to expand...
Holy sh*t, your back?
 
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lostinstars

Well-known member
Thirdteenth said:
If a planet is just a planet and it is just made up of elements that helps retain the planet’s anatomy then why go forth to try to place these real-life associations on a planet that exist to just exist in our universe to be merely just a planet floating around the sun in the first place? :lol: What would that make astrology as a whole? A theory in itself? So many questions. Such a thought-provoking thread :joyful:
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I'm curious how do you think planets affect the lives of humans on Earth?
 
CapAquaPis

CapAquaPis

Well-known member
The last 2 great conjunctions: 1980 (March involving Mars and Dec in Virgo), 2000 (May and Dec in Taurus) brought on great societal change: neo or retroconservatism and globalization or economic neoliberalism mixed with multiculturalism and political correctness from the 1980 Virgo great conjunction, and the war on terror and an interest in social democracy (Obamacare) after the 2000 Taurus great conjunction.
 
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chiamaria

Well-known member
Well, saturn returns are well known for bringing changes into people's lives, so I believe it can be a big catalyst for change, something that I know is more typically attributed to Uranus. But Saturn's is more about shedding what no longer serves and adopting habits that help you to mature. My tastes personally changed during saturn return. Even the types of guys I liked pre saturn return are the types I'd avoid like the plague now. They just look disgusting to me now as people. But it's about way more than just about who you like and don't like. In a lot of ways I'm not even the same person anymore. If saturn didn't exist, there may be some changes today, of course, but I would probably still be resembling more of my old self than what I do now.
 
waybread

waybread

Well-known member
Saturn returns can also coincide with major shifts in one's status, although faster-moving planets may provide the trigger. My son and my mother married at age 29. My son (first child) was born when I was 29.
 
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sentR89day

Well-known member
It can be a catalyst for change. My Saturn Return pretty much bopped any bad karma, from my past, into the abyss. I am much happier now.
 
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