Overlapping Sign-Blending

Bunraku

Well-known member
Petosiris,
Let me try to make a graphic of that when I have time. It's a chore to try to imagine it in my mind.
 

Bunraku

Well-known member
How do you feel about using Aristotle's the natural place when conceptualizing the universe in terms of the ac/dc mc/ic axis

That means air to the east (Saturn and Mercury), water to the west (Mars), earth to the north (Venus and Moon), and fire to the south (Jupiter and Sun).
 

david starling

Well-known member
How do you feel about using Aristotle's the natural place when conceptualizing the universe in terms of the ac/dc mc/ic axis

That means air to the east (Saturn and Mercury), water to the west (Mars), earth to the north (Venus and Moon), and fire to the south (Jupiter and Sun).

This would mean using a different Elemental pattern than is usual. So, you have Air-signs opposite Water-signs, and Fire-signs opposite Earth-signs.

Another unusual pattern, suggested by the alchemical symbol, Solomon's Seal, is Fire opposite Water (the upward pointing and downward pointing triangles), which cross over each other to form the upward and downward triangles for Air and Earth.

Most astrologers, of course, have Fire/Air and Earth/Water as opposites.
 
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petosiris

Banned
How do you feel about using Aristotle's the natural place when conceptualizing the universe in terms of the ac/dc mc/ic axis

That means air to the east (Saturn and Mercury), water to the west (Mars), earth to the north (Venus and Moon), and fire to the south (Jupiter and Sun).

Where did Aristotle assign the planets to the winds and elements?

I follow Ptolemy's qualities of the angles and assign the planets to them - http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Ptolemy/Tetrabiblos/1B*.html#10

The Ascendant is the body, therefore it should be earthy, or rather the other way around. Air is always opposite earth, and fire is always opposite water.
 

petosiris

Banned
Aristotle had 4 sublunar/changeable spheres corresponding to the 4 elements - fire at the top, air below fire, water below air and earth at the bottom. Only the winds according to Petosiris of astrologyweekly follow this scheme as well as the triplicities.

Aries + Leo + Sagittarius = (South or Fire) - north (ptolemy/chaldeans) or east (paulus) according to others
Taurus + Virgo + Capricorn = (West or Air) - south (ptolemy/chaldeans/paulus) or earth (valens et al) according to others
Gemini + Libra + Aquarius = (North or Water) - east (ptolemy), west (chaldeans/paulus) or air (valens et al) according to others
Cancer + Scorpio + Pisces = (East or Earth) - west (ptolemy), north (paulus) or water (valens et al) according to others
 
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david starling

Well-known member
Where did Aristotle assign the planets to the winds and elements?

I follow Ptolemy's qualities of the angles and assign the planets to them - http://penelope.uchicago.edu/Thayer/E/Roman/Texts/Ptolemy/Tetrabiblos/1B*.html#10

The Ascendant is the body, therefore it should be earthy, or rather the other way around. Air is always opposite earth, and fire is always opposite water.

Normally, an Earth-sign Asc has a Water-sign Desc.
Are you assigning different elements to the Signs than is usually Traditionalistic?
 

petosiris

Banned
Normally, an Earth-sign Asc has a Water-sign Desc.
Are you assigning different elements to the Signs than is usually Traditionalistic?

I follow the earlier Hellenistic tradition of assigning the elements to the signs according to the seasons - this was used by Ptolemy and Antiochus, actually following Aristotle.

L3l6OD2.png


Most of the Hellenistic astrologers never assigned elements according to the four cardinal directions of the signs, rather they used the seasons, or sometimes the constellations (for example Cancer, Capricorn, Aquarius and Pisces are all watery according to Dorotheus and Manilius, even though they have different seasonal qualities and winds).
 

petosiris

Banned
The element of the season is greater than the wind, even though the element of wind changes the quality and rulership of the sign along also with the elevation - this can be beautifully seen in my schemes - for example the solid signs are where the elements of the season and wind agree. I don't use the element of the wind except for explaining the triplicities.

boCas8X.png
 

Bunraku

Well-known member
David,

Judgment 15

If a planet were in the last degree of a sign, its strength has already receded from that sign, and its strength will be in the next sign: like a man who put his foot upon the threshold of the gate, wanting to go out--which if the house then fell, it would not impede him. Indeed if a planet were in the twenty-ninth degree, the strength of the planet will be in the same sign. Because there are three degrees of every planet in which its virtue is spread out--namely, the degree in which it is, and the degree which is behind it, and the degree which is in front of it.

 

aquarius7000

Well-known member
Quite honestly, I find it boring and childish.
I would like to continue to know more about what you think about astrology, David.
I say, get on with it and stay on point, both of you.
You should apply for moderatorship. That bit fits in well :D To be taken with a pinch of salt.

I, personally, find the pics draining. The tremendous use of my down-arrow cursor has made it quite rusty. :lol:
 

JUPITERASC

Well-known member
You should apply for moderatorship.

That bit fits in well :D

To be taken with a pinch of salt.

I, personally, find the pics draining.
The tremendous use of my down-arrow cursor has made it quite rusty. :lol:
Consider re-applying for your old unpaid job as a moderator of our forum :smile:
scatters pinch of salt
 

david starling

Well-known member
So my mercury 29 degree is in sag has power in cap

This is somewhat different from Sign-blending, and can be used with it or by itself: "Orb-Influence", whereby an indicator's influence is expanded from a single, longitudinal point, to the full gradient of its allowable Orb.
So, with a 5 degree Orb, Mercury's influence extends 5 degrees from its pinpoint location in both directions, for a total of 10 degrees.
Mercury is strongest at pinpoint, gradually weakening by degree until the 5 degree limit is reached.

An "exact" Conjunction is when two pinpoint positions coincide. With a 5 degree Orb, the greatest allowable "Wide-Orb" Conjunction is with the pinpoint positions are separated by 5 degrees. Obviously, the tighter the Conjunction, the more the effect.

When Mercury's pinpoint location, for example, reaches within 5 degrees of a Sign in either direction, its Orb-Influence gradually begins to activate that Sign's qualities, with increased activation the closer Mercury's pinpoint location gets to the 0 degree Sign-boundary. And, once it ingresses that Sign, it continues to have (gradually decreasing) Orb-Influence over the Sign it left behind until its pinpoint location is 5 degrees away from that Sign's boundary-line.
 
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david starling

Well-known member
I'm using the pinpoint (longitudinal) location of the planets to determine Chart-ruler(s). So, 29 degrees Mercury in Sagittarius would bring in Jupiter as dispositor, even though Mercury's Orb-Influence is extended into Capricorn. At 1 degree Capricorn, Mercury's pinpoint location would mean Saturn as dispositor, even though Mercury's Orb-Influence is still activating some Sagittarian qualities.
 
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